Lord Discordant Load Out.

[El_Dicko]

 

 

Just finished putting together mine first LD and im surprised by how small he is. Anyone planning to use a maulerfiend as a base will be vastly oversized.

He's basically an extended juggerlord, with the torso of the helstalker being almost identical to a juggernaught body (extended to fit an extra pair of legs at the back).

Oooh, now that is cool news! If I can get away with a juggernaut as a mount in terms of close-enough scale, I'm gonna build a bunch of them.

Good to know! I had been pondering the idea of an 8 legged jugger as a Helwright one dark abeyant, could make a fun Discordant

[Furnace Lord]

I'm also still running a proxy until I can get an actual model. How easy is the rider to modify...swapping heads or torso, that sort of thing?

[HeresyBeliever]

I'm still debating buying one or not. While the model is amazing i'm not sold on the rules.

 

Question 1 

How fragile have you found him to be with a relic or physic buff?

 

Question 2 

How pose-able is the model? 

[Annatar Giftbringer]

What’s people’s opinion on the maw weapon? Stick with injector or swap for magma cutter?

[Panzer]

What’s people’s opinion on the maw weapon? Stick with injector or swap for magma cutter?

I don't find either particularly exciting but I'd definitely go with the injector over the cutter.

The cutter is a single S8 AP-4 D3 attack you can do only every other turn (you can't shoot during your opponents turn) when you are in melee (because when you are not in melee you want to shoot with the other weapons).

The injector is a single S8 AP-4 D1d3 attack you can do every turn when you are in melee and has chance to do additional mortal wounds against vehicles.

 

Plus the cutter costs 16p while the injector is free. It's a very easy decision imo.

[Annatar Giftbringer]

 

 

What’s people’s opinion on the maw weapon? Stick with injector or swap for magma cutter?

I don't find either particularly exciting but I'd definitely go with the injector over the cutter.

The cutter is a single S8 AP-4 D3 attack you can do only every other turn (you can't shoot during your opponents turn) when you are in melee (because when you are not in melee you want to shoot with the other weapons).

The injector is a single S8 AP-4 D1d3 attack you can do every turn when you are in melee and has chance to do additional mortal wounds against vehicles.

 

Plus the cutter costs 16p while the injector is free. It's a very easy decision imo.

That was my gut feeling as well, glad to see it wasn’t only me :)

 

The pistol would interfere with the main gun, the injector has the potential for more damage, and in the end it’s just a single attack so more of a happy bonus when it does hit than something to rely on - not something I’d wanna spend points on.

[Prot]

I'm also still running a proxy until I can get an actual model. How easy is the rider to modify...swapping heads or torso, that sort of thing?

 

I think you might be disappointed if you're a huge converter. I don't find he is very swappable friendly. The head, arms, legs are all really hard to swap. They are however very well done and unique.

 

 

I'm still debating buying one or not. While the model is amazing i'm not sold on the rules.

 

Question 1 

How fragile have you found him to be with a relic or physic buff?

 

Question 2 

How pose-able is the model? 

 

He's fragile. A lot of people ridiculed those that made the comment he's too fragile at 12 wounds, but it is definitely the case. The only time your opponent is not going to start by targeting him is if they don't have a clue what he does, or what his Warlord trait may be (I'm Black Legion and not taking half damage trait.... I'd rather have 6 Daemon Engines get a 2" bonus and charge one in after advancing personally).

 

I try to Psychically buff him.. it's really hard though. He takes off and once you try to advance to keep up to him, you are (very likely) putting your Sorc /MoP in an area of the table you really don't want him. 

 

The Lord Disco is good though, but not quite as good as I hoped. He's okay against low brow infantry, and okay against Vehicles but not great.

 

I'm finding his detachment relic is a bit of a red herring.... in 8th your opponent is not going to move into base you in assault if they have a clue what they're doing. You will be based and unable to try to get more 'stuff' within his relic's sweet zone of 1".

 

It looks good on paper but doesn't work in practice... just my opinion, but I stopped taking it. I prefer relics that... don't rely on opponent's not knowing what they do. :)

 

 

 

 

What’s people’s opinion on the maw weapon? Stick with injector or swap for magma cutter?

 

Injector by a mile. Above all else... the Injector is the best thing you have going against Knights, etc. on the charge.

 

 

Further to load out... I think the Baleflamer is what I'm going with on one of these units. I am building the other with the cheaper option.

 

Right now my lists feature 2 of them. I've had bizarre games with them though.

 

This is a bit off topic so I'll keep it brief: the thing I'm finding is most of the 'effective' Chaos Detachments differ from the loyalist ones in Vigilus in a substantial way. They need a strong, wholesale commitment to work. The Possessed definitely need this, the Raptors are better with a full buy in, even this Daemon Engine detachment needs a larger buy in for success. 

 

I do think the Venomcrawler still needs a point reduction. In my games the Defiler is a lot more valuable (larger foot print too for buffs/psyker stuff). 

 

People have asked me at the store why I use the Venomcrawler considering my view/experiences with them... simply put the model is extremely cool and the Defiler still reminds me of a washing machine on crab legs.

[Sception]

On the specialist detachment warlord trait: if you're running two of him anyway, it only takes a single command point to make one of them a field commander, letting you take the half damage trait on the other anyway. Even if you're only taking one, a regular warpsmith is one of our cheaper hq options, and can be a field commander as well. Yeah, your daemon engines will be put of range after the first movement phase, but that's the most important phase for extea movement anyway.

 

For relics, though, I agree. The relic tendrils seem cool, and might have some utility against hordey orcs or the like, but talisman of burning blood, intoxicating elixer, or black legion's sightless helm all seem like better relics for him in general.

[Prot]

In my case I'm using Abaddon as my Warlord so I can't do that, can I? 

[Guiltysparc]

Speaking of his size, i was surprised when i picked up the box and saw how little it was.  In terms of survivability, i think its the same deal as with all, powerful melee units.  You can't run him in a vaccuum and you need to build your army around melee as a threat,rather than a particular unit as a threat.  I'm working up a 1500pt list that looks like this...

 

Soulforged Detachment with DL, Abby, 1 maulerfiend, and 2 venomcrawlers

World Eater Patrol with Khârn, 8 Berzerkers, and a rhino

Khorne Demon Patrol with Bloodthirster of Insensate Rage, 10 bloodletters

 

So, as the opposing player you have quite a few things to think about shooting.  If the DL is the only powerful melee unit, then ya, totally, he's getting wrecked, but i think thats more an issue of list design than a problem with the unit.

In my case I'm using Abaddon as my Warlord so I can't do that, can I? 

 

Spend a pre-game command point to make the DL a field commander and the we can take a warlord trait.  In my army i'm using Abby as the warlord and the DL as a field commander with the extra movement trait from the soulforged pack.  The half damage trait would be good too.

[Sception]

Field commander can only take the command trait of their specialist detachment. So an LD can take the movement boosting trait from the daemon engine detachment, but nothing that would stop him from being nuked off the table in the first shooting phase. Of course, if your army includes abaddon standing near some las or chain havics, the enemy might have higher first turn priorities.

 

Regardless, best defence for LD is still to run 2-3 of him, but then making one a field commander only lets the enemy know which to target first. Though that could be used to aim attention away from an LD with a relic.

[Prot]

Speaking of his size, i was surprised when i picked up the box and saw how little it was.  In terms of survivability, i think its the same deal as with all, powerful melee units.  You can't run him in a vaccuum and you need to build your army around melee as a threat,rather than a particular unit as a threat.  I'm working up a 1500pt list that looks like this...

 

Soulforged Detachment with DL, Abby, 1 maulerfiend, and 2 venomcrawlers

World Eater Patrol with Khârn, 8 Berzerkers, and a rhino

Khorne Demon Patrol with Bloodthirster of Insensate Rage, 10 bloodletters

 

So, as the opposing player you have quite a few things to think about shooting.  If the DL is the only powerful melee unit, then ya, totally, he's getting wrecked, but i think thats more an issue of list design than a problem with the unit.

In my case I'm using Abaddon as my Warlord so I can't do that, can I? 

 

Spend a pre-game command point to make the DL a field commander and the we can take a warlord trait.  In my army i'm using Abby as the warlord and the DL as a field commander with the extra movement trait from the soulforged pack.  The half damage trait would be good too.

 

I know you're playing thematically but man... you could really benefit from a MoP in that type of list. I'm running two (considering dropping the Dark Apostle for good).

 

I love MoPs. I think if you have fun with any of these daemonic entries, it's a great, fun way to make the list a little more interesting. If you're playing hardcore Khorne, I understand. :)

 

How many games have you played with your Lord Disco?

 

I disagree that putting more stuff around him makes him a little better. It isn't a list thing.. it's the fact he is capable of being singled out, and once people know what he does, they would be crazy to ignore him in favour of taking out... a Venom Crawler or whatever.

 

Once your opponent knows what they do, let me know how long he's lasting for you. I'm not being facetious just not a theory hammer guy.. in the least. I play a lot and draw my personal strategy from those findings. My first games I found my opponents didn't know, and paid a price. 

 

Maybe using 3 is a thing... I dunno it feels boring though. I think I'm capping my list at 2. Only one can be the Warlord anyway. 

 

As a side note we're always using two large pieces of terrain in the center but it's quite easy to get lanes of fire. Tau usually don't have a problem with riptide height, etc. 

 

 

I will say in all honesty that I have not tried the half damage Trait. Again this is because of Abaddon, however, I don't think I'd use it well in my meta. Lots of volume here, and no one really plays the Castellan outside of Tournament practice and lascannons are not a thing here. I'm more looking at a very high volume of shots (which is why I originally went with Dark Apostle set up. But again it's good for maybe one battle round?) Which might be all I need if I go first.

 

That's the other thing to note.. I have not gone first one time in the last two weeks worth of games. VERY annoying. lol

[Sception]

Just finished putting together mine first LD and im surprised by how small he is. Anyone planning to use a maulerfiend as a base will be vastly oversized.

He's basically an extended juggerlord, with the torso of the helstalker being almost identical to a juggernaught body (extended to fit an extra pair of legs at the back).

Hrm. I /do/ have a juggerlord conversion I'm particularly proud of, but don't really know what to do with these days. Will have to look at whether I can convert a decent LD out of him. That might be my solition to wanting to run him in pairs, but not wanting to double up on an extremely distinctive model. Will see.

 

The jugger lord is super khorne-y, but then again talisman of burning blood is one of the better relics on it. Hrmm.

[helterskelter]

I'm surprised we haven't suggested the slaanesh route.

 

Of regular legions, mk of slaanesh plus elixir, plus herald, plus greater possessed, plus diabolic strength gives you a tasty little number, with the soulforged pack for the movement trait.

 

Or

 

Flawless host with all the trinkets, plus herald/diabolic etc

 

Now let's assume a vacuum of miraculous circumstance, +1 attack from the cloak, he's now got 5 base attacks, with a total of 13. Warlord trait explodes 6's not once but thrice, so there's a potential, in this very particular vacuum, for 39 attacks. Or vs imperial, as it stacks, 52.

 

Or with diabolic strength on, 6 base, 14 full, 42 regularly or 56 vs imperial.

 

Averages obviously imply this would be significantly less with an additional 6 to 8 much more likely, buuuuut when the S of these buffed are coming in at

Chainglaive s10 or s16 (if its additions before multiply now? Otherwise s12) on the charge

2 s8 tendrils

S11 beasty attacks

S12 injector attack

Any of these exploding in such a fashion is going to cause considerable pain.

Edited April 16, 2019 by helterskelter

[Panzer]

I'm surprised we haven't suggested the slaanesh route.

 

Of regular legions, mk of slaanesh plus elixir, plus herald, plus greater possessed, plus diabolic strength gives you a tasty little number, with the soulforged pack for the movement trait.

 

Or

 

Flawless host with all the trinkets, plus herald/diabolic etc

 

Now let's assume a vacuum of miraculous circumstance, +1 attack from the cloak, he's now got 5 base attacks, with a total of 13. Warlord trait explodes 6's not once but thrice, so there's a potential, in this very particular vacuum, for 39 attacks. Or vs imperial, as it stacks, 52.

 

Or with diabolic strength on, 6 base, 14 full, 42 regularly or 56 vs imperial.

 

Averages obviously imply this would be significantly less with an additional 6 to 8 much more likely, buuuuut when the S of these buffed are coming in at

Chainglaive s10 or s16 (if its additions before multiply now? Otherwise s12) on the charge

2 s8 tendrils

S11 beasty attacks

S12 injector attack

Any of these exploding in such a fashion is going to cause considerable pain.

 

Multiple reasons.

1. That's a lot of support you list that's far slower than he is.

2. No legion traits for him so scratch the Flawless Host idea.

[helterskelter]

 

 

Multiple reasons.

1. That's a lot of support you list that's far slower than he is.

2. No legion traits for him so scratch the Flawless Host idea.

To the former, jump pack Sorceror and warp time has the potential to negate a bit of that, also impending slaanesh release might have goodies for the herald so let's see.

And to the second

Bugger. So yeah that could've been a fun thing let's hope the FAQ does something?

[Guiltysparc]

I'm still building that army, so i haven't played it yet.  My thinking wasn't just that he has some engines around him and so people might not shoot him, its that he has some engines around him, and a bloodthirster, and a rhino full of berzerkers and Khârn.  And my opponnent won't be killing all three of those things before i get into combat.  So, if the LD gets killed on turn 1, its highly likely that the bloodthirsters and berzerkers are making it into combat on my turn, and similiarly if one of the other units gets killed.  I like to think of threat in terms of redundancy.  It worked really well for me with my 30k world eaters army where i ran a spartan full of marines + Khârn, a rhino with inductii, and a leviathan dreadnought.  

 

The master of possession is very cool, and i can see how he would help that list.  But, on the other hand, the Bloodthirster gives all my demon engines (including the LD) charge rerolls, so thats pretty strong too (and the BT himself is no slouch).

[Doom Herald]

Maybe I missed it, but has anyone tried rushing him into melee using a bike sorcerer to reduce the shots fired at him? Soulforged warlord trait to amp his movement to 14", advance him, advance Bike Sorcerer to come up with him and cast Diabolic Strength and then warp time, advance again, use detachment strat to advance and charge, and slam into a target with fury. If I understand right, his buff combined with BS and WS means he autohits, absent penalties to hit, and he will have quite a few attacks.

 

(14+D6)+(14+D6)+2D6 for (28+4D6)" melee threat range, average of 42".

 

Then either Intoxicating Elixir for more attacks or Fleshmetal Exoskeleton for regeneration.

Edited April 23, 2019 by Doom Herald

[Mekhitar]

1s to hit always fail.

[Prot]

Maybe I missed it, but has anyone tried rushing him into melee using a bike sorcerer to reduce the shots fired at him? Soulforged warlord trait to amp his movement to 14", advance him, advance Bike Sorcerer to come up with him and cast Diabolic Strength and then warp time, advance again, use detachment strat to advance and charge, and slam into a target with fury. If I understand right, his buff combined with BS and WS means he autohits, absent penalties to hit, and he will have quite a few attacks.

 

(14+D6)+(14+D6)+2D6 for (28+4D6)" melee threat range, average of 42".

 

Then either Intoxicating Elixir for more attacks or Fleshmetal Exoskeleton for regeneration.

 

I've had about 5 games with single and dual Lord Disco's with an assortment of Daemon Engines.

 

The last one was last night against Deathguard. I've had a lot of different games with these guys and they're okay. I think LD's were way over hyped on release. It turns out if you play with terrain then your opponent just had to stay in ruins and you're pretty limited in your interaction with that army. What the LD's do well is buff more 'flexible' and potent units into delivering a little more damage and potency. 

 

I don't think you have to go as far as what you describe. It's really not terribly hard to get into close combat in turn one with some psykery and the formation bonuses. The issue is... he's left unsupported and will likely die with only T6 (my biggest beef since release)  OR you smash into chaff.

 

I don't play against gunline armies that don't have a lot of chaff so it's really risky to launch him into your opponent in those games. Your best match up is against someone with an elite army, or CC army that has reserves to rely on and you can take advantage of that match up pretty easily.

[Furnace Lord]

I've been trying to make them work but I've had no success, not even using the half damage warlord trait. I'm kind of convinced at this point that it's better to take three, or take none. Since I want daemon engines of some kind that's my current consideration.

 

Do you think Maulerfiends and/or Venomcrawlers are worth taking without the LD buff? Maulerfiends seem fine since they just want to rush at things, Venomcrawlers I don't know. The other option is three LD which doesn't sound too bad, though I'm afraid to actually put anything special on them because they'll get immediately targeted for it.

[Prot]

I’ve been playing a lot of games lately using the Daemon forge detachment.

 

They’ve been all over the place for models and I keep saying this but I think the Venom will go down a bit in points. I don’t think it’s that bad if it does go down. It synergizes very well with Disco Lord and MoPs. People need to ficus it down or it heals well and the Disco Lord goes after vehicles while the Venoms chomp on infantry.

 

The disco aura is good but in the formation it’s that advance and asssault Strat theta really makes it work. I haven’t fond the rest of it too great but the Strat is great

 

The Baledrake has been very disappointing. I do still find the Venom is okay. Once it’s in the middle tier and without a Disco Aura it certainly suffers But it can be annoying and ties stuff up nicely.

[helterskelter]

I've been pissing about with my Lord Disco, rammed him up against a knight in a hilarious warp time 36 inch charge (with advance and charge strat) took a small chunk of wounds off, technovirus injector did it's job, overkilled a couple of Alaitoc rangers (weird store Apoc game) and took multiple units dedicated shooting to kill him, then leaving my other robots unscathed.

I also lobbed him at Mortarion, and once I got death hex off, got him down to 9 wounds (opponent had some excellent disgustingly resilient rolls).

 

I charge him up with diabolic strength and the intoxicating elixir, now I've had my "lolz" with him, properly applying him in the right place this character has some excellent potential for murder, especially with his dinobot and spiderbum in tow, strongly considering a supporting heldrake just to keep up with shenanigans or to make more