Jump to content

Immortal tactica discussion


USNCenturion

Recommended Posts

I’m in the process of building my murder robots (androids? Cyborgs? Terminators?) and am having trouble deciding how to outfit my first batch of immortals. I get the whole, “ depends on the rest of your list thing”, but for discussion sake, what are people finding works better on them in more situations; gauss or Tesla?

 

There’s the obvious advantages gauss has over tesla on armored targets within 12”, especially running Sautekh for the ignore Heavy penalty. I also feel like there are better sources of tesla throughout the army, via Tomb Blades, flying crescents, and annihilation barges. For some reason though I’m still heavily considering the tesla carbines on the immortals; probably because actually getting them into their double tap range regularly seems rather difficult.

 

I’m definitely going to play test on my own and adjust accordingly, but I’d like to be comfortable in building one or the other now, and giving it a fair shake. Would love to hear the thoughts of my fellow frater.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I built mine as gauss because I like the aesthetic more and haven't looked back. The S5 AP-2 (-3 at half range *laughs in Mephrit*) speaks up in my experience. Even against horde armies it's nice to know models are getting pulled off the table instead of getting to roll a save, even a 6.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think Gauss immortals are better for taking objectives and taking the fight to the enemy, while Tesla immortals are better for the back line, where they can better use their Tesla rule and not lose firepower potential from being at max range. I think I’ll be running and even mix with a focus on Tesla, personally, as I like having large packs of warriors as my frontline troops. (I say this as a planned mephrit player, which kinda contradicts what I say here but eh. I’m not a WAAC optimizer so I don’t care *that* much.)

 

Also, Gauss becomes even more killy when paired with Mephrit. You not only double the shots, but that extra -1 AP will probably wreck anything they come across, short of TEQs.

 

For just one squad though, as you seem to be implying, I’d go with gauss. Get the AP to ensure your hits go through before worrying about volume of fire.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So extensive math and testing tells me that I'm going to be using Immortals largely for Tesla. With MWBD on them, it's effective. With Mephrit added on its very effective. Gauss is good, but doesn't benefit nearly as much from MWBD. And a squad of 20 Warriors is more effective against most targets, so that's what I use for Gauss.

 

Ultimately though if you know who you're fighting, it makes a big difference. Against PA, bring Gauss. Against Daemons, bring Tesla. Against most other armies, probably want a mix.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Math hammer is hard to argue that tesla is just statistically better. However, in practice there are just so many -1 to hit units and armies in the meta that it can actually be quite challenging to proc the tesla effect. I take gauss on mine because I know they will always be deadly and as an above poster said make a great frontline unit.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

It’s definitely a positive that the codex offers such competitive (in a selection sense) options, and that there isn’t one weapon so overpowering as to be obvious in 100% of lists.

 

I’m in agreement that Gauss immortals may be better with Sautekh, while tesla immortals work better with Mephrit, and that can help in any decision someone wants to make. I’m leaning towards a well rounded Sautekh force with AB and tesla tomb blades, so I’m going to try the gauss first. I like the thinking above that fewer higher powered shots may serve me better than possibly higher volume, lower power shots.

 

I still think it’s a fascinating discussion and debate, and am glad for the choice that’s available.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I feel like we're seeing this develop for Immortals:

 

If you plan on accompanying Immortals with an Overlord, take tesla. Otherwise, take gauss.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yeah, tomb blades are a good candidate for gauss since they can't get MWBD. I definitely think for most situations you should have a mix, unless you know you're fighting stuff like marines or daemons/harlequins. Anything in between though a mix is gonna be better.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I converted the telsa carbine with the gauss blaster so I get to choose while list building instead of having to buying double depending on how I feel, but I mostly use the Tesla
Link to comment
Share on other sites

So far I am going Tesla. 6’s (5’s with MWBD) me sing 3 hits is the definition of “make them roll 1’s”. Even with Mephrit.

 

This might be weird logic, but for me there’s sort of diminishing returns with Mephrits bonus to AP. Near with me here:

 

AP-1 is good against anything

AP-2 is good against just about anything as well

AP-3 is ideal for MEQ

AP-4 or better is best against vehicles.

 

Where I am going with this is that at a certain point, the “ideal” targets of AP-3 or better will start getting invuln saves. Think SM HQ’s, Termies, etc... so AP-1 orAP-2 is “just as good” as AP-3 or better. So massed quantities of cheap AP-1 (Warriors) or the like is “fine” for dealing with a broad range of targets.

 

On the other end of the spectrum, scary MC’s and big nasty vehicles typically don’t have invulns but almost always have high armor saves. In which case I want my biggest guns to have even higher AP (think Heavy Gauss). So it becomes even more useful firing at Land Raiders.

 

The middle part is where it gets tricky. So that’s why I lean towards Tesla, even with Mephrit since to me, quantity of shots > quality at that end of the spectrum. Sort of a reverse bell curve.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have been on the receiving end of Gauss Blasters several times and they leave my Ultramarines in a mess. Never underestimate what AP-2 is capable of and try ignoring the stats a little. You might get a 3rd extra wounds on a Space Marines squad but the opponent will still save on a 3+.

 

Remember; dice don't care what the average is - that's not how real life works ;)

 

If you're against high armour then take Gauss Blasters. If you need extra hits then take Tesla.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

-2 is a real sweet spot for AP.  It's at the right point where it's almost never wasted.   Few things have ONLY a 6+ save.  Most have a 5+ or better, and in cover, of course, even better.  And even those things that have a 2+ save get pretty scared against a -2 AP weapon.  As Indefragable said, it's also not so much AP that it gets wasted because of Invuln Save overlap. 

 

So last night I had a game vs. my buddy's Slaanesh daemons.  The lack of armor saves rendered my Gauss AP pretty wasted, and thus, my Tesla immortals shined last night, and I used my Gauss Immortals as screens/blockers. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

-2 is a real sweet spot for AP.  It's at the right point where it's almost never wasted.   Few things have ONLY a 6+ save.  Most have a 5+ or better, and in cover, of course, even better.  And even those things that have a 2+ save get pretty scared against a -2 AP weapon.  As Indefragable said, it's also not so much AP that it gets wasted because of Invuln Save overlap. 

 

So last night I had a game vs. my buddy's Slaanesh daemons.  The lack of armor saves rendered my Gauss AP pretty wasted, and thus, my Tesla immortals shined last night, and I used my Gauss Immortals as screens/blockers. 

 

That's my other thought on the matter. I kind of see Tesla as bolters in 7th: anything that can be killed by them will be killed by them with the right # of them. It's "impossible" to waste them.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I like the point that Gauss blasters may be better served on tomb blades, as they can’t benefit from MWBD like immortals can, and they are faster and more durable and so are better able to get into rapid fire range. The tesla immortals can stay back at 24” and benefit from chain lightning on a 5 or 6.

 

I think for me, I can get good ap from a gauss CCB, destroyers, and tomb blades, not to mention a squad or two of warriors. My tesla platforms are looking more and more like immortals and annihilation barges to start.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think I agree with the gauss blasters are better on the faster closing units.  Having tesla back and being effective at a father range is solid position for them.  Although the VoD and 10 man immortal squad deep striking in rapid fire rang is always fun.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.