Marshal Rohr Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 Void Dragon of course Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sete Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 Yeah the real one got bitchslapped so hard it's still unconscious :D Jokes aside, I want to know how that encounter went down . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b1soul Posted December 18, 2018 Share Posted December 18, 2018 I was thinking void dragon but UR-025 refers to the Omnissiah as "he" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyriks Posted December 18, 2018 Share Posted December 18, 2018 I was thinking void dragon but UR-025 refers to the Omnissiah as "he" the c'tan are usually referred to as "he." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carach Posted December 18, 2018 Share Posted December 18, 2018 doesn't necessarily have to be C'Tan, though. If one listens to where Oll' goes with his merry band of followers through space and time, they end up on a planet he knows has been destroyed by some gigantic robotic fiend in the wars that occurred between men of iron and humanity, so it implies iirc. Considering the lore/in-universe knowledge of that particular time is practically non-existent the 'real' Omnissiah could be anyone or anything. It could be the first man of iron that led the rest of his kind into rebellion.. entirely separate from the impossibly ancient C'tan jazz Of course we know though that the Void Dragon was somehow killed/tamed in Medieval times. Then transported to Mars at some other time. In the hugely vast time period spanning between the Emperor appearing and the Void Dragon being enslaved.. could it be that perhaps mr Void Dragon managed to pull some manipulation jazz on thinking robots? there's a :cuss load of scope for story telling on that one.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob P Posted December 18, 2018 Share Posted December 18, 2018 Slight off topic but ... doesn't necessarily have to be C'Tan, though. If one listens to where Oll' goes with his merry band of followers through space and time, they end up on a planet he knows has been destroyed by some gigantic robotic fiend in the wars that occurred between men of iron and humanity, so it implies iirc. Considering the lore/in-universe knowledge of that particular time is practically non-existent the 'real' Omnissiah could be anyone or anything. It could be the first man of iron that led the rest of his kind into rebellion.. entirely separate from the impossibly ancient C'tan jazz Of course we know though that the Void Dragon was somehow killed/tamed in Medieval times. Then transported to Mars at some other time. In the hugely vast time period spanning between the Emperor appearing and the Void Dragon being enslaved.. could it be that perhaps mr Void Dragon managed to pull some manipulation jazz on thinking robots? there's a load of scope for story telling on that one.. Do we take the void dragon and Emperor thing at face value? I mean, it's possible because of the webway, but if the void dragon was on Terra in medieval times (and, presumably, earlier), wouldn't it have incited a technological revolution? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Rohr Posted December 18, 2018 Share Posted December 18, 2018 Wasnt ADBs creation of the Aresian Path the finalization of that answer? The Void Dragon arrived on Earth via the Webway and the Emperor imprisoned him on Mars by taking him there on the Path? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mellow Posted December 18, 2018 Share Posted December 18, 2018 I just presumed that the Omnissiah that UR refers to is probably an AI from the DAoT. For example the first/most powerful one that appeared during those times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyriks Posted December 18, 2018 Share Posted December 18, 2018 Slight off topic but ... doesn't necessarily have to be C'Tan, though. If one listens to where Oll' goes with his merry band of followers through space and time, they end up on a planet he knows has been destroyed by some gigantic robotic fiend in the wars that occurred between men of iron and humanity, so it implies iirc. Considering the lore/in-universe knowledge of that particular time is practically non-existent the 'real' Omnissiah could be anyone or anything. It could be the first man of iron that led the rest of his kind into rebellion.. entirely separate from the impossibly ancient C'tan jazz Of course we know though that the Void Dragon was somehow killed/tamed in Medieval times. Then transported to Mars at some other time. In the hugely vast time period spanning between the Emperor appearing and the Void Dragon being enslaved.. could it be that perhaps mr Void Dragon managed to pull some manipulation jazz on thinking robots? there's a :cuss load of scope for story telling on that one.. Do we take the void dragon and Emperor thing at face value? I mean, it's possible because of the webway, but if the void dragon was on Terra in medieval times (and, presumably, earlier), wouldn't it have incited a technological revolution? Well, it didn't have much to start with. If it really happened the Emperor must have found out about it somehow, maybe it did start one and the Emperor realized it was unnatural and hunted down the source before it did too much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carach Posted December 18, 2018 Share Posted December 18, 2018 who's to say the Emperor did not imprison him in the first place with the plan to use it to create a technological revolution? Him being chained up and jazz could of led to a lot of the tech advancement mankind then made leading up to horrendous collapse. and/or Emps could well have been one of those great inventors back when he was hiding away behind the scenes - he could of got that stuff from mr VD (lol) Wasn't there some conjecture that the whole reason for a Mechanical Mars was because of the Void Dragon's latent presence? This is stuff that could flesh out all that history but i do like the other thought of the 'real' Omnissiah being the kind of 'chosen one' super leader AI that led the men of iron into rebellion against humanity. These things don't necessarily all have to lead back to one of the established characters - there is a boat load of time for epic characters to have been born/created, lived and died.. at the end of the day its just one of those fun little one liners that stirs the mind and makes you sit up and smirk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burni Posted December 19, 2018 Share Posted December 19, 2018 Anyone read Motherlode? Any good? I didn't realise there was another BSF story in the calendar (I read Man of Iron). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyriks Posted December 19, 2018 Share Posted December 19, 2018 who's to say the Emperor did not imprison him in the first place with the plan to use it to create a technological revolution? Him being chained up and jazz could of led to a lot of the tech advancement mankind then made leading up to horrendous collapse. and/or Emps could well have been one of those great inventors back when he was hiding away behind the scenes - he could of got that stuff from mr VD (lol) Wasn't there some conjecture that the whole reason for a Mechanical Mars was because of the Void Dragon's latent presence? This is stuff that could flesh out all that history but i do like the other thought of the 'real' Omnissiah being the kind of 'chosen one' super leader AI that led the men of iron into rebellion against humanity. These things don't necessarily all have to lead back to one of the established characters - there is a boat load of time for epic characters to have been born/created, lived and died.. at the end of the day its just one of those fun little one liners that stirs the mind and makes you sit up and smirk Also, no reason to think they're exclusive. VD could have made the MOI in an attempt to get free or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carach Posted December 19, 2018 Share Posted December 19, 2018 Anyone read Motherlode? Any good? I didn't realise there was another BSF story in the calendar (I read Man of Iron). its not got any lore-gems in it but its a fun little read Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carach Posted December 24, 2018 Share Posted December 24, 2018 Well it was nice to see Lotara again. Lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roomsky Posted December 24, 2018 Share Posted December 24, 2018 Great short, great to see Lotara again, even after her recent appearance in Prince of Blood. Plenty of fun little tidbits about how the World Eaters operate now, and probably the creepiest description of a daemon ship I've seen yet. Great stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbienw Posted December 24, 2018 Share Posted December 24, 2018 She is going to end up a Khorne Daemon Princess I reckon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karthak Posted December 24, 2018 Share Posted December 24, 2018 She is going to end up a Khorne Daemon Princess I reckon. I really hope both she and the ship go down in flames at Terra. We need more named Heresy-era traitors to die; as is, so many survive that one wonders why they didn't win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morovir Posted December 24, 2018 Share Posted December 24, 2018 The Conquerer is still around as of the 13th Black Crusade, according to The Lords of Silence, where the Conquerer under Kossolax the Foresworn leads the attack on Aggripinaa. Lotara has no such guarantee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SchultzChaos Posted December 24, 2018 Share Posted December 24, 2018 If not Lotara merges with the Conquerer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Rohr Posted December 25, 2018 Share Posted December 25, 2018 ADB doesn’t recycle character arcs like that and it would be too close to the Vengeful Spirit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kriegsmacht Posted December 25, 2018 Share Posted December 25, 2018 It kind of reads like Goulding just wanted to stir the pot a little bit and plant these questions then turn around and say 'too bad I can't tell you the answer, it's just going to be a big mystery I guess!' That is a horrible piece of storytelling in any medium. If there's never going to be a payoff to a mystery then teasing about it is irritating and pointless not to mention boring. I'm sure I read on here that the authors were told to stop with the whole missing legions teasing sometime after The First Heretic was released. Why this Goulding guy is keeping it going is beyond me. Just let the Missing Legions die and go away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkChaplain Posted December 25, 2018 Author Share Posted December 25, 2018 Thing is, it isn't strictly about the Lost Legions. It's about Horus realizing that the Primarchs, for all their achievements, are relatively easy to abandon for the Emperor and Malcador in particular. That his fears of losing out when Russ was found and he wasn't the only one anymore might hit closer to heart than he'd realized. That Malcador is fully willing to rewrite history if it suited the Imperium, even if it meant erasing Primarchs. It feeds right into the False Gods problem with Horus being shown visions of a future where he and many of his brothers were abandoned and the Emperor set up as a God with a select host of Primarch-demigods by his side. For years people have felt like his conversion came a bit too suddenly, but pieces like this one, or the opening of Wolfsbane, contribute to show us that the cracks leading up to it had been around for a long time before then. Horus saw first hand that the Imperium, and his father, already abandoned at least one of his brothers, unceremoniously and to the point of melting down the statue entirely. At this point, the visions shown to him aren't just "the Emperor could throw half of you away, maybe, sometime in the future" and more like "he has been planning to rid himself of you all along, and you know he has done so before twice already - your fears were justified". And then it is also a story developing Malcador as a character further, as well as the role of the High Council, something that was clearly lacking in the series. It harkens back to Malcador's earlier life while showing another glimpse at his distaste at what he is made to do for the supposed good of the Imperium. It also shows that his walls of mystery are not impregnable and his past is something he might feel the need to atone for by aiding the Emperor. That he wasn't a good man to begin with. On top of that all, it even gives us Jaghatai's early relationship with Horus, and his change of heart. He hated the tyranny of the Imperium, and erasing a brother of his is basically the purest expression of that. It might have been an experience that firmly put him onto Horus' side of the board, something we knew Horus was gambling on and Malcador feared. That he came around to not only holding true to his loyalties to his father's Imperium, but also recognizes the intent and reasons behind the shameful acts of yesteryear, and warming up enough to Malcador to issue a warning? That speaks to me as quite a development from the Khan's reluctance to even just receive a bookkeeper into his Legion. He's committed now, along with his Legion, and has chosen a side he considers if not fully correct, then at least enough so that he doesn't hold that particularly grudge anymore. I think it is honestly more interesting to look at what the story actually gives us through clever use of the Lost Primarch hooks, something that we know existed in setting even if we'll never have it detailed, rather than what it deliberately won't and can't tell us. It's easy to get distracted by the mystery surrounding the lost ones, but is that really the focus of the story, or the points it is trying to make and reinforce? I don't think so. It is yet another piece that fits snugly into various character arcs, not least of all Malcador's weariness at being made to commit pretty vile things for the greater good of the Imperium, at the Emperor's behest. It is also a piece that contrasts rather well with what we've seen before, with Malcador desperately clinging on to the past and human history, while the Emperor is foreward-facing to a fault. It's not just his collection of ancient human artifacts like the Rosetta Stone, but also his hand in creating the order of Remembrancers - something that's always been a late addition to the Great Crusade. I wouldn't even discount the possibility that it's establishment was a direct result of this confrontation, or the purge of the second lost brother, in that it would be used to record the Legions' deeds for the annals of the Imperium, to provide a safety net and assure the Primarchs that they won't just be forgotten and purged the same way. Malcador really is a pitiful being in the grand scheme of things. He's being torn between his personal beliefs and his loyalty to the Emperor, always. Consider his acts as Grand Master of Assassins, behind the Emperor's back, for example, or his reactions in The Board is Set, and his dilemma in First Lord. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nagashnee Posted December 25, 2018 Share Posted December 25, 2018 Dark Chaplain of course! How brilliant of BL to build up the fall of horus a DECADE after they WROTE A TRILOGY ABOUT IT in the form of a calender short. Those clever rascals are only listening to customer feedback and trying to fix their mistake. For a second there i thought BL simply let goulding play to his worse impulses. Like all the others times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b1soul Posted December 25, 2018 Share Posted December 25, 2018 I can look past Laurie's milking of the lost primarchs if the story were actually good However, Malcador's Force-choking of Horus was farcical IMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkChaplain Posted December 25, 2018 Author Share Posted December 25, 2018 Dark Chaplain of course! How brilliant of BL to build up the fall of horus a DECADE after they WROTE A TRILOGY ABOUT IT in the form of a calender short. Those clever rascals are only listening to customer feedback and trying to fix their mistake. For a second there i thought BL simply let goulding play to his worse impulses. Like all the others times. And I thought it was the season for Snowmen, rather than Strawmen... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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