How has the new codex performed for you?

[Medjugorje]

Normally I play at least one game a weak ( average is about 3 games I think)... I dont have the codex so far... but I am so hyped and so interested about the games will change. So I hope a few of you will give me/us a bit content. Just a bit if you dont have enough time or willing to write it down. It would be enough to write a few units and how they performed and how the enemie units/lists you played against

 

 

Edit:changed the topic title to better reflect the discussion

Edited August 20, 2019 by Acebaur

[Lippy]

Tonight I'm playing a 2000pt game against Salamanders.

 

I'm not the most tactical player (beer & pretzels games ftw) but hopefully after tonight I'll have lots to feed back on.

[Brother Sheep]

Laeroth's blog provides a huge amount of information.

https://www.implausiblenature.net/laeroths-blog

 

Or watch the video of seo winters. (im on my phone, no link, sorry)

[Medjugorje]

Tonight I'm playing a 2000pt game against Salamanders.

 

I'm not the most tactical player (beer & pretzels games ftw) but hopefully after tonight I'll have lots to feed back on.

I think it will be the toughest match for us... Salamanders are like Anti marine builds because of negative combat doctrines.  Which units do you want to play and what would you expect to see on the other side?

[Medjugorje]

Laeroth's blog provides a huge amount of information.

https://www.implausiblenature.net/laeroths-blog

 

Or watch the video of seo winters. (im on my phone, no link, sorry)

THX - but I still know the rules now. Its more about how they really perform in the game, because normally I am very fast in terms of finding someone to play and test new units&rules. But for now I had an accidant (disc prolapse) and dont come into play the game. So its the first time a BT codex is out now and i cannot expect my first game.

[Link2edition]

Well you already saw the list I am planning to bring to my next tournament: http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/357811-new-codex-black-templar-alphastrike-pods-2000-points-8cp/

The tourney is Saturday, so I can report back after it. Thank you for your comment by the way. I updated the list to be "rule of three" compliant. I am also trying to get a test game in Thursday, but that one is up in the air.
 

[Brother Talarian]

I’m playing a 2v2 on Thursday night va Sallies and DW.

Will report back on how it went :)

[Medjugorje]

oh yes. reports, especially from tournaments would be great

[Marshal Vespasian]

Should mangae to play a game next week hopefully. Will report back.

[Lippy]

Ok so here's my report from last night

It didn't go well!

 

So as I mentioned I played against salamanders in 2000pts. It was a maelstrom game from Chapter Approved and a beer and pretzels style friendly game.

 

First, My list:

Batallion 1:

Phobos Captain

Phobos Lieutenant

 

5x Infiltrators w/comms

5x Infiltrators w/comms

5x Veteran Intercessors - bolt rifles

 

Ven Dread w/ Twin Lascannon

 

Devastators - 2x Missiles, 2x Las

 

Batallion 2:

Captain - Teeth of Terror, Storm shield - WT Master Swordsman

Emeperor's Champion

 

5x Crusaders - P.Axe, Flamer, P.Sword

5x Intercessors - Auto Bolt

5x Veteran Intercessors - bolt rifles

 

5x company Veterans - all p.sword/StormSheild

5x company Veterans - all p.sword/StormSheild

 

Droppod

Droppod

 

Vanguard:

Chaplain - Jumppack, plasma pistol & Relic Crozius

 

3x Aggressors - Flamers

5x Reivers

5x Reivers

 

So the clever ones among you will see I was around 90 pts down - I missed a squad of intercessors...!

 

Davastators deployed with Ven dread in one corner,

Autobolts, lieutenant, and chaplain together,

Vet Intercessors and phobos marshal together,

with infiltrators on the mid way point on either flank to gain some ground control. 

1st droppod held EC, SlashMarshal and 5x Vets

2nd droppod held 5x vets and 5x Crusaders

Both reivers came down using gravchutes

 

His list (without knowing the breakdown 100%):

Batallion:

Phobos Captain

Phobos Lieutenant

 

5x Infiltrators

5x Infiltrators

5x Scouts

 

Contemptor - Kheres Assault and Twin LasCannon

 

5x Helblasters

5x Helblasters

 

Batallion:

Captain (chaper master) - Jumppack, Burning Blade, Stormshield(?) - Salamanders Warlord trait (+2 Str)

Lieutenant - Jumppack, PowerSword, stormshield

 

5x scouts

5x scouts

5x scouts

 

3x Suppressors

 

5x Devestators - 4x Missilelaunchers

 

Vanguard:

Phobos Psyker (witch!)

 

Vanguard Vets - all Lightning Claws

5x Sternguard

5x Sternguard

 

Droppod

 

He had a nice Castle with Hellblasters, contemptor and infiltrators buffed by phobos capt, lieutenant and psyker.

A shooty flank with suppressors and Devastators

Then Infiltrators, vanguards and jumppack chaptmast+ lieut on the other flank (in a building, which I hate as a rule because it means you cannot shoot inside it...)

His scouts pushed up to match my infiltrators in blocking the middle as far as possible.

 

'Battle Report'

 

I took the took first turn and rolled my litany which i chose the +2" charge.... Failed. I rerolled. Failed.

 

Took it on the chin and moved up with most units so that we could do what we do. But, i wasn't aggressive enough and didn't push up enough with some units.

My droppods came down as far forward as they could however the scouts did a good job holding me far enough back. I also split my drop and this was ultimately my downfall.

 

Shooting i used fury of the ancients which helped my devastators, I targetted the infiltrators and some how one remained (in hindsight i should have shot the hellblasters). I split some fire to pick off scouts but didnt get far.

 

All of my vets missed their 9" charges... even if the +2" had gone off i would have failed. Apparently I roll 4+2 for charging even with rerolling!

Not good and I was now a sitting duck.

 

 

Hellblasters proceeded to rip through my Veterans and crusaders, leaving only the EC and Slasher standing from my 'Alpha strike'.

The contemptor murdered my hellblasters and the sternguard dropped into my back line. Thankfully they fluffed and I tanked their shots.

 

Next Turn, my Litany went off, again 2" charge.

Infiltrators, Chaplain, and phobos castellan moved to the left flank and attacked the units in the building.

EC and Marshal attacked a scout squad - yes they ripped through them easily.

Intercessors and infiltrators attached the sternguard - Veterans + Shock Assault is pretty big to buff just a standard shooting unit. To get 17 attacks from 4 was useful.

 

The infiltrators, phobos lieut and chaplain took out the infiltrators - Chaplain's relic was crazy good and will be good against TEQ units.. possibly knights(?). but i did miss the reroll to hit from him from a nostalgic pov.

 

Slashcaptain is good and i enjoyed him ripping through scouts but wish i'd been able to do some more with him.

 

 

His turn,

Again Hellblasters battered my remaining units. I played transhuman physiology and thought i'd cracked it, but it makes little difference when 7 of 8 to wound rolls were 4+...!

 

His assault phase- Salamander chaptermast with burning blade was crazy - 6, Str9, D2 attacks hurt my chaplain and he died mercifully. I should have played 'Only in death does duty end' but forgot...

Vanguard Vets with Lightning Claws getting 21 attacks also hurt me and tore through the infiltrators.

 

 

By now the writing was on the wall but played it through because Never Surrender and Accept ANY Challenge... and all that.

Through playing the mission I eventually lost by 2 victory pts but on the tabletop it felt like he had the upper hand from the off.

 

 

Summary

I was pretty green - Haven't played 40k since March and my opponent plays weekly so that plus having a new codex to familiarise with on the fly was difficult.

 

The Salamanders now ignoring -1 AP pretty much negated the benefit of combat doctrines. So this was disappointing!

And their rerolling a fail hit and fail wound as well as he lietuenant and captain/chapter master rerolls was big especially for the castle that he created in the centre.

 

I made a lot of mistakes, mainly schoolboy ones. such as dropping my shooty reivers outside the building, and the chainsword ones by the devestators...

I should have moved the units from the droppod behind cover rather than in the open trying to force my charge. Cut my losses.

 

Nevertheless,

Positives -

The addition of 5+++ (MW) FNP was a boon. It helped against Smite and Mind Wipe psychics as well as a few weapon MW and Hammer of Wrath. Happy with that.

+1 A on all marines is big. It means that Scouts (neophytes) are worth throwing in to combat, as well as the rest of the units. Vanguards will be strong i feel, but even standard intercessors can do a job. I'm going to try a Thunderhammer sergeant in future - 5A if hes a Vet.

 

Our Characters are more powerful now. Hero Hammer is bigger just like in the books.

 

Negatives

Negating droppods is still too easy with small units like scouts. Having to find the footprint for your pod, plus the unit's movement etc was too much. I think Id rather try a Rhino/Razorback next time... wait.. an LRC!

Even with the extra attack I felt that i was trying to force a Combat style out of a Shooting oriented army. I kept flicking through the stratagems for something to help and struggled to find much. Maybe it was a case of Overchoice and paralysis in that I couldn't make a decision.

 

So there we are. Pick the bones out of that!

Happy to answer any questions, but as you'll have read, i may not be the best to ask!

[Link2edition]

I am sad to hear the pods didn't do well for you. My list has about 1250 points tied up in pods. Almost everything inside can shoot out to 24inches though, so I am hoping that will mitigate screening. I am also using scouts of my own to try and keep a guaranteed DZ.

I really think anything that is podding in needs to be good at shooting, but you can always assault after you shoot if anything is close.

I don't know who my game tomorrow is against, but I know my game Friday will be against worldeaters. Should be funtimes.

Edited August 21, 2019 by Link2edition

[Lippy]

Yeah I've changed my list to include Grav Devs coming out of the pod - they wont clear a screen but certainly wouldve taken out the hellblasters!

[Link2edition]

Yeah I've changed my list to include Grav Devs coming out of the pod - they wont clear a screen but certainly wouldve taken out the hellblasters!

Devs coming out of a pod with Helbrect is going to be nasty this edition, not just for the re-rolls, but because they are getting 11+ str 5 attacks in close combat while they are near the bossman.

[SydonianDragoon404]

I think a melee unit coming out of a pod is the wrong idea, too many factors like what happened with Lippy. I prefer Rhinos where I have more control. Besides, your pod is dropping in your opponents front lines unless they're a noob or a moron. Most people's juicy charge targets aren't going to be at the front. 

 

I played a 750 pts game against the Smurfs the other night:

 

His list-

Primaris Captain

Primaris Lt

 

9 Intercessors

5 Intercessors

5 Scouts

 

3 Bolter Aggressors

 

2 Whirlwinds

 

-----

 

My list-

 

Primaris Captain, power sword

Captain, Jump Pack, Teeth of Terra, Emperor's Sword WT

 

10 Intercessors, auto bolt, PF

8 Intercessors, Stalker Bolt rifles

5 Scouts, HB

 

3 Plasma Inceptors

 

---------

 

Black Templars won, his Whirlwinds completely whiffed, I got into close combat, got into a position to charge the aggressors with the Teeth of Terra without facing overwatch due to terrain, Inceptors came down and smoked a Whirlwind. I lost more than half of my intercessors but Transhuman Physiology helped out with weathering the storm from the Whirlwinds. His characters weren't built for CC and mine were, when I got there it was over. 

 

Interesting notes:

 

When assault doctrine is active: Power Swords are AP -4, Plasma Pistols are AP -4, and the Teeth of Terra is AP -3. Ouch.

When tactical doctrine is active on turn 2: Plasma Inceptors are AP -4. No 6+ saves for vehicles with 3+ Armor. Even better returns when shooting at something in cover. 

Honor the Chapter is 3 command points, still worth it. Especially when your Teeth of Terra captain gets 9 attacks at strength 6. 

[Medjugorje]

Salamanders is a hard case. I think you did it really well. His army was very tough against your melee list. Nevertheless, like your list. 

[Medjugorje]

 

 

Interesting notes:

 

When assault doctrine is active: Power Swords are AP -4, Plasma Pistols are AP -4, and the Teeth of Terra is AP -3. Ouch.

When tactical doctrine is active on turn 2: Plasma Inceptors are AP -4. No 6+ saves for vehicles with 3+ Armor. Even better returns when shooting at something in cover. 

Honor the Chapter is 3 command points, still worth it. Especially when your Teeth of Terra captain gets 9 attacks at strength 6. 

congrats...  

[Closet Skeleton]

Honour the Chapter was always 3 CP, it was Only in Death Does Duty End that was 2.

[Brother Talarian]

Sooooo:

 

My list:

 

Grimaldus

EC

Captain with ToT, SB WLT

 

x2 crusaders with HB

x1 scouts

 

x10 VV with SS and Power axe

 

x5 Devastator with Grav

x2 Drop Pod

 

—————

 

It was epic.

Grav is next level with the strat.

Two drop pods clear chaff and bigger targets. Remain stationary.

 

T2 Grimaldus chants canticle of hate. VV drop down 7” charge re-rolling.

 

+1 A for SM is epic.

The captain combo mixed with Grims aura is insane as well.

 

So far I’m very pleased. Eager to see what our new starts will bring.

[Link2edition]

Looks like fish is back on the menu brothers!

Goodness the game against tau was an absolute massacre, he conceded turn 2 because he got wrecked on the drop, and what was left was about to eat a charge from 20 Templar, Helbrect, the emperor's champion, and a bunch of other things.

My list is pictured here, and can be found here: http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/357811-new-codex-black-templar-alphastrike-pods-2000-points-14cp/

His list was

3x Stormsurges with Early warning override
60 Fire Warriors
2 Tau Commanders

I got pictures, but despite him being a veteran tau player he hasn't run them much in 8th so he was proxying to test units out.
Knights = Stormsurges
Infantry models = Fire warriors

We were playing ITC missions, he deployed with his fire warriors in front screening his stormsurges, he seized the initiative and got first turn. 
He blew up all my scouts in the center and two of my speeders. He would have done more damage but I kept saving the mortal wounds from his missiles dues to righteous zeal, this gave me a pretty good place to start from on my first turn.

So when my turn came I moved around some units to get better fire lanes and then called in the sword bretheren

I lost 5 Marines due to "Early warning override" because I dropped a little too close to the front, but the rest lit up his gun line with heavy weapons.
Compare this to the pic of his deployment:

Multi-meltas made short work of one of the Stormsurges, another was knocked down to 4 wounds. Storm bolters wiped out one of the fire warrior squads. 

On his turn he pours as much fire as he could into the DZ, but I had dropped into cover and he was having a lot of trouble getting past that 2+ save. I lost a drop pod and all the melta but the sarge, but he knew I was about to get a round of shooting at full BS, and this time with -1 AP on bolters. We mathammered it out and realized he was toast, so we called the game there.

If it had continued I was going to move out and charge him with everything, but given how late we started the game I understand stopping where we did.

Drop Pod Templar works beautifully. The highlight for me has to be turn 2 when he called in an orbital strike on the drop zone and I saved but all but one of the mortal wounds thanks to our tactic.

 

 

Edited August 23, 2019 by Link2edition

[Medjugorje]

A Tau without drones isnt a real Tau^^ Expect a different game with just 1 unit of drones in it.

[Marshal Laeroth]

I am loving the new "Peek-a-Boo!" units (Concealed Positions/Indirect Fire), combined with the durability of Primaris.  Its working out pretty fantastic.

[Smirnov]

Is combat doctrine worth losing out on allied armies? I haven't played since 6th edition, so don't really know much about 'soup meta' that gets all the hate... but thematically Templars not having Codex doctrine is somewhat logical

[Link2edition]

Test 2: Black Templar Vs World Eaters

 

Templar list here: http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/357811-new-codex-black-templar-alphastrike-pods-2000-points-14cp/
WorldEaters:
Smashcaptain
Deamonprince
3x 10 Zerkers in Rhinos
2x Forgeworld Dreads
1x Chaos Marines
3x Bolter Deamon engine things

This battle can be summed up pretty shortly, I dropped in, killed a FW dread and the unit of heavy bolter deamon engine things, then I shot up the chaos marines and charged them.
 

He counter charged and got the smash captain and a unit of zerkers into the drop zone. But I interrupted CC after the smash captain swung and burned about half my CP giving Helbrect every buff I could from vigilus and the codex. 

Our chapter master waded into the fray and saved the DZ by killing almost the whole unit of berzerkers. The smash captain lost 4 wounds to plasma in defensive fire (lots of the plasma blew up doing this, but with the banner it just gave them more shooting attacks) he was subseqently beaten to death by grav cannons in melee, in true templar fashion.

The apothecary healed one of the grav cannons and they nuked another unit of berzerkers at close range.

We ended up calling the game in the middle of turn 3 due to time constraints, and called it a draw due to the points being even, but we agreed that if we had more time the templar probably would have killed the rest of his stuff.

I am really enjoying this list, I have a tournament in the morning I am bringing it to, so wish me luck!

Edit: I got these guys up to WYSIWYG about a week before the tourney, and they don't have a painting requirement this time, so excuse the grey.

 

 

Edited August 24, 2019 by Link2edition

[Medjugorje]

good luck brother.

[Jacques Corbin]

Question, so how good are Company Veterans for y'all now? They can intercept wounds for Characters, but with (new) Black Templar CT, they get a 5+ vs Mortal Wounds.