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Buried Dagger: Doom of the Death Guard


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#1
Taliesin

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Caught this blurb on the warcom site and wondered about it:

 

 

The Buried Dagger, by James Swallow, tells the long-awaited story of the fall of the Death Guard. Bestilled in the warp, the Legion is ravaged by contagion. Nurgle wishes to bestow his gifts upon them – but will proud Mortarion accept such corruption to save the lives of his sons? It’s also a bridge between the series so far and the Siege, catching up with heroes on the Throneworld, including Knights-Errant, the Sigillite, the would-be saint Euphrati Keeler… and nine mysterious silver-armoured figures with psychic powers.

 

Aside from the fact that this blurb makes it sound very interesting, that reference at the end surprised me.

 

Sounds like Grey Knights. But, it's Horus Heresy time. And.. Knights Errant are already mentioned separately in the same blurb.

 

Thoughts?



#2
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I think it's fairly obvious. If not the Grey Knights, then their predecessors.



#3
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#4
Lord Marshal

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For the Death Guard's one, only and most defining book, I sure hope it doesn't become 50% about the Knights-Errant/Grey Knights.

 

I'd be surprised if it didn't mind you.


Edited by Lord Marshal, 24 January 2019 - 10:57 PM.

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#5
Kelborn

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I'd say Knight Errants being a bunch of agents for Malcador. Not all of them were psykers. The GK were founded by members of the KE, not of their entirety.

We'll see Ianus again, which was confirmed to me by James himself.

I assume that it'll cover the very first steps of their founding or rather a revelation of the KEs true purposes.

Don't forget, Titan was hidden before the final assault. So they're out there during the Siege.

Edited by Kelborn, 24 January 2019 - 11:00 PM.

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#6
b1soul

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I hope this reads with more vim than Fear to Tread
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#7
mc warhammer

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cautiously optimistic
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can't touch this
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warhammer time!
 

#8
DarkChaplain

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Keep in mind that the Death Guard are due getting a bit warp-lost, and things in the warp are rarely linear.

 

We also know that at least one Death Guard dude turned Daemon Prince was imprisoned on Pythos in the Pandorax system, which was also where they left Epimetheus. Pandorax was one of the first big missions for the Grey Knights after re-emerging. Then there's the thing about the Grey Knights actively trying to curtail Mortarion, which sees the elevation of Kaldor Draigo way in the future, and Mortarion tells him he knew Janus.

From the Mortarion's Heart script:

 

 

At this, Mortarion began to laugh. Draigo remained resolute.

MORTARION (snorting): \\Oh, noble and mighty Janus! Noble, mighty, steadfast, pious and honourable Janus–//

Draigo snapped his hand out in a punitive gesture, and a psychic blow flashed against Mortarion’s wards like the crack of a whip. It was delivered with the unwavering resolve of a beast-tamer bringing his charge to heel.

DRAIGO (helmet-vox): Do not speak his name. You are unworthy. Janus was the first of us to stand against the forces of Chaos, and the greatest.
The primarch still rippled with mirth, but shot through now with a flicker of agitation.

MORTARION: \\I am unworthy? I spit on the name of “Janus”. You are more like him than you could ever know...//

 

[.....]

 

MORTARION (low, conspiratorial): \\But of course, I doubt even the archives of Titan would contain the original identities of the Sigillite’s... errant angels. Names. Power. It works both ways. Guarded. Hidden. [pause] The truth of Janus’s past would shake your pitiful Chapter to its very foundations. Of that, you can be certain. Treachery, cowardice... heresy, and a brother who would willingly betray his own for the sake of some half-imagined redemption.//

 

Draigo faltered, just for a second, but Mortarion saw the moment of doubt in the Grey Knight’s heart. The primarch’s words became no more than a filtered whisper through the rebreather.

 

MORTARION: \\As I told your master before I cut him down – you have all been deceived.//

 

So it makes perfect sense for Mortarion to be privy to the Grey Knights project. This was long coming. The question is how Swallow is going to handle it, and whether or not Malcador casts his weave in this novel, to hide Titan away.

Chances are we'll find out many juicy bits, I just hope they won't be wasted on another floppy attempt like Fear to Tread...


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#9
Tymell

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For the Death Guard's one, only and most defining book, I sure hope it doesn't become 50% about the Knights-Errant/Grey Knights.

 

I'd be surprised if it didn't mind you.

 

This is exactly what I fear/suspect from the descriptions. Books split between two different main narratives can work fine, but this is one instance where I really don't agree with it. If there's one legion that deserves a book entirely to themselves, it's the Death Guard.


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#10
Angel_of_Blood

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That it says nine, rather than eight makes me wonder. I’m thinking the ninth may be Garro, but as hinted before, he may die as the first true martyr of the new Imperial Faith.

As for some of them not having psychic powers, this doesn’t seem much of an issue, as Epimetheus stated that his original gene seed was taken out and replaced by another, ginger to be from the Emperor. Always thought from that, it was going to address how the non-psychic Knights Errant will get their psychic powers.

We still have quite a few of them kicking around too, more than eight(nine), to become those original eight grand masters. Might make another thread on that though.

In any case, I’m cautiously optimistic for the novel.

#11
Biscuittzz

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That it says nine, rather than eight makes me wonder. I’m thinking the ninth may be Garro, but as hinted before, he may die as the first true martyr of the new Imperial Faith.

As for some of them not having psychic powers, this doesn’t seem much of an issue, as Epimetheus stated that his original gene seed was taken out and replaced by another, ginger to be from the Emperor. Always thought from that, it was going to address how the non-psychic Knights Errant will get their psychic powers.

We still have quite a few of them kicking around too, more than eight(nine), to become those original eight grand masters. Might make another thread on that though.

In any case, I’m cautiously optimistic for the novel.

 

You're forgetting that Janus was the first Supreme Grand Master, not just Grand Master. So it would be him and 8 other GMs to make up the aforementioned nine.

 

Of the knights-errant, my feeling would be that the Chief Librarians are most likely to be Grand Masters. So the Salamander, the Night Lord and the newest Raven Guard recruit.


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#12
DarkChaplain

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I'm curious if there'll be any hint about the Dark Angel that'll end up being Epimetheus. Speculation that it's Zahariel has been hit and miss for years, seeing Angels of Caliban, although a redeemed Zahariel would certainly be qualified for the name Epimetheus... Hindsight is 20/20, and all that.


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#13
Angel_of_Blood

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That it says nine, rather than eight makes me wonder. I’m thinking the ninth may be Garro, but as hinted before, he may die as the first true martyr of the new Imperial Faith.

As for some of them not having psychic powers, this doesn’t seem much of an issue, as Epimetheus stated that his original gene seed was taken out and replaced by another, ginger to be from the Emperor. Always thought from that, it was going to address how the non-psychic Knights Errant will get their psychic powers.

We still have quite a few of them kicking around too, more than eight(nine), to become those original eight grand masters. Might make another thread on that though.

In any case, I’m cautiously optimistic for the novel.

You're forgetting that Janus was the first Supreme Grand Master, not just Grand Master. So it would be him and 8 other GMs to make up the aforementioned nine.

Of the knights-errant, my feeling would be that the Chief Librarians are most likely to be Grand Masters. So the Salamander, the Night Lord and the newest Raven Guard recruit.

Not forgetting. In The Emperors Gift, it’s stated that Janus is one of the eight. That coupled with the lore that Malcador presented the Emperor with eight Astartes.

I’m not willing to bet that the eight will be revealed in this novel, but they really should be. Seeing as they are meant to have no part in the siege at all and Malcador is meant to vanish Titan before it begins. So unless they are covered in maybe the first or second novel of the Siege series, then they should be gone. Feels like that’s too much to tie up in this last novel though, as well as the main Death Guard plot as well as some Caliban fun.

Edited by Angel_of_Blood, 26 January 2019 - 09:30 PM.


#14
TheRealMcCagh

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What novels/shorts cover the latest Knights Errant recruits? I remember Garro getting Loken, Rubio, and Varren in those short stories, who are all still alive as far as I know. Iacton has been there the whole time, similar to Severian. Arvida gets brought in right at the end there. The group in Vengeful Spirit seems to all die either in the novel or later in Wolfsbane. So that leaves those first four, Severian, and Arvida still around, maybe two or three from that Vengeful Spirit raiding party



#15
Morovir

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Out of the surviving Knights-Errant, the psykers are:

 

Tylos Rubio - Ultramarines

Severian - Luna Wolves

Vardas Ison - Unspecified, though stated in the Horus Heresy Weekender 2016 to be an Iron Hand

Revuel Arvida - Thousand Sons

Fel Zharost - Night Lords

Umojen - Salamanders

Balsar Khurthuri - Raven Guard

Antaka Cyvaan - Raven Guard

 

We also know that the Dark Angel who would be known as Epimetheus was one of the founders of the Grey Knights, so technically, that's all nine provided that they all survive. However, I doubt that this will be the actual makeup of the founding Grey Knights, especially as two of them are Raven Guard, with one only being introduced briefly in Crimson King, and so is unlikely to be a major plot character like the rest.


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#16
Tymell

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Out of the surviving Knights-Errant, the psykers are:

 

Tylos Rubio - Ultramarines

Severian - Luna Wolves

Vardas Ison - Unspecified, though stated in the Horus Heresy Weekender 2016 to be an Iron Hand

Revuel Arvida - Thousand Sons

Fel Zharost - Night Lords

Umojen - Salamanders

Balsar Khurthuri - Raven Guard

Antaka Cyvaan - Raven Guard

 

We also know that the Dark Angel who would be known as Epimetheus was one of the founders of the Grey Knights, so technically, that's all nine provided that they all survive. However, I doubt that this will be the actual makeup of the founding Grey Knights, especially as two of them are Raven Guard, with one only being introduced briefly in Crimson King, and so is unlikely to be a major plot character like the rest.

 

Was Severian actually confirmed as a psyker? It's been a while since I read Vengeful Spirit and Wolf Mother, so I can't recall.

 

I don't know if they'd go with it, but as far as Dark Angels go, there was the Blackshield one Garro recruited in FW Book VI, "The Nemean". I don't believe it was ever stated that he was a psyker, but I don't think it was stated that he wasn't either.


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#17
Biscuittzz

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Out of the surviving Knights-Errant, the psykers are:

 

Tylos Rubio - Ultramarines

Severian - Luna Wolves

Vardas Ison - Unspecified, though stated in the Horus Heresy Weekender 2016 to be an Iron Hand

Revuel Arvida - Thousand Sons

Fel Zharost - Night Lords

Umojen - Salamanders

Balsar Khurthuri - Raven Guard

Antaka Cyvaan - Raven Guard

 

We also know that the Dark Angel who would be known as Epimetheus was one of the founders of the Grey Knights, so technically, that's all nine provided that they all survive. However, I doubt that this will be the actual makeup of the founding Grey Knights, especially as two of them are Raven Guard, with one only being introduced briefly in Crimson King, and so is unlikely to be a major plot character like the rest.

 

Drop off the second Raven Guard ( not Balsar as he's the Chief Librarian) and add in Sevatar, who's heavily hinted to be the first Grand Master of the 8th Brotherhood, and you have a reasonable potential 8 first GKs maybe?

 

@TheRealMcCagh Balsar Kurthuri was the RG Chief Librarian but sent away to present himself to Malcador by Corax in Weregeld. His arc is continued in the short story The Grey Raven. Emphasis on the grey part I guess doesn't leave much to the imagination.

 

Edit: If you count Severian as a 'Traitor Legion' astartes and bring in Sevatar, you'll have 4 loyalist and 4 traitor astartes as the initial grand masters. My own ideal canon would be that all 8 of them come from traitor legions. Think it adds a different dynamic.


Edited by Biscuittzz, 27 January 2019 - 12:32 AM.


#18
Angel_of_Blood

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I’m sure ADB posted somewhere that Sevatar was not Khyron, damned if I can find where though.

Also a little conflicting as the Night Lords talk about him being on Terra for the Siege, a lot even believing he died there. Can’t be on Terra if he’s meant to be on Titan. But then his current status is nowhere near Terra or Titan, so who knows.

#19
fire golem

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Yeah I was under the impression the whole ‘Sevetar is one of the first Grey Knights’ had been debunked by ADB before too (although maybe I’m wrong).

#20
Morovir

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I doubt Sevatar was one of the founders, as there is already Fel Zharost as a Night Lord, and so far he seems like far more of a viable candidate for being a loyalist than Sevatar.


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#21
Biscuittzz

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For those interested in the Sevatar theory. Posters over on the 40k lore reddit had an immense post on it breaking down nearly every reason and angle. I found it to be  good read.

 

https://www.reddit.c..._is_a_founding/



#22
Fedor

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Who was the Knight Errant in Deathfire that took Narek from Macragge? if i remember rightly Narek wakes up next to his dead body and stowed away on the Salamanders ship. Was that supposed to be someone we knew previously, or just a Redshirt to get Narek where he needed to be? It didn't make much sense to me.



#23
DarkChaplain

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Kaspian Hecht. I don't believe he featured anywhere else, so yeah, just a way to move Narek from where Abnett left him to where Kyme needed him to be. Another bit that The Unremembered Empire didn't really coordinate well, I feel.

 

I wonder if we'll finally find out whether or not Garviel Loken is actually a Giraffe....



#24
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I’m sure A D-B posted somewhere that Sevatar was not Khyron, damned if I can find where though.

He has not. More specifically, he has not given a direct answer on the topic.

That’s not to say that Sevatar is Khyron, of course. I think it’s fair to argue that the Emperor’s Gift hints at this being the case, but one can’t speak with certainty on this sort of matter. Either way, I would never expect A D-B to reveal something like that until he decides to address it in a story.

#25
Kelborn

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What Aaron did say was that he and Alan discussed about Sev's fate.

Although I'm hoping to see a continuation of his story arc, somehow, I don't see him as a founding member of the GK. Fel Zharost is a way more valuable candidate for this and as a former member of the 8th, he could make use of its iconic weapon.

 

I'd rather see him becoming a blackshield or something, fighting against the true horrors of the void, which were mentioned in The Long Night rather than continuing fighting loyalists or traitors. Maybe even as a founding member of a chapter. But let's just wait and see. ;)


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