Ruinstorm (HH#46)/Fate of the Traitor legions' homeworld

[Manchu warlord]

Just finished the book, it was surprisingly very good. Annadale handled the primarchs very well. And, it was finally good to see Sanguinius in action again.

 

Now, I can't wait to read the novel where Lion goes on a killing streak of traitor worlds. It would also be cool if Guilliman decides to dispatch the 22nd chapter to accompany the Lion, so as to have the XIII legion take part in this much-deserved vengeance.

When/if this book comes out, I imagine they'll be a lot of Dreadwing action, they and the Destroyer company would make good friends.

[Phoebus]

Consider me unconvinced.

I hope that future entries convincingly show how the plan Guilliman, the Lion, and Sanguinius makes sense, but prior efforts haven't encouraged me to hold my breath. For example, I respect your always well-stated takes, Xisor, but disagree with the idea that the Lion has been shown to be meaningfully shrewd or pragmatic. He has certainly been secretive -- but most instances of that have served as little more than plot armor: they serve as a source of conflict for the author and ensure the storyline is (needlessly) prolonged, to the detriment of the character. I'm self-aware enough to recognize that my own factional bias is coming into play, but I like to think I'm fair enough that this wouldn't be nearly as much of an issue for me if the Lion had always been pitched thusly.

 

Beyond that, there's also the potential for departures from the old lore, with no real benefit. One of the two most defined bits of the mythology built around the Lion and Russ was their delayed return to Terra. The Lion wanted to return post-haste, Russ wanted to liberate worlds, and when the two arrived too late to make a difference, the former blamed the latter for it. Now we have Russ getting back to Terra, sending out "pathfinders" to vaguely set some conditions for a suicidal attack on Horus, which will occur prior to the Siege of Terra itself and before he (I'm assuming here) links up with the Lion. I fear that what we're seeing is groundwork for a role-reversal of sorts between the two, wherein it's the new, edgier, and more reckless Lion that is slowing down their return -- in order to virus-bomb Traitor worlds they run across. Even worse, we may be treated to the sort of 180 turn wherein Russ -- who thus far has been billed as the ruthless lord of a legion that prides itself for its ruthlessness -- will be set up to curb the Lion's genocidal excesses.

 

That sounds remarkably pessimistic, I know.

 

Prior entries centered on the Lion and the Dark Angels haven't exactly left me confident about future ones, though. A big part of this comes down to authors veering away from the old lore for no discernible reason only to deliver a lackluster, less sensible storyline that hinges on giving a central character some new twist. For example, in the old lore, Luther was left behind to rule Caliban as regent and lead the Dark Angels' recruitment and training efforts for a very good reason: he was too old to be made into an Astartes. The Lion thought he was doing him a favor, but Luther didn't see it as such. The jealousy the Lion's friend felt, and his subsequent corruption, were perfectly plausible even before we consider the influence of the Ruinous Powers -- whether via Caliban's taint or the subversive efforts of a third party. Opinions will obviously vary, but all that sounds more plausible than sending the man who almost turned a blind eye to your assassination to serve as your regent on a world that you know the be cosmically corrupted. Between that and the unfortunate depictions of the Lion in the Imperium Secundus storyline, A D-B's brief look at the character feels like an oasis.

[Marshal Rohr]

For anyone who has read the book, do they mention what year the Blood Angels successfully arrived at Terra?

[DogWelder]

Didn't the Ultramarines in Ruinstorm have the largest fleet/force though?

 

If they started out with 250,000 marines, lost 120,000 at Calth and then proceeded to lose 30-50,000 during the Shadow Crusade (estimates based on the fact that 100 of the 500 Worlds were destroyed by the Shadow Crusade), then they'd still have close to 100,000 marines by the end of the Heresy,

 

As for the Scouring, the massive post-war growth that Ultramar underwent which saw it produce tons of new marines for the 13th Legion (before the initial dissolution ofc).

[Manchu warlord]

For anyone who has read the book, do they mention what year the Blood Angels successfully arrived at Terra?

Well, the Blood Angels haven't actually arrived at Terra yet, but they are on their way; the book ends with the IX legion enroute to Terra.  But the last battle in the book (the Second Battle of Davin) took place in the year 011.M31.  So it appears they arrive a year - or slightly less - before the Siege.

[Marshal Rohr]

The Siege begins in February of 014.M31. If the Angels arrive at Terra in 011.M31 that is three years prior to being encircled in the Solar System.

[Indefragable]

The Siege begins in February of 014.M31. If the Angels arrive at Terra in 011.M31 that is three years prior to being encircled in the Solar System.

Obviously we’ll wait and see, but that does not make sense to me.

 

I can’t get it out if my head that the BA arrive just in the nick of time. (I mentally picture the image from The movie version of LOTR Return of the King where the horse drags Faramir back to the Gates with all of Mordor steps behind).

[Manchu warlord]

The Siege begins in February of 014.M31. If the Angels arrive at Terra in 011.M31 that is three years prior to being encircled in the Solar System.

My bad.  I understand my failing and will be sure to correct it.

[karden00]

I’ve never really thought timelines, what with warp shenanigans, we’re the most rewarding thing to focus on.

Do they really still use our months?

[Marshal Rohr]

I’ve never really thought timelines, what with warp shenanigans, we’re the most rewarding thing to focus on.

Do they really still use our months?

 

Nah, they call it Secundus, so its their second month - I was just being flippant because February is ours. Timelines may not be rewarding to try and nail down for us, definitely, but FW operates with broad strokes about it and I was interested in some rough numbers because it is looking like Sanguinius, Russ, and Dorn are all on Terra at the same time in the new Savier Art. That could only really happen before Yarant and Beta-Garmon. 

[b1soul]

@ Indefragable

 

'Now tell me, agent of the Emperor,' he said, 'for I truly wish to know - what would you have done, if Dulanian ships had come to Caliban and made such demands as you have made?'

The Lion remained impassive. His sword remained sheathed. 'I have heard that question posed from rulers of a dozen worlds. And to them all, I give the same answer - it matters not. You did not come to us, we came to you. Fate has given you the only answer you will ever receive.'

[Indefragable]

@ Indefragable

 

'Now tell me, agent of the Emperor,' he said, 'for I truly wish to know - what would you have done, if Dulanian ships had come to Caliban and made such demands as you have made?'

The Lion remained impassive. His sword remained sheathed. 'I have heard that question posed from rulers of a dozen worlds. And to them all, I give the same answer - it matters not. You did not come to us, we came to you. Fate has given you the only answer you will ever receive.'

 

That's the one.

 

Man, the Lion is such a :cuss ......I love it!

[Saphrael]

A D-B's brief look at the character feels like an oasis.

Amen.

 

Prince of Crows and Savage Weapons were a godsend for the much benighted Dark Angels' fan in the HH.

 

That said, The Great Wolf was a refreshingly apt take on the Lion as well.

 

Pretty amusing that the DA have only been well served by entries that don't feature them as the main characters.

[b1soul]

Well...ADB and Wraight are generally more character-focused and less dry than Thorpe

[Phoebus]

I don't think dry writing is the issue. It's the choices the characters make, or -- more appropriately -- why they make them. There's a whole different topic for that, though.

[Fedor]

Angels of Darkness is still the best Dark Angels book imo. Astelan in the Heresy series has been handled clumsily though, i think the Caliban contingent could have done with their own book by now to really get into the characters motivations before they hit the stage they were at in AOC. Then again i'm sure plenty would have moaned about it not progressing the main plot line fast enough.

[Manchu warlord]

 

'Now tell me, agent of the Emperor,' he said, 'for I truly wish to know - what would you have done, if Dulanian ships had come to Caliban and made such demands as you have made?'

The Lion remained impassive. His sword remained sheathed. 'I have heard that question posed from rulers of a dozen worlds. And to them all, I give the same answer - it matters not. You did not come to us, we came to you. Fate has given you the only answer you will ever receive.'

... Is the fate of Chemos and Barbarus.  Well... something in that manner.  

[rendingon1+]

Angels of Darkness is still the best Dark Angels book imo. Astelan in the Heresy series has been handled clumsily though, i think the Caliban contingent could have done with their own book by now to really get into the characters motivations before they hit the stage they were at in AOC. Then again i'm sure plenty would have moaned about it not progressing the main plot line fast enough.

Angels of Darkness was the first book and it is hard to judge it because of that. Thing is Thorpe uses Fallen theme in each and every of his works (except those set in HH for obvious reasons) and personally I have enough. As for Astelan and Caliban arc I find them much more interesting than a IS. I'm certainly not a fan of Zahariel and Demon Caliban thing but interactions and politicking in the Order were very well made IMHO. Astelan as a character is quite funny and chill (nevertheless dangerous and oportunistic) when compared to Luther or knights of Caliban in general. I'm certain we're gonna see his more sinister side during the battle of Caliban etc.

[Indefragable]

 

Angels of Darkness is still the best Dark Angels book imo. Astelan in the Heresy series has been handled clumsily though, i think the Caliban contingent could have done with their own book by now to really get into the characters motivations before they hit the stage they were at in AOC. Then again i'm sure plenty would have moaned about it not progressing the main plot line fast enough.

Angels of Darkness was the first book and it is hard to judge it because of that. Thing is Thorpe uses Fallen theme in each and every of his works (except those set in HH for obvious reasons) and personally I have enough. As for Astelan and Caliban arc I find them much more interesting than a IS. I'm certainly not a fan of Zahariel and Demon Caliban thing but interactions and politicking in the Order were very well made IMHO. Astelan as a character is quite funny and chill (nevertheless dangerous and oportunistic) when compared to Luther or knights of Caliban in general. I'm certain we're gonna see his more sinister side during the battle of Caliban etc.

 

 

Astelan is a pretty interesting character, IMO.

An almost....mercenary...Astartes? ...who is not a Blackshield, but someone who fought by the Emperor himself?

My, that is pretty interesting and worth exploring. Unfortunately his arcs seem to get bogged down in pettiness and everything I want to know about him seems ignored.

[JH79]

I'm wondering if anyone caught sight of one Jerune Kanshell during their run through of Ruinstorm? He was the

only survivor

at the end of Damnation of Pythos and someone who I really wanted to see more of. His fate at the end of the novel was certainly grim

dragged screaming and kicking at the command of Madail toward the remade demonic Veritus Ferrum

but there was no evident hint that his fate would end immediately in death, indeed he was to bear witness to what was to come.

 

I'm still hoping to see more of him at some point! 

[mc warhammer]

only just halfway to though this now, around davin, and it’s at that point that this book has really picked up for me

 

anyone else feel the chaos temptations/tests in this seem like better examples of what we could have gotten earlier in the series? sanguinius’ visions of the emperor and terra were more insidious and convincing to me than horus’ in false gods. likewise guilliman’s struggle with the anathame’s compared to fulgrim’s sword in the self titled book.

 

i particularly liked the lion’s test

[Charlo]

OOOO I really like this as a nice analogue!

 

 

only just halfway to though this now, around davin, and it’s at that point that this book has really picked up for me

anyone else feel the chaos temptations/tests in this seem like better examples of what we could have gotten earlier in the series? sanguinius’ visions of the emperor and terra were more insidious and convincing to me than horus’ in false gods. likewise guilliman’s struggle with the anathame’s compared to fulgrim’s sword in the self titled book.

i particularly liked the lion’s test

 

Yeah thats where it picked up for me too. The earlier parts of the book are a lot of fighting, that while cool, is a bit weak. Guillimans struggle with the daemon weapon is nice though.

 

On the subject of the Lion though, I gotta agree with Indefragable - I bloody love him. He is Lawful Good to an extreme so much it twists on it's head. Plus his legion has the coolest toys.

I

like the narrative that the Lion goes around killing traitor legion home worlds, seeing the degradation and corruption first hand, and delivering the killing blow. Makes so much sense that, after having done that 2 or 3 times, when he arrives at Caliban and sees those same signs, he follows the same pattern.

 

[Tymell]

only just halfway to though this now, around davin, and it’s at that point that this book has really picked up for me

 

anyone else feel the chaos temptations/tests in this seem like better examples of what we could have gotten earlier in the series? sanguinius’ visions of the emperor and terra were more insidious and convincing to me than horus’ in false gods. likewise guilliman’s struggle with the anathame’s compared to fulgrim’s sword in the self titled book.

 

i particularly liked the lion’s test

 

This was probably my favourite aspect of the book. For me, it's one of the rare instances in the series of such temptations being subtle, and the story being one of real character development. Chaos is trying to exploit the inherent weaknesses of these Primarchs, and they need to overcome those in order to progress.

[Indefragable]

i particularly liked the lion’s test

 

Been a while since I read this and my copy is buried in a box somewhere. What is the Lion's [spoilered ] test again?

[mc warhammer]

the lion

is determined to destroy davin, when saguinnius decides to land there with a jail broken cruze. the situation could logically be read as the angel losing his mind (he attacked many dark angels in the process)

 

is this what i must do, then? destroy it, and kill sanguinnius? precipitate war with the ninth legion? and possibly the ultramarines as well? and what is the alternative? stay my hand, and let this madness play out? allow davin to wreak havoc? reach this point only to fall into a trap?

 

the beauty of these tests beyond the way they just crept on the primarchs (rather than announcing themselves “aha! i am a test!”) was that all options are plausible, the wrong choice seems noblest

 

a lot of the earlier tests in the HH seemed more “do this bad thing, i dare ya. go on.”