ITC Faction Police

[PeteySödes]

So when the ITC mono faction changes were announced I was pretty thrilled, seemed like a really nice soft touch approach to balance at the meta level vs. rules.

 

This weekend though was my first GT since the change and it seems like the rules are self reported based on what you enter in BCP. I went though a bunch of the lists, starting with wolves as I was shocked there were 4 of us, and saw a pretty large amount of people reporting the faction wrong. There were a solid amount of people that added knights that didn’t kick their faction up the taxonomy chain to imperial or chaos. Presumably whatever was in BCP is what hits the rankings so like the proper “ackchually *pushes up glasses” grognard I am, I pointed it out to the TO who said he’d fix it.

 

Got me thinking though how many of these are slipping through with a less observant TO? Kinda lame to have the great hope of tournament mono players get squashed like this. Is this a weird one off or have people noticed anything similar?

Edited May 22, 2019 by PeteySödes

[duz_]

I guess its the same issue they have about misreporting prior to the changes

I'm not sure if BCP or ITC are going to filter and change this later when updating (until list formats are standardized and able to be auto audited I doubt it)

 

The best recourse in the meanwhile would be speaking to the TO and have them adjust the player profile if the offending player doesnt want to change it 

Could also be that they don't know the changes have been made

[Panzer]

There seem to be plenty people who find it incredibly difficult to dermine what kind of army they play. At least that's the only explanation I have for similar issues I see all over the internet.

Just yesterday I've seen an Miniwargaming batrep titled “Chaos Daemons vs ...“ while it was actually a pure Slaanesh CSM + Daemons list so it should've been “Mixed Slaanesh vs ...“ instead.

Things like that literally make me shake my head in disbelieve and annoyance.

[PeteySödes]

Yea I doubt it’s a case of intentionally trying to slip through for most players. It just bummed me out that there’s not a ton of oversight as someone who is actively shooting for a best in faction this year.

[Trevak Dal]

Yeah it's silly to me.

 

Yo dawg, do you have anything with your Grey Knights? Then you aren't playing Grey Knights, you are playing Imperium.

 

Yo dawg, do you have anything besides World Eaters Chaos Space Marines in your army? Then you are playing Chaos faction.

 

This is some King Solomon :cuss here.

[PeteySödes]

Yeah it's silly to me.

 

Yo dawg, do you have anything with your Grey Knights? Then you aren't playing Grey Knights, you are playing Imperium.

 

Yo dawg, do you have anything besides World Eaters Chaos Space Marines in your army? Then you are playing Chaos faction.

 

This is some King Solomon :cuss here.

Sorry, silly like the distinction is silly or the confusion?

[Vermintide]

I think there should be a ceiling on "allies" before it changes your faction entirely. Like, it's it's a majority (faction) list with a couple of Helverins, that's not suddenly Imperial soup, it just has a Knight detachment. You know? Or a Wolves list that includes a single Vanilla Marines Librarian. Or a dozen other things like that that can be fluffy and personal to a player as well as just tryhard WAAC. Or else just name the faction after the biggest detachment. I think it's a bit arbitrary to just be like "nah dude those aren't Grey Knights, it's Imperium".

 

Eh.

[PeteySödes]

I think there should be a ceiling on "allies" before it changes your faction entirely. Like, it's it's a majority (faction) list with a couple of Helverins, that's not suddenly Imperial soup, it just has a Knight detachment. You know? Or a Wolves list that includes a single Vanilla Marines Librarian. Or a dozen other things like that that can be fluffy and personal to a player as well as just tryhard WAAC. Or else just name the faction after the biggest detachment. I think it's a bit arbitrary to just be like "nah dude those aren't Grey Knights, it's Imperium".

 

Eh.

That’s what it was before though and it was pretty lame honestly. 1001 points of wolves plus knights and gaurd was still wolves and were obviously outperforming pure codex.

 

Personally I love the all or nothing approach it’s just it seems that not everyone is reporting it correctly.

[ERJAK]

I think there should be a ceiling on "allies" before it changes your faction entirely. Like, it's it's a majority (faction) list with a couple of Helverins, that's not suddenly Imperial soup, it just has a Knight detachment. You know? Or a Wolves list that includes a single Vanilla Marines Librarian. Or a dozen other things like that that can be fluffy and personal to a player as well as just tryhard WAAC. Or else just name the faction after the biggest detachment. I think it's a bit arbitrary to just be like "nah dude those aren't Grey Knights, it's Imperium".

 

Eh.

It depends on what the goal of the faction categorization system is. If the goal is to see more diversity in what gets played, then 'most points faction is your faction' makes the most sense.

 

FLG and the ITC seem to be going for encouraging mono-codex armies, which is why they've switched to the current system.

 

It's always about what you're trying to DO with the system you create.

[duz_]

It was a player vote and was at least 2:1 of not 3:1 in favour of pure lists

 

It was all of nothing because of the limitations already around reporting correctly and enforcement

 

This may change as list checking becomes more automated

[Dracos]

This was talked about in the latest (?) Chapter Tactics podcast. It’s an issue they are aware of and taking steps with BCP to fix. It’s just going to be a matter of taking some time to work the bugs out of the system. It took a while for them to get the army reader working when it first was introduced also. I think it’s a matter of the community just needing to be patient and let the technology catch up to the new system.

[chapter master 454]

"I'll just put in a battery battalion so I have CP for my custodes list that isn't 3 shield-captains on dawn eagle jetbikes. Still a custodes list though really so I'll leave that"

 

-Thump Thump Thump, FBI OPEN UP-

 

 

Just the image I had with the title XD

[Brother Cambrius]

-Thump Thump Thump, FBI OPEN UP-

 

 

Just the image I had with the title XD

In this case it'd be "Adeptus Arbites! Open up!". :lol:

 

It's a shame people are performing workarounds with what appears to be ease, but I feel this particular Edition has not helped much.

 

Cambrius

 

<Edit: Typo Purged>

Edited May 27, 2019 by Brother Cambrius

[Gederas]

-Thump Thump Thump, FBI OPEN UP-

 

 

Just the image I had with the title XD

In this case it'd be "Adeptus Arbites! Open up!".

And let's be honest here, it wouldn't be "open up" it'd be -door gets blasted open by melta charges- :lol:

 

But yeah, the fact that people are somehow getting NOT mono-faction armies put as mono-faction at ITC and other tournaments is kind of irksome.

[chapter master 454]

 

-Thump Thump Thump, FBI OPEN UP-

 

 

Just the image I had with the title XD

In this case it'd be "Adeptus Arbites! Open up!".

 

It's a shame people are performing workarounds with what appears to be ease, but I feel this particular Edition has not helped much.

 

Cambrius

 

<Edit: Typo Purged>

 

 

Its just the fact there seems to be an odd stigma against allies. Would be funny if the inverse was true though at that point there would be no active discussion about it nor talks about how to help the issue. But for some reason a guy brings one little knight and our TOs got scared so they said "your now only using mono-faction armies for ITC", when the tournament rolled up the lists said "mono-faction" but this was rare but they said na, YOHO on with the games!

[Trevak Dal]

I meant the confusion is silly or maybe it should be silly. If you got anything besides knights, you should be classified as imperium. If you got anything besides your codex/chapter it's the wider faction (imperium, Craft worlds, etc I don't know them all) Edited May 31, 2019 by Trevak Dal