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Chapters still making standard Space Marines


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#1
Robbienw

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So it appears i was correct, and a lot of Space Marine chapters in the current dark imperium setting are still making standard marines alongside primaris to still be able to use the standard Space Marine gear.

 

From the recent warhammer community 500 stores article:

 

"84. Most Chapters now have the means and technology to create Primaris Space Marines of their own (drawn from their usual recruitment worlds), though many still choose to create standard Space Marines as well for their more flexible and readily available equipment and combat doctrines."

 

There you have it.

 

 

Also another interesting fact on Primaris marines from the same article:

 

"85. Much like the first Space Marines of the Great Crusade, the first wave of Primaris Space Marines were almost universally Terran- or Martian-born"

 

I suspected this was the case after reading War of Secrets in which the Dark Angel primaris are clearly terran or martian, and the new Space Wolves codex which states that the primaris Space Wolves sent by Gulliman were not fenrisian (and implies they were Terran).  I guess that means the Primaris like Bjarni and Felix from the Dark Imperium books were an initial batch taken from their respective legion homeworlds, and then when Cawl started making them in numbers he turned to the large populations of terra and mars for recruits.  Possibly also because he and/or gulliman didn't want other chapters and primarchs to know what was going on.

 



#2
Ishagu

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Yeah, it was never stated to be otherwise. They have readily available wargear in stockpile that needs to be used.

Over time it will change as chapters are supplied with greater quantity of new armour, weapons and vehicles.

Of course people are free to ignore Primaris. Just base your forces around a chapter that's operating in M39 or M40.

Edited by Ishagu, 21 October 2018 - 11:38 AM.

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-~Ishagu~-


#3
Robbienw

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It’s the first time GW have outright stated it though.

It’s good to know, because that was my theory as to why classic space marines were still being made, and there were people on here that doubted it, it’s good to be proved right :lol:

I think it will take a while to change, in the order of several centuries to a millennium, given that up to the current timeline 120 years or so past the start of the indomitus crusade, there are many standard marines still about and whole famous chapters like the novamarines with few Primaris in their ranks.

I still think eventually there will be a third type of marine created that brings the whole line back together in the medium to long term future (in terms of models and fluff). Let’s see if my theory on that turns out to be correct or not :D

#4
Kallas

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Of course people are free to ignore Primaris. Just base your forces around a chapter that's operating in M39 or M40.

Or one of the 3% (urgh, so ridiculously low) of Chapters that didn't take on Primaris.



#5
Ishagu

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It’s the first time GW have outright stated it though.

It’s good to know, because that was my theory as to why classic space marines were still being made, and there were people on here that doubted it, it’s good to be proved right :lol:

I think it will take a while to change, in the order of several centuries to a millennium, given that up to the current timeline 120 years or so past the start of the indomitus crusade, there are many standard marines still about and whole famous chapters like the novamarines with few Primaris in their ranks.

I still think eventually there will be a third type of marine created that brings the whole line back together in the medium to long term future (in terms of models and fluff). Let’s see if my theory on that turns out to be correct or not :D


The Blood Angels codex stated the same thing. I'm not sure why it's such a big deal. The rules for regular Astartes aren't going anywhere and there was never any danger of that.

It doesn't mean GW won't have a focus on Primaris in the future, but people should be confident that their armies will not be invalidated.

-~Ishagu~-


#6
Captain Idaho

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Is this like how AoS didn't invalidate the Legacy armies because they had rules, but now those armies are a dead duck in the community by and large and get zero releases?
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#7
Lord Kallozar

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Which were the space marine chapters that refused to accept primaris marines?

#8
Robbienw

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Which were the space marine chapters that refused to accept primaris marines?

 

 

None as far as we know yet.  I think its more due to the size of the galaxy and the current dark imperium chaos that not every chapter has received the technology and/or primaris marines from cawl yet.



#9
sfPanzer

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Is this like how AoS didn't invalidate the Legacy armies because they had rules, but now those armies are a dead duck in the community by and large and get zero releases?

 

Funnily enough the Tomb Kings are still going strong competetive wise if you can find someone who did spend way too much money on an army (the prices on ebay are ridiculous for TK models lol). :P


Disclaimer:

If my posts appear rude to you, I apologize. It's not meant to be rude in any way, it's just the way folks are in my country. It's really more about being direct than being rude. I know how it's perceived in the english speaking community and I already try to tone it down but I barely notice when it's too much since it's normal for me.


So yeah, I'm really not rude it's basically just cultural differences that act against me here. Again, I apologize.

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#10
Captain Idaho

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I know and I'm a Tomb Kings player! It's like plastic gold.
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#11
TheTrans

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Yeah, it was never stated to be otherwise. They have readily available wargear in stockpile that needs to be used.

Over time it will change as chapters are supplied with greater quantity of new armour, weapons and vehicles.

Of course people are free to ignore Primaris. Just base your forces around a chapter that's operating in M39 or M40.

Can't stand Primaris mate.. and instead on :cussting on other peoples loves/hates your suggestion is spot on..

S'all good in the Badab War ;) 


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#12
Margulix

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Of course people are free to ignore Primaris. Just base your forces around a chapter that's operating in M39 or M40.

Or one of the 3% (urgh, so ridiculously low) of Chapters that didn't take on Primaris.

 

 

My Black Templars crusade ignores Primaris completely. All Black Templars primaris are sent to separate crusades, so they do not intervene with our ZEAL.


+++ No Pity. No Mercy. No Remorse. +++
 

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#13
Ishagu

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Of course people are free to ignore Primaris. Just base your forces around a chapter that's operating in M39 or M40.

Or one of the 3% (urgh, so ridiculously low) of Chapters that didn't take on Primaris.

My Black Templars crusade ignores Primaris completely. All Black Templars primaris are sent to separate crusades, so they do not intervene with our ZEAL.

Interesting that your zeal involves going against the word of the Emperor, his son and the Custodes? 😜
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-~Ishagu~-


#14
Captain Idaho

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I just take Ultramarines who aren't Primaris. Problem solved. Not set any time differently or anything. The guys are just not Primaris.

Now, whether this is a deliberate communication with the community that Classic Marines aren't going away or just a throwaway comment we don't know. The proof will be in the pudding I suppose.

I certainly don't think it's recognition of economic considerations but I wouldn't be surprised if Space Marines sales have decreased lately. After all, the Codex isn't very interesting and weak on the table for the most part. Plus, what mentalists are buying Primaris at the cost they are compared to boxed sets? £30+ for one character? Yeah okay mate.

So overall this is fairly benign in its impact. GW are still going to be forcing Primaris down our throats with every release and there won't be any Classic Marines releases, but the rules will continue to exist as long as the sales are there for older stuff.
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#15
Closet Skeleton

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Is this like how AoS didn't invalidate the Legacy armies because they had rules, but now those armies are a dead duck in the community by and large and get zero releases?

 

What is or isn't a 'legacy army' is a mess in AoS. Not having your own book is normal for AoS factions and there are plenty of popular factions that are stuck with warhammer fantasy models.

 

There were 11 factions in AoS who got actual proper model releases but another 6 who got books without any new units and 9 who got rules in the latest General's Handbook.

 

Dark/Craftworld Eldar didn't need any new models to get to be top tier. If it means no more random nonsense like Centurions I'm happy with non-primaris getting no new models (except they are sort of getting the odd new model like those very nice space marine heroes terminators). I just want my old models to be usable.



#16
Margulix

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Of course people are free to ignore Primaris. Just base your forces around a chapter that's operating in M39 or M40.

Or one of the 3% (urgh, so ridiculously low) of Chapters that didn't take on Primaris.

My Black Templars crusade ignores Primaris completely. All Black Templars primaris are sent to separate crusades, so they do not intervene with our ZEAL.

Interesting that your zeal involves going against the word of the Emperor, his son and the Custodes?

 

 

The Emperor himself never gave any direct opinions about this.

 

Gulliman was never in favor in our order with his cookbook, i do not think others have enough authority over our order anyway.


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+++ No Pity. No Mercy. No Remorse. +++
 

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#17
Robbienw

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We have actually had roughly equal releases for Primaris and Classic this year in terms of model numbers.

 

Primaris:

 

DA Lieutenant

BA Lieutenant

SW Lieutenant

UM Lieutenant via the Conquest series

500 stores limited Lieutenant

Wake The Dead set Lieutenant

DA, BA and SW accessory sprues

 

Classic:

 

7 terminator models from the Space Marine Heroes series 2

 

 

I know the Heroes models are only on sale in japan currently, but they are very easy to get via the internet and they will be released worldwide at some point, so they count.



#18
Lord Raven 19

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There are no primaris named characters yet
Lord Raven19

Lord of Deliverence and Scion of Tallarn; Champion of Mortarion.

Victorus aut Mortis

#19
sfPanzer

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Of course people are free to ignore Primaris. Just base your forces around a chapter that's operating in M39 or M40.

Or one of the 3% (urgh, so ridiculously low) of Chapters that didn't take on Primaris.

My Black Templars crusade ignores Primaris completely. All Black Templars primaris are sent to separate crusades, so they do not intervene with our ZEAL.

Interesting that your zeal involves going against the word of the Emperor, his son and the Custodes?

 

 

The Emperor himself never gave any direct opinions about this.

 

Gulliman was never in favor in our order with his cookbook, i do not think others have enough authority over our order anyway.

 

 

The Emperor himself never directly approved of the zeal Black Templars show either to be completely fair. :P


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Disclaimer:

If my posts appear rude to you, I apologize. It's not meant to be rude in any way, it's just the way folks are in my country. It's really more about being direct than being rude. I know how it's perceived in the english speaking community and I already try to tone it down but I barely notice when it's too much since it's normal for me.


So yeah, I'm really not rude it's basically just cultural differences that act against me here. Again, I apologize.

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#20
Margulix

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The Emperor himself never directly approved of the zeal Black Templars show either to be completely fair. tongue.png

 

 

In our visions, yes. *FANATIC DETECTED*

 

But anyways we are sidetracking from original topic.


+++ No Pity. No Mercy. No Remorse. +++
 

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#21
Robbienw

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Yeah the only word from the Emperor on Primaris marines has been delivered from the Emissaries Imperiatus Custodes who say their visions have told them it is the emperors will that the space marines accept the primaris (some Custodes were sceptical about the Primaris).  Neither of the two has specified how the Primaris should be used operationally in the Chapters, only Gulliman has ordered they should be fully integrated into the regular chapter force structure.  And the Templars have form for ignoring Gullimans operational edicts, they have been largely ignoring the codex for the past 10,000 years :lol:

 

There is also nothing stating a marine strike force has to be made up of both types of marine, you can still have classic or primaris only groups from the same chapter if you want.



#22
Triszin

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Space wolves are making both.

 

there was some fun excerpts in Ashes of Prospero.

 

Where the bloodclaws( new old marines) got into bar brawls with the new Primaris marines.

 

the space wolves set ground rules for these brawls.

 

A. Let them Happen.

B. No killing

 

 

ahh, the space wolves!


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banana


#23
Captain Idaho

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We have actually had roughly equal releases for Primaris and Classic this year in terms of model numbers.
 
Primaris:
 
DA Lieutenant
BA Lieutenant
SW Lieutenant
UM Lieutenant via the Conquest series
500 stores limited Lieutenant
Wake The Dead set Lieutenant
DA, BA and SW accessory sprues
 
Classic:
 
7 terminator models from the Space Marine Heroes series 2
 
 
I know the Heroes models are only on sale in japan currently, but they are very easy to get via the internet and they will be released worldwide at some point, so they count.


Come on no one is counting the Space Marines Heroes as a legitimate 40K release. It's only in Japan for one thing.
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#24
sfPanzer

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My thoughts exactly. It's nice that they can be used for regular 40k but they definitely aren't aimed to be a proper 40k release.


Disclaimer:

If my posts appear rude to you, I apologize. It's not meant to be rude in any way, it's just the way folks are in my country. It's really more about being direct than being rude. I know how it's perceived in the english speaking community and I already try to tone it down but I barely notice when it's too much since it's normal for me.


So yeah, I'm really not rude it's basically just cultural differences that act against me here. Again, I apologize.

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#25
Brother Casman

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Yeah, this is roughly what I was thinking as well. The Age of the Dark Imperium requires "all hands on deck" and the various chapters have a ton of material built up for "classic" marines, so there are going to be battle brothers made to use it all.
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