Frater Cornelius Posted April 21, 2018 Author Share Posted April 21, 2018 I have searched my old junk boxes with broken models and left overs. I was able to find and (re)assemble three infantry squads, six heavy weapon bases and a command squad company commander. They already had their first showing with three Leman Russes in addition to my Stormies against the Nids. Plays so much more fluidly and relaxed. I hope that this new and revised setup will fare better against whatever the DA can cook up next. What my setup looks right now, based on what I found: Hidden Content Cadian Battalion Company Commander - Relic of Lost Cadia Primaris Psyker Command Squad - 4 Plasmas 3 Infantry Squads - (3) Grenade Launchers 2 HWS - (6) Heavy Bolters Chimera - 2 Heavy Bolters Cadian Spearhead Pask - Punisher, 3 Heavy Bolters 2 LRBTs - Battle cannon, 2 Heavy Bolters, Lascannon (its so classic, I had to) 2 Wyvern Militarum Tempestus KASRKIN Battalion Kasrkin Prime (?) - Command Rod, Auto-reliquiary Lord Commissar Command Squad - 4 Hotshot Volley Guns (Hellvolley Guns?) 2 units of 5 Kasrkins - 2 Plasmas, Plasma Pistol, Vox 10 Kasrkins - 4 Meltas, Plasma Pistol, Vox 2 Taurox Primes - Autocannons, Gatling 1980pts Unused, but available: Valkyrie - full dakka 3 Bullgryns plus Bodyguard 3 Scout Sentinels A bit short on anti-tank, but ai hope that is more in line with what Imperial Guard is all about :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mileposter Posted April 22, 2018 Share Posted April 22, 2018 Wanted to chime in and add to the support - it's really awesome to see it hasn't knocked the wind out of your sails. Applause at getting back into the fight with the Emperor's Finest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doof Posted April 23, 2018 Share Posted April 23, 2018 I ran against an almost identical list this weekend. Here's what i had: Hidden Content Vostroyan BrigadeWarlord : Company Commander with Plasma Pistol, Kuirovs Aquila and Grand Strategist2 Company Commanders4 Inf Squads with Plasma Guns2 Inf Squads with Sniper Rifle and LascannonAstropath w/ Psychic Barrier (baby sat Hydra)Command Squad with 4 Sniper Rifles8x Crusaders1 Ministorum Priest with Plasma GunArtemia Pattern Hellhound2x Scout Sentinals w/ multilaserLeman Russ Annihilator w/ lascannonHWT with MortarsHydraValkyrie with Rocket Pods, Multilaser, Hvy BoltersCatachan VanguardPrimaris Psyker with Mental Fortitude, Nightshroud (babysat Annihilator)2 Hades Breaching drills squads with 2 plasma in eachMaster of OridinanceBasiliskManticoreAuxillary Detatchment:Inquisitor Coteaz with TerrrifyCoteaz, Crusaders and Priest rode in Valkyrie. He went first: Deployed Football style, tons of LOS blocking terrain and ruins. We played new faq /beta rules with increased CP and deep strike restrictions. Night fight rule was in effect 1st turn. in back left corner i set up my Artillery + mortars + Annihilator outside of LOS, 4 Squads of infantry bubble-wrap in ruins. Other corner i put 2 squads + snipers in ruins + astropath and Wyvern. Hades + Valkyrie squad were in reserve. His first Turn: He deployed at the edge of his deployment, so he moved up everything (5 raiders with mix of units inside, 3 venoms with mix of units, 15-20 reavers in a single unit, void bomber and razorwing) Was effectively in my lines ( no charges this turn) His shooting killed 3 squads of infantry in ruins, his jet put a few wounds on my Hydra, almost destroyed my hellhound. My first turn. Brought in 1st Hades squad Drill and squad charged a raider, killing it. Incubi inside. Shooting i put his void bomber on 2nd tier, and killed all reavers except for 4. Random wounds on a couple units. Valkyrie came in and shot some stuff, pretty ineffective. His second turn : killed all the rest of my 98% of my infantry with fire from raiders, tied up Manticore and Basilisk with remaining scatter bikes, killed my hell-hound, His Archon + some killy retinue got out of a venom and cleaned up my bubble wrap around Hydra. Incubi killed my drill + half shotgun "veterans".. His razor wing flew off the table My second turn: Managed to kill the rest of the reavers, Put my Valkyrie in hover mode and shot full BS, not very effective. 2nd Hades came in and tried to kill off Incubi in open, failed charges. Crusaders + priest + coteaz disembarked near his archon + retinue. Got pychic barrier off on crusaders 2+ save now. Multi charged his Archon and Slyth, needed a 6 rolled a 5. Used stratagem to re-roll - and he blocked it with his shenanigan 3 CP stratagem. His third Turn: Incubi charged and killed 2nd Hades squad, He shot my 2+ save crusaders down to 1 man, all remaining infantry were killed ( couple auto pass squads with 1 man left at this point). Tied up all my artillery + Leman russ with infantry from raiders. His HQ got back in the venom and ran away. I had 1 Hydra that could shoot, 2 scout sentinels, Coteaz with Priest + 1 crusader, 2 mortar teams, and 2 company commanders left (including HQ). I conceded here. The whole game i managed to kill 1 raider, a 5 man wych unit, and his 15-20 reavers. Don't know what i could have done differently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mordian Glory Posted April 23, 2018 Share Posted April 23, 2018 I ran against an almost identical list this weekend. Here's what i had: Hidden Content Vostroyan Brigade Warlord : Company Commander with Plasma Pistol, Kuirovs Aquila and Grand Strategist 2 Company Commanders 4 Inf Squads with Plasma Guns 2 Inf Squads with Sniper Rifle and Lascannon Astropath w/ Psychic Barrier (baby sat Hydra) Command Squad with 4 Sniper Rifles 8x Crusaders 1 Ministorum Priest with Plasma Gun Artemia Pattern Hellhound 2x Scout Sentinals w/ multilaser Leman Russ Annihilator w/ lascannon HWT with Mortars Hydra Valkyrie with Rocket Pods, Multilaser, Hvy Bolters Catachan Vanguard Primaris Psyker with Mental Fortitude, Nightshroud (babysat Annihilator) 2 Hades Breaching drills squads with 2 plasma in each Master of Oridinance Basilisk Manticore Auxillary Detatchment: Inquisitor Coteaz with Terrrify Coteaz, Crusaders and Priest rode in Valkyrie. He went first: Deployed Football style, tons of LOS blocking terrain and ruins. We played new faq /beta rules with increased CP and deep strike restrictions. Night fight rule was in effect 1st turn. in back left corner i set up my Artillery + mortars + Annihilator outside of LOS, 4 Squads of infantry bubble-wrap in ruins. Other corner i put 2 squads + snipers in ruins + astropath and Wyvern. Hades + Valkyrie squad were in reserve. His first Turn: He deployed at the edge of his deployment, so he moved up everything (5 raiders with mix of units inside, 3 venoms with mix of units, 15-20 reavers in a single unit, void bomber and razorwing) Was effectively in my lines ( no charges this turn) His shooting killed 3 squads of infantry in ruins, his jet put a few wounds on my Hydra, almost destroyed my hellhound. My first turn. Brought in 1st Hades squad Drill and squad charged a raider, killing it. Incubi inside. Shooting i put his void bomber on 2nd tier, and killed all reavers except for 4. Random wounds on a couple units. Valkyrie came in and shot some stuff, pretty ineffective. His second turn : killed all the rest of my 98% of my infantry with fire from raiders, tied up Manticore and Basilisk with remaining scatter bikes, killed my hell-hound, His Archon + some killy retinue got out of a venom and cleaned up my bubble wrap around Hydra. Incubi killed my drill + half shotgun "veterans".. His razor wing flew off the table My second turn: Managed to kill the rest of the reavers, Put my Valkyrie in hover mode and shot full BS, not very effective. 2nd Hades came in and tried to kill off Incubi in open, failed charges. Crusaders + priest + coteaz disembarked near his archon + retinue. Got pychic barrier off on crusaders 2+ save now. Multi charged his Archon and Slyth, needed a 6 rolled a 5. Used stratagem to re-roll - and he blocked it with his shenanigan 3 CP stratagem. His third Turn: Incubi charged and killed 2nd Hades squad, He shot my 2+ save crusaders down to 1 man, all remaining infantry were killed ( couple auto pass squads with 1 man left at this point). Tied up all my artillery + Leman russ with infantry from raiders. His HQ got back in the venom and ran away. I had 1 Hydra that could shoot, 2 scout sentinels, Coteaz with Priest + 1 crusader, 2 mortar teams, and 2 company commanders left (including HQ). I conceded here. The whole game i managed to kill 1 raider, a 5 man wych unit, and his 15-20 reavers. Don't know what i could have done differently. Sounds tough, but I have a few bits of advice for you: 1) You have a lot of 1 off units e.g. 1 manticore, 1 basilisk, 1 leman russ, 1 hell hound etc. There is an old saying in the Guard "if it is worth taking once, it is worth taking 3 times". By only having 1 of each unit it makes it easy for your opponant to target priority. 2) You had very little Infantry. Your screens need screens! By turn 2 your screens were gone. In my own 1500 pts army I run at least 100 infantry and I use a "3 line defence" line 1 = cheap infantry squads, either bare bones or with a heavy bolter and plasma depending on the points (used to be conscripts before nerf) line 2 = more infantry squads with more dakka, maybe a couple of hell hounds and bullgryns line 3 = toy breakers, tanks and arty The reason you need 2 screens is it means you have redundancy. Take a look at your infantry. Assume you will lose 40-60 men by turn 2. Thats means after turn 2 (at the latest) the enemy will be running amok in your toy breakers. Thus the natural answer is you need more time to let your boom boom units get to work and the best way to do this is to have more bloody infantry holding them back. Hope this helps :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doof Posted April 24, 2018 Share Posted April 24, 2018 I ran against an almost identical list this weekend. Here's what i had: Hidden Content Vostroyan Brigade Warlord : Company Commander with Plasma Pistol, Kuirovs Aquila and Grand Strategist 2 Company Commanders 4 Inf Squads with Plasma Guns 2 Inf Squads with Sniper Rifle and Lascannon Astropath w/ Psychic Barrier (baby sat Hydra) Command Squad with 4 Sniper Rifles 8x Crusaders 1 Ministorum Priest with Plasma Gun Artemia Pattern Hellhound 2x Scout Sentinals w/ multilaser Leman Russ Annihilator w/ lascannon HWT with Mortars Hydra Valkyrie with Rocket Pods, Multilaser, Hvy Bolters Catachan Vanguard Primaris Psyker with Mental Fortitude, Nightshroud (babysat Annihilator) 2 Hades Breaching drills squads with 2 plasma in each Master of Oridinance Basilisk Manticore Auxillary Detatchment: Inquisitor Coteaz with Terrrify Coteaz, Crusaders and Priest rode in Valkyrie. He went first: Deployed Football style, tons of LOS blocking terrain and ruins. We played new faq /beta rules with increased CP and deep strike restrictions. Night fight rule was in effect 1st turn. in back left corner i set up my Artillery + mortars + Annihilator outside of LOS, 4 Squads of infantry bubble-wrap in ruins. Other corner i put 2 squads + snipers in ruins + astropath and Wyvern. Hades + Valkyrie squad were in reserve. His first Turn: He deployed at the edge of his deployment, so he moved up everything (5 raiders with mix of units inside, 3 venoms with mix of units, 15-20 reavers in a single unit, void bomber and razorwing) Was effectively in my lines ( no charges this turn) His shooting killed 3 squads of infantry in ruins, his jet put a few wounds on my Hydra, almost destroyed my hellhound. My first turn. Brought in 1st Hades squad Drill and squad charged a raider, killing it. Incubi inside. Shooting i put his void bomber on 2nd tier, and killed all reavers except for 4. Random wounds on a couple units. Valkyrie came in and shot some stuff, pretty ineffective. His second turn : killed all the rest of my 98% of my infantry with fire from raiders, tied up Manticore and Basilisk with remaining scatter bikes, killed my hell-hound, His Archon + some killy retinue got out of a venom and cleaned up my bubble wrap around Hydra. Incubi killed my drill + half shotgun "veterans".. His razor wing flew off the table My second turn: Managed to kill the rest of the reavers, Put my Valkyrie in hover mode and shot full BS, not very effective. 2nd Hades came in and tried to kill off Incubi in open, failed charges. Crusaders + priest + coteaz disembarked near his archon + retinue. Got pychic barrier off on crusaders 2+ save now. Multi charged his Archon and Slyth, needed a 6 rolled a 5. Used stratagem to re-roll - and he blocked it with his shenanigan 3 CP stratagem. His third Turn: Incubi charged and killed 2nd Hades squad, He shot my 2+ save crusaders down to 1 man, all remaining infantry were killed ( couple auto pass squads with 1 man left at this point). Tied up all my artillery + Leman russ with infantry from raiders. His HQ got back in the venom and ran away. I had 1 Hydra that could shoot, 2 scout sentinels, Coteaz with Priest + 1 crusader, 2 mortar teams, and 2 company commanders left (including HQ). I conceded here. The whole game i managed to kill 1 raider, a 5 man wych unit, and his 15-20 reavers. Don't know what i could have done differently. Sounds tough, but I have a few bits of advice for you: 1) You have a lot of 1 off units e.g. 1 manticore, 1 basilisk, 1 leman russ, 1 hell hound etc. There is an old saying in the Guard "if it is worth taking once, it is worth taking 3 times". By only having 1 of each unit it makes it easy for your opponant to target priority. 2) You had very little Infantry. Your screens need screens! By turn 2 your screens were gone. In my own 1500 pts army I run at least 100 infantry and I use a "3 line defence" line 1 = cheap infantry squads, either bare bones or with a heavy bolter and plasma depending on the points (used to be conscripts before nerf) line 2 = more infantry squads with more dakka, maybe a couple of hell hounds and bullgryns line 3 = toy breakers, tanks and arty The reason you need 2 screens is it means you have redundancy. Take a look at your infantry. Assume you will lose 40-60 men by turn 2. Thats means after turn 2 (at the latest) the enemy will be running amok in your toy breakers. Thus the natural answer is you need more time to let your boom boom units get to work and the best way to do this is to have more bloody infantry holding them back. Hope this helps What percentage of your points in a given list would you say you allocate to infantry and their upgrades? What kind of detachments are you using with all your infantry squads? Most of your points are solid, the one of each is mainly due to the models I own. My next priorities for guard purchases are more Russes and a baneblade variant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
domsto Posted April 25, 2018 Share Posted April 25, 2018 After i played against Dark Eldar yersterday i can say. Yes it seems to be total normal to get completely destroyed by them before you even had the chance to roll a die. Half my army got wiped out in the shooting phase and the little rest that remained got first Turn charged across the Table. All this happened before my first Turn. So my only option i had left was the good old Table Flip No seriously i gave up after my Enemy ended his FIRST Turn. I had a long chat after the game with my Enemy and neither of us was able to came up with a other Tactic i could have used to survive into turn 2. so i have to join the chor How do you beat this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inso Posted April 25, 2018 Share Posted April 25, 2018 Could having a Stormlord full of troops survive a first turn barrage? How about adding a few fortifications? Lots of Valkyries packed with storm-troopers (deep striking after the Dark Eldar)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
domsto Posted April 25, 2018 Share Posted April 25, 2018 Could having a Stormlord full of troops survive a first turn barrage? How about adding a few fortifications? Lots of Valkyries packed with storm-troopers (deep striking after the Dark Eldar)? i had 32 Sions in Deepstrike but it was already to late to turn the game and with the new Deepstrike rule i would have had wait till turn 2 to deepstrike them anywhere they could do some real damage. Fortifications are a huge waste of points in my Opinion, if i include a Fortification i couldn't afford units to man it. A stormlord could work but i really hate the idea i have to tailor my army against some enemy's to even stand a Chance where is this mysterious "Balancing" everybody talks about when i need it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mordian Glory Posted April 25, 2018 Share Posted April 25, 2018 I ran against an almost identical list this weekend. Here's what i had: Hidden Content Vostroyan Brigade Warlord : Company Commander with Plasma Pistol, Kuirovs Aquila and Grand Strategist 2 Company Commanders 4 Inf Squads with Plasma Guns 2 Inf Squads with Sniper Rifle and Lascannon Astropath w/ Psychic Barrier (baby sat Hydra) Command Squad with 4 Sniper Rifles 8x Crusaders 1 Ministorum Priest with Plasma Gun Artemia Pattern Hellhound 2x Scout Sentinals w/ multilaser Leman Russ Annihilator w/ lascannon HWT with Mortars Hydra Valkyrie with Rocket Pods, Multilaser, Hvy Bolters Catachan Vanguard Primaris Psyker with Mental Fortitude, Nightshroud (babysat Annihilator) 2 Hades Breaching drills squads with 2 plasma in each Master of Oridinance Basilisk Manticore Auxillary Detatchment: Inquisitor Coteaz with Terrrify Coteaz, Crusaders and Priest rode in Valkyrie. He went first: Deployed Football style, tons of LOS blocking terrain and ruins. We played new faq /beta rules with increased CP and deep strike restrictions. Night fight rule was in effect 1st turn. in back left corner i set up my Artillery + mortars + Annihilator outside of LOS, 4 Squads of infantry bubble-wrap in ruins. Other corner i put 2 squads + snipers in ruins + astropath and Wyvern. Hades + Valkyrie squad were in reserve. His first Turn: He deployed at the edge of his deployment, so he moved up everything (5 raiders with mix of units inside, 3 venoms with mix of units, 15-20 reavers in a single unit, void bomber and razorwing) Was effectively in my lines ( no charges this turn) His shooting killed 3 squads of infantry in ruins, his jet put a few wounds on my Hydra, almost destroyed my hellhound. My first turn. Brought in 1st Hades squad Drill and squad charged a raider, killing it. Incubi inside. Shooting i put his void bomber on 2nd tier, and killed all reavers except for 4. Random wounds on a couple units. Valkyrie came in and shot some stuff, pretty ineffective. His second turn : killed all the rest of my 98% of my infantry with fire from raiders, tied up Manticore and Basilisk with remaining scatter bikes, killed my hell-hound, His Archon + some killy retinue got out of a venom and cleaned up my bubble wrap around Hydra. Incubi killed my drill + half shotgun "veterans".. His razor wing flew off the table My second turn: Managed to kill the rest of the reavers, Put my Valkyrie in hover mode and shot full BS, not very effective. 2nd Hades came in and tried to kill off Incubi in open, failed charges. Crusaders + priest + coteaz disembarked near his archon + retinue. Got pychic barrier off on crusaders 2+ save now. Multi charged his Archon and Slyth, needed a 6 rolled a 5. Used stratagem to re-roll - and he blocked it with his shenanigan 3 CP stratagem. His third Turn: Incubi charged and killed 2nd Hades squad, He shot my 2+ save crusaders down to 1 man, all remaining infantry were killed ( couple auto pass squads with 1 man left at this point). Tied up all my artillery + Leman russ with infantry from raiders. His HQ got back in the venom and ran away. I had 1 Hydra that could shoot, 2 scout sentinels, Coteaz with Priest + 1 crusader, 2 mortar teams, and 2 company commanders left (including HQ). I conceded here. The whole game i managed to kill 1 raider, a 5 man wych unit, and his 15-20 reavers. Don't know what i could have done differently. Sounds tough, but I have a few bits of advice for you: 1) You have a lot of 1 off units e.g. 1 manticore, 1 basilisk, 1 leman russ, 1 hell hound etc. There is an old saying in the Guard "if it is worth taking once, it is worth taking 3 times". By only having 1 of each unit it makes it easy for your opponant to target priority. 2) You had very little Infantry. Your screens need screens! By turn 2 your screens were gone. In my own 1500 pts army I run at least 100 infantry and I use a "3 line defence" line 1 = cheap infantry squads, either bare bones or with a heavy bolter and plasma depending on the points (used to be conscripts before nerf) line 2 = more infantry squads with more dakka, maybe a couple of hell hounds and bullgryns line 3 = toy breakers, tanks and arty The reason you need 2 screens is it means you have redundancy. Take a look at your infantry. Assume you will lose 40-60 men by turn 2. Thats means after turn 2 (at the latest) the enemy will be running amok in your toy breakers. Thus the natural answer is you need more time to let your boom boom units get to work and the best way to do this is to have more bloody infantry holding them back. Hope this helps What percentage of your points in a given list would you say you allocate to infantry and their upgrades? What kind of detachments are you using with all your infantry squads? Most of your points are solid, the one of each is mainly due to the models I own. My next priorities for guard purchases are more Russes and a baneblade variant. I normally go for a rough 50/50 split so in my 2000 pts list I go for 800-1000pts of infantry. I like to run 12 Infantry Squads and 3 Veteran Squads split across a Brigade and a Battalion. I always aim for about 120-150 "Line Infantry" Model collection is always a tricky one. My advice is to scour ebay on a weekly basis and keep an eye of for great deals. Try to avoid paying more then £1 per guardsmen and £3 per heavy weapon. Russes can be picked up for about £20. Bane blades are cool, but dark eldar are very good at picking a target and surgically removing it. However they are really cool and super powerful! If you can keep it alive it will dominate games Dark Eldar seem really popular atm, maybe its time for us to bring some proper anti flyer... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spafe Posted April 25, 2018 Share Posted April 25, 2018 Have you considered switching to mordians for the inf? Even if you only end up with half a squad, they can pump out a ton of firepower... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Withershadow Posted April 25, 2018 Share Posted April 25, 2018 I gave an extensive list of things to do against Drukhari a page or two back. A lot of these difficulties sound like not being familiar with the army and it’s threat ranges, as well as throwing down really unfocused lists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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