2413 replies to this topic

[Shinespider]

I agree, it's hard to believe that all of the functions of this suit could be controlled by just two hand controls. Presumably a neural interface element is present, but still.

[Volt]

I'd be a bit more concerned by the glaring lack of pilot protection than the lack of foot pedals.

[Brother Chaplain Kage]

The pilot is in space marine power armor, not a T-shirt and Crocs.

[CCE1981]

The fact they upped the points on THs for characters in a more or less clear move to nerf slamcaptains...And then left them at the old price for Slamguinius is...Well,i'd say funny if not for the chain-facepalming

No, Thunderhammer points increase was required. As an example White Scars Captain 4 attacks, Charge +1 attack, Mastercrafted thunderhammer, warlord trait +d3 attacks, assault doctrine ap -1, damage +1.

On the charge, counter-charge, heroic Intervention, that is 6-8 attacks, Str 8, AP -4, d5 reroll attacks! That is without Litanies, or Psychic Powers to buff them!

[Volt]

The pilot is in space marine power armor, not a T-shirt and Crocs.

 

You say that but it looks a lot like a guy in capris, an 80's crop top, and crocs.

[Lemondish]

Spoiler

So, if I'm reading this right, a C:SM player can take detachments of BA/DA/SW IA vehicles and not lose Combat Doctrines because every one of those vehicles, including the Damocles Rhino and Chaplain Dreadnought for legal HQ choices, has Combat Doctrines, but nothing in those four Codexes have Combat Doctrines...

I don't think you're reading that correctly because I don't know how you came to that conclusion lol

See my reply to RayJ.

The errata for Imperial Armour - Index: Forces of the Adeptus Astartes gives Combat Doctrines to all datasheets except those in the Grey Knights section.

Angels of DeathAdd the following ability to all datasheets (excluding Grey Knights datasheets): ‘This unit has the following abilities: And They Shall Know No Fear, Bolter Discipline, Shock Assault and Combat Doctrines.’

Ergo, the Blood Angels, Dark Angels, and Space Wolves versions of those units have Combat Doctrines, yet the C:BA, C:SW, and C:DA units do not. Therefore, if you want access to a BA, SW, or DA stratagem, warlord trait, or relic in an otherwise C:SM army and don't want to give up Combat Doctrines, you can include a detachment lead by a Chaplain Dread that only uses units from the Astartes Imperial Armour book and then make the rest of your army from C:SM.

A blood angels vanguard detachment with Chaplain Dreadnought and 3x dual CCW Contemptors actually sounds awesome.

For turn 3 combat doctrine use?

Might be alright for anything alongside BA armies, but I don't see that being very valuable for C:SM armies with what you're giving up.

Suppose we'd need to see the rest of the supplements to see what we give up.

More rule of cool awesome, really. And I was just purely thinking the +1 attack.

They get shock assault no matter what. Doctrines only adds AP and ties into the special rule the chapter gets from the supplement.

I know? I wasn't suggesting anything about doctrines. . .

You were responding to a thread regarding marketing doctrines even for BA armies so I think it was fair for me to assume that you were contributing to that conversation. My apologies.

[Ishagu]

You guys do realise Space Marine bikers are a more silly concept, potentially? The first pothole would send Marines flying and they have no protection. Landspeeders are the same.

Why is the Astartes armour in a landspeeder perfectly fine, but here it's suddenly a problem?

Edited by Ishagu, 16 August 2019 - 11:09 PM.

[Marshal Rohr]

The pilot is in space marine power armor, not a T-shirt and Crocs.

You say that but it looks a lot like a guy in capris, an 80's crop top, and crocs.

Oh god, I can’t unsee it.

[Volt]

You guys do realise Space Marine bikers are a more silly concept, potentially? The first pothole would send Marines flying and they have no protection. Landspeeders are the same.

Why is the Astartes armour in a landspeeder perfectly fine, but here it's suddenly a problem?

Landspeeders actually have armor and sloped cockpits with only the gunner being exposed, and are also a fast moving skimmer meant to only briefly engage the enemy instead of a slow moving walker. Bikes likewise would be one of the most realistic units in 40k if they were only equipped with hunter killers and lascannons instead of plasma guns and meltaguns.

[Fulkes]

You guys do realise Space Marine bikers are a more silly concept, potentially? The first pothole would send Marines flying and they have no protection. Landspeeders are the same.

Why is the Astartes armour in a landspeeder perfectly fine, but here it's suddenly a problem?

Landspeeders actually have armor and sloped cockpits with only the gunner being exposed, and are also a fast moving skimmer meant to only briefly engage the enemy instead of a slow moving walker. Bikes likewise would be one of the most realistic units in 40k if they were only equipped with hunter killers and lascannons instead of plasma guns and meltaguns.

Translation? Handwavium for old stuff apparently.

I stand by the thought that the Invictus is likely based on the old STC mankind used before the Dark Ages and the Emperor had them stick a life support coffin in it.

Now we've gone back to that original design but slapped guns on it.

Edited by Fulkes, 16 August 2019 - 11:33 PM.

[taikishi]

 

Ergo, the Blood Angels, Dark Angels, and Space Wolves versions of those units have Combat Doctrines, yet the C:BA, C:SW, and C:DA units do not. Therefore, if you want access to a BA, SW, or DA stratagem, warlord trait, or relic in an otherwise C:SM army and don't want to give up Combat Doctrines, you can include a detachment lead by a Chaplain Dread that only uses units from the Astartes Imperial Armour book and then make the rest of your army from C:SM.

Wait, that means I could make a ‘Defenders of Terra’ army made of one Imperial Fists, one White Scars and one Blood Angels detachments and still not lose access to Doctrines?

Wow, and here I thought I would be handicapping myself doing just that!

 

 

You can only include the BA detachment if all of the units in the detachment are from Imperial Armour, since (at the moment), those units get Combat Doctrines while the ones in Codex: Blood Angels do not. Otherwise, you still lose Combat Doctrines.

[Volt]

 

 

You guys do realise Space Marine bikers are a more silly concept, potentially? The first pothole would send Marines flying and they have no protection. Landspeeders are the same.

Why is the Astartes armour in a landspeeder perfectly fine, but here it's suddenly a problem?

Landspeeders actually have armor and sloped cockpits with only the gunner being exposed, and are also a fast moving skimmer meant to only briefly engage the enemy instead of a slow moving walker. Bikes likewise would be one of the most realistic units in 40k if they were only equipped with hunter killers and lascannons instead of plasma guns and meltaguns.

Translation? Handwavium for old stuff apparently.

I stand by the thought that the Invictus is likely based on the old STC mankind used before the Dark Ages and the Emperor had them stick a life support coffin in it.

Now we've gone back to that original design but slapped guns on it.

 

No, because those units are specifically not designed to be shot at. This would be like making a tank with an open concept design for a hull, and then saying it's perfectly reasonable because aircraft only have 10mm or less armor. The entire point of the fast mover is that it doesn't get shot at because it's only there briefly, relying on mobility above armor for survival. That's not the case with the Invictor, which is a large lumbering war suit that towers over the battlefield and is such a large silhouette that even a crosseyed cultist with an autocannon could splatter the pilot. 

[Triszin]

Not a fan of the invictor. The 360 angles matter it worse for me. The amount I would have to alter is just to great for me to like it.
I think I would've liked it more if it had two
functional arms.

It's not for me, I still enjoy the concept, just not the execution

[Slips]

Have the digital codex.

 

Entry on the Invictor Warsuits confirms that the marines piloting them do interface with the suit through plugs on the wearers armor with specific mention of their autosenses being joined.

[Lord Nord]

It looks like there are two bareheaded options for the Invictor driver as well. One can be seen in the product photos, but on the sprue it looks like there are three heads total.

 

Also, with the front cover in place, the marine's feet are obscured, so I wouldn't put too much stock in there not being any controls down there. It may simply be that the designers didn't feel it was worth modelling that section.

[Dracos]

I dislike how the pilot's feet are just hanging. They need to be operating controls.

 

I agree. I think I'm going to use plasticard to hide his waist and legs or buy a Redemptor sarcophagus shell

[Slips]

 

I love this "chucking my combat knife into a fool" pose.

[Triszin]

Have the digital codex.

Entry on the Invictor Warsuits confirms that the marines piloting them do interface with the suit through plugs on the wearers armor with specific mention of their autosenses being joined.

Any new lore advancement?

[Slips]

 

Have the digital codex.

Entry on the Invictor Warsuits confirms that the marines piloting them do interface with the suit through plugs on the wearers armor with specific mention of their autosenses being joined.

Any new lore advancement?

 

Only skimming through it right now, not reading it fully.

[Boldthreat]

I dislike how the pilot's feet are just hanging. They need to be operating controls.

I agree. I think I'm going to use plasticard to hide his waist and legs or buy a Redemptor sarcophagus shell

I’m leaning this way myself. I’m ok with a open topped space marine walker (as it’s no different to a speeder or a bike), but that open roll cage is not jiving with me. I think the chest piece of the Redemptor right there would make it 10 times better as far as visuals go.

[DeadFingers]

 

The pilot is in space marine power armor, not a T-shirt and Crocs.

 

You say that but it looks a lot like a guy in capris, an 80's crop top, and crocs.

All I can see now is this.

 

 

It worked quite well for this guy, to be frank.

Edited by DeadFingers, 17 August 2019 - 01:23 AM.

[Dracos]

Seriously? Get over yourelves. It's not a Guardsman sitting inside a Sentinel. So this whining about the unprotected pilot makes no sense even in the physics of a 40k universe.

 

3+ armor save sitting inside a 3+ armor save. Give it a break for the 1000th time we get you don't like Phobos armor. How about we find a more constructive addition to the conversation? 

Edited by Dracos, 17 August 2019 - 01:21 AM.

[Volt]

Seriously? Get over yourelves. It's not a Guardsman sitting inside a Sentinel. So this whining about the unprotected pilot makes no sense even in the physics of a 40k universe.

 

3+ armor save sitting inside a 3+ armor save. Give it a break for the 1000th time we get you don't like Phobos armor. How about we find a more constructive addition to the conversation? 

How the hell is a thick dreadnought plate able to shrug off autocannons the same as power armor which is much thinner and vulnerable to autocannon fire? And it's not a 3+ save sitting in a 3+ save, it's a toughness 4 model sitting in a stripped down toughness 7/8 model down to toughness 6 with all of the armor gone. And in lore the Invictor could be killed pretty easily by any dude with a crew served lascannon right in the front, where the brunt of all fire will be taken. The rear armor is literally thicker in this case (or rather, extant).

[Marshal Rohr]

This is just Centurions 2.0. The back and forth will continue until someone on IG makes a cool conversion that everyone copies and it’ll all smooth over.

[Boldthreat]

I just think the legs and hands are the weakest features of the model. A chest piece like the Redemptor has covering up to the pilots chest would look much better. The roll cage looks and feels tacked on to me. It would also be a great place for a chapter badge or eagle or something.

Open topped space marine vehicles don’t bother me. Heck we have had that for years. I just don’t like the visual of the Invictor cockpit. It’s an easy fix though. 80 percent of the model is great.