New 2019 spring FAQ changes.

[Ahzek451]

Just wanted to bring up the FAQ. Little sad that our bolters do not get bolter discipline on things like rhinos, but the new FAQ concerning perils and rubrics...anyone else take this as rubrics taking the hit (if a player wanted) and preventing the aspiring sorc from dying? 

Edited April 29, 2019 by Ahzek451

[Skerr]

That's how I read it.

[Raven1]

Big takeaways for us is that we for sure can summon turn 1, only 3 damon princes regardless of codex can be taken as they now all count as the same datasheet. Rubrics and Scarab Occult don't double explode on perils.

 

I think most people were playing like this but it's nice to have it clarified.

[Skerr]

At work and only got to glimpse at lunch. Did u say summoning got tweaked?

[Prot]

Also  there is no way to use Antimatter Crystal turn one since all of these game mechanisms trigger the deployed as reinforcements rules. 

[Heliomanes]

I disagree with your reading, Prot. You can use the Crystal to redeploy turn 1, but they clarified that you cannot warp time them. About time.

The Ksons reddit has a good runthrough.

https://www.reddit.com/r/ThousandSons/comments/bir19r/official_faq_updates_4292019/

[The Yncarne]

Also, can’t you use DMC on turn one as long as you aren’t in your opponent’s deployment zone at the the end of movement ? Edited April 29, 2019 by The Blood Raven

[GreaterChickenofTzeentch]

Also  there is no way to use Antimatter Crystal turn one since all of these game mechanisms trigger the deployed as reinforcements rules. 

In the Big FAQ "update" document they specifically state that mechanics that take a unit that starts on the table and then redeploy it are exempt from the turn 1 clause. It's on pg. 8

At work and only got to glimpse at lunch. Did u say summoning got tweaked?

 

Yep. Explicitly stated to be usable on the 1st turn. Also, those armies that can use the Malefic Discipline can use Incursion to summon even if they moved.

[Skerr]

That's awesome though a pure 1k sons doesn't have access to the malefic, correct?

[Raven1]

That's awesome though a pure 1k sons doesn't have access to the malefic, correct?

I believe just the master of summoning guy has access.

[GreaterChickenofTzeentch]

That's awesome though a pure 1k sons doesn't have access to the malefic, correct?

Correct. If you want to ally in, say, some Scourged, a Master of Possession might be interesting.

[MillionsSons]

Also our relic contemptors can now use twin lascannon (FW index FAQ)

[Tokugawa]

Butcher cannon >> lascannon, though.

[BoomWolf]

Don't really see what scourged donate for us though.

 

The biggest thing might be the bolter discipline being official now.

Rubrics double tapping at 24" make a solid contribution to your battle plan even when sitting far on objectives.

Sacrabs having all guns at full efficency at 24", and having quite some fiewpower per model, means you can really just walk them up and they will do some work.

If your mission has alternate deployment, keeping them for last when you can pick DS or line deployment after seeing the majority of enemy deployment means they are quite flexible even without a crystal bearer around.

 

Clarifying you don't have to lose the sorcerer first on perils also helps. too bad most TS spells are still rather bad, but we work with what we've got.

 

Assassin splashing for IoM being a bit more of an effort is also a great boon for us, given how vulnerable we are to the culexus.

 

Beyond that, mostly the nerfs to IK and elfsoup seem to be a roundabout assistance for us, as it improves us by comparison.

[Prot]

I disagree with your reading, Prot. You can use the Crystal to redeploy turn 1, but they clarified that you cannot warp time them. About time.

 

The Ksons reddit has a good runthrough.

 

https://www.reddit.com/r/ThousandSons/comments/bir19r/official_faq_updates_4292019/

 

I haven't read this link yet.. .no time right now. But really I wish they would just address Dark Matter Crystal and similar mechanisms specifically.  I don't understand it being legal as of yet, but I do know a fair number of people are still confused.

 

EDIT: So if you're like me and have to see it..... I think this is it: Here's where I was confused:

 

 A: If a rule or ability causes a unit to be removed from the battlefield and subsequently set back up, the following rules apply to that unit:

  1.  Any rules that are triggered by or apply to units that are ‘set up on the battlefield as reinforcements’ are also triggered by and apply to that unit when it is set up on the battlefield.

 

^ So this told me 'no'.

 

But the rules for Matched Play Tactical Reserves state:

Furthermore, in matched play games, units that are not placed on the battlefield during deployment in order to arrive on the battle mid-game as reinforcements cannot arrive on the battlefield during the first battle round.

 

Then... 

For clarity, this matched play rule does not apply to units that are set up on the battlefield during Deployment, but that use Stratagems, abilities, psychic powers etc. to be removed from the battlefield and set back up during the first or subsequent battle rounds. Also note, that no part of this matched play rule applies to units that are added to your army during the battle (such as those that require reinforcement points to be added); these units cannot be set up anywhere (on the battlefield or otherwise) during deployment because they do not exist until the point where the rule that ‘creates’ them is used, and that point is always after deployment has finished.

 

Hopefully that ends it. 

Edited April 30, 2019 by Prot

[Tokugawa]

Assassins are so good. No one would stop to take them due to 1 more CP.

 

When planning tactics against an Imperium list, we should assume there is always a Culexus stand in the middle of road. Personally i see daemon Flamers a viable choice. They have 12" range, so teleport-and-burn could be performed.

[GreaterChickenofTzeentch]

Assassins are so good. No one would stop to take them due to 1 more CP.

 

When planning tactics against an Imperium list, we should assume there is always a Culexus stand in the middle of road. Personally i see daemon Flamers a viable choice. They have 12" range, so teleport-and-burn could be performed.

Yeah, Culexus Assassins HATE Flamers of Tzeentch. :)

 

Speaking of Flamers, if you summon them, it can be done first turn if you're at a good range. It also doesn't count toward the limit on the amount of your army set up in "deep strike reserve" and you can use the points for something else if they're not relevant for some reason.

 

Also, for folks asking what Scourged bring to the table, they bring a few extremely reliable Heavy Weapons when deployed in MSU style, along with Deep Strike defense and the possibility of using a Master of Possession to move and then summon Daemons. Not for everyone, but interesting.

[Prot]

Don't really see what scourged donate for us though.

 

The biggest thing might be the bolter discipline being official now.

Rubrics double tapping at 24" make a solid contribution to your battle plan even when sitting far on objectives.

Sacrabs having all guns at full efficency at 24", and having quite some fiewpower per model, means you can really just walk them up and they will do some work.

If your mission has alternate deployment, keeping them for last when you can pick DS or line deployment after seeing the majority of enemy deployment means they are quite flexible even without a crystal bearer around.

 

Clarifying you don't have to lose the sorcerer first on perils also helps. too bad most TS spells are still rather bad, but we work with what we've got.

 

Assassin splashing for IoM being a bit more of an effort is also a great boon for us, given how vulnerable we are to the culexus.

 

Beyond that, mostly the nerfs to IK and elfsoup seem to be a roundabout assistance for us, as it improves us by comparison.

 

Bolter Drill is great... agreed.

 

Now I'm not disagreeing with you so don't take this the wrong way but I think for us a Knight type list was something we were 'okay' against because Mortal Wounds are Mortal Wounds no matter the victim.  BUT to a larger point I think people saw the writing on the wall for the Castellan and even Ynarri. I don't know that Ynarri really got hit that hard. But as a result tournament players have been gravitating towards Tau, and Astra. 

 

Tau and Astra are really difficult for me. Especially Astra and their numbers are starting to show it. Tau is having very good showings recently and I anticipate the Astra Parking lot is going to be massive, especially with the Assassins.

 

Assassins are ridiculously good. The extra CP (I think?) is negligible for the return. I anticipate facing a darn Culexus every Imp game now.

[Tokugawa]

Ynnari rules was much more poisonous than Knights. Problem of Castellan is just due to flaw of the whole game system(huge CP refund from grand-kurov),or inaccurate price(should it cost 600/650/700pts?).

 

Ynnari got "free" double action advantage, which need to invest un-negligible resource to achieve in every other codex. Free vs charged, that is really difficult to balance. So GW fixed it multiple times, but Ynnari is still imba, and GW has to nuke it.

 

Gav Thrope dont know and dont care about competitive 40k. I wish GW keep that guy never touch his hands on any future rulebooks.

[Panzer]

I'm not sure I 100% agree.

Knights are the main reason why people pack this much anti-tank in their lists which in return invalidates many vehicles who aren't nearly as durable for competetive play. That's not just the Castellan though. The same goes for regular Knights as well. T8 with so many wounds and a good invul just requires too much anti-tank to deal with compared to most other vehicles in the game.

So in that regard I find Knights much more "poisonous" than Ynnari.

[BoomWolf]

 

Don't really see what scourged donate for us though.

 

The biggest thing might be the bolter discipline being official now.

Rubrics double tapping at 24" make a solid contribution to your battle plan even when sitting far on objectives.

Sacrabs having all guns at full efficency at 24", and having quite some fiewpower per model, means you can really just walk them up and they will do some work.

If your mission has alternate deployment, keeping them for last when you can pick DS or line deployment after seeing the majority of enemy deployment means they are quite flexible even without a crystal bearer around.

 

Clarifying you don't have to lose the sorcerer first on perils also helps. too bad most TS spells are still rather bad, but we work with what we've got.

 

Assassin splashing for IoM being a bit more of an effort is also a great boon for us, given how vulnerable we are to the culexus.

 

Beyond that, mostly the nerfs to IK and elfsoup seem to be a roundabout assistance for us, as it improves us by comparison.

 

Bolter Drill is great... agreed.

 

Now I'm not disagreeing with you so don't take this the wrong way but I think for us a Knight type list was something we were 'okay' against because Mortal Wounds are Mortal Wounds no matter the victim.  BUT to a larger point I think people saw the writing on the wall for the Castellan and even Ynarri. I don't know that Ynarri really got hit that hard. But as a result tournament players have been gravitating towards Tau, and Astra. 

 

Tau and Astra are really difficult for me. Especially Astra and their numbers are starting to show it. Tau is having very good showings recently and I anticipate the Astra Parking lot is going to be massive, especially with the Assassins.

 

Assassins are ridiculously good. The extra CP (I think?) is negligible for the return. I anticipate facing a darn Culexus every Imp game now.

 

 

 

While true, you also need to remember that IG and tau also tend to feature a lot of light infantry (and drones) around, who are answered with small arms.

And you know what small arms are horrid against? All is Dust.

On the other hand high-impact AT is the answer to IG parking lot, rather than high-volume AT that is for knights. high-impact guns are ALSO out of their element against our "everything has an invul" lists.

 

Having more IG/tau around in the meta is actually a roundabout boon for us, as the things that people will pack to deal with them are rather ineffective against us.

Not easy matchups, but doable.

IG parking lot is not any more resilient to smite spam than knights after all. and the assassins taking a bit more work to deploy matters. (that 1 extra CP means a lot, and the fact you cant use it any more if you got other assassins in the list means they cant pack a vindi or three and still summon a culexus.)

 

Tau have no psyker defense AT ALL. thier light units are highly susceptible to inferno bolts, they are horrendous at CC meaning goats can effectively clean house if they get anywhere, and much of the tau firepower comes from pulse spam-All is Dust directly counters that.

 

Sure, its not as perfect matchup as marines, but these are not matchup that we are screwed against.

I'd reckon a meta of tau and IG is slightly easier than knights and elfsoup.

[GreaterChickenofTzeentch]

 

 

Don't really see what scourged donate for us though.

 

The biggest thing might be the bolter discipline being official now.

Rubrics double tapping at 24" make a solid contribution to your battle plan even when sitting far on objectives.

Sacrabs having all guns at full efficency at 24", and having quite some fiewpower per model, means you can really just walk them up and they will do some work.

If your mission has alternate deployment, keeping them for last when you can pick DS or line deployment after seeing the majority of enemy deployment means they are quite flexible even without a crystal bearer around.

 

Clarifying you don't have to lose the sorcerer first on perils also helps. too bad most TS spells are still rather bad, but we work with what we've got.

 

Assassin splashing for IoM being a bit more of an effort is also a great boon for us, given how vulnerable we are to the culexus.

 

Beyond that, mostly the nerfs to IK and elfsoup seem to be a roundabout assistance for us, as it improves us by comparison.

 

Bolter Drill is great... agreed.

 

Now I'm not disagreeing with you so don't take this the wrong way but I think for us a Knight type list was something we were 'okay' against because Mortal Wounds are Mortal Wounds no matter the victim.  BUT to a larger point I think people saw the writing on the wall for the Castellan and even Ynarri. I don't know that Ynarri really got hit that hard. But as a result tournament players have been gravitating towards Tau, and Astra. 

 

Tau and Astra are really difficult for me. Especially Astra and their numbers are starting to show it. Tau is having very good showings recently and I anticipate the Astra Parking lot is going to be massive, especially with the Assassins.

 

Assassins are ridiculously good. The extra CP (I think?) is negligible for the return. I anticipate facing a darn Culexus every Imp game now.

 

 

 

While true, you also need to remember that IG and tau also tend to feature a lot of light infantry (and drones) around, who are answered with small arms.

And you know what small arms are horrid against? All is Dust.

On the other hand high-impact AT is the answer to IG parking lot, rather than high-volume AT that is for knights. high-impact guns are ALSO out of their element against our "everything has an invul" lists.

 

Having more IG/tau around in the meta is actually a roundabout boon for us, as the things that people will pack to deal with them are rather ineffective against us.

Not easy matchups, but doable.

IG parking lot is not any more resilient to smite spam than knights after all. and the assassins taking a bit more work to deploy matters. (that 1 extra CP means a lot, and the fact you cant use it any more if you got other assassins in the list means they cant pack a vindi or three and still summon a culexus.)

 

Tau have no psyker defense AT ALL. thier light units are highly susceptible to inferno bolts, they are horrendous at CC meaning goats can effectively clean house if they get anywhere, and much of the tau firepower comes from pulse spam-All is Dust directly counters that.

 

Sure, its not as perfect matchup as marines, but these are not matchup that we are screwed against.

I'd reckon a meta of tau and IG is slightly easier than knights and elfsoup.

 

Gotta agree. We give Tau fits because we close like other Chaos Marines, then stop and blast them to ash instead of charging into their precious overwatch. They only get 1 shooting phase against us instead of 2. :) We also smash tanks and suits with magic (against which they have few defenses if we deleted their drones with Inferno Bolts) and a large chunk of their weaponry is D1. Once we've beaten them up for a bit with pointblank fire and Smite, then we send in the goats for cleanup.

[Xenith]

Allowing Rubricae to take the hit on a perils is wonderful!

[PiñaColada]

Rubricae starting to look a lot more viable now, with beta bolters in effect and perils less of an issue. If only they lower the point cost of the icon from 5 to 1 and I'd be super stoked (or rather, even more stoked)

[Quixus]

Rubricae starting to look a lot more viable now, with beta bolters in effect and perils less of an issue. If only they lower the point cost of the icon from 5 to 1 and I'd be super stoked (or rather, even more stoked)

It would be much better to keep or increase the cost of the icon but give it a more worthwhile effect.