The Different Legions and HQ's - A discussion

[Leonite]

Simply put, I want this thread to be about discussing what kind of HQ's would be most effective regarding each specific legion trait in the Heretic Astartes Codex. Sure it'd be easy to say "Daemon Prince" for all of them, but I also want to encourage people to think outside the box, make suggestions you think could be fun or commentate on the choices of others.

 

To start with, I would like to suggest for the Emperor's Children and a Biker Lord with a Power Sword + Intoxicating Elixer/the Murder Sword/Power Weapon and Blissgiver. Something with a decent amount of shooting on his own while also being able to cut down small units himself. Put him in a Slaaneshi Biker Squad and suddenly that shooting becomes much more frightening for hordes.

 

So, what do you guys think?

[Midnight Brotherhood]

Night Lords - Jump pack Chaos Lord HQ with Claws of the Black Hunt relic with Night Haunters warlord trait for rerolling charges, teamed up with 2x 5 man squads of Raptors with 2 Plasma Guns and a combi plasma in each squad with one squad nurgle marked having an icon of despair, the other squad is slaanesh marked.

 

They all come down together, supercharge ALL the plasma putting out 12 shots re-rolling ones. Slaanesh squad does endless cacophony for another 6 supercharged shots re-rolling ones so 18 altogether. - average TEN dead MEQ models.

 

Charge with both Raptor units and the Lord, inflict even more casualties in CC (average SEVEN dead MEQ models) and then watch the rest run away as they try to pass leadership on -5 (-3 from 3x Night Lord units, -1 Icon of despair, -1 Raptor's fearsome visage) + casualties inflicted on top of that from the shooting and fight phases.

 

It's brutal, visually awesome and incredibly fluffy for Night Lords. I love it.

[Dragonlover]

Ok, let's run through what I've got in my various armies. I'm not saying they're the perfect archetypical ones, but they work for me.

 

World Eaters: Lord on bike with Murder Sword, Jump Pack Lord with power axe, Dark Apostle, Exalted Champion with power axe.

 

The two lords accompany two units of their respective transport method, the Apostle and Champion are in Rhinos with Berserkers.

 

Alpha Legion: Lord with Hydra Blade, Terminator Sorcerer with force axe and combi plas.

 

Lord sits with my firebase and has the Blade because why not, while the sorcerer drops in with some combi-plasma termies and supports them/any cultists that are still around.

 

Iron Warriors: Lord with power maul and combi flamer, Sorcerer with force axe, naked Lord.

 

Equipped Lord and Sorcerer in Rhinos with Chosen, naked Lord sits with my Preds and Contemptor so they get rerolls.

 

Dragonlover

[Leonite]

Night Lords - Jump pack Chaos Lord HQ with Claws of the Black Hunt relic with Night Haunters warlord trait for rerolling charges, teamed up with 2x 5 man squads of Raptors with 2 Plasma Guns and a combi plasma in each squad with one squad nurgle marked having an icon of despair, the other squad is slaanesh marked.

 

They all come down together, supercharge ALL the plasma putting out 12 shots re-rolling ones. Slaanesh squad does endless cacophony for another 6 supercharged shots re-rolling ones so 18 altogether. - average TEN dead MEQ models.

 

Charge with both Raptor units and the Lord, inflict even more casualties in CC (average SEVEN dead MEQ models) and then watch the rest run away as they try to pass leadership on -5 (-3 from 3x Night Lord units, -1 Icon of despair, -1 Raptor's fearsome visage) + casualties inflicted on top of that from the shooting and fight phases.

 

It's brutal, visually awesome and incredibly fluffy for Night Lords. I love it.

 

I like, I like. Very fluffy indeed

 

 

Ok, let's run through what I've got in my various armies. I'm not saying they're the perfect archetypical ones, but they work for me.

 

World Eaters: Lord on bike with Murder Sword, Jump Pack Lord with power axe, Dark Apostle, Exalted Champion with power axe.

 

The two lords accompany two units of their respective transport method, the Apostle and Champion are in Rhinos with Berserkers.

 

Alpha Legion: Lord with Hydra Blade, Terminator Sorcerer with force axe and combi plas.

 

Lord sits with my firebase and has the Blade because why not, while the sorcerer drops in with some combi-plasma termies and supports them/any cultists that are still around.

 

Iron Warriors: Lord with power maul and combi flamer, Sorcerer with force axe, naked Lord.

 

Equipped Lord and Sorcerer in Rhinos with Chosen, naked Lord sits with my Preds and Contemptor so they get rerolls.

 

Dragonlover

Oh, then aside from my Word Bearers (I have basically everything there) I should mention...

 

World Eaters/Berserker Cult Word Bearers: Lightning Claw Lord, Power Axe Lord, either able to equip Jump Packs or not. Naked Exalted Champion. Power Axe armed Juggerlord.

 

Emperors Children: Sorcerer or Lord with Force/Power Sword (Converted from Palatine Blade model), Terminator Lord/Sorceror conversion in process with Combi-Plasma and Power/Force... uh... weapon. (Custom built Cat o'Nine Tails style whip with Lightning Claw Claws attached. Not sure what to make it yet)

 

Admittedly I asked beca

[Ketzer]

Outside the box?

Any Legion: Lord with two Plasmapistols to support Havocs or other backfield stuff.

Alpha Legion: Lord with Blade of the Hydra (already mentioned) but with additional Chainsword and Flames of Spite. Mortal Wonds on a 6 and probably some more attacks thanks to DTTFE - and dirt cheap.

[WarriorFish]

I've had a lot of success with my Slaaneshi Lord - two Lightning Claws, Intoxicating Elixir and Flames of Spite. He reaps a fearsome tally and does great running with other troops both as an aura and helping handle things they'd rather not :) Daemon Prince version hits harder of course, but is also a huge fire magnet for it which along with his footprint and cost isn't always for the best.

[Deadass]

Something I came up with for the Black Legion is a Dark Apostle with the Black Mace and the First Amongst Traitors trait. He's an amazing buff for a squad of Berzerkers with Chainswords fighting against the Imperium, as rerolling everything in melee and DttFE on a 5+ can mean quite a lot of exploding dice, and while a nearby Sorcerer casting Prescience on the 'Zerkers might not be very fluffy, it definetely increases their deadliness by a huge margin.

[Leonite]

Something I came up with for the Black Legion is a Dark Apostle with the Black Mace and the First Amongst Traitors trait. He's an amazing buff for a squad of Berzerkers with Chainswords fighting against the Imperium, as rerolling everything in melee and DttFE on a 5+ can mean quite a lot of exploding dice, and while a nearby Sorcerer casting Prescience on the 'Zerkers might not be very fluffy, it definetely increases their deadliness by a huge margin.

I actually like that. It sounds like a blood priest of Khorne. Sounds like something the Black Legion or the World Eaters might have.

[Helicus]

For Iron Warriors, I've been running a Warpsmith with combi-melta and mark of Slaanesh, usually in a Termite with plasma havocs. 2 melta shots hitting on a 2+ (and a flamer), using endless cacophony if needed. He can also drop some mortal wounds on vehicles using machine curse and Daemon shell if needed, or heal the Termite.

[Tallarn Commander]

I agree with Midnight Brotherhood that a raptor lord with Claws of the Black Hunt does Yeoman's work for Night Lords warbands. I've also had success with a biker sorcerer or raptor sorcerer moving up behind my advancing raptors, bikers, and maulerfiend and buffing them with prescience and/or warptime.

 

With my World Eaters I can't say enough about an Exalted Champion buffing the main line (and DPs are great as well).

[GreaterChickenofTzeentch]

Outside the box?

Any Legion: Lord with two Plasmapistols to support Havocs or other backfield stuff.

Alpha Legion: Lord with Blade of the Hydra (already mentioned) but with additional Chainsword and Flames of Spite. Mortal Wonds on a 6 and probably some more attacks thanks to DTTFE - and dirt cheap.

Flames of Spite Lord is a beast. I run mine in World Eaters with 2 chainswords, the Brass Collar, and an Exalted Champion nearby.

 

Ran those two into a 5 man Deathwatch kill team all with Stormshields. Just the Mortals killed all 5.

[Trevak Dal]

I'm leaning towards a world eaters exalted champion with lightning claws and a dark apostle. Might crack out my Juggerlords (there were three blood crusher models and somebody gave me the sprue other one...what was I supposed to do? "Four Juggerlords of the Apocalypse" sounded cool and were my CSMs only answer to Wraith Knights in 7th) though I imagine powerfist/lightning claws aren't in Vogue anymore.

[TrawlingCleaner]

I know they're not technically a legion, but does anyone have any tips for Renegades? There's only two relics to choose from and Huron is very okay in my opinion. Maybe I haven't given him enough of a chance

[GreaterChickenofTzeentch]

For Renegades, go Index and use a Lord on a Bike. Go with mounted combi-bolter and a combi-Flamer or Melta. Allows him to Advance a guaranteed 6, fire, and charge (melta or flamer only of course). For CC weapons, go with high strength stuff like Axes and fists because you don't have Vets of the Long War.

[Leonite]

I'm leaning towards a world eaters exalted champion with lightning claws and a dark apostle. Might crack out my Juggerlords (there were three blood crusher models and somebody gave me the sprue other one...what was I supposed to do? "Four Juggerlords of the Apocalypse" sounded cool and were my CSMs only answer to Wraith Knights in 7th) though I imagine powerfist/lightning claws aren't in Vogue anymore.

You see them far less, yes. Honestly I have my own Juggerlord, only used him at the debut of the edition but he was a surprisingly killy addition to my list.

[TrawlingCleaner]

For Renegades, go Index and use a Lord on a Bike. Go with mounted combi-bolter and a combi-Flamer or Melta. Allows him to Advance a guaranteed 6, fire, and charge (melta or flamer only of course). For CC weapons, go with high strength stuff like Axes and fists because you don't have Vets of the Long War.

Would the black mace work as well?

[GreaterChickenofTzeentch]

 

For Renegades, go Index and use a Lord on a Bike. Go with mounted combi-bolter and a combi-Flamer or Melta. Allows him to Advance a guaranteed 6, fire, and charge (melta or flamer only of course). For CC weapons, go with high strength stuff like Axes and fists because you don't have Vets of the Long War.

Would the black mace work as well?

 

It should, yeah.

[Midnightmare]

Terminator Khorne Lords; what are we thinking for one of them? I was thinking Combi-Melta/Axe of Blind Fury? What do people think of the AoBF in it's 8th edition form? Not as good as the Black Mace? Also looking at a Chainfist or dropping the melta for twin Lightening Claws

 

Just to Clarify - This Lord will be for Black Legion smaller games when Abaddon is more cost prohibitive, dropping in with either a melta-toting or plasma-toting Terminators bodyguard, and likely a Sorcerer.

[Khornestar]

The lack of re-rolling 1’s/hitting friendlies within an inch is a real bummer for the AoBF, though the damage output is good. I think I’d go with it over the black mace because it’s more thematic for my dudes, but I don’t think it’s good enough to justify the down-sides overall.

 

Either choice brings a juggerlord to S8, or unmounted/biker lord to S7, so that alone is pretty neat. I don’t think S7 is all that special, whereas S8 is gonna help with wounding most targets without the -1 to hit from a power fist.

 

I dunno though, I’m not terribly enthused about chaos lords this edition. Daemon princes are much better close combat fighters, and the dark Apostle/exalted champ are much better for providing buffs. Maybe a bit too gamey of an attitude, but genuine. Of course, they help with shooting, whereas the other 2 power armored HQs don’t, so there is that role.

[Midnightmare]

Yeah I was kind of thinking that when comparing the AoBF to the Mace - I think I am going to be modelling a few hefty maces for my Lords I think.

 

I here what you are saying for the Lords in general, I used to love my old AoBF Juggerlord - such a beast when he rolled high!!

 

EDIT - sp

[Trevak Dal]

Axe of blind fury is a "so you want to pretend to be Khârn without kharns benefits?" Relic. Or if you wanted another guy to teamkill your own guys for little benefit "because it's funny". If you still got +d6 attacks or got 2d6 attacks like blood reaper or whatever then it'd be a trade-off, as it is, it's been "Balanced for being previously too good" or at least it feels that way.

 

I'm more than a little annoyed with the stuff I'm seeing out of space wolves. But this is why you paint your army in general tones and don't use special characters.

[SanguinaryGuardsman]

I've had a lot of success with my Slaaneshi Lord - two Lightning Claws, Intoxicating Elixir and Flames of Spite. He reaps a fearsome tally and does great running with other troops both as an aura and helping handle things they'd rather not Daemon Prince version hits harder of course, but is also a huge fire magnet for it which along with his footprint and cost isn't always for the best.

 

I killed 22 ork boyz with this loadout using the Excess or Violence stratagem and VoTLW.  

[Deadass]

Terminator Khorne Lords; what are we thinking for one of them? I was thinking Combi-Melta/Axe of Blind Fury? What do people think of the AoBF in it's 8th edition form? Not as good as the Black Mace? Also looking at a Chainfist or dropping the melta for twin Lightening Claws

 

Just to Clarify - This Lord will be for Black Legion smaller games when Abaddon is more cost prohibitive, dropping in with either a melta-toting or plasma-toting Terminators bodyguard, and likely a Sorcerer.

 

I've seen people give the Axe to Chaos Lords on buffing duty. He'd stay in your back with your fire base enabling you to reroll 1s while acting as a bit of a deterrent towards deepstriking units intending to rid you of your fire support. Give him a jump pack to get around a bit faster, and enemies should think twice about putting pressure on your big guns!

[Kierdale]

How would you arm an Iron Warrior TDA lord dropping in with Slaaneshi IW Obliterators?

[Khornestar]

Combi-plasma + power something, probably.