Sisters codex (proper) wishlisting 2.0

[Beams]

Beams, check your math? 1/3 of 30 is 20 hits... with full rerolls that’s 26.6 hits, difference of 6.6 hits..?

 

Don’t forget, if your chapter master is going to be in range, she’d have been a canoness pre-upgrade, so your squads would already be rerolling their 1s. Your 3cp strat just lets those units also reroll 2s, not reroll 1s AND 2s over the ordinary canoness.

 

So, 23.3 hits for canoness vs 26.6 with the upgrade, total of 3 hits difference.

 

So you are only getting half the benefit it “looks like” you are getting (you’d have to take the canoness anyway).

 

Hubs has always commented that the reroll benefit doesn’t start really getting good till you hit on 4s rerolling.

 

What IS boss, though, is rerolls to wound! This is what makes Bobby G such a boss. I’d love a Lt buff for sisters - especially with all the melta we are packing.

Sorry, 7 instead of 9, that was a typo. Phones and all. But the point was mostly that 20 shot difference per 3 squads of Dominions within 9", which is an entirely new squad.

 

And yeah, the Cannoness would have reroll 1s, but there's the question of how likely you'd be having Dominions' within a reroll 1s aura vs a reroll all, since the increase of reroll ones isn't as big vs their mobility.

 

That said, the bonus here is two-fold 9" reroll 1s and 2s vs 6" +1 to hit for comprable performance. And the space marine one doesn't require a 4+ and then 3 CP for a single turn, instead being a 3CP upgrade that you get in the beginning of the game.

 

Which is kind of the point of my original post, that I'd rather just have chapter master then +1 and vessels.

[Mekhitar]

Oh yeah, I definitely agree about that one.

[ERJAK]

 

Beams, check your math? 1/3 of 30 is 20 hits... with full rerolls that’s 26.6 hits, difference of 6.6 hits..?

 

Don’t forget, if your chapter master is going to be in range, she’d have been a canoness pre-upgrade, so your squads would already be rerolling their 1s. Your 3cp strat just lets those units also reroll 2s, not reroll 1s AND 2s over the ordinary canoness.

 

So, 23.3 hits for canoness vs 26.6 with the upgrade, total of 3 hits difference.

 

So you are only getting half the benefit it “looks like” you are getting (you’d have to take the canoness anyway).

 

Hubs has always commented that the reroll benefit doesn’t start really getting good till you hit on 4s rerolling.

 

What IS boss, though, is rerolls to wound! This is what makes Bobby G such a boss. I’d love a Lt buff for sisters - especially with all the melta we are packing.

Sorry, 7 instead of 9, that was a typo. Phones and all. But the point was mostly that 20 shot difference per 3 squads of Dominions within 9", which is an entirely new squad.

 

And yeah, the Cannoness would have reroll 1s, but there's the question of how likely you'd be having Dominions' within a reroll 1s aura vs a reroll all, since the increase of reroll ones isn't as big vs their mobility.

 

That said, the bonus here is two-fold 9" reroll 1s and 2s vs 6" +1 to hit for comprable performance. And the space marine one doesn't require a 4+ and then 3 CP for a single turn, instead being a 3CP upgrade that you get in the beginning of the game.

 

Which is kind of the point of my original post, that I'd rather just have chapter master then +1 and vessels.

I agree also that it's better than Vessels, I've argued that on dakka in the past; HOWEVER, that's not an endorsement of the Chapter Master stratagem, it's an INDICTMENT of Vessels.

 

The benefits you get with Chapter Masters for the same amount of CP as Vessels are absolutely superior, no doubt about it. Yet very few space marine players ever use the stratagem because the value gained simply isn't worth 3CP. At least not for a BS3+ army.

 

The proposes stratagem is significantly stronger than Vessels, but it's still too weak to be a viable option at 3CP. At 2CP, I think it would be a consideration in most lists.

[Beams]

 

 

Beams, check your math? 1/3 of 30 is 20 hits... with full rerolls that’s 26.6 hits, difference of 6.6 hits..?

 

Don’t forget, if your chapter master is going to be in range, she’d have been a canoness pre-upgrade, so your squads would already be rerolling their 1s. Your 3cp strat just lets those units also reroll 2s, not reroll 1s AND 2s over the ordinary canoness.

 

So, 23.3 hits for canoness vs 26.6 with the upgrade, total of 3 hits difference.

 

So you are only getting half the benefit it “looks like” you are getting (you’d have to take the canoness anyway).

 

Hubs has always commented that the reroll benefit doesn’t start really getting good till you hit on 4s rerolling.

 

What IS boss, though, is rerolls to wound! This is what makes Bobby G such a boss. I’d love a Lt buff for sisters - especially with all the melta we are packing.

Sorry, 7 instead of 9, that was a typo. Phones and all. But the point was mostly that 20 shot difference per 3 squads of Dominions within 9", which is an entirely new squad.

 

And yeah, the Cannoness would have reroll 1s, but there's the question of how likely you'd be having Dominions' within a reroll 1s aura vs a reroll all, since the increase of reroll ones isn't as big vs their mobility.

 

That said, the bonus here is two-fold 9" reroll 1s and 2s vs 6" +1 to hit for comprable performance. And the space marine one doesn't require a 4+ and then 3 CP for a single turn, instead being a 3CP upgrade that you get in the beginning of the game.

 

Which is kind of the point of my original post, that I'd rather just have chapter master then +1 and vessels.

I agree also that it's better than Vessels, I've argued that on dakka in the past; HOWEVER, that's not an endorsement of the Chapter Master stratagem, it's an INDICTMENT of Vessels.

 

The benefits you get with Chapter Masters for the same amount of CP as Vessels are absolutely superior, no doubt about it. Yet very few space marine players ever use the stratagem because the value gained simply isn't worth 3CP. At least not for a BS3+ army.

 

The proposes stratagem is significantly stronger than Vessels, but it's still too weak to be a viable option at 3CP. At 2CP, I think it would be a consideration in most lists.

... That was the point?

[Montford]

I was listening to a WH40K podcast today and something they said got me thinking about Celestine: I'd like to see her Healing Tears ability be able to affect any Sororitas Unit, not just the Geminae. Do you think that might be overpowered?

[ERJAK]

 

 

 

Beams, check your math? 1/3 of 30 is 20 hits... with full rerolls that’s 26.6 hits, difference of 6.6 hits..?

 

Don’t forget, if your chapter master is going to be in range, she’d have been a canoness pre-upgrade, so your squads would already be rerolling their 1s. Your 3cp strat just lets those units also reroll 2s, not reroll 1s AND 2s over the ordinary canoness.

 

So, 23.3 hits for canoness vs 26.6 with the upgrade, total of 3 hits difference.

 

So you are only getting half the benefit it “looks like” you are getting (you’d have to take the canoness anyway).

 

Hubs has always commented that the reroll benefit doesn’t start really getting good till you hit on 4s rerolling.

 

What IS boss, though, is rerolls to wound! This is what makes Bobby G such a boss. I’d love a Lt buff for sisters - especially with all the melta we are packing.

Sorry, 7 instead of 9, that was a typo. Phones and all. But the point was mostly that 20 shot difference per 3 squads of Dominions within 9", which is an entirely new squad.

 

And yeah, the Cannoness would have reroll 1s, but there's the question of how likely you'd be having Dominions' within a reroll 1s aura vs a reroll all, since the increase of reroll ones isn't as big vs their mobility.

 

That said, the bonus here is two-fold 9" reroll 1s and 2s vs 6" +1 to hit for comprable performance. And the space marine one doesn't require a 4+ and then 3 CP for a single turn, instead being a 3CP upgrade that you get in the beginning of the game.

 

Which is kind of the point of my original post, that I'd rather just have chapter master then +1 and vessels.

I agree also that it's better than Vessels, I've argued that on dakka in the past; HOWEVER, that's not an endorsement of the Chapter Master stratagem, it's an INDICTMENT of Vessels.

 

The benefits you get with Chapter Masters for the same amount of CP as Vessels are absolutely superior, no doubt about it. Yet very few space marine players ever use the stratagem because the value gained simply isn't worth 3CP. At least not for a BS3+ army.

 

The proposes stratagem is significantly stronger than Vessels, but it's still too weak to be a viable option at 3CP. At 2CP, I think it would be a consideration in most lists.

... That was the point?

No it wasn't. Your original post was and subsequent supoorting posts boil down to 'CM is worth 3 CP' This post said 'It's not worth 3 CP'.

 

Those things are different from each other.

[Beams]

Living Saint strategem - 3CP all units within 6" may reroll all failed to hits.

Erjak, this is the original post. I get I didn't come right out and say it, but please don't argue my intent with the only person who actually knows it. Thanks, bro.

 

If you want to read into that, fine. But it was 100% I'd rather have that than what we have.

[Atrus]

Holy Promethium-2CP

Use this stratagem at the start of your shooting phase. Choose a friendly Adepta Sororitas <Order> unit. Flamer type weapons (handflamer, flamers, heavy flamers, immolation flamers) do not roll to determine the amount of hits they cause. Instead these weapons automatically cause 6 hits each this shooting phase.

 

 

One can dream...

[Slasher956]

Holy Promethium-2CP

Use this stratagem at the start of your shooting phase. Choose a friendly Adepta Sororitas <Order> unit. Flamer type weapons (handflamer, flamers, heavy flamers, immolation flamers) do not roll to determine the amount of hits they cause. Instead these weapons automatically cause 6 hits each this shooting phase.

 

 

One can dream...

 

Remove phase limitations & add 6" range when being used.... that way we can use it twice on the deep striking seraphim :p

 

 

Also something similar to add range to melta weapons....

[Atrus]

Nah, Melta just need the melta rule to apply to the weapons full range ;)

[Slasher956]

Was thinking more about the melts pistols on the seraphim so they can actually join in the fun when you do a burning descent!

[Atrus]

I know what you were thinking. I'm just thinking more "effecient/reliable" melta.

12" inferno pistol for a turn sounds nice, but 24" multimelta getting 2d6 take the highest damage at 24" sounds nastier.

 

Edit 2:

What I'm hoping to see is builds of each 3 to be viable.

The above mentioned flamers one makes flame based squads viable to the sheer amount of auto hits it can dish out even in a bss squad.

The melta one making the melta based squads a viable choice as it makes them more reliable with their damage output vs armour.

And the storm bolser one still has it's place with its extra damage.

 

To me, there's no clear cut winner with those option as to my eye they all look worthwhile.

 

Though I'd honestly rather see the storm bolster strat be Celestian only and apply to all bolt weapons in the squad.

 

Edit 3: superheacy! A rolling cathedral with heavy bolster and heavy flamers and a giant melta cannon on the front that shoots d3 times, 36" range s8 ap-4 D2d6 and melta which lets it roll 4d6 for damage and take 2 highest in half range.

Let's it transport up to 15 models that can shoot out of it cuz we should be the annoying army with mobile pillboxes :p

[Eddie Orlock]

What I want is the city fight strat to overwatch after they make the charge roll as just a standard option for sisters.

[Atrus]

Maybe as a Conviction? That'd make the one that overwatches on 5+ real nice.

[Eddie Orlock]

As a conviction I think it’d be pretty bonkers against some armies. As a strat it’s limited in competitive play to once a turn which would help it from distorting the meta too much.

[Atrus]

I don't think it distorts it that much. My reading of it is that the over watch only happens after the opponent successfully charges. So if the charge or multiple charges fail, there's no over watch at all. But if a unit does get to over watch it's because it's just been sucesfully charged and doesn't get a chance to over watch again after that and the only benefit really is that flamers can hit if the charge was over 8" or if the charge was out of LoS.

 

Tau have more distorty with their multi over watch shenanigans- if anything, tau overwatch should be stratagemised.

[ThePenitentOne]

RE: Superheavy:

 

Waiting to see if we get one in the new dex before I proceed, but my plan had been a baneblade chasis with 2 exorcist launchers, 2 immo turrets and a priest/ dialogus type who has a pulpit, which allows it to AoF.

 

The transport capacity 15 is an excellent idea.

 

Other wishlist?  A flyer. And again, truth be told, I'd sacrifice both to get a GW Repressor kit with rules in GW Codex. FW is just too rich for my blood. I can barely afford GW.

[EmperorGTank]

I love everything about the Superheavy idea only I think the melta cannon should be str 9 and maybe just 1d6 damage but it has the melta rule at any range. Also I think it should have flamestorm cannons instead of heavy flamers, Str 6 AP -1/-2 D 1/2. We have so much str 8 in the army but no real lascannon equivalent or reliable ways of dealing with T8 other than Holy Trinity unfortunately!

[Atrus]

Well I say heavy flamers, I really mean more like Immolation Flamers. Maybe dealing 2 damage because superheavy. Same for the heavy bolters. Though I'm not married to the idea of 2 damages.

 

I thought about saying S9 on the melta but I'm just not a fan of it myself even though the knight errands melta is S9. I wanted to offset that S8 superheavy weapon with a killer damage profile. It may struggle against T8 and more with invos, but when it hits, it'll be felt.

That's just my train of thought anyways.

[EmperorGTank]

Yea immolation flamers on it would be awesome, 2 dealing 2d6 hits would be insane! I understand wanting to have increased damage instead of strength I jst think the army lacks anything in the S6,7, and 9 categories. We dont have access to autocannons, lascannons, even something equivalent to a multilaser for anti infantry/light vehicle duty. If we had equivalents of those kinds of weapons for dealing with a vast array of opponents I think we would just be so much more versatile as an army. I do not want to step on the IG's armory, but just one of each of those weapon equivalents for us would be so nice and give us that many more options in the army. Of course I would want them to be bolter, melta, flame based as to not break the trinity!

[Plasmablasts]

I wondered about a sort of “stretch Land Raider”, with 15-20 transport capacity, with the sponson choices being quad heavy bolters, Inferno cannons or the Armiger Thermal Spear.

[Eddie Orlock]

I doubt we’ll get a spartan with alternate weapon options. Pity.

 

Got another thing I’d want on the wish list. A reliable way to negate invulnerable saves. What’s the point in have a great stack of -4 save weapons when everything that really needs smiting usually has some such save that’s nearly as good as its armour.

[Slasher956]

I'd like them to increase the amount of acts of faith available, but you pick the ones you want to use limited by (for example) the amount of canoness in your list.  With each act doing somehting different.  A bit like psyhich powers are chosen, but keeping the ability for any unit to use them.

 

So a Canoness allows you take 2 acts from the list of 12 -15... where the acts have movement buffs, shooting buffs (extra shots or plus' to shooting), extra attacks /round of combat, negating overwatch, negating invun saves, a FNP save, extra AP (either in CC or shooting), a way of forcing a moral check out of phase on an enemy unit, minus to being shot... etc etc 

[A.T.]

After some recent games with the exorcist - move and fire. I miss it being a more mobile unit (and play with enough LoS blocking scenery for it to count).

[Mekhitar]

I wouldn’t be surprised if priests end up with a prayer mechanic similar to the new chaos Dark Apostle.

 

Wouldn’t it be neat if one of them could turn off an enemy invuln?