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What are Thousand Sons hoping for from Chapter Approved?

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#1
Prot

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So since it's not too far off, I thought for fun we can just take a few guesses at our most likely changes. Obviously point drops will be a prominent feature in a lot of marine based codexes (or so the rumours seem to indicate.)

 

For the sake of keeping this quick, and somewhat under control let's say we list our top 5 biggest expectations. #5 being what you think is least likely, #1 being what you think is nearly certain:

 

#1 Point reduction in Scarab Occult Termies

#2 Point reduction in Rubrics

#3 Point reduction in Mutalith (perhaps a rules tweak as well)

#4 A change to power armoured survivability. Not sure what, but it wouldn't surprise me.

#5 A tweak to Exalted Sorcs. (although a point reduction is most obvious, I wonder if they might get a boost in some other way.)

 

Thoughts? Ideas?

 

 


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#2
Dolchiate Remembrancer

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Rubrics and SOT need to be differentiated. There is no point in having both in an army list.

Bring back our 4+ save mechanic from 7th. I miss being able to survive shooting phases.


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#3
Are Verlo

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+1 to the suggestions above and I would love to see a massive decrease in the cost for both warpflamers and heavy warpflamers.

To my knowlege they are unique to M4”/M5” units and have a 8” range so unless we DMC+warptime the units, they can’t «deep strike» in range.

The cost should reflect the issue these units (rubrics and SOT) have with getting in flamer range.

Edited by Are Verlo, 21 November 2018 - 06:18 PM.

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#4
WarriorFish

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As I'm finally building up my Sons (WIP coming soon™) I'm most excited about point drops - Sons are expensive confused.gif I'd also love for Scarab Occult to get something more than a points drop (which they sorely need) - a 4++ save sounds fair given Tzeentchian ways (plus Cataphractii 4" with a 4++).

 

Basically, anything to make Marines more viable and better is what I want. It's Codex: Thousand Sons after all! That's about all I can say given I've yet to get a game in :P


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#5
Quixus

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I agree improved abilities are much more interesting than point drops.

 

PA and TDA Sorcerers should get some aura too.

 

Horrors in addition to Tzaangors in the TS detachment. And while we're at it why not make TS Tzeentch Daemonkin?

 

BTW why is a marine in PA just as fast as a conscript and a marine in TDA is slower?


Edited by Quixus, 21 November 2018 - 10:57 PM.

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#6
Raven1

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I agree improved abilities are much more interesting than point drops.

PA and TDA Sorcerers should get some aura too.

Horrors in addition to Tzaangors in the TS detachment. And while we're at it why not make TS Tzeentch Daemonkin?

BTW why is a marine in PA just as fast as a conscript and a marine in TDA is slower?

Because horde armies make GW more money than elite marines?

In all truth, what i would like to see as follows;

Exalted Sorcerer rules tweak to make them worth taking. Possibly all the benefits of a regular sorcerer but with a stat line buff and psychic buff. So familiar, Terminator armor etc. I think the points are fine.

Points decreases for all power armor troops. A survivability buff to all marines and but more to rubric types. Maybe like in 3ed codex where only S5 weapons could actually wound or from the 3rd or 3.5 the extra wound on Rubric would be appreciated. I wouldnt be upset if marines in general got some sort of Transhuman physiology where you could ignore the first wound. 15 ponts is way too much in my opinion for the Warpflamer. Exploding inferno bolts ala 3.5 so like a 6 it does D3 hits instead of 1.

Rules change to the Icon of Flame to you know make it worth taking. A tweak to like how it is in AoS would be a step in the right direction.

Regenerating Tzaangors like in AoS, and expanding Tzaangor weapon options to included everything in the box.

Thrall wizards from 3.5

Aspiring sorcerer squads...as an elite choice a sort of psychic chosen squad.

If i continue my wishlist...psychic dreads and an osiron dread.

So like my whole wish is basically a dream and we will probably at most get a 1-2 point drop on some units, but not all.

Edited by Raven1, 22 November 2018 - 02:26 AM.

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#7
Sonoftherubric21

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I echo a majority of the above; 

 

Point reductions for both Rubricae and Scarab Occult as well as Exalted. 

Honestly Exalted IMHO don't need much, but I might be in the minority. I take them all the time and they are consistently very solid on the table. I refuse to crutch daemon princes. 

 

By way of example for expectations: the rumored 5-10% drop (if we are looking at 10%) would actually make Rubrics an identical point cost to Rubrics in Killteam (16)..... If we still pay for Inferno guns we might end up with 18 point rubrics, or perhaps 16-17 by the time its said and done. If we are between 16-18 id say that's a very solid point cost for what they bring to the table. 16 would be totally perfect if it includes gun. 

 

And if Terminators really are getting an 8 point per model drop? Scarab Occult will be sitting quite pretty IMHO. We might end up being one of the best "marine" armies on the table. Our guns having actual AP makes a really big difference, and both of these units coming down in price is a massive boon to our already solid codex. 

 

That said: I expect cultists will go up to 5, and our tzaangors....May or may not go up a point. I don't think they will come down, though I think them being equal to Ork boyz in points is perfect. 



#8
Raven1

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Honestly Exalted IMHO don't need much, but I might be in the minority. I take them all the time and they are consistently very solid on the table.

We might end up being one of the best "marine" armies on the table.

That said: I expect cultists will go up to 5, and our tzaangors....May or may not go up a point.


Exalted are an absolute solid choice. The problem lies every other choice is more points efficient and they are missing equipment options that are puzzling like a jump pack even though a representative option exists in the box.

I think as "Marine" armies go we are a solid choice and could do well if they get some much needed buffs.

If guardsman get a point increase than for sure cultists will get a points increase although 1 point i dont think will have much of an effect. They will become less efficient but i fear no less dominant.

I dont think Tzaangors are going anywhere. They feature heavily in TS competitive lists but you dont see people complaining about how broken they are, because they arent. They are fairly close in stats to an ork boy with a few buffs but are more expensive.
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#9
Sonoftherubric21

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Honestly Exalted IMHO don't need much, but I might be in the minority. I take them all the time and they are consistently very solid on the table.

We might end up being one of the best "marine" armies on the table.

That said: I expect cultists will go up to 5, and our tzaangors....May or may not go up a point.


Exalted are an absolute solid choice. The problem lies every other choice is more points efficient and they are missing equipment options that are puzzling like a jump pack even though a representative option exists in the box.

I think as "Marine" armies go we are a solid choice and could do well if they get some much needed buffs.

If guardsman get a point increase than for sure cultists will get a points increase although 1 point i dont think will have much of an effect. They will become less efficient but i fear no less dominant.

I dont think Tzaangors are going anywhere. They feature heavily in TS competitive lists but you dont see people complaining about how broken they are, because they arent. They are fairly close in stats to an ork boy with a few buffs but are more expensive.

 

 

Actually Tzaangors are identical, as of the new Dex Ork boyz are 7 points each. 

 

And thats a fair point on Exalted, the floating exalted at least should have a "fly" keyword option for it or something as an upgrade. 

 

I think its less the singular point increase on cultists, and more the "increase on cultist + decrease on marine" would equal more use of marines and less use of weak chaff as the crux of a list. 

Our base Rubricae are a very solid choice currently but suffer from elitism in a game edition where elites are frowned upon due to rules, hopefully this CA will fix that with a solid points drop. Id imagine that alone would make a massive impact on our meta. 



#10
Tyriks

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I want either more psychic powers or maybe some way to cast some powers twice (through a strat or maybe a once a turn exemption). More powers would be better. We have a lot of okay powers but not many that are really clutch. So I guess buffing some of the 'not quite smites' or something would be good.

#11
Brother Captain Ed

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All I expect is for the marine entries in the codex to go along with any changes/point reductions to space marine models gamewide.  I hope that Rubrics and scarabs get a little extra cut since they are starting from a bit more overpriced, but I do not expect it.

 

Frankly, anything more than that is extremely optimistic at best or, as some folks here seem to be doing, outright wishing for a new codex, which ain't gonna happen.


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#12
Kite Senet

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Mostly, I'd just like to see a decrease to Rubric/Scarab costs. Also a refinement of the Perils rules so they don't punish our non-HQ casters so horribly.

My pipe dream would be to see Scarabs differentiated a bit more as melee powerhouses and Rubrics more as ranged powerhouses, but I'm not holding out hope for that.
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#13
Tyriks

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I would love that.

#14
Quixus

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Also a refinement of the Perils rules so they don't punish our non-HQ casters so horribly.

Are you talking about the goats? Aspiring sorcerers can put the mortal wounds on a rubric/SOT.

#15
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8th is an anti-power armor edition, undoubtedly.

GW is boosting these PA units carefully(but slowly), reduce 1 or 2 pts each time for normal PA wearers, 2 or 3 pts for termies.

So...when CA2022 arrived, "true" Thousand Sons armies would become fairy competitive!

#16
Kite Senet

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Also a refinement of the Perils rules so they don't punish our non-HQ casters so horribly.

Are you talking about the goats? Aspiring sorcerers can put the mortal wounds on a rubric/SOT.
Nope, I was not. (I just forgot that Shamans were elite; I haven't bought or played with our goat allies much.)

I was not aware of that. Do you have an official source for this clarification of the rules? It conflicts with the consensus on Perils that seemed to have been reached rules-as-written previously.

#17
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Technically the whole unit is the psyker, not exclusively the aspiring sorcerer, per the keywords. But I think the rule says it's the sorcerer casting so RAW it's kind of a toss up. However that seems really gimmicky so I wouldn't count on that staying that way.

#18
Quixus

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I was not aware of that. Do you have an official source for this clarification of the rules? It conflicts with the consensus on Perils that seemed to have been reached rules-as-written previously.

The whole unit not a certain model within the unit has the psyker rule, and the psyker suffers the mortal wound(s). Wounds are allocated by the player whose unit takes the wounds.



#19
Skerr

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Anything as an incentive to put more PA on the table.
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#20
Raven1

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I know its off topic but im going to throw my 2 cents on the Rubric psyker rules. The main rulebook perils section talks about a psyker (lower case) and the first paragraph says some models have the PSYKER keyword and then refers to them as a payker (again lower case)

Rubrics and SO Terminators dont have a separate keyword list for Aspiring Sorcerers and when you pay for them you pay for the base model and one of them is the Aspiring Sorcerer.

Next the unit has the PSYKER keyword making the unit the psyker not a single model as there is just the one set of keywords.

The wrench is Rubric/SO Terminator only the Asp Sorcerer can cast so lose that model no psychic powers so it would seem that he perils explodes and perils on the sqaud.

However given how the key word system works in my estimation the unit is the psyker and the unit suffers the perils.

I would agree that it is poorly written and needs an FAQ and is an awful oversight by GW that needs clarification and needed clarification when our first FAQ came out.
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#21
Skerr

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It would be great to clarify because I can see it either way. Though weird wording it may have been designed for the unit to absorb the perils for the AS.

I think Exalted need 1 maybe 2 more options game mechanics wise. I have not played or looked at 1000 sons codex in a few months though are we even able to make a decent Exalted warlord if we wanted?

I would like to see ES have aura options to pick from. Reroll spell, invulns or hits for example. That would put more on the table.

Edited by WarriorFish, 24 November 2018 - 03:15 PM.


#22
Heliomanes

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I honestly think we won't get much more than some points adjustments, and will be pleasantly surprised if they do some more in depth changes.


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#23
Prot

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I honestly think we won't get much more than some points adjustments, and will be pleasantly surprised if they do some more in depth changes.

 

I agree, and with that in mind we need to temper our expectations. I even remind myself that CA has a lot of scope to cover and in no way will be a 'fix my codex' event.

 

We have some very dysfunctional units, but I do think it's realistic to see how GW handles some of the wonky points on units, and it should give us an indication of where they feel there is tweaking that needs to be made.

 

So for example; I personally feel the Mutalith needs a point adjustment and rules tweak. If the rules and points aren't tweak, to me that would indicate that GW considers the Mutalith is working as intended.... and I shall continue to avoid it at all costs in the future! :) (seriously I'd like to paint one but my test games have it at the bottom of the pile... that's just me personally.)


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#24
WarriorFish

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Expect the worst, hope for the best - usually a good mantra for life in general :lol:


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#25
WarriorFish

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Poking through my codex and Battlescribe a bit tonight, and something occurred to me that might be nice to help - Sorcerers. As in normal ones. Does anyone use them? Why would you when you have the Exalted option? The extra hitting skill and re-roll aura seems useful to me, but it's also a theme thing.

 

A Sorcerer who is the same as any other CSM spell flinger doesn't seem fitting for the Thousand Sons confused.gif It seems a bit odd that Exalted Champions in C:CSM are a nice extra option for sub-commanders yet there's no equivalent here - a Sorcerer is simply a budget option?

 

I don't expect a change in CA of course, but this bugs me now :P


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