Who knew of the primaris project?

[Kinstryfe]

I love that the question of "Who knew about the Primaris project?" leads to a bunch of fluff that has been there for ages as potential Primaris origins. It's like if we suddenly got a tank between Predators and Raiders: the possibility was long hinted at, and can retroactively fit.

 

I wouldn't be surprised (if they wanted to flesh it out) if they made some of those weird, accidental duplicate chapters Primaris experiments. One chapter of Imperial Dragons operating in X Segmentum, while Cawl's group had another set in the same livery out there doing field testing. As has been brought up, who would know? And in the Imperium, any weird coincidences can just be said to be clerical errors along the way. I wouldn't be at all surprised if we learn that Primaris have a secret history going way back.

[Doghouse]

I personally don't think that anyone would know any different if Primaris were operating long before Gathering Storm. Realistically speaking given their numbers Marines aren't going to be common place, there will be regular soldiers that go their entire lives never seeing one and to the untrained eye, with all their differing traditions and cultures, isn't really going to look that different. If you stood a Ultramarine, Salamander and Space Wolf without their helmets in front of the average guard Commander would they comprehend the differences between them?

 

If they were under educated scrutiny then maybe.

[vanimal]

What is the mentors legion is exactly that , a legion. As in a legion of primaris, all being tested though our their stages of implantation?

[Elzender]

The Sons if Antaeus being primaris would be a curious and kinda clever touch. Regarding their apothecaries, if all marines on that chapter were primaris, they would probably not know they are actually different from the others, they would assume that all marines have the same organs.

[Steel Company]

 

My real question is what happened to MkIX armour. 

 

 

I've taken to looking at Grey Knight PA being Mk IX, it is different enough that I'd call it that. Not to mention how they are kept secret, mostly, it'd make sense for Mk. IX armour to be 'skipped' over in that regard.

[Metzombie]

The Deathwatch Marines are wearing MkIX.

[Gederas]

The Deathwatch Marines are wearing MkIX.

No. They. Are. NOT.

 

That is a recurring untrue fan-theory.

 

They're wearing Mark VIII.

 

It's specifically even stated as such in the product description for Watch Captain Artemis, who's wearing the same armour as the Kill Team marines:

 

"This multi-part plastic kit contains the components necessary to assemble Watch Captain Artemis. Clad in Mk VIII power armour, he is posed lunging forward, ever eager to lead from the front and attack with maximum aggression – an attitude that has landed him in trouble even with his superiors."

 

Also, if you look the Deathwatch Codex, page 13, note 2. It says as such:

 

"2. Mk VIII battle-plate

The Mk VIII armour used by the Deathwatch is a latter-day design, but provides just as much strength and agility as it's predecessors.Some suits bear backpack-mounted auspicator lenses to improve data presience."

 

And the depicted marine is literally one of the marines from the Kill-Team box.

 

I've looked into this. There has never been ANY reference to Mark IX armour, especially not Deathwatch using it. That misinformation needs to stop.

 

 

My real question is what happened to MkIX armour. 

I've taken to looking at Grey Knight PA being Mk IX, it is different enough that I'd call it that. Not to mention how they are kept secret, mostly, it'd make sense for Mk. IX armour to be 'skipped' over in that regard.

Grey Knight armour is its own thing. It can't be MkIX if it predates MkVIII too :lol:

[Irbis]

 

My real question is what happened to MkIX armour. 

I've taken to looking at Grey Knight PA being Mk IX, it is different enough that I'd call it that. Not to mention how they are kept secret, mostly, it'd make sense for Mk. IX armour to be 'skipped' over in that regard.

Grey Knight armour is its own thing. It can't be MkIX if it predates MkVIII too

 

Technically, it looks like it's just Mk VI with 'beakie' helmet missing sensor beak in front and extra chest plate with gorget covering cables. If you look, rest is nearly identical to Mk VI, particularly legs, so if that's not just chapter variant (some legions had armour marks modified nearly to the point GK do) it's certainly a development of Corvus, IMO.

[Claws and Effect]

I personally don't think that anyone would know any different if Primaris were operating long before Gathering Storm. Realistically speaking given their numbers Marines aren't going to be common place, there will be regular soldiers that go their entire lives never seeing one and to the untrained eye, with all their differing traditions and cultures, isn't really going to look that different. If you stood a Ultramarine, Salamander and Space Wolf without their helmets in front of the average guard Commander would they comprehend the differences between them?

 

If they were under educated scrutiny then maybe.

Pretty sure a regular Joe would notice differences between a Salamander, Ultra, and Wolf.

 

Glowing red eyes with pitch black skin on one and fangs on the other are going to stand out a bit. You chose bad examples.

 

If you had said a Fist, a Dark Angel, and an Ultramarine they'd be unable to tell the difference.

 

Edit: Unless you mean to say the differences are obvious, but the Guard commander wouldn't understand the significance of them.

[FlamingDeth]

I think that's what he's getting at. Side by side comparison has obvious differences, but when an eight foot tall guy wearing a tank walks up to you and says "THE EMPEROR SENT ME" and you've only heard legends that vaguely resembled him then you're probably not going to argue.

[Doghouse]

Yeah that is what I was pretty much aiming for. :)

[bluntblade]

How about the Minotaurs, they fit the bill for being unknowing early Primaris.

 

They're big, shadowy past, tough, and go through other marines (Chaos, Rebel or just a bit questionable) like a train.

 

Rik

That last one seems to be more because the Minotaurs almost always operate at full force in-theatre and get the very nicest toys. A Chapter which is less well-supplied and has to split itself a few ways is liable to be defeated in detail.

[Wispy]

Cawl had Heresey Era Fenrisians to make Space Wolves out of, so Russ had to have known and was cooperating.

[slitth]

I would expect that a surprisingly high number of people would know of the project, but not of its scale and source material.

After all a hidden project is a void that would stick out like a sore thumb in the heart of the Imperium.

But if you are one in many there and if you are supervised by allies with in the Inquisition.

 

I would also not be surprised if Cawl was exposed to members of the Traitor legions that remained loyal to the Imperium.

And he would have willing and eager helper from such persons.

After all if Cawl really succeeded in make the Astartes more resistant to chaos, then there would be a chance that the traitor legions could be reinstated in the imperium.

But pure and uncorrupted.

 

Many, just maybe Cawl has a hidden sponsor in the form of the Alpha Legion. As this would be the for loyal members to drop the undercover act.

A long shot if there ever was one, but the Alpha Legion is good at uncovering secrets.

[bluntblade]

Cawl had Heresey Era Fenrisians to make Space Wolves out of, so Russ had to have known and was cooperating.

I like the idea of Cawl being a part of the Wolf Brothers fiasco and going into some sort of exile as a result.