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super mega huge apocalyptic micro battles


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#1
mughi3

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With the release of titanicus from 40K my old epic 40K nerves started a tingling

As it turns out 8th ed being so simplified works super good at epic scale-playing straight 8th edition while halving ranges and movement....suddenly basalisks can use their full range, transports become super important. bringing the big shiny models including FW( in 6mm) in numbers befitting the scale of the 40K universe is a thing of beauty and the cost savings..... one player just dropped $120 for a 10K thousands sons force (28mm translation close to $4k) great thing that there are a bunch of fans of epic scale still supporting the minis-

vanguard miniatures- defeat in 6mm
https://vanguardmini...-in-detail-6mm/
.Tusculum nova-space marines/imperial guard (death corp, tallarn, cadian, tempestus)
.eloi-eldar
.skinners-orks
.cybershadows-mechanicum/skitarii/titan legions
.tainted-chaos maries

Defeat in 15mm-entomorphs-large tyranids-hierophant anyone?

onslaught miniatures
https://www.onslaugh...m/11-6mm-sci-fi
.avians-kroot
.grudd-dwarfs
.stigians-dark elder
.okama-tau
.talos sindicate-knights
.sisterhood....sisters of battle
.hellborn-chaos/demons
.xenomites/classic minis-all the other tyranids
.terran federation/police- imperial guard (mordian/vostoyans) arbites, tempestus vehicles

Necron goodness can be found here-
https://www.trolls.c...ns/6mm-infantry

a great place for terrain in 6mm
http://www.brigademo...o.uk/index.html

this is what it looks like on the table

q8aJDER.jpg

eNBRU1L.jpg

r9L3zZG.jpg

AIC3KgR.jpg

Edited by mughi3, 12 June 2019 - 09:01 AM.

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"life is not measured in years, but by the deeds of men"

"Heresy begets retribution."
"Retribution begets reloading."

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#2
Trench

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Awesome idea, I will have to tell the guy at my club who is big in to epic about this, maybe offer to give it a test game with him one night soon.



#3
Stercus

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Looks like pretty good stuff. Which is a shame, because they are surely going to be sued til their bones squeak.

<p>gallery_48988_6285_50857.png
My thread of things:
http://www.bolterand...lds-some-stuff/

 

WIP Index Astartes Articles:

  Gatekeepers: http://www.bolterand...pers/?p=4192488

  Harvesters: http://www.bolterand...ters/?p=4192489

  Sons of Aetius: http://www.bolterand...tius/?p=4192491

 

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#4
Trench

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Looks like pretty good stuff. Which is a shame, because they are surely going to be sued til their bones squeak.

 

Doubtful as the guy at my club who is big in to Epic has been buying from those companies for a few years now, so they have been going for a while without GW going on the attack.



#5
mughi3

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Yeah GW doesn't support epic (or BFG it's a shame since it was one of their best games) anymore It was never a big money maker for them, none of the specialist games were. besides they make them look just different enough to avoid copyright conflicts. look at the difference between the 2 aeronatica t-hawks compared to the vanguard one in my picture.
"life is not measured in years, but by the deeds of men"

"Heresy begets retribution."
"Retribution begets reloading."

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#6
Frostglaive

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By order of the Holy Inquisition, this idea has been requisitioned and passed along for further examination and use by the Conclave of Gothmos (aka the guys at my FLGS). The Emperor thanks you for your service.

 

I'm all for this idea. Cheap, massive 40k battles? Heck yeah!

 

Now what I'm curious about is would the Knights and Titans from Adeptus Titanicus work for this scale? I haven't seen enough of the models to accurately judge the size compared to 6mm models.


When life tries to knock you down, fight back and fight dirty. Aim for the throat and kick it while it's down.


#7
Brother Tyler

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While this is about using Epic scale models (which would normally be in Other Games), it appears to be about using standard WH40K 8th Ed and the new Apocalypse, so I'm moving it over to the Apocalypse forum.


gallery_26_548_13550.pnggallery_26_6416_0.gifgallery_26_548_4494.pnggallery_26_6416_0.gifgallery_26_14910_14794.png


#8
mughi3

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By order of the Holy Inquisition, this idea has been requisitioned and passed along for further examination and use by the Conclave of Gothmos (aka the guys at my FLGS). The Emperor thanks you for your service.
 
I'm all for this idea. Cheap, massive 40k battles? Heck yeah!
 
Now what I'm curious about is would the Knights and Titans from Adeptus Titanicus work for this scale? I haven't seen enough of the models to accurately judge the size compared to 6mm models.

They scale perfectly
In fact that was the motivation for getting these armies together

iZxBY59.jpg
"life is not measured in years, but by the deeds of men"

"Heresy begets retribution."
"Retribution begets reloading."

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#9
Sherrypie

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By order of the Holy Inquisition, this idea has been requisitioned and passed along for further examination and use by the Conclave of Gothmos (aka the guys at my FLGS). The Emperor thanks you for your service.

 

I'm all for this idea. Cheap, massive 40k battles? Heck yeah!

 

Now what I'm curious about is would the Knights and Titans from Adeptus Titanicus work for this scale? I haven't seen enough of the models to accurately judge the size compared to 6mm models.

 

Titanicus models are indeed empirically proven to be in 6 mm scale (well, heroic ~6,5 mm but anyway) and work perfectly well.


Conversion heavy truescale Death Guard project, getting to army size! http://www.bolterand...s-with-the-xiv/

Legio Favilla walks, Ashen Gods unleashed! http://www.bolterand...gods-unleashed/


#10
Brother Tyler

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I was never a huge fan of Apocalypse. The primary reason for this was the close setup of the models - it smacked of something that poor generals would allow (forces were way too close). There were a lot of really neat things about the expansion, and I have no doubt that the new version will be interesting, but the close proximity of forces after deployment always ruined it for me.

Epic [Armageddon] scale models always seemed like a much better way to implement the Apocalypse rules, allowing the large forces to be set up in a way that better represented tactical planning and more effective use of fire and maneuver. Of course, that kind of undid the whole Apocalypse concept, which was to allow players to use massive quantities of 28mm miniatures in huge battles.

One thing I would recommend to anyone using the Apocalypse rules with Epic scale models is to relax the deployment rules a bit, increasing the distance between deployment zones/forces so that you can represent smarter forces on the tabletop. The only downside is that official Epic scale miniatures are both hard to come by and limited in terms of the units that are available. Third party manufacturers can definitely mitigate these issues.

gallery_26_548_13550.pnggallery_26_6416_0.gifgallery_26_548_4494.pnggallery_26_6416_0.gifgallery_26_14910_14794.png


#11
Canadian_F_H

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Neato. Might dabble in this one day.

#12
mughi3

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Brother Tyler

We actually did this by halving everything-movement and weapon ranges including deployment zone sizes.
"life is not measured in years, but by the deeds of men"

"Heresy begets retribution."
"Retribution begets reloading."

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#13
Frostglaive

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With the new Apoc rules being out for a few days now, what are peoples' thoughts on the game and using the 6mm scale models for it?


When life tries to knock you down, fight back and fight dirty. Aim for the throat and kick it while it's down.


#14
mughi3

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With the new Apoc rules being out for a few days now, what are peoples' thoughts on the game and using the 6mm scale models for it?


I don't think it is needed 8th works fine, as it is simple enough. I don't care for the new APOC rules with the blast markers/d12's etc..

same reason I still play classic battletech and not quick strike rules. making it to simple looses much of the immersion and flavor of the game.
"life is not measured in years, but by the deeds of men"

"Heresy begets retribution."
"Retribution begets reloading."

M.ilitary U.tility G.enetic H.igher I.ntelligence.

#15
Interrogator Stobz

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It's funny you say that Mughi3, I stopped playing 8th because it lacks the immersion I need. Everyone is different I suppose.

 

I'm hoping Apoc fixes our bigger games at least, KT has fixed the small games.

 

Now I may need to convince my group to invest in AT and Epic stuff so we can do it like this at 6mm.


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#16
mughi3

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It's funny you say that Mughi3, I stopped playing 8th because it lacks the immersion I need. Everyone is different I suppose.
 
I'm hoping Apoc fixes our bigger games at least, KT has fixed the small games.
 
Now I may need to convince my group to invest in AT and Epic stuff so we can do it like this at 6mm.


Well it's based on experience I remember how time consuming it was to play apoc at full scale in 5th. the main reason it works for 8th especially at micro scale is minimizing the terrain interaction and unit facing. as for KTs/combat patrol we still use the format straight out of the 4th ed rulebook

I do agree with you though I really don't like playing 8th at normal scale for that very reason. the guys at my store sat around one night and discussed how to make 40K better using 5th edition as the base and adding in better rules from the other editions from 3-7, which as it turns out means that all codexes from 3rd-7th are usable. so you can use the one that best really fits the fluff of the faction you play like 3rd for khorn aligned chaos marines, Armageddon for the black Templars etc...

this is how it turned out

40K 3rd-7th edition add-ons to improve 5th ed
.rapid fire weapon rules (6th/7th)
.snap fire(6th/7th)
.new weapon profiles(grav etc..)(6th/7th)
.overwatch(6th/7th)
.objective secure-troops choice(6th/7th)
.CCW AP value(6th/7th)
.grenade throwing(6th/7th)
.fearless-no LD checks(3rd)
.3+ reserves(6th/7th)
.no hull points
.flyer rules with 3 exceptions-jump units can assault, -12" range penalty, immobilize result= destroyed(5th)
.All AA units can choose to fire skyfire or ground fire same as aircraft(5th)
.4th addition vehicle assault rules-to-hit +armor facing
.6th edition smash for MCs(half attacks rounded up max S 10)
. independent characters can fight separate in CC(counts as separate battle)
.D/macro weapons 5th=auto pen/wound, no cover or armor- invul only/ 1 damage against MCs/instant death non-MCs/ +1 on vehicle damage chart
.vehicle squads act as talons, can break and act independent but not reform during game.
.psyker powers used when in the proper phase(shooting attacks in shooting phase, melee in CC etc..) on lD check/selecting the known powers available at the start of the game as per 5th ed rules-includes all 7th edition disciplines.
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"life is not measured in years, but by the deeds of men"

"Heresy begets retribution."
"Retribution begets reloading."

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#17
Frostglaive

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Me personally, I think the simplicity makes Apoc far better. I don't want to be focusing so heavily on a bunch of rules designed for a skirmish-level game that regular 40k is meant to be. I want to see a bunch of tanks and infantry mow each other down fast and explosively like an actual war zone. And having the game at 6mm scale, you're able to pack in a bunch more models that don't require you focusing super heavily on them in a more confined space in a faster-paced game.


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When life tries to knock you down, fight back and fight dirty. Aim for the throat and kick it while it's down.


#18
Frostglaive

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So I ordered about $80 worth of Space Marine infantry the other day. I'm expecting them to come in about a week or two now. I did not expect them to be so cheap. I think the amount of models I'm going to be getting will be 2+ Battle Companies worth (yeah, 6mm scale and all. But still. 200+ Marines. Dang). Gonna buy some tanks and other vehicles on my next paycheck.

 

I know Vanguard has their own rendition of Dreadnoughts for Space Marines. But the first pic posted in this thread has models that look almost identical to regular Dreadnoughts. Are those actual 40k Epic miniatures, or did you find those elsewhere?


When life tries to knock you down, fight back and fight dirty. Aim for the throat and kick it while it's down.


#19
mughi3

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they are actually old epic 40K dreads I found on ebay (there are a lot of old epic items that are on there for good prices) the vanguard ones are all contemptor pattern, they also have the grey knight dread knights as well.

also if you want the stormhawks they are on ebay as well from pomornik, several private sellers have 3d printed items not found on vanguard or onslaught
https://www.ebay.com...8cAAOSwB09YIFd1

P.S.
So what did you get? the assault terminators are very nice. the support unit sets have special and heavy weapons as well as tech marines and thunderfire cannons. in fact they pretty well have everything except some of the new primaris units...and yes it is cheap being about 1/5 the cost of regular 40K

my buddy did a 1k sons rubric terminator list for 8th that was about $120 for a 10K army...with vehicles it would be around $3,500 in regular 40K scale.


Also I use the (5 slot) strip bases that I then attach to flames of war rectangular bases to make large units.

Edited by mughi3, 18 July 2019 - 03:59 PM.

"life is not measured in years, but by the deeds of men"

"Heresy begets retribution."
"Retribution begets reloading."

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#20
Frostglaive

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My Vanguard order was just infantry for now. So no tanks yet, but I do have some coming in. The Vanguard models actually arrived yesterday. So much faster than I thought they'd take, and I'm so happy with them too!

 

2 sets of the 40 Tactical marines

A set of 40 Jump Pack Marines

40 Scouts

40 Cataphractii Terminators

The Support unit set

A set of 20 power armour characters

A set of 18 Cataphractii Terminator characters

 

I do have 3 more orders coming over the next few weeks as well. A set of 6 Rhinos from eBay, I found someone on Etsy selling their version of Storm Eagles and Marine Bikers, and there was another order on eBay for 10 of the old school Epic 40k Land Raiders for $25.

 

So far I've spent about $130 on everything. I'm wanting to pick up a bunch more too. Because right now in my local meta I'm the only one with Epic-scale models. So I'm trying to have a bunch for other people to be able to use as well, at least until they buy their own (if they like playing Apoc at Epic-scale that is). Hence why I'm just buying Space Marines for now.


Edited by Frostglaive, 24 July 2019 - 09:57 AM.

When life tries to knock you down, fight back and fight dirty. Aim for the throat and kick it while it's down.


#21
mughi3

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Cool man! the vanguard land raiders are Spartan pattern so win win if you want some of them. onslaught have the marine style bikers in the sisterhood section.


so $130 for I am guessing at least 10K points of marines, bet you never thought it would be so easy to build entire companies of marines. now scare yourself and price that out at GW retail prices.

Yeah vanguard are pretty fast on the delivery, I usually get my stuff within a week. so have you shown them off to your game group yet? what was their reaction?


P.s. did you mean storm ravens?. I've seen those on ebay but not storm eagles. the vanguard kit allows you to build either.

Edited by mughi3, 24 July 2019 - 10:34 AM.

"life is not measured in years, but by the deeds of men"

"Heresy begets retribution."
"Retribution begets reloading."

M.ilitary U.tility G.enetic H.igher I.ntelligence.

#22
Frostglaive

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I may pick up some Vanguard land raiders at some point, just to have a difference between the old school ones (the models that the new Land Raider Proteus is based off) and some godhammer patterns. The bikers, I'll wait and see how these etsy ones turn out first.

 

With how cheap these marines are, I'm half-tempted to go full potato and build a full-blown Chapter.... tempted, but I know I shouldn't lol

 

I've only shown one of my friends. He likes the models, but he's more worried about them getting lost in our FLGS than anything. But seeing as how they're my models, I told him not to worry about it lol

 

And no, I meant Storm Eagles.The FW models


When life tries to knock you down, fight back and fight dirty. Aim for the throat and kick it while it's down.


#23
mughi3

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double post

Edited by mughi3, 24 July 2019 - 01:46 PM.

"life is not measured in years, but by the deeds of men"

"Heresy begets retribution."
"Retribution begets reloading."

M.ilitary U.tility G.enetic H.igher I.ntelligence.

#24
mughi3

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Yeah 40K in epic scale does look awesome, have not had any problems loosing them yet as i base most units on flames of war rectangular bases then transport them in pluck foam.

The cost is a big deal, I have several people who play 40K now with epic scale where as before they would not touch 28mm 40K because of the severe buy in cost. it is even better since nearly every unit is available in 6mm including many FW units. that with the fact both vanguard and onslaught both keep adding to their lines- in the last couple months vanguard added kataphrons and killakans for example.
"life is not measured in years, but by the deeds of men"

"Heresy begets retribution."
"Retribution begets reloading."

M.ilitary U.tility G.enetic H.igher I.ntelligence.

#25
Frostglaive

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I'm going to stick with the GW round bases. Squads of 5 Marines per base. If a squad of 10, then I'll just have the bases next to each other in a game.

I'm gonna try 15mm bases I ordered online for characters. I'll trim 'em down if they're too big. Think that'd work?

Yeah the cost is one of the two biggest reasons I'm pushing for Epic Apoc in my group. That and much MUCH bigger battles while taking up so little space

When life tries to knock you down, fight back and fight dirty. Aim for the throat and kick it while it's down.





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