Jump to content

Welcome to The Bolter and Chainsword
Register now to gain access to all of our features. Once registered and logged in, you will be able to create topics, post replies to existing threads, give reputation to your fellow members, get your own private messenger, post status updates, manage your profile and so much more. If you already have an account, login here - otherwise create an account for free today!
Photo

Primaris deathwatch testimonials


  • Please log in to reply
35 replies to this topic

#26
Black Orange

Black Orange

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 9,917 posts
  • Location:Unto realms immortal...
  • Faction: TODESKOMPANIE
Fortis Kill Team is what it is. They do work.

Had a league game tonight versus Tau Empire and it turned into a real blood bath too -

64-DEA996-B18-B-4552-99-CE-2-AA4-D6-E125

Poor old Xenos.

Edited by Black Orange, 06 December 2018 - 05:18 AM.

  • Prot likes this

No one can beat my Wu Tang Sword Style!
my 40k blog:https://greenblowfly.../alan-seds.html - Terminus Est - Space Marines 247
wc.jpg
Blood and Honor!https://1d4chan.org/wiki/Mary_Sue Mary Sue and Plot Armor are terms used by losers


#27
Xisor

Xisor

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 922 posts
Modifications made to the DW or Primaris rules have the capacity to break the perceived symbiosis and attested effectiveness of Primaris in this context.

E.g. it is conceivable (if not especially likely) that CA might balance things to make Veterans strikingly more efficient, with non-SB options attractive

If that happens, and I expect one day that will happen in some form, then this vaunted reasoning is for naught - synergies will be broken, and svelte elegance may be lost - and so the DW Primaris might be somewhat lacklustre and expensive compared to running Primaris as Codex Adeptus Astartes itself.

Afterwall, it would be very strange indeed for GW to sustain and grow the idea that Deathwatch is 'the best way to do Primaris en masse'.
  • Lemondish likes this

#28
our_baz

our_baz

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 1,017 posts
  • Location:Wiltshire
  • Faction: 55th Company Salamanders
To answer the OP, only used DW once in anger against horde orks. My intergressor squad was my standout performer. Used them to hold the centre ground of the board very successfully. But like I said only ran them once.
Further question, possibly little off topic (edit if necessary), of the two primaris battleforces which one in the fraters opinion is best for adding to/starting off with primaris in DW

#29
Vel'Cona

Vel'Cona

    ++ DUCTOR EXSANGUIS ++

  • ++ MODERATI ++
  • 5,718 posts
  • Location:Krumpin' distance!
  • Faction: WAAAGH!!!

Yikes, something about that photo makes my eyes hurt.  Is that the paint scheme or just overexposed?


Seems like these models will never end!

ETL_2015_Banner_02_Custos_Fidei_02.jpgETL_2016_Banner_03_Custos_Fidei01.jpggallery_48988_10069_10495.pngETL_Medal_02.gifETL_2018_Medal_01_Custos_Fidei_01.gif


 


#30
Qui-Gon

Qui-Gon

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 131 posts

 

I do try too but sometimes people wear out the welcome mat figuratively speaking. We are quite tactical in this forum and Deathwatch is currently the most competitive SM dex imho. Primaris work because you can mix Marines from different units... you don't need a Reiver with a plasma pistole.

I think Xisor's point is that the options to mix and match that deeply appeal to many and, in many cases, can emulate what can already be done with a Fortis team, so why even maintain the limitations? Basically, if I'm parsing it right, why even maintain these limitations that take complicated combinations to overcome when a simple "give access to X wargear to model Y" would be simpler. It's a uniquely different perspective because it both has merit but also misses the point of Primaris.

I do not disagree that it's a draw to make those types of choices for your units. That's a compelling point, and shouldn't be discounted. The simplicity for Primaris comes less from streamlining access to wargear and instead focusing everyone on what the baseline model contributes to the unit. Veterans select models AND relevant wargear, and the possible permutations are myriad, but many are largely irrelevant. Primaris kill teams choose models with set wargear as a package, making it ultimately simpler. You know what an Intercessor or Hellblaster is bringing. You know what a Reiver and Inceptor contributes. You slot that into your unit much easier than deciding what type of the several dozen variations of Veteran you can craft, some of which are ill advised.

Removing boundaries may seem simpler, and a Reiver with an assault plasma incinerate sounds awesome, but it is a facade. There's hidden complexity and pitfalls there that don't exist with Primaris entirely because of their legion aesthetic, and that means that their synergies are tighter and symbiotic.

 

 

And yet in some other forms of sharing Deathwatch experience, in spite of the simplicity, I see every two weeks another question and reiteration of the discussion on what is better: the bolt rifle, stalker bolt rifle, or the auto bolt rifle, (or other insert primaris weapons option). We all know that the heavy versions of things are bad, the assault versions only if you're Aggressing and rapid fire every other time. Yet people still can't pick up on the simplicity. :P



#31
Lemondish

Lemondish

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 1,035 posts

And yet in some other forms of sharing Deathwatch experience, in spite of the simplicity, I see every two weeks another question and reiteration of the discussion on what is better: the bolt rifle, stalker bolt rifle, or the auto bolt rifle, (or other insert primaris weapons option). We all know that the heavy versions of things are bad, the assault versions only if you're Aggressing and rapid fire every other time. Yet people still can't pick up on the simplicity. :P

The simplicity is that they're all relevant for the same target type and their value is compared only to each other.

If I were to ask you which is better to equip a Veteran with, and then list all 31 individual options, we balloon from 3 choices to literally dozens upon dozens of potential combinations. Want to know how many of those options are in the actual kit? 12. Even fewer that are considered viable. I dislike trap picks.

And I'm not letting Primaris off the hook on that - the heavy options need to be viable. But can you guess how much easier it'll be to make those viable compared to making over two thirds of the wargear options for Veterans viable?

The answer will be storm bolter/chainsword anyway.

DW, right now, pre-CA and campaign book, are still the best place to play Primaris. That's because they gain access to valuable stratagems, an amazing chapter bonus in SIA and Mission Tactics, and mixed units that cover many of the individual unit weaknesses.

But that obviously doesn't mean they're the best way to play DW. Sadly, from the GT tournament analysis I've done in other threads, Vets with storm bolters in mixed teams that focus on improving the storm bolter Vet above all else are the better choice to try and make it to top tables.

But Primaris are still super competitive at all other levels of the game. And the future is far brighter with CA rumoured points drops and the inevitable new Primaris additions.

Edited by Lemondish, 06 December 2018 - 02:42 PM.


#32
Black Orange

Black Orange

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 9,917 posts
  • Location:Unto realms immortal...
  • Faction: TODESKOMPANIE

I am all for the auto bolt rifles with an Aggressor(s) so they can advance and shoot without penalty. I use my FKT primarily to clear enemy chaff and screens so the lack of AP is generaly not an issue.

 

The picture is just the way I snapped it last night - maybe the shop lighting ?


  • Lemondish likes this

No one can beat my Wu Tang Sword Style!
my 40k blog:https://greenblowfly.../alan-seds.html - Terminus Est - Space Marines 247
wc.jpg
Blood and Honor!https://1d4chan.org/wiki/Mary_Sue Mary Sue and Plot Armor are terms used by losers


#33
Prot

Prot

    ++ EQUES AEDITUUS ++

  • ++ MODERATI ++
  • 12,991 posts

Fortis Kill Team is what it is. They do work.

Had a league game tonight versus Tau Empire and it turned into a real blood bath too -

64-DEA996-B18-B-4552-99-CE-2-AA4-D6-E125

Poor old Xenos.

 

Tau are the bane of 98.7% of my armies. Beautiful picture. thumbsup.gif

 

 

I am all for the auto bolt rifles with an Aggressor(s) so they can advance and shoot without penalty. I use my FKT primarily to clear enemy chaff and screens so the lack of AP is generaly not an issue.

 

The picture is just the way I snapped it last night - maybe the shop lighting ?

I do this as well. I use autobolters with aggressor squads.


Edited by Prot, 06 December 2018 - 07:48 PM.

Click to see....
gallery_2760_14273_30255.jpg
Instagram: @Prot40k


#34
Lemondish

Lemondish

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 1,035 posts
Absolutely love the auto bolt rifle with Aggressor units. So mobile, so cool looking with those big drum mags. Adding in some Reivers to that unit to give it a bit more fun specialness as well, but have to paint them up first.
  • Prot likes this

#35
Black Orange

Black Orange

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 9,917 posts
  • Location:Unto realms immortal...
  • Faction: TODESKOMPANIE

Prot those dirty got run right over by a freight train ! :D They could not pull their triggers fast enough.


  • Prot and Lemondish like this

No one can beat my Wu Tang Sword Style!
my 40k blog:https://greenblowfly.../alan-seds.html - Terminus Est - Space Marines 247
wc.jpg
Blood and Honor!https://1d4chan.org/wiki/Mary_Sue Mary Sue and Plot Armor are terms used by losers


#36
Trevak Dal

Trevak Dal

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 3,678 posts
  • Location:Tennessee
  • Faction: Black Legion (Night Blades)
That Tau player lacked proper aggressiveness, he used crutch units. Lean too heavily on a crutch and one day it might break on you.

"Our Turn" - Centurion Khârn.

 





1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users