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Unusual units in 8th?

8th Space Marines Rare

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#1
Astartes Consul

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So, something that has been on my mind as someone who has yet to play any 8th edition is, what units from the codex do you only see or use rarely? Not in ultra-competitive games but on a more regular, casual basis. 

 

I'm interested out of a mix of idle curiosity and also wanting to try and incorporate some lesser used or seen units in my collection. 


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#2
N1SB

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I am curious about this, too, from other metas.  Speaking just for myself, I have not seen anyone use:

 

Inceptors - all other Primaris seems to get some use.  Intercessors and Hellblasters are increasingly common.  I've heard some people use Aggressors (particularly for Salamanders and Raven Guard) and I see them being built.  Inceptors, the jump pack assault bolter Primaris, have yet to be fielded from what I've seen.  Why this stands out to me is my Warhammer Store has 3 Inceptors painted and just sitting there for demo games and the manager is happy for us to borrow them and try them out (to encourage try & buy, etc.), but no one has.  Considering they can accompany classic Space Marine Captain w/ jump packs, which are a common default HQ here, the lack of Inceptors is noticeable.  Not saying they're competitive or not for their points, just noting their absence (Edit: I found they're slowly being added to Deathwatch for their special fall back rule).

 

Hunter/Stalker tanks - I don't see these very often, but that's not surprising.  Partly, Dreadnoughts seem to have become the go-to Astartes Heavy Weapons vehicle platform here, so you don't need the Hunter or Stalker.  Then in the case of the Stalker, an anti-air tank, EditFlyers AIRCRAFT aren't as common or as threatening as in 7th ed (in fact, there are plenty of Flying things now).  Thus, again they're kinda absent, but I can understand why (I now think it's time to re-think the Stalker tank).

 

Centurions - was pretty popular in 7th, now absent in 8th.  Probably just seen as too expensive.

 

The meta has competitive and casual players, but so far (and it might change or someone may be fielding these that I haven't noticed), these aren't just rare but non-existent on the tabletop.  That might change with a new Chapter Approved, etc.


Edited by N1SB, 20 July 2018 - 10:15 PM.

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#3
MARK0SIAN

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Personally, I’m yet to see the following in any match I’ve played (I’m not saying they’re never played though, just that I haven’t seen them myself):

Hunter/Stalker
Vindicator
Honour Guard
Centurions (either type)

A lot of the other units are also pretty rare sights but I have seen them.

Edit - I should also say I’ve never seen normal Assault marines actually played as Assault marines, they’re normally ‘counts as’ for Vanguard Veterans.

Edited by MARK0SIAN, 16 July 2018 - 05:42 PM.


#4
justicarius6

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I'm pretty much the main space marine player in my group and so far I've yet to use Vindicators, Drop Pods, Ironclad Dreadnoughts, basic librarians (Tiggy has been used a few times), Thunderfire Cannons, Assault Centurions, Assault Marines, Honour Guard, Company Veterans, Landspeeders, Hunters, any primaris HQs, terminators (normal, assault, cata or tarty), biker squads, servitors, or attack bikes.

#5
Vykes

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I've never actually seen a Stalker or Hunter on the table at all... ever.  But, with Imperial Fists, Space Wolves, and Iron Warriors bumbling about locally, I've seen pretty much everything else from Primaris to Imperial Armour stuff fairly recently including Sicaran Venators, Typhons, even a Deathstorm... which was weird as I was sure those were scraped for 8th.

 

Overall rare units though, I'd say attack bikes, specialist Land Raiders (Crusaders/Redeemers), company champions and ancients, vindicators, and assault marines are rare.  Usually they're the province of just one or maaaaybe two players.  But almost everything is pretty decently represented and used in some of our collections.  Bolter Centurions got a surprising resurgence, and our Death Wing Dark Angels player inspired most others to pick up and use terminators pretty heavily.  


Edited by Vykes, 16 July 2018 - 04:20 PM.

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#6
Kallas

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Inceptors - all other Primaris seems to get some use. Intercessors and Hellblasters are increasingly common. I've heard some people use Aggressors (particularly for Salamanders and Raven Guard) and I see them being built. Inceptors, the jump pack assault bolter Primaris, have yet to be fielded from what I've seen. Why this stands out to me is my Warhammer Store has 3 Inceptors painted and just sitting there for demo games and the manager is happy for us to borrow them and try them out (to encourage try & buy, etc.), but no one has. Considering they can accompany classic Space Marine Captain w/ jump packs, which are a common default HQ here, the lack of Inceptors is noticeable. Not saying they're competitive or not for their points, just noting their absence.


That certainly is odd! Inceptor performance is excellent; though I can understand that they're definitely somewhat odd from a model perspective.

#7
Rik Lightstar

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Inceptors were definitely over costed on release but seem about right now.

Hunters just need an "indirect fire" rule and they'd be worth 90 points for a S9 AP-3 Dam D6 60" range weapon that hits on 3+ with a reroll and 2+ vs flyers.

Stalkers would be pretty solid if they didn't get the penalty to hit non-flying targets.

Centurions are pretty much the same points as Dreadnoughts, but with 3 wounds not 8 and toughness 5 not 7. They need a major points cut.

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#8
Basteala

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Hunter, Stalker, and Vindicator are all rarely seen in my meta. I don't see the Thunderfire cannon very often, nor do I see the Stormhawk. 

 

Very few Contemptors oddly enough. Hm.



#9
Brother Adelard

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I saw a guy with three vindicators on Sunday, I can't understand why, they suck. I converted mine to a Laser Destroyer and all of a sudden it terrifies people!
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#10
sfPanzer

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Vindicators would be alright with like 12" more range imo. The short range on a heavy weapon non-FLY tank really hurts.


Disclaimer:

If my posts appear rude to you, I apologize. It's not meant to be rude in any way, it's just the way folks are in my country. It's really more about being direct than being rude. I know how it's perceived in the english speaking community and I already try to tone it down but I barely notice when it's too much since it's normal for me.


So yeah, I'm really not rude it's basically just cultural differences that act against me here. Again, I apologize.

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#11
Iron Father Ferrum

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I love my Hunter and use it often, but I'm going to build the Stalker turret and try that. Fly is actually a pretty common keyword, especially in tourney settings (Shining Spears, Eldar grav tanks of every stripe, every Tau battlesuit, Flyrants, Winged Daemon Princes, both Chaos Primarchs...) and 6 shots hitting on 2s with enough strength to wound most targets on a 3 or 4 doing two damage a shot isn't bad at all.

But then again, an observation I've made over the last six months or so since I've been more actively playing the game is that I tend to take - and use effectively - what are considered by more...shall we say conventionally-minded players to be oddball or less-efficient units. I use Storm Talons, Storm Hawks, Thunderfire Cannons, Hunter, lasplas Razorbacks, and I'm going to try a full armored list with a Vindicator and an LRR in the near future. Partially its because I despise cookie cutter lists but I also like to catch opponents off guard, and things like a Storm of Fire Captain and LT supporting paired TFCs is capable of doing an amazing amount of damage across a huge swath of the board and it's so beyond the pale that no one can tech against it.
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#12
Brother Adelard

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Vindicators would be alright with like 12" more range imo. The short range on a heavy weapon non-FLY tank really hurts.


The laser destroyer's volley cannon is 36" two firing modes means it can either dish out two S10,AP-5,D6 shots. Or, potentially 4 S9, D3 shots.
The downside of the S10 shots is that hit rolls of 1 cause 3 mortal wounds.
Still, the 4 shot version makes it a cheaper, tougher annihilator.
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#13
Firepower

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Vindis arguably got hurt more than any other SM unit with 8ths rules. They simply can't do near the damage they should/could to hordes with the new non-template rules.

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#14
Nalim

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Inceptors were definitely over costed on release but seem about right now.
 

 

I think they had some very good months between CA and the March/April FAQ. Hell, I even built, painted and used 12 Plasma Inceptors during that time. The deepstrike nerf hit them just as everyone else, though. Bolter Inceptors are still useful against expensive MEQ like Devastators, but these are rare too.



#15
N1SB

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I love my Hunter and use it often, but I'm going to build the Stalker turret and try that. Fly is actually a pretty common keyword, especially in tourney settings (Shining Spears, Eldar grav tanks of every stripe, every Tau battlesuit, Flyrants, Winged Daemon Princes, both Chaos Primarchs...) and 6 shots hitting on 2s with enough strength to wound most targets on a 3 or 4 doing two damage a shot isn't bad at all.

 

Thanks for correcting my thinking about the Stalker tank.  I use TWO Winged Daemon Princes in 1000 pts...I should've known better.

 

I think I made the same fallacy maybe others in my meta have, which explains the lack of Stalker tanks: people still think of Flyers as Aircraft.  By that, I mean things like the Valkyrie or Heldrakes or Dakka Jets.  However, if anything, there are more things with the Fly keyword that the Stalker tank specialises against.

 

This is such a great point, not just about this one unit, the Stalker tank, but I think people here are still adjusting to the changes in 8th.  We're not fully settled in yet.  And I'm guessing that once most people have settled in...a new Chapter Approved will jostle things up again.


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#16
Iron Father Ferrum

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That lack of understanding can be exploited on the tabletop. I burned down a Wolf Lord with jump pack and storm shield using my Storm Hawk. He was completely unprepared for me needing 2s to hit and not really be bothered by the storm shield.

The look on the face of an Eldar player when I knocked half his Shining Spears out of the sky for the same reasons will be a treasured memory.
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#17
RandomMarine

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Aggressors very rarely see the table outside of RG . I always run plasceptors but seem to be the only person doing so.
Apocathries in any form .

Something that surprises me is how little I see techmarines. They are a solid HQ IMO. Good access to weapons ,bs2+ ,2+ save and pretty cheap

#18
Harrowmaster

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I'm gonna contest the apothecary point, I haven't played a game in 8th with my marines where I didn't bring at least one apothecary (if not two), they're great with hellblasters or sternguard to give them staying power. 

 

Edit: Also I've used one with the teeth a couple of times and its hilarious cause the opponent tends to underestimate him.


Edited by Harrowmaster, 23 July 2018 - 10:37 AM.

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#19
Iron Father Ferrum

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Something that surprises me is how little I see techmarines. They are a solid HQ IMO. Good access to weapons ,bs2+ ,2+ save and pretty cheap


They pack a lot of firepower in a relatively cheap package. I was using a harness+combi-plasma one to support a Tac Squad in Razorback but I've swapped him out for a conversion beamer in my latest list. It never hurts to get more S8 guns in the field.
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#20
sfPanzer

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Aggressors very rarely see the table outside of RG . I always run plasceptors but seem to be the only person doing so.
Apocathries in any form .

Something that surprises me is how little I see techmarines. They are a solid HQ IMO. Good access to weapons ,bs2+ ,2+ save and pretty cheap

 

Inceptors suffered a lot from the beta rules but they are still very solid imo.

Apothecaries are often seen with GK since they wear Terminator armor and pack a punch with their Thunderhammer while also being psyker of course. Otherwise they don't offer that much since Marines simply die too fast and you'd probably be better of just taking more Marines instead.

 

The reason why you rarely see Techmarines is probably because other HQ options are much more useful and once you included those you already have so many points in HQs that you're better off investing those points into actual units.


Disclaimer:

If my posts appear rude to you, I apologize. It's not meant to be rude in any way, it's just the way folks are in my country. It's really more about being direct than being rude. I know how it's perceived in the english speaking community and I already try to tone it down but I barely notice when it's too much since it's normal for me.


So yeah, I'm really not rude it's basically just cultural differences that act against me here. Again, I apologize.

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#21
Aegir_Einarsson

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TFC? I havn’t seen any for a while. Overcosted „No need LoS” weapon. Only usefull when you want use tremor shells. It’s a pity, because model is Great. Next minus is that you need techmarine tax.
If it have rule: If you take any techmarine you can add one TFC to your army, would be Great. Cheap durable HQ And Nice fire support.

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#22
CCE1981

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The techmarine with you Thunder Fire Cannon can fire while your techmarine is repairing your fire sipport dreadnoughts.

#23
Aegir_Einarsson

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Right but If they’re CLose enough he can do both

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#24
Iron Father Ferrum

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Actually the Techmarine doesn't fire the TFC. He has to be within 3" but it shoots on it's own which means the Techmarine can fire his own guns as well if enemies are close enough. This happens about half the time in my experience since the guns are common targets for deep strikers.
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