Think Tank: Hypothesizing SW Unit Combo's, Options, Etc.

[munocat]

I loving that scouts have behind enemy lines, works like on the hunt. Cheap units, I am running a 5 man unit with Melta and a combi Melta wolf guard park leader. Another with flamer and combi flamer. A group with sniper rifles.

[CCE1981]

I think Black Death is a Frost Weapon, so a Runepriest can’t take it.

 

I came up with him earlier, but ling thread so whatever, I also gave Murderous Hurricane. Against 18 guys it’s an average of 3 kills but a big potential for more and not likely to grt noe.

[TiguriusX]

Blood Angels get Smaguinious to smash monsters, SpaceWolves get the blender for hordes:

 

Runes Priest with Jump Pack, Armor of Russ, Ruinic Axe, Muderous Hurricane and Fury of the Wolf Spirits. For 9x Str 5 AP -2/-3 attacks for about 120pts.

You did indeed put it first. credit is deserved and recognized.

 

The rune priest with fury of wolf spirits is going to surprise the hell out of hordes when fighting twice

 

Makes a strong candidate to follow WL and WGBL around playing hero hammer

[PeteySödes]

 

Blood Angels get Smaguinious to smash monsters, SpaceWolves get the blender for hordes:

 

Runes Priest with Jump Pack, Armor of Russ, Ruinic Axe, Muderous Hurricane and Fury of the Wolf Spirits. For 9x Str 5 AP -2/-3 attacks for about 120pts.

You did indeed put it first. credit is deserved and recognized.

 

The rune priest with fury of wolf spirits is going to surprise the hell out of hordes when fighting twice

 

Makes a strong candidate to follow WL and WGBL around playing hero hammer

 

 

I see Fury as more of a defensive move, seems incredibly inefficient to run one headlong into a tarpit.

[TiguriusX]

 

 

 

I see Fury as more of a defensive move, seems incredibly inefficient to run one headlong into a tarpit.

 

 

It is a scalpel but I guess "defensive" depends on how you define it and use it.

 

If you manage to cast the spell in your psychic phase you are definitely diving in to do the blender job on a horde of chaff

 

The tactical flexibility saves you a ton of points in your army building.

 

Comparison for perspective

Pre codex our WG Bikers with SB were amazing at clearing chaff because they spit out 40 shots (200+ points)

 

The fury of the wolf spirit buff on a RP can put out 20 attacks if you spend CP to fight twice.  Those attacks are all at WS2 with decent AP and S 

Comparable chaff clearing for free (*you pay CP to do this)!

 

Fewer attacks but much more reliable (WS2 with good S and AP)

 

Run this RP near your storm cannon leviathan (chooser of the slain...character blocking etc.)

 

Your small 4 unit formation (leviathan + 3 heros) has the potential to chew through many different unit types

 

The synergy is off the charts

 

Oooooooh I can't wait to field test this stuff!

[PeteySödes]

Yea by defensively I mean what you said essentially. Deterrence and flexibility. He can guard a backline and if i cast that and telegraph Chooser of the slain Im daring them to drop some backfield clearers T2. 

[Jorin Helm-splitter]

I like that cunning of the wolf isn't limited to one use (you can use a stratagem multiple times during deployment). You can use to outflank something (I'm trying to use it with 6 agressors with bolters, fairly fast with assault weapons and fists for CC), or to protect a unit of long fangs if your going second. You can move them onto the table during your first turn as long as they're in your deployment zone, and keen senses will let you shoot without any negative modifiers. Which is pretty important with how knight heavy some metas are.

[M.Redbeard]

 

 

 

Something else that will be fun is using the strategem to place a unit of Hellblasters or Long Fangs “On the Hunt”.

Really my favorite is a squad of bolter Aggressors. That way they are in range in turn one, and with my lists, I'll have so many high priority targets, I doubt anyone is going to blow them off the table the turn they arrive, and turn two they will be absolutely brutal

You cant outflank turn 1 under the beta rules for reserves.

Codex trumps rules, codex says any turn, so yes turn 1.

It may trump rules but FAQs trump Codex. And this is a FAQ Beta rule...

 

And the melee hurricane RP is nice, but aside from a surprise I don't see him working that well by himself. He needa support and using 3 points for Honour the Chapter on 10 attacks while good, I don't see it as great. Compare that to give Wulfen the ability to strike again.

 

For melee blender... I think the idea of Chaplain Dread with Wulfenstone and Saga of the Wolfkin might hold some water. Give +2 attacks after saga activated, and +1 S to all SW near him, and Wisdom of the ancients to reroll to 1's to hit. Just add a WGBL with armour of Russ and you get cheap DC thaf can blend MEQs due to sheer numbers, amd any of our troops get the benefit (4 attacks TWC with Frost Swords, and add a TH for your smiting needs). Also thanks to the WGBL and stratagem you reroll all the ones. Ans Wulfen wound Shield Captains on a 2+. Which is nice

[CCE1981]

Unfortunetly Chaplain Dreadnought does “NOT” give +1 str to units near him, only against units he is in melee with. Wish he gave that and Chaplain auras but sadly no :(

 

Edit:

The rule is written weird, you have to be in combat with a unit he is in combat with to get that +1 str. AND it only applies to individual models.

[M.Redbeard]

Unfortunetly Chaplain Dreadnought does “NOT” give +1 str to units near him, only against units he is in melee with. Wish he gave that and Chaplain auras but sadly no :(

 

Edit:

The rule is written weird, you have to be in combat with a unit he is in combat with to get that +1 str. AND it only applies to individual models.

My error. Still as a part of a deathball and with HI he can easily give those bonuses. And with 41 atracks on GH if he gets into combat too the enemy can say goodby to the unit

 

Edit: seeing it it gives +1 Strength to the models that are in combat with the same unit the CD. So juat multicharge and you can get a decent aura.

[vigitant]

 

Unfortunetly Chaplain Dreadnought does “NOT” give +1 str to units near him, only against units he is in melee with. Wish he gave that and Chaplain auras but sadly no

 

Edit:

The rule is written weird, you have to be in combat with a unit he is in combat with to get that +1 str. AND it only applies to individual models.

My error. Still as a part of a deathball and with HI he can easily give those bonuses. And with 41 atracks on GH if he gets into combat too the enemy can say goodby to the unit

 

Edit: seeing it it gives +1 Strength to the models that are in combat with the same unit the CD. So juat multicharge and you can get a decent aura.

 

It'll be especially useful collapsing on a knight.  Armor relic prevents the knight from interrupting, ChapVen makes your TH's S10.  No more knight.

[M.Redbeard]

 

 

 

Unfortunetly Chaplain Dreadnought does “NOT” give +1 str to units near him, only against units he is in melee with. Wish he gave that and Chaplain auras but sadly no

 

Edit:

The rule is written weird, you have to be in combat with a unit he is in combat with to get that +1 str. AND it only applies to individual models.

My error. Still as a part of a deathball and with HI he can easily give those bonuses. And with 41 atracks on GH if he gets into combat too the enemy can say goodby to the unit

 

Edit: seeing it it gives +1 Strength to the models that are in combat with the same unit the CD. So juat multicharge and you can get a decent aura.

It'll be especially useful collapsing on a knight. Armor relic prevents the knight from interrupting, ChapVen makes your TH's S10. No more knight.

And if it is TWC the Knight can't step over them if he survives, and is forced to fight las. It is not a bad melee blender and versatile I think.

[CCE1981]

 

Unfortunetly Chaplain Dreadnought does “NOT” give +1 str to units near him, only against units he is in melee with. Wish he gave that and Chaplain auras but sadly no :(

 

Edit:

The rule is written weird, you have to be in combat with a unit he is in combat with to get that +1 str. AND it only applies to individual models.

My error. Still as a part of a deathball and with HI he can easily give those bonuses. And with 41 atracks on GH if he gets into combat too the enemy can say goodby to the unit

 

Edit: seeing it it gives +1 Strength to the models that are in combat with the same unit the CD. So juat multicharge and you can get a decent aura.

No worries, I remembered it was incredible niche, but as you stated you work around it and you can get some cool combo’s from it.

[L30n1d4s]

I think the "Wulfen Lord" (referenced a few posts ago... TH, SS, JP, Wulfen Stone, Saga of the Wolfkin) will be quite powerful, especially if paired with an allied Jump Pack SM Librarian "squire" with the Might of Heroes and Veil of Time powers.... both the Wulfen Lord and the SM Libby deep strike in together, the Libby casts MoH and VoT on the Wulfen Lord... now the Wulfen Lord gets 7 x S10 AP-3 D3 attacks that hit on rerollable 2+s on the charge (becomes 14 attacks if you use Honour the Chapter stratagem)... if you attack a Knight, then you can use the Strategem to reroll to Wounds and the Wulfen Lord also is T5, meaning dancing feet only wounds him on 3+s.... finally, the Wulfen Lord gets to reroll failed charges and always fights first (even in later rounds), since he has VoT cast on him.

[One Two Wolf]

Do Canis' and Harald's wolfie attacks count towards their warlord trait saga? Ie if Harald kills four and Icetooth kills one, is that buff now go go time?

 

I fear not because that would be too cool, and it says "with your warlord" but isn't a rider and his mount one model...

[M.Redbeard]

I think the "Wulfen Lord" (referenced a few posts ago... TH, SS, JP, Wulfen Stone, Saga of the Wolfkin) will be quite powerful, especially if paired with an allied Jump Pack SM Librarian "squire" with the Might of Heroes and Veil of Time powers.... both the Wulfen Lord and the SM Libby deep strike in together, the Libby casts MoH and VoT on the Wulfen Lord... now the Wulfen Lord gets 7 x S10 AP-3 D3 attacks that hit on rerollable 2+s on the charge (becomes 14 attacks if you use Honour the Chapter stratagem)... if you attack a Knight, then you can use the Strategem to reroll to Wounds and the Wulfen Lord also is T5, meaning dancing feet only wounds him on 3+s.... finally, the Wulfen Lord gets to reroll failed charges and always fights first (even in later rounds), since he has VoT cast on him.

I really like that idea for running a soup. If running with the idea you cam have for example a Raven Guard batallion (Lt and Librarian, Scout troops to give board control with Concealed Positions) and a vanguard SW with WL and depending RP, WGBL or WP and Wulfen. I'd still see if possible to run Stormwolves (or even a Stormfang for the characters) to get them closer as the rerollable charge is knly a 47% chance of getting in.

 

The only issue for us being a meta army for soup is that for us to be as effective as Slamguinius at Knight killing, is that we have to have the WT on our Wulfen Lord to make him effective, meaning the AM battery will not be as efficient (a soup with a SW might still take the Aquila but Grand Strategist is where the most CP are recovered). With that and our need for transports to be really efficient in the charge I doubt the Wulfen Lord will replace Slamguinius on more competitive lists.

 

Edit 2: I made a prototype with 2 batallions and a vanguard SW, RG and AM for 1750. Two pack of Wulfen, and RP some Wolf Scouts with meltas (Keen Senses you can advance and shoot without penaly. Add Shotvuns for extra bodies and :cusss) and Stormwolf (one pack of Wulfen goes on the Stormwolf the other can either use Cunning of the Wolf or just run a little bit using cover) Jump Pack/Bike RP to follow Stormwolf and give -1 to hit (you can always cast smite). AM and RG support. 14 CP and some bodies in the table. I doubt it is too competitive but in can be done.

 

Edit:

 

Do Canis' and Harald's wolfie attacks count towards their warlord trait saga? Ie if Harald kills four and Icetooth kills one, is that buff now go go time?

 

I fear not because that would be too cool, and it says "with your warlord" but isn't a rider and his mount one model...

[TiguriusX]

 

The only issue for us being a meta army for soup is that for us to be as effective as Slamguinius at Knight killing, is that we have to have the WT on our Wulfen Lord to make him effective, meaning the AM battery will not be as efficient (a soup with a SW might still take the Aquila but Grand Strategist is where the most CP are recovered). With that and our need for transports to be really efficient in the charge I doubt the Wulfen Lord will replace Slamguinius on more competitive lists.

 

It still "works" without the warlord trait but you have less room for error (you need 8/10 successful TH attacks to kill a common knight)

 

I'm hoping the CP farming is stopped or severely nerfed in the next planned GW community update (supposed to be after the NOVA events)

[M.Redbeard]

 

 

The only issue for us being a meta army for soup is that for us to be as effective as Slamguinius at Knight killing, is that we have to have the WT on our Wulfen Lord to make him effective, meaning the AM battery will not be as efficient (a soup with a SW might still take the Aquila but Grand Strategist is where the most CP are recovered). With that and our need for transports to be really efficient in the charge I doubt the Wulfen Lord will replace Slamguinius on more competitive lists.

 

 

It still "works" without the warlord trait but you have less room for error (you need 8/10 successful TH attacks to kill a common knight)

 

I'm hoping the CP farming is stopped or severely nerfed in the next planned GW community update (supposed to be after the NOVA events)

hmm scratch ehat I said. If Slamguinius doesn't have his WT the Wulfen Lord does 9.1 to Slamguinius' 9.1 (against Knights, average of 7 attacks, hitting on 3+ and wounding on 3+ for BA and 5 attacks with rerolls for us). With CP regen Slamguinius is 4 CP to the Wulfen Lord 2.7 (this is thinking of CP in the battle, I don't know if you can use the CP to recoup extra relics of Death Visions of Sanguinius). I guess here is what do you plan to do with the rest of your army. Slamguinius can better be allied to AM if it is a main AM since he can come in and do the stuff himself. The Wulfen Lord needs more of a support to get a more reliable charge (I still doubt DS evem woth rerolls is a good way to get him into combat) so if you are running a mainly SW the Wulfen Lord is better. Hmmmm that showz me for speaking before doing the maths (Seeking a saga does wonders to increase or reliabilty hitting big stuff. And both Slamguinius amd Wulfen Lord kill a Daemon Prince in one turn, although the BA is a bit more reliable for that)

[vigitant]

I think the "Wulfen Lord" (referenced a few posts ago... TH, SS, JP, Wulfen Stone, Saga of the Wolfkin) will be quite powerful, especially if paired with an allied Jump Pack SM Librarian "squire" with the Might of Heroes and Veil of Time powers.... both the Wulfen Lord and the SM Libby deep strike in together, the Libby casts MoH and VoT on the Wulfen Lord... now the Wulfen Lord gets 7 x S10 AP-3 D3 attacks that hit on rerollable 2+s on the charge (becomes 14 attacks if you use Honour the Chapter stratagem)... if you attack a Knight, then you can use the Strategem to reroll to Wounds and the Wulfen Lord also is T5, meaning dancing feet only wounds him on 3+s.... finally, the Wulfen Lord gets to reroll failed charges and always fights first (even in later rounds), since he has VoT cast on him.

BA smashcaptain is good, but you have to be really careful going in on a knight, especially if he has a fist.  Death grip is no joke.

IT makes BA captains a good finisher for a knight, but poor at killing them.  2-3 smash captains can kill a knight, until the knight spends 2 CP to interrupt, stomps one down, and death grips the other.

 

In comes the SW relic armor.  Now the knight can only fight last.  No interrupt.

2-3 SW captains/dreads/wulfen/TWC/etc. are going to SHRED a knight, and he never gets to retaliate.

 

[M.Redbeard]

 

 

I think the "Wulfen Lord" (referenced a few posts ago... TH, SS, JP, Wulfen Stone, Saga of the Wolfkin) will be quite powerful, especially if paired with an allied Jump Pack SM Librarian "squire" with the Might of Heroes and Veil of Time powers.... both the Wulfen Lord and the SM Libby deep strike in together, the Libby casts MoH and VoT on the Wulfen Lord... now the Wulfen Lord gets 7 x S10 AP-3 D3 attacks that hit on rerollable 2+s on the charge (becomes 14 attacks if you use Honour the Chapter stratagem)... if you attack a Knight, then you can use the Strategem to reroll to Wounds and the Wulfen Lord also is T5, meaning dancing feet only wounds him on 3+s.... finally, the Wulfen Lord gets to reroll failed charges and always fights first (even in later rounds), since he has VoT cast on him.

BA smashcaptain is good, but you have to be really careful going in on a knight, especially if he has a fist. Death grip is no joke.

IT makes BA captains a good finisher for a knight, but poor at killing them. 2-3 smash captains can kill a knight, until the knight spends 2 CP to interrupt, stomps one down, and death grips the other.

 

In comes the SW relic armor. Now the knight can only fight last. No interrupt.

2-3 SW captains/dreads/wulfen/TWC/etc. are going to SHRED a knight, and he never gets to retaliate.

Rules question, wouldn't Only on Death Does Duty end rake presedence over Death Grip for the BA player? As such he would get to fight first, possibly reducing the bracket. Unless the Kmight is using the relic guantlet (I do not know how prevalent that is) that can be a -2 or -3 from his base WS. Might act as a deterramt against Death Grip.

 

Still the SW relic will be very good (and probably why we need two characters, as the synergy of those relics is pretty good).

[Bloody Legionnaire]

 

 

 

It is a scalpel but I guess "defensive" depends on how you define it and use it.

 

If you manage to cast the spell in your psychic phase you are definitely diving in to do the blender job on a horde of chaff

 

The tactical flexibility saves you a ton of points in your army building.

 

Comparison for perspective

Pre codex our WG Bikers with SB were amazing at clearing chaff because they spit out 40 shots (200+ points)

 

The fury of the wolf spirit buff on a RP can put out 20 attacks if you spend CP to fight twice.  Those attacks are all at WS2 with decent AP and S 

Comparable chaff clearing for free (*you pay CP to do this)!

 

Fewer attacks but much more reliable (WS2 with good S and AP)

 

Run this RP near your storm cannon leviathan (chooser of the slain...character blocking etc.)

 

Your small 4 unit formation (leviathan + 3 heros) has the potential to chew through many different unit types

 

The synergy is off the charts

 

Oooooooh I can't wait to field test this stuff!

 

 

That's pretty similar to the idea I have but utilizing Drop Pods and a Storm Wolf. Leviathan Dreadnought comes down turn 2, in a Pod, accompanied by x4 MM LFs and Iron Priest in a Pod. WGPL in TDA deepstrikes in to support the units arriving by drop pod. By T2 the Stormwolf with bloodclaws (possibly RP haven't decided how I want to have him join the arriving units). Between the Storm wolf, Long Fangs, and Leviathan they should be able to put plenty of fire power into what ever they drop on. If the opponent decides to charge me on his turn I can really put the hurt on him with HI. 

[Jarl Caldersson]

Is there any place for Wolf Priest/Primaris Wolf Priest in this codex. They are probably my favorite unit in the fluff but I ran into issues with them unable to keep up with Wulfen/TWC and they can't revive BCs like other apothecary.

[M.Redbeard]

Is there any place for Wolf Priest/Primaris Wolf Priest in this codex. They are probably my favorite unit in the fluff but I ran into issues with them unable to keep up with Wulfen/TWC and they can't revive BCs like other apothecary.

I think they are great with Hammer Wulfen. Since in the charge the -1 is ignored you reroll everything. And that is an increase in hit oercentage of over 20 ppt. Very good. Just put him in a JP and he can easily follow Wulfen.

[Bloody Legionnaire]

Is there any place for Wolf Priest/Primaris Wolf Priest in this codex. They are probably my favorite unit in the fluff but I ran into issues with them unable to keep up with Wulfen/TWC and they can't revive BCs like other apothecary.

all the tactica I've seen so far has been about maximizing heroes with some trying to recreate the wolves version of 'slamguinious.' I think a Wolf Priest works very well for keeping those heroes nice and healthy and in particular keeping the warlord alive. 

[M.Redbeard]

Another thing you can do with the WP is assiting two WL. One may think that his aura is useless, but you can use Mentor's Guidance. That is two characters rerolling to hit and wound only for 2CP. Combines well against kow model count mechanised armies as birh can get the benefits of the Wulfen Stone and saga of the Beastslayer. At the end just use the WP to heal tmhiwever got hurt back up.