Struggling to pick a Chapter

[ShibeKing]

@Lemondish, yeah I should devote more time to that Ultima founding idea I had so I can just play with any rule set. I'll just need to learn how to play with transfers like Doghouse recommended, or just learn how to freehand.

I have to say your friends can go get bent, Brother Sgt Arkley. I think the Nemesis Chapter would be really cool to expand on and your initial paint scheme looks good to me. They're also called Nemesis. That's a pretty badass name imo.

[templargdt]

If I was doing an all Primaris Chapter I would go either Dark Angels for the Plasma stratagem or Blood Angels for the chapter tactic.  

[Claws and Effect]

Necropolis Hawks.

[Sete]

Too late I saw it!!!! xD

Agree with you yellow is a bit scary, but really any of the options is fine.

Personally I don't like half or quartered schemes.

CF with the new fists sprue might be really cool to paint.

[HighMarshalAmp]

CF with the new fists sprue might be really cool to paint.

At least that's what I'll do when I start a Primaris force :)

Edit: well, with the new Honor Guard, it's one of two options at least... but I can always just paint 'em blue all over and see where it goes from there...

[templargdt]

I hate to say this, but just go with the Ultramarines.  Not because I like them, but frankly, you will get the most options from GW, the most support, and the strongest rules for competitive play.  I think it stinks, but it is what it is.

[Panzer]

Disagreed.

They are the poster boys and they have Guilliman now but they aren't in that much a better place than Raven Guard or Salamanders. Also I remember that back in 7th the go-to competetive Space Marine lists from the vanilla Codex included either White Scars or Iron Hands, not Ultramarines. Also there's an Imperial Fists detachment coming that looks pretty strong so there's that.

 

Pick Ultramarines if you like them. Pick Ultramarines if you like being pictured and mentioned almost all the time.

Don't pick Ultramarines when it's only about the performance on the table because that can change all the time and in the end they are still just using the same Codex as RG, Salamanders, WS, IH, IF and BT.

[HighMarshalAmp]

I hate to say this, but just go with the Ultramarines. Not because I like them, but frankly, you will get the most options from GW, the most support, and the strongest rules for competitive play. I think it stinks, but it is what it is.

The UMs are the poster boys because blue and gold look good. That's why the Crimson Fists get so many special mentions as well - they're blue, that's half of the way already and they're the blue alternative for all those who ain't mainstream enough to play UMs.

 

Me, I painted my guys as Ultramarines and Templars because my freehand would usually have to be purged by a Chaplain... In the Deathwatch box, there were those nice shoulder pads with the emblems mirror flipped. UMs and Templars were among the few symmetrical ones.

That's all.

I don't even like the rules for them so much. Raven Guard have a nice Stratagem and Salamanders get re-rolls. In the games I've played, I've never gotten any use out of +1 Ld and I fell back to shoot exactly once. Re-rolling a few dice for free or even ignoring cover? Doesn't sound so bad to me all of a sudden. I do try some different Chapter Tactics sometimes, but I do prefer to have my guys look like the Chapter I'm playing them as if they're not a home-brew Chapter anyways.

So when the IF upgrade sprue was announced, I really hoped that maybe other Chapters might get them too and I could finally get around to painting up some Salamanders without Heresy era emblems or the white blob I'd have managed at best...

And then, there was Calgar.

 

Calgar and the Honor Guard definitely catered to UMs though. I was gonna do some Primaris Crimson Fists but those Honor Guard models... on this one, I agree, that was showing off the poster boys some more.

What's it with the bloody mittens on Calgar though? If I paint him as a Sally, I've got Marneus Banner. What's next, a Raven Guard Hawkeye?

[templargdt]

Disagreed.

They are the poster boys and they have Guilliman now but they aren't in that much a better place than Raven Guard or Salamanders. Also I remember that back in 7th the go-to competetive Space Marine lists from the vanilla Codex included either White Scars or Iron Hands, not Ultramarines. Also there's an Imperial Fists detachment coming that looks pretty strong so there's that.

 

Pick Ultramarines if you like them. Pick Ultramarines if you like being pictured and mentioned almost all the time.

Don't pick Ultramarines when it's only about the performance on the table because that can change all the time and in the end they are still just using the same Codex as RG, Salamanders, WS, IH, IF and BT.

I think the large pile of data from tournament listings since 8th dropped says otherwise.  Were Scars good in 7th?  Yes, but it's not 7th anymore.  Go have a look at the Scars forum and see how active it is these days.  Sallies are also not in a good place, at all.  Raven Guard were the one passable alternative to UM for C:SM until SFTS got the nerf bat.

[Panzer]

 

Disagreed.

They are the poster boys and they have Guilliman now but they aren't in that much a better place than Raven Guard or Salamanders. Also I remember that back in 7th the go-to competetive Space Marine lists from the vanilla Codex included either White Scars or Iron Hands, not Ultramarines. Also there's an Imperial Fists detachment coming that looks pretty strong so there's that.

 

Pick Ultramarines if you like them. Pick Ultramarines if you like being pictured and mentioned almost all the time.

Don't pick Ultramarines when it's only about the performance on the table because that can change all the time and in the end they are still just using the same Codex as RG, Salamanders, WS, IH, IF and BT.

 

I think the large pile of data from tournament listings since 8th dropped says otherwise.  Were Scars good in 7th?  Yes, but it's not 7th anymore.  Go have a look at the Scars forum and see how active it is these days.  Sallies are also not in a good place, at all.  Raven Guard were the one passable alternative to UM for C:SM until SFTS got the nerf bat.

So you're saying you'll change chapters with each new edition? Or with each new Chapter Approved? Or what? Because if not I don't see how it's relevant that Ultramarines are the most competetive vanilla chapter RIGHT NOW.

Sure Ultramarines are better currently, but then again Deathwatch are each better than Ultramarines right now, so why not go with those instead? Or Blood Angels thanks to their Captain? It has literally no relevance what's currently the strongest. As I said, what's best can change anytime and Ultramarines weren't the best all the time either.

Pick what you like, not what's the best for now.

[templargdt]

I picked up this game in 2008 after playing Dawn of War and painted about 4000 points of Blood Ravens.  I use whatever CT I think works best when I play.  If I could do it all over again, I would paint them as Black Templars because I love their fluff and novels.  

 

I do not think the DW are better than UMs right now, and they certainly won't be after Vigilis drops and people start using Veteran Intercessors and Victrix guard detachments.

If I wanted to play Warhammer as successfully as possible today, I'd be painting things blue.  That's how I took the OPs question.

[Rogue]

So you're saying you'll change chapters with each new edition? Or with each new Chapter Approved? Or what?

I do that. My marines are my own chapter, and I think I’ve changed my ‘rules’ chapter pretty much every time a new codex comes out.

 

Less for competitive tournament advantage, because I don’t play in them; more for personal variety, trying new things.

 

But either way, why not? Play your men how you want. It’s something a lot of other factions seem to do a lot - I’ve seen a number of YouTube games where the players will say “Today I’m using the Mars dogma”, then “Today I’m trying Stygies”, or the guard equivalent, or whatever.

 

As long as everyone knows up front, it’s all good.

[Panzer]

 

So you're saying you'll change chapters with each new edition? Or with each new Chapter Approved? Or what?

I do that. My marines are my own chapter, and I think I’ve changed my ‘rules’ chapter pretty much every time a new codex comes out.

Less for competitive tournament advantage, because I don’t play in them; more for personal variety, trying new things.

But either way, why not? Play your men how you want. It’s something a lot of other factions seem to do a lot - I’ve seen a number of YouTube games where the players will say “Today I’m using the Mars dogma”, then “Today I’m trying Stygies”, or the guard equivalent, or whatever.

As long as everyone knows up front, it’s all good.

That's perfectly fine, but then you don't really pick a chapter. It's always a valid option to just do a homebrew chapter and do whatever rules you want for them. That's obviously not what I was talking about tho since I was replying to someone suggesting Ultramarines and not a homebrew chapter. ^^

[Rogue]

True. I think I’m in agreement with you, just putting in a different perspective.

 

I also think that marines are in a funny position when it comes to colour schemes and chapter rules. Because the main chapters are so well known and recognisable, the thought of playing Ultramarines as Blood Angels (or whatever) seems wrong to some people; whereas playing black-armoured Dark Eldar as whatever Cabal takes your fancy is much less of an issue (he says as a non-DE player).

[Spinsanity]

In regards to homebrews being fielded as a known 'mainline' chapter, how are they usually accepted in Tournaments? Could I field, say, a Novamarines or SilverSkulls army and include Calgar because I'm using the Ultramarines CT, or not because they have the <Novamarines Chapter> keyword instead of the <Ultramarines Chapter> one? Can they benefit from Guilliman's XIII Promarch rule (or whatever it's called)?

[HighMarshalAmp]

In regards to homebrews being fielded as a known 'mainline' chapter, how are they usually accepted in Tournaments? Could I field, say, a Novamarines or SilverSkulls army and include Calgar because I'm using the Ultramarines CT, or not because they have the <Novamarines Chapter> keyword instead of the <Ultramarines Chapter> one? Can they benefit from Guilliman's XIII Promarch rule (or whatever it's called)?

Now in every tournament except for official GW ones maybe, you're not bound by how you paint your guys.

 

You are, however, restricted in which Characters and Relics you can take. Some are only available to models with a certain Chapter keyword.

There's nothing keeping ou from mixing detachments of different Chapters in your force or, much simpler, just playing your Novamarines as Ultramarines - because the only one who's saying that they don't have the Ultramarines keyword is you ;)

[Johanhgg]

Pick a chapter you like the history of and think not solely of performance. I have white scars, not because they are beasts on the table. Its because i love their fluff and way of war.

 

I think this is how you keep yourself from despair When the coolest chapter with the best rules suddenly becomes not so great after a CA.

[Panzer]

Pick a chapter you like the history of and think not solely of performance. I have white scars, not because they are beasts on the table. Its because i love their fluff and way of war.

 

I think this is how you keep yourself from despair When the coolest chapter with the best rules suddenly becomes not so great after a CA.

 

While true, it doesn't help much with the despair when your picked chapter keeps getting bad rules while others keep getting cool stuff. :P

Still pretty much the best advice one can give as long as the person isn't explicitly looking for a strong army.

[Johanhgg]

 

 

Pick a chapter you like the history of and think not solely of performance. I have white scars, not because they are beasts on the table. Its because i love their fluff and way of war.

 

I think this is how you keep yourself from despair When the coolest chapter with the best rules suddenly becomes not so great after a CA.

While true, it doesn't help much with the despair when your picked chapter keeps getting bad rules while others keep getting cool stuff. :P

Still pretty much the best advice one can give as long as the person isn't explicitly looking for a strong army.

I agree with you 100%. Personally i had to change my view on this because i always tried to pick the ”best chapter”. As an example In 7th picked Iron Hands because of strong rules, started painting, booom, 8th happened and IH is at the bottom