Vogon Posted February 18, 2019 Share Posted February 18, 2019 I now have enough bits and bobs to make a 5 man support squad but am faced with a choice and I’m really not sure which way to go. Talk to me about the pros and cons of Plasma versus Melta. While we’re at it the same question for a combi armed vet squad. Cheers Vogon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unknown Legionnaire Posted February 18, 2019 Share Posted February 18, 2019 Five lone Legionnaires die like ... flies. Veterans or not. So, they'll be a suicide unit anyway, and not something you count on to score an objective later in the game. And a suicide units needs a quick method of insertion, on a sidenote. As for the Melta vs. Plasma thing ... Combi-Melta on Machine Killer Vets. Plasma on all others variants. Armoured Ceramite is out there in abundance and Plasma excels at slaying elite infantry and has the potential to harm lighter vehicles still. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brofist Posted February 18, 2019 Share Posted February 18, 2019 Magnets! You should take both options! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vogon Posted February 19, 2019 Author Share Posted February 19, 2019 I’ve seen drop prodded 5 man Melta units work really well as back field vehicle killers. Good point on the armoured ceramite though. Cheers Vogon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Excessus Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 They're glass cannons but can dish out a lot of hurt. Armoured Ceramite is a bastard but many units doesn't have access to it, like many LoW and most dreads. In your local meta, which units do you have the most problems with? Heavy infantry or walkers? Vets with machine killers are of course better, but take an elite slot. tactical support guys takes a troop slot, which at least I have an abundance of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 Never half ass two things, whole ass one thing. 5 man is too small, I'd say 7 is a minimum! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vogon Posted February 19, 2019 Author Share Posted February 19, 2019 They're glass cannons but can dish out a lot of hurt. Armoured Ceramite is a bastard but many units doesn't have access to it, like many LoW and most dreads. In your local meta, which units do you have the most problems with? Heavy infantry or walkers? Vets with machine killers are of course better, but take an elite slot. tactical support guys takes a troop slot, which at least I have an abundance of. My biggest issue so far has been with World Eaters red butchers and the special character medic that gives them a 4+ fnp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cadmus Tyro Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 Melta guns it is then! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eternal Despair Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 If you want this squad to specifically go after the red butchers with fnp , you are best served by the arming them with meltaguns/combi meltas, as the strength 8 means instant death vs the red butchers T4 meaning their two wounds aren't worth dirt, also this means that they don't receive their fnp save. Now you have a choice between vets or a legion support squad, if you have the elites slots I would go with the machine killer vets, in all due likely hood this squad will die after one round of shooting so the combi meltas aren't really a handicap, and the machine killer skill gives them +1 on armour penetration rolls gives them even better chances of slagging a vehicle when you don't play the red butchers also they are 25points cheaper with nothing but combi meltas vs the support squad with meltaguns I'm a massive fan of the machine killer vets with combi meltas drop podding in and slagging a spartan or superheavy in one turn, granted I usually like to run a larger squad than just five men to do the job but if you only have five what can you do. In the end no matter what loadout you choose, because it is a small unit they will die quickly unless they can get to their target quickly, a rhino probably won't cut it as it will get shot off the board. Your best bet to have them get off their combi shots effectively is bringing them in via drop pod Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cadmus Tyro Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 Delivery method is key, as others have said veterans are probably a better unit all round, able to handle themselves in combat a little better than the average marine. What the veteran squad offers is more tactical flexibility. If you take veterans you could opt to scout/outflank their Rhino. An anvillus claw or termite is the more reliable delivery method, but if you invest the points in this I would suggest you have a larger squad size. With custodes, I find a more defensive strategy works well. A close combat orientated army is always wanting to press forwards, which can leave them over exposed. Using rhinos filled with shooting units for a “rapid response” seems to be effective. In terms of the Rhinos survivability, this depends more on your opponents target priority, so present them with threats that they cannot ignore. I would only ever choose a tactical support squad over veterans in two circumstances: 1) the lack of elites slot availability, 2) the expectation of the squads survival beyond their first turn of shooting (so if I attach a character like Autek Mor to give them fearless, preferred enemy and to tank wounds). If you take the tactical support squad, give the sergeant the combi weapon upgrade, it’s free so it will save you 15 points on the squad. If you take the veteran squad, give one member a meltagun, just on the off chance they survive a round of return fire, the remaining squad member(s) will still be a threat. This increases the veteran squad cost by only 5 points. Finally, artificer armour is worth considering with either build, it means that your opponent will have to dedicate more firepower to remove the unit. Cadmus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imren Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 Perhaps a big of an intrusion on your army list but run Dynat with CotH and use Gal Vorbak that deep strike (their own rules) with S10 power fist and a meltagun on the sarge, and then you use Dynat's rule and deep strike your five man melta/plasma same time, that gives two nuts to crack for your opponent early game at their deployment zone. However, the effectiveness of this tactic is :cusse if you face an opponent with an abundance of augury scanners. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StruManChu Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 I'm not sure about whether or not the Mathhammer makes the shooting slightly more or slightly less effective, but - 5 Man Plasma Support Squad - 175 pts 3 Outriders with TL Plasma - 165 pts That's before any sergeant upgrades, etc. For 10 less points, you're getting -2 wounds, but +1 toughness, 12" movement and scout. Those last two are especially important because they mitigate the cost of a transport. That said, it's a troop choice vs a fast attack choice. I appreciate that's probably not super helpful considering you've got bits for a TSS squad and not Outriders, but just highlighting that there are other ways to do what a TSS does. Put me down as another vote to make them Vets instead! Edit - Remember the rules wrong! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daimhin Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 I regularly run 8-man Plasma Support and they work very well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leman Russ SW Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 If you are going after infantry Seekers with Combi are better, cheap combi's, BS5 and preferred enemy. Plus use a fast slot which most armies have spare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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