The Siege of Terra: The Lost and the Damned

[DarkChaplain]

The audible version launched with a doubled-up chapter 17, while missing chapter 16.

[Ascanius]

It seems to be fine now.

[rookie40K]

I had the double up chapters from Audible and reported it. I was told I would be informed when the issue was resolved, which I have not heard back. Also the audio had no afterword section to address anything. Still really enjoyed book a lot.

[karden00]

It really grinds my gears that the Thane/Dantalion debacle exists, and I truly feel the book should be marked down, even a token 5%. For anyone that has invested the time, attention, and money in three series’ of books, this is a bummer. A real bummer. If a fan can pick it up, an author/editor/editing board/secret cabal of authors should have yawned it out of existence.

[Grey Angel]

The audible version launched with a doubled-up chapter 17, while missing chapter 16.

They sorted it out now, but the audible version is now 12 hrs 42 mins long compared too 12 hrs 58 mins on the Black Library one.

[Morovir]

The most jarring part of this book for me is the depiction of Little Horus post-facial reattachment. He is described as looking less like Horus after the reattachment, despite Abnett's story Little Horus explicitly making the point that the reattachment of his face made him look more like Horus. It's a small detail, but one that stood out to me.

[bluntblade]

You'd think there would be more focus on... recent physical changes, where Little Horus is concerned.

[drooling blood]

Read it. Thought Haleys churn finally caught up with him.

[Petitioner's City]

You'd think there would be more focus on... recent physical changes, where Little Horus is concerned.

I feel I've missed something here

[Fire Golem]

 

You'd think there would be more focus on... recent physical changes, where Little Horus is concerned.

I feel I've missed something here

[mawhis]

Apologies if this has already been discussed, but does anyone have any theories about which Primarch was told the truth about Chaos? 

 

‘Only one of you had the mettle to resist the whispers of the gods at the start. He was told.’

 

 

 

[DarkChaplain]

Would be easier to discuss who it couldn't have been, due to their reactions / disbelief when first confronted with daemons.

[bluntblade]

Presumably Jaghatai "sure there are daemons, we call them yakhsha" Khan doesn't count as being told.

 

Horus seems to have some idea of them, and he has gazed upon the raw stuff of the aether in one Crusade-set story.

[mawhis]

Jaghatai denies that its him in that scene.

 

My guesses would by Vulkan, Leman Russ or Alpharius

[Noserenda]

I suspect Alpharius certain one of the Trefoil primarchs and the other two while well suited did seem a lot more surprised :D 

It could have been Magnus but he 100% missed the point of the lesson if thats the case!

[Ingo Pech]

I Think it's Alpharius. In "Legion" he told one of the Cabal about the Emperor, his plan to fight and overthrow Chaos and so on, so at least he seems to be in the knowledge about some parts of the big picture ..

[Beren]

Wasn't Corax told something by the Emperor in their first meeting, and had a grasp of tbe significance of the skull cairns the World Eaters built in the wake of the Dropsite Massacre?

[bluntblade]

Alpharius is Trefoil. Magnus is quite separate

[calgar101]

is it not the Lion? I think its mentioned in Savage Weapons how he refused their temptations?

[Indefragable]

In FW Black Book 8 Malevolence ...

...it talks about how the Imperial Fists are used as a containment/cleanup crew for warp/chaos artefscts and psykers and such whenever the Custodes are unavailable to handle it. More of in a police way than a military campaign way (where the TSons were at the top of their game). It says the VII Legion has the steel discipline to not only resist most temptations, but also to never ever look inside the box that they were asked to kindly bring to the incinerator out back and don’t mind any sounds coming from within it.

 

Edited November 4, 2019 by Indefragable

[DarkChaplain]

If the Lion knew properly about Chaos, he wouldn't have been so lost in The Lion or Ruinstorm. It'd have made sense for him to be told things re: Caliban, but his actions there also highlight that he doesn't know what's going on there. His knowledge at best comes via the Watchers now.

 

As for Dorn, if it was him, shouldn't that have been acknowledged in the novel itself? I don't think it's Dorn, Sanguinius or Jaghatai, at the minimum.

[mawhis]

If the Lion knew properly about Chaos, he wouldn't have been so lost in The Lion or Ruinstorm. It'd have made sense for him to be told things re: Caliban, but his actions there also highlight that he doesn't know what's going on there. His knowledge at best comes via the Watchers now.

 

As for Dorn, if it was him, shouldn't that have been acknowledged in the novel itself? I don't think it's Dorn, Sanguinius or Jaghatai, at the minimum.

 All three specifically say that it wasn't them in the book:

 

‘Who?’ said Dorn in surprise. ‘I thought this was kept from all of us?’ ‘Which one could have known?’ said Sanguinius. ‘Jaghatai?’

The Khan shook his head. He was not so concerned as his brothers at his lack of forewarning. ‘It was not I.’

 

Haley, Guy. The Lost and the Damned (The Horus Heresy Siege of Terra Book 2) . Games Workshop. Kindle Edition. 

 

 

 

 

[DarkChaplain]

That confirms it, then.

 

So who do we have left? Let's make a list.

 

• Lion El'Jonson - Oblivious to it, didn't understand daemons during The Lion, discovers a lot during Ruinstorm
• Purged
• Fulgrim - War against the Laer should've tipped him off if he did know
• Perturabo - ???
• Jaghatai Khan - Denies being the one
• Leman Russ - Decent enough candidate, all things considered
• Rogal Dorn - Denies being the one
• Konrad Curze - As if...
• Sanguinius - Denies being the one, Signus Prime confirms this
• Ferrus Manus - ???
• Purged
• Angron - As if...
• Roboute Guilliman - Oblivious to Chaos until Calth
• Mortarion - Despises sorcery but also denies it, had to read a lot of arcane tomes to build his knowledge
• Magnus the Red - Knows a lot about the warp, had chitchats with the Emperor about it, but did not seem to grasp the full extent in A Thousand Sons
• Horus Lupercal - Knows that there's something up with the warp in Horus Rising, but does not fully understand things by the time of Davin
• Lorgar Aurelian - Highly unlikely, seeing he "discovered" the Gods on his pilgrimage
• Vulkan - ???
• Corvus Corax - ???
• Alpharius/Omegon - ???

[mawhis]

My first thought was Vulkan, especially given where he is at this point in the Solar War Story - Literally guarding the gates to hell. The reference to "Resilience" might point to him. Vulkan is the most Humanitarian of the Primarchs, which might have protected him.

 

Its been years since I read "Legion", but my memory is that, when the Cabal told Alpharius and Omegon their plan, that they had already reached similar conclusions, and were aware of the Existence of Chaos. Could be wrong though.

 

Russ strikes me as being a guy who could be trusted to not delve into things that he wouldn't be able to control - to understand where the line was and not cross it. As headstrong as he is/was, he draws a very clear line between the Sorcery of the Thousand Sons and the Fenrisian elemental magic practiced by his own legion.

[Blindhamster]

I.e. he is a hypocrite