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Delegatus command squad


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#26
Inquisitor Verhek

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Yaaar's Revenge, on 12 Dec 2019 - 2:32 PM, said:

"A single Legion Command Squad may be chosen as a retinue for a Legion Praetor, Primarch or Legion special character with the Master of the Legion special rule which is also your Army's Warlord. They may not be taken as part of an army on their own, instead sharing a Force Organisation chart choice with the Warlord they are selected for, nor do they add to the points of a Primarch when determining Lords of War and the 25% rule".

TBH, it could be read either way - I am very confident it is not abe to cover Delegatus', but I guess we will have to wait for FW to clarify that one. In the meantime I'd say run them but be prepared for them to lose access to it in the worst case. Best case we get the rules fixed that are messy such as Rite of Command because that is messy.

Also, saying a Delegatus is a special character is mega-stretching. You know exactly what a special character is, a Delegatus is not one of them, he is a generic bog-standard character like the rest of the Consuls. Special in this instance clearly means someone like Maloghurst or Remus, who are named special characters with Master of the Legion.

By the standards of going off of the Retinue rules for the command squad, the Delegatus would never have been able to take a command squad. The original rules as printed stated; "may only be chosen as a retinue for a Legion Preator or Legion special character with the warlord special rule..." Which the delegatus has never fulfilled those criteria. In order to ever have been able to take a command squad, it would have to have a special rule alloowing it do to so........ which it did. And still does seeing as how there are no rewrites/errata/FAQs for the Delegatus consul.

I see no mess with the rule Rite of Command. A lower rank officer has been given the Rite of command of a small force of Legion assets. As such he is the warlord and has the ability to effect the rites of war by his chosen army composition/goals/assets available/etc. And as such, he is given the honor of a command squad in order to assist fulfilling his duties. Essentially it was a way to work in rites of war and customisation into lists at less than 1000 points. No fuss, no muss. It's the exact same rule that preators get just without the limitation of needing 1000+ points to field. And confers the ability to take a command squad.

There really isn't a need to wait for a clarification. The legion command squad is very specific in criteria for who can take it, just as the delegatus is very straitforward in saying that it doesn't meet the criteria, but that's ok, I still have a rule allowing me to take them. There's even a negative effect of him giving an extra VP when he is killed. Of course he needs protection!

And I said "look at him as a special character." Not that he was. Subtle, yet important difference. I was merely trying to relate it in and easier fashion, and apparently, missed the mark.
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#27
Yaaar's Revenge

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Yeah, I've been rereading it a bunch and I think you are 100% right, the retinue rule was changed not the actual Delegatus rules. There's literally only two options of how to rule it:

  1. Delegatus' have never been able to take them in the past because the Retinue rule doesn't include them, and their special rule allowing them to take it is wrong.
  2. They can take them because their special rule overides the Retinue rule, regardless of how it has been changed because it now includes Primarchs as the real change to the available options.

Obviously, option 2 seems the most likely just in case there was confusion, which is a really nice revelation because myself (and my local group) have been genuinely convinced that the Delegatus couldn't despite us all reading and discussing the rule - nobody noticed that it was a change to a rule that already interacted with the Delegatus in the same way as before the change. Definitely need to focus on the before and after analysis with future stuff!

Thanks for guiding me to the right answer though, was a tough one for me :D



#28
Inquisitor Verhek

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Thank you, Yaaar. It's been a long while since I've been on here posting. I'm glad to see my first rules discussion wasn't a big argument. I hope I didn't come across as rude. I've been told my tone tends to get a bit heavy and forceful. If it did in any way, I'm sorry, it wasn't intended.

I look forward to future discussions with you.
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#29
Yaaar's Revenge

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Thank you, Yaaar. It's been a long while since I've been on here posting. I'm glad to see my first rules discussion wasn't a big argument. I hope I didn't come across as rude. I've been told my tone tends to get a bit heavy and forceful. If it did in any way, I'm sorry, it wasn't intended.

I look forward to future discussions with you.

Not rude in the slightest, was interesting to have a discussion which yielded some interesting results (and as it turns out, was down to the source of the rule rather than what was in it). Glad you are back posting again!

Likewise! :D


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