What is a mortal and mortality in 40?

[Marshal Rohr]

Mortal is a baseline human, like one of us. Their life can be extended via medical procedures, the way we can live longer via medical procedures, but eventually they will die without continuing those treatments.

[RobWrath]

 

 

 

Well not quite. One is a mech, the other is armour.

With mechs you have some form of cockpit (that would be the sarcophagus) and the rest of the body and limbs is completely artificial. With armour you surround your body and limbs directly with stuff to protect (and in case of power armour to enhance) it. That's why Crisis Suits are mechs and not power armour as well (tho Stealth Suits should be power armour by that definition ).

 

What cockpit? DA display doesn't really differ from HUD found on power armour helmet, especially in the dumb DA models where pilot's head pokes out for some reason (venerable, contemptor, leviathan, etc). The only difference is literally the fact that in DA, marine is wired in, while power armour is operated wirelessly through black carapace (but in a lot of cases it's the same wire-in even in PA, see Huron, or literally 90% of IH astartes who have to plug in implants due to them lacking black carapace). Is Marneus Calgar or Gabriel Angelos a dreadnought just because three of his limbs are artificial too?

 

 

Do you REALLY not understand the difference between a mech and armour? 

I'd love to educate you but it's not really the topic and I don't want to derail it even more so I guess you have to use google if you want to know it.

 

 

I'm pretty sure he understands the difference but I'm not sure the difference is relevant when we refer back to the OP; the relative mortality of the operator/pilot/guy in the suit.

 

Perhaps there's a distinction to be drawn between an entity who uses his armour/mech and steps out of it after battle, and one who is reliant on the tech to live? 

And then you have the blurred line of CSMs who are in power armour or terminator armour but cannot take it off as it's been 'warped' into part of their bodies.

 

I still think I'd refer to the inhabitant of all of the types of exoskeleton/mech/armour I've described above as 'mortal'. 

[Ishagu]

What about a patient kept alive by a life support machine in hospital? Are they not mortal?

[RobWrath]

What about a patient kept alive by a life support machine in hospital? Are they not mortal?

 

Well isn't that basically what a dreadnought is? But with big guns!

So yes. 

[Marshal Rohr]

A patient being kept alive in a hospital is a great example of the limits of medicine in the face of mortality.

[NiceGuyAdi]

I’ve always seen The Emperor presented as an immortal, but since the Golden Throne is basically a life support machine with added bells and whistles, is the Emperor not also then mortal?

[Panzer]

Is it really? The Emperor is a perpetual so he shouldn't need a life support machine. Looks to me like the Golden Throne is actually draining him instead. ^^

[Marshal Rohr]

If the Emperor is a perpetual, he doesn't die, he just 'respawns' so to speak. The Golden Throne is keeping him from dying.

[Schlitzaf]

Okay given we now feel mortal is defined by being able to die. How about this, to push the question.

 

What does it mean to be mortal? More accurately how are certain characters (Astartes or Eldar for example) affected by their ‘mortality’.

[Sword Brother Adelard]

The Eldar are acutely affected by it. Their fear of death outstrips any other race, because they know the fate that awaits their souls, there's a fluff piece about it somewhere, how surprised an inquisitor was by their fear.

Their fear is tempered by the infinity stones somewhat, it's what affects their mortality that they die, but don't truly leave this plane.

[Panzer]

Yeah and on the other side mortality means nothing to Astartes. Whether they die or survive has no value as long as they accomplish their mission. Of course they'd prefer to survive to keep fighting but they usually wouldn't hesitate to sacrifice themselves.

[Claws and Effect]

I'd say "will eventually die of old age" would be the qualifying factor.

[Moonreaper666]

Is it really? The Emperor is a perpetual so he shouldn't need a life support machine. Looks to me like the Golden Throne is actually draining him instead. ^^

Perpetuals can die permanently (Without Numellon's sacrifice Vulkan would still be dead)

 

(Grammaticus lose his immortality when he permanently killed Vulkan)

 

Wouldn't surprise me that Chaos somehow strip him of his immortality

 

 

Funny enough, when Erebus revived a certain woman in red she became a Perpetual

 

 

Horus could have dealt a Warp-based curse/poison on the Emperor which could explain why he needs to be in the Golden Throne

[Lexington]

Just...words, aren't they?

 

I guess I don't get the question. Words are words - they're used to describe reality. They're not tangible concepts in and of themselves. We know what these words mean, and if they don't make absolute, ironclad sense for everyone and everything in 40K, that's fine. Language isn't absolute, and there can be other words.

[slitth]

Inspired by Ishagu thread for reference;

 

As the title says, what is mortal in 40k? I don’t mean literally mortals meaning a character who can die. I mean mortal as in ‘human’ (or the vague equivalent thereof). Marines are seen as ‘Angels’, and Demi-Gods. End of the day they have flaws, they are human. The premise of the question is this;

 

For me personally what makes 40k something beyond a Lovecraftian Horror or similar story. Because the universe is defined, by the various mortal races, refusing to go gently. Necrons, Humanity And Aeldari provide the most blatant example of whose core narrative entities are based on “How do we survive or even thrive?”. But even Tau and Orks, both are races whom narrative is based on how they win or overcome. Tau adapt and Orks simply cannot imagine the possibility of going gently into the night.

 

So this brings me to the question, what is being a ‘mortal’? And then by extension for sake of discussion, for the three races noted above (Necrons, Aeldari, And Humanity), has that concept changed for them?

Just some example prompts someone could used or one of their own.

-Astartes And Aspect Warriors, by becoming a weapon did they renounce their own mortality?

-Are any of the modern necrons truly mortal?

-Are the Non-Astartes Humans whom by tech or magic extended their lives, still mortal? (Cawl And Coteaz for example)

-Are Dark Eldar or Craftworld equally mortal?

 

So, what is mortality in 40k?

 

This is a really hard question to answer. But I guess you have to define "life" before the can define death and the ability stay alive infinitely.

 

Now there is many way to define like.

Like in a pure physical meaning, a theoretical meaning or a spiritual meaning to name a few.

In a pure physical meaning of the body functions it's alive, even if the a personally it lost do to something amnesia.

A theoretical meaning is more about the personality of the entity, but when does a personally beginning and end?

As we live the personality changes as we forget, learn and understand, the innocent child we were might have died, but the adult live on in its place.

And of course there is the concept of the soul, which would be the spiritual meaning.

 

To me it's all about the theoretical existence, my personality might die, but my body might keep on functioning and to me that is death.

As long as my personality exists and evolves I am alive and if I can keep that up indefinitely I would be functionally immortal.

But as long as there is a possibility that my personality can cease to exist I would remain mortal.