Terrified Templar Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 Definitely imrovements for Chapter Tactics and Stratagems Cost reduction for transports. Maybe 45-50 points for rhinos, razorbacks, and drop pods? More Beta Bolter Rule flavor improvements. A chainsword one, maybe -1ap for chainswords and/or close combat weapons wielded by units with the Astartes keyword, and something for power armor such as ignoring 1 point of an opponents Ap modifier so -1AP would become 0AP and -2AP would become -1AP and so on. Another suggestions would be ignoring opponent's AP characteristic unless it is -2 or higher or something like that. Massed lasguns would still be a problem but I can't think of anyway to get around that without making marines too overpowered and stat increases are honestly a fool's hope at this point now that we have Primaris Marines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewarriorhunter Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 After last night's release I think I'm firmly in the camp of 'it's safe to say nothing is going to be done for oldmarines'. I don't necessarily like making that statement but I don't think it's far off. I could even see Primaris getting their own codex that sees updates while the marine dex is left to slowly fade away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dracos Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 Nah ;) I'm thinking not for four or five years at least. There's still blood in that turnip, and it'll take another two or three to build Primaris up enough to be a true stand alone faction Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kallas Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 It's probable that Primaris get their own Codex soon, maybe one year out is my guess. At that point OldMarines will be left to rot. They won't actively discontinue them, but they'll continue to put more and more emphasis on Primaris, especially now that they have the Rubicon and everyone* will start turning themselves into Primaris. * Except the completely unnamed and eventually discarded 3-6% that didn't take them up, that will just die off screen to showcase how superior Primaris are! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurica Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 If that were the case (and it seems fairly obvious) I do hope people will allow us to use mini marines to "proxy" as Primaris. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheTrans Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 Could you give Marines re-roll on armour saves for any D1 weapons? Would help sure them up against high volume-low impact fire. Termies could then wade up to gun lines and the opposing player would really need to think where they are putting their AT assets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishagu Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 If that were the case (and it seems fairly obvious) I do hope people will allow us to use mini marines to "proxy" as Primaris. To me, personally, 40k is very much a visual game and any sort of proxy is a no no. Some incredible conversion is always on a case by case basis, but generally using one unit as another is not OK. Should I be allowed to proxy my Storm Raven as a Fire Raptor? How about a Knight Crusader as a Castellan? There are exceptions to the rule of course, but they are typically thematic ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 Proxy for me is definitely a very temporary solution and I wouldn't want to play very ofteb against someone who doesn't plan to replace his proxies with the proper model. Conversions are a whole different topic though and I'm fine with any as long as I can see which unit it's supposed to represent without it getting confusing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishagu Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 Yeah I used to tolerate it but soon realised that the people who proxy don't replace the models. They are typically "testing something out" but then they move on to testing something else out with the same models. It's a big No from me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlamingDeth Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 I think in this case he was referring to the future (distant or not, but bound to eventually happen) where old marines no longer have rule support. In that eventual case I don't see any problem with using Primaris rules for them...I mean what else would you use them for then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 If regular Marines really aren't a thing anymore, then yeah of course that would be totally fie. As long as regular Marines still have rules I don't see it though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishagu Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 I don't imagine a scenario where the regular Astartes don't have rules for 10+ years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 A few thoughts on Primaris below, not strictly OT but my 2p. I think much in the same way Brettonia & Tomb Kings have rules and points values in AoS, Classic Marines will always have rules and points in 40k. However, once Primaris have a fully rounded range, ready to rival that of the classic marines I think we will start to see the classic's no longer updated, whether that be models or points or other rules. Truthfully, I'm not sure how far away that time is. Primaris already have a lot of the other units "covered" (some are loose but you get the idea) Intercessors / Tacticals Inceptors/ Assault Marines Aggressors/ Terminators Reivers [Eliminators]/ Scouts Hellblasters / Devastators Dreads / Redemptor Repulsor / Land Raider Most characters have an analogue The only things that are missing here is some dedicated CC units (power weapons etc) to replace the likes of Vanguard/ command squads etc and then it's almost done. Classic marines will still be there, but I can see them being relegated to vehicle crew/ centurions and other support roles etc On topic however, I think the bolter rule has gone a way to making Tacticals better, but they could certainly do more. I think extra CP for bringing more of them is an okay solution - or maybe some free stratagem-esque rules for each squad to use once per battle. Basically a "Bolter/ Combat/ Grenade/ Morale" Doctrine akin to the old 7th ed detachment bonuses, to showcase their strength which is meant to be tactical flexibility. As for Assault Marines - no idea. The gear and statline is just pretty meh overall. I'd say maybe something about impact hits when they charge but i'm not even sure that's enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted February 13, 2019 Author Share Posted February 13, 2019 I'd say Aggressors are more similar to Centurions than Terminators. Certainly they don't give me the feeling of Terminators. Likewise, Inceptors are about as similar to Assault Marines as Swooping Hawks are to Striking Scorpions... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishagu Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 The Primaris are not mirrors of units in the classic line, at all. To try to view them as such is folly and a shortcoming of the player. They are significantly different in function and design. Even a Tactical and Intercessor are different. One has flexibility in wargear and function, the other is strictly an objective grabbing unit designed to engage basic infantry. I've seen people complain that Intercessors couldn't damage a tank. Which part of their wargear and rules suggest they are designed to engage armour? I despair at times. And how are Reivers or Eliminators supposed to be Scouts? They aren't even a troop choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted February 13, 2019 Author Share Posted February 13, 2019 =][= I think we're far enough off topic so I'll close this down as I think we're probably done with the conversation now. =][= Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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