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2K Ahriman/No Tzaangor List

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#1
themortalgod

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While I'm not averse to Tzaangor in concept and like them in AoS, I've just never really felt they fit in a Thousand Sons army.  Thus I've opted to move my army in a different direction than what I think most 1K sons are these days. I recognize it probably won't be the strongest list ever created but I'm hoping it can at least be strong enough to not auto lose.

 

The general goal is to use the Exalted Sorcerer on foot to babysit and lend his aura + prescience to the predators while pumping out free-rolls.

 

Meanwhile the Rubric Marines along with the other exalted Sorcerer act as a hammer while the brims take up space, act as speedbumps, and babysit objectives.

 

Ahriman will act as general support and just be wherever he is needed, disc + warptime generally means he can be wherever I want him at a moment's notice.

The terminators will aim to deep strike into the enemy back line and set up shop in cover with glamour so they can stand around and shoot while being able to absorb quite a bit of fire themselves. 

 

Finally the screamers and prince will look to sweep down a flank and cause a ton of damage. The buff to screamers has made their charge pretty scary, especially with the DP aura and boon of tzeentch on them.

 

I feel like Dark Matter Crystal is a no brainer for an army that struggles with movement but also wanted the helm so I feel that going down to 8CP to have both is well worth it. I suspect most of my CP will go into veterans of the long war and re-rolls to prevent perils. 

 

Detachment 1:

 

1 Ahriman on Disc Warptime, Temporal Manipulation, Weaver of Fates 166pts

1 Exalted Sorcerer Force Stave, Inferno Bolt Pistol, Dark Matter Crystal, Doombolt, Death Hex 121pts

10 Rubric Marines Soul Reaper, Glamour of Tzeentch 222pts

10 Rubric Marines Soul Reaper, Tzeentch's Firestorm 222pts

10 Brimstone Horrors   30pts       

7 Screamers   217pts

1 Predator Twin Lascannon, Lascannon Sponsoons 190pts

1 Predator Twin Lascannon, Lascannon Sponsoons 190pts

5 Scarab Occult Terminators Hellfire Rack, Reaper Autocannon, Glamour of Tzeentch 238pts

 

1596pts

 

Detachment 2

 

1 Daemon Prince with Wings Two sets of Talons, Gaze of Fate, Boon of Change 180pts

1 Exalted Sorcerer Force Stave, Inferno Bolt Pistol, Helm of the Third Eye, Prescience, Weaver of Fates 121pts

10 Brimstone Horrors   30pts

10 Brimstone Horrors   30pts

10 Brimstone Horrors   30pts

 

391pts


Edited by themortalgod, 21 March 2018 - 01:25 PM.


#2
Nym

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Your list isn't a THOUSAND SONS army list unfortunately. Both of your detachments are broken by Daemons (they don't have the THOUSAND SONS keyword), which means you won't get access to Thousand Sons stratagems and relics.

 

Put the Screamers in the second detachment and remove the Brimstone Horrors in the first detachment (use Cultists instead) in order to have at least 1 pure THOUSAND SONS detachment, for stratagems.

 

Also, 10 Rubrics with Soulreaper = 220pts, not 222

 

And take Diabolic Strength on the Daemon Prince, leave Boon of change at home.


Edited by Nym, 21 March 2018 - 09:40 PM.


#3
themortalgod

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Your list isn't a THOUSAND SONS army list unfortunately. Both of your detachments are broken by Daemons (they don't have the THOUSAND SONS keyword), which means you won't get access to Thousand Sons stratagems and relics.

 

Put the Screamers in the second detachment and remove the Brimstone Horrors in the first detachment (use Cultists instead) in order to have at least 1 pure THOUSAND SONS detachment, for stratagems.

 

Also, 10 Rubrics with Soulreaper = 220pts, not 222

 

And take Diabolic Strength on the Daemon Prince, leave Boon of change at home.

 

Well thats a bummer, I didn't even realize GW put stuff in the book you can't even field if you want to keep your allegiance... Great design there.... I guess I gotta completely rework the army, don't like cultist models at all...

 

Updated list:

 

1 Ahriman on Disc Warptime, Temporal Manipulation, Weaver of Fates 166pts

1 Exalted Sorcerer Force Stave, Inferno Bolt Pistol, Dark Matter Crystal, Infernal Gaze, Death Hex 121pts

1 Exalted Sorcerer Force Stave, Inferno Bolt Pistol, Helm of the Third Eye, Prescience, Weaver of Fates 121pts

 

10 Rubric Marines Soul Reaper, Glamour of Tzeentch 220pts

10 Rubric Marines Soul Reaper, Tzeentch's Firestorm 220pts

10 Rubric Marines Soul Reaper, Doombolt 220pts

 

1 Predator Twin Lascannon, Lascannon Sponsoons 190pts

1 Predator Twin Lascannon, Lascannon Sponsoons 190pts

 

5 Scarab Occult Terminators Hellfire Rack, Reaper Autocannon, Glamour of Tzeentch 238pts

 

1565pts

 

Detachment 2

 

1 Daemon Prince with Wings Two sets of Talons, Gaze of Fate, Diabolic Strength 180pts

 

6 Screamers 186pts

 

10 Brimstone Horrors   30pts

10 Brimstone Horrors   30pts

 

426pts


Edited by themortalgod, 22 March 2018 - 12:34 AM.


#4
sneakybamsen

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If I might chip in - I'd probably ditch the screamers to add one unit of horrors and get a second HQ for detachment 2, making it a batallion for +3CP. I know a DP is more than 150'ish points, but a sorcerer in TDA (with warptime) or exalted on disk or whatever would be worth considering as far as I can figure. That way you lose out on a decent melee unit that is fast moving, but you gain support for the SoT's for instance with a sorcerer in TDA and warptime, and you have 3 extra CP for those sweet stratagems and another unit for grabbing objectives.


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#5
Quixus

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If you can get 190 pts somewhere (like from the screamers) you could get a third predator and put them with one HQ into a spearhead detachment for one more CP and access to the killshot stratagem.


Edited by Quixus, 22 March 2018 - 10:49 AM.


#6
themortalgod

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If I might chip in - I'd probably ditch the screamers to add one unit of horrors and get a second HQ for detachment 2, making it a batallion for +3CP. I know a DP is more than 150'ish points, but a sorcerer in TDA (with warptime) or exalted on disk or whatever would be worth considering as far as I can figure. That way you lose out on a decent melee unit that is fast moving, but you gain support for the SoT's for instance with a sorcerer in TDA and warptime, and you have 3 extra CP for those sweet stratagems and another unit for grabbing objectives.

 

If you can get 190 pts somewhere (like from the screamers) you could get a third predator and put them with one HQ into a spearhead detachment for one more CP and access to the killshot stratagem.

 
Interesting ideas, I actually have been really toying with the idea of dropping the Daemons completely. I really only included them because I wanted to run screamers since they are finally good again hahah. 
 
Does the army function effectively with no chaffe?
 
For example, say. 
 

1 Ahriman on Disc Warptime, Temporal Manipulation, Weaver of Fates 166pts

1 Exalted Sorcerer Force Stave, Inferno Bolt Pistol, Dark Matter Crystal, Infernal Gaze, Death Hex 121pts

 

10 Rubric Marines Soul Reaper, Glamour of Tzeentch 220pts

10 Rubric Marines Soul Reaper, Tzeentch's Firestorm 220pts

10 Rubric Marines Soul Reaper, Doombolt 220pts

 

Rhino - Combi-bolter - 72pts

Rhino - Combi-bolter - 72pts

 

5 Scarab Occult Terminators Hellfire Rack, Reaper Autocannon, Glamour of Tzeentch 238pts

 

1 Exalted Sorcerer Force Stave, Inferno Bolt Pistol, Helm of the Third Eye, Prescience, Weaver of Fates 121pts

1 Predator Twin Lascannon, Lascannon Sponsoons 190pts

1 Predator Pred autocannon, Lascannon Sponsoons 180pts

1 Predator Pred autocannon, Lascannon Sponsoons 180pts

 

2000pts even with 6 CP

 

Added Rhinos because I wasn't sure what to do with the extra points but maybe a better choic emight be dropping one of the preds down to Heavy bolters to make it cheaper then using the extra points for something else like a Heldrake? I think one problem the list has now is lack of tools to kill hordes. 

 

Thanks so much everyone!


Edited by themortalgod, 22 March 2018 - 02:54 PM.


#7
sneakybamsen

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If running killshot, keep in mind that as soon as 1 of the preds die, it's no longer an option. Laspreds are good for busting big things, but they don't have much utility. The autocannon+bolter configuration seems interesting with killshot, but it's only AP-1 shooting still. So medium strength tanks and monsters get 4+ saves. With Killshot the heavy bolters wound anything between T6 and T9 on 4+ and do 2 damage per wound. The autocannon becomes a real menace, if you get enough shots with it. However, as mentioned the AP is low, so it's not super effective if your target has a 2+ save or hides in cover. In other words, killing stuff like Morty will take time with killshots stratagem on 3 dakkapreds. They are decent for kiling chaff however, much better than laspreds at least. So they are cheaper and have more utility.

 

Depending on your desired level of competitiveness, you might want to consider getting cheaper troops (cultists). I respect that you don't want tzaangors in your list, but they are a solid choice when equipped for close combat with brayhorn and deepstrike shenanigans. Especially when being a herd of 30.


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#8
Quixus

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So medium strength tanks and monsters get 4+ saves. With Killshot the heavy bolters wound anything between T6 and T9 on 4+ and do 2 damage per wound.

Umm, Lascannons are S9 AP -3 So a 3+ Save as most tanks have becomes a 6+ save, even without the stratagem. The stratagem allows you to wound on 2+ up to T8, 3+ for T9, I am not sure if T10 even exists and wounds do 4.5 damage on average (d6+1) That should take down big threats pretty fast. Have an exalted sorcerer nearby and you even improve the chance to hit. If you have a CP to spare, Daemonforge makes hitting and wounding even more likely.



#9
Are Verlo

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So medium strength tanks and monsters get 4+ saves. With Killshot the heavy bolters wound anything between T6 and T9 on 4+ and do 2 damage per wound.

Umm, Lascannons are S9 AP -3 So a 3+ Save as most tanks have becomes a 6+ save, even without the stratagem. The stratagem allows you to wound on 2+ up to T8, 3+ for T9, I am not sure if T10 even exists and wounds do 4.5 damage on average (d6+1) That should take down big threats pretty fast. Have an exalted sorcerer nearby and you even improve the chance to hit. If you have a CP to spare, Daemonforge makes hitting and wounding even more likely.

I might misunderstand your post, but daemonforge only affects daemon vehicles, not predators.

#10
Quixus

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You are right. I somehow overlooked the DAEMON keyword.

#11
sneakybamsen

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Yes, you can definitely use killshot on laspreds, but you still have more utility with dakkapreds (as they are way better at killing other things). You quote me as if I'm wrong, then talk about laspreds.

 

Not that you are wrong about laspreds in any way, it's just having three of them is 12 lascannon shots, and when you've killed the big target(s), they've got very low efficiency.


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#12
Quixus

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Yes, you can definitely use killshot on laspreds, but you still have more utility with dakkapreds (as they are way better at killing other things). You quote me as if I'm wrong, then talk about laspreds.

 

Not that you are wrong about laspreds in any way, it's just having three of them is 12 lascannon shots, and when you've killed the big target(s), they've got very low efficiency.

I totally agree, but TS don't have many chpoices to take out the big and scary stuff.



#13
sneakybamsen

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Yes, you can definitely use killshot on laspreds, but you still have more utility with dakkapreds (as they are way better at killing other things). You quote me as if I'm wrong, then talk about laspreds.

 

Not that you are wrong about laspreds in any way, it's just having three of them is 12 lascannon shots, and when you've killed the big target(s), they've got very low efficiency.

I totally agree, but TS don't have many chpoices to take out the big and scary stuff.

 

That is so true, there isn't a lot of options for heavy hitting. Three laspreds does feel like overkill to me, however. If I were to get 3 preds, I think I'd do a mix of them. For my DA I have 3 of the dakka variant (not magnetized), and I really haven't used them much. Gonna have a game tomorrow though where I hopefully get a chance to use Killshot, however.


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#14
Quixus

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I suggest you magnetize the TS predators.



#15
Paladin777

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I tend to use two autoturret/las sponson predators and sometimes a Dakka Pred. It tends to work pretty well.

Edited by Paladin777, 27 March 2018 - 04:43 PM.





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