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Why is a certain city so deep with the earth?


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#1
Theredknight

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SPOILER ABOUT ANCIENT HUMANITY ETC mainly read from master of mankind.



I’m wondering if anywhere it says how NEPAL / why this is?

I have been interested in crust displacement lately, something which is said to drop continents within a day (that’s a long story and happy to discuss!)

Is this the reason given? Considering it occurs every 12k year’s or so it’d be lucky not to have completely destroyed it but has done other cities.

Just wondering if anyone is lored up on this!!

Edited by Theredknight, 30 August 2019 - 03:41 PM.


#2
Marshal Rohr

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What city?


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#3
Theredknight

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What city?


Nepal, they walk past it on the way to the gate and the peaks of the Himalayas. Etc

#4
Marshal Rohr

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Nepal is a country and also not under the Imperial Palace. The Imperial Palace is in the north east of the Tibetan plateau. Nepal is actually only a small section of the palace.

Edited by Marshal Rohr, 30 August 2019 - 03:52 PM.

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#5
Closet Skeleton

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There's no such thing as dropping a continent in a day, that would be Atlantis based nonsense. Charles Hapgood published a book on pole shift a few years before modern plate tectonics came and invalidated it and later writers have been recycling his claims with no new evidence but various new coats of paint ever since. Due to continental drift the Himalayas are rising by about 5mm a year which in 28,000 years would be 140 meters but that would just make the peaks higher not sink a city on the side of anything.

 

Cities can end up underground due to earthquakes, pyroclastic flows and more simple land and mudslides. The city of Helike on the Gulf of Corinth sank into the sea within (the source of most lost continent stories) Plato's lifetime due to an earthquake, its just a thing that happens from time to time to vulnerable locations.

 

The street level in cities that have been occupied for thousands of years like Rome and London have risen by many meters due to a wide variety of reasons none of them to do with the earth's crust. Old Prague is underground in modern Prague because they literally built a new city on top of the old streets at one point.


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#6
Theredknight

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There's no such thing as dropping a continent in a day, that would be Atlantis based nonsense. Charles Hapgood published a book on pole shift a few years before modern plate tectonics came and invalidated it and later writers have been recycling his claims with no new evidence but various new coats of paint ever since. Due to continental drift the Himalayas are rising by about 5mm a year which in 28,000 years would be 140 meters but that would just make the peaks higher not sink a city on the side of anything.

Cities can end up underground due to earthquakes, pyroclastic flows and more simple land and mudslides. The city of Helike on the Gulf of Corinth sank into the sea within (the source of most lost continent stories) Plato's lifetime due to an earthquake, its just a thing that happens from time to time to vulnerable locations.

The street level in cities that have been occupied for thousands of years like Rome and London have risen by many meters due to a wide variety of reasons none of them to do with the earth's crust. Old Prague is underground in modern Prague because they literally built a new city on top of the old streets at one point.

Yes he mentions Nepal, I am sure it was that or Tibet I can’t remember off the top of my head, maybe you know better?
Lol you know about as much as me. Don’t dismiss what could always be possible 👍🏼
Japan moved something like 8m in that big quake a few years ago, over a day or so, so who knows. You know about plate tectonics and what is at the centre of the earth for sure? No. I doubt it.

You should read the recently de classified CIA document by chan Thomas ‘the Adam and eve story’ something which was originally 200+ pages and classified in 60s. Then heavily edited for public release at 50 odd pages. It’s all about this amongst other things.
Then ask yourself why would they classify it if there wasn’t some semblance of truth.
It also has to do with magnetic shifts etc. Etc.

There are many strange things such as flash frozen mammoths, fish at the top of the Himalayas which wouldn’t ‘happen over centuries’

So please don’t tell me I’m ‘wrong’ when you can be equally so 😉

All I asked was if there was an explanation in the books for it.

Edited by Theredknight, 30 August 2019 - 04:35 PM.


#7
Marshal Rohr

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Nepal is mentioned several times, and it is to the south of the main setting of the Lost and the Damned, beyond the walls of Palace. The capital of Nepal is Kathmandu, which is mentioned in some Heresy novels, as is Dwalghiri and Annapurna. They aren't under the Imperial Palace though.

 

 

This map should help

 

https://imgur.com/gallery/lUi7Sh5


Edited by Marshal Rohr, 30 August 2019 - 04:39 PM.

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#8
Astartes Consul

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TBF, there is a passage in Master of Mankind - in the chapter Labyrinth - where Diocletian tells Zephon that the ruined city they are passing, on the way to the Imperial Dungeon, was once the capital of Nepal...

 

Considering the setting is 30,000 years in the future, and have tens of thousands of years of apocalyptic warfare with all sorts of arcane, world altering weaponry, it isn't that unreasonable that the Himalayas have sunk and crumbled a bit. And thats before a continent sized palace was built on top of them. 


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#9
Theredknight

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Nepal is mentioned several times, and it is to the south of the main setting of the Lost and the Damned, beyond the walls of Palace. The capital of Nepal is Kathmandu, which is mentioned in some Heresy novels, as is Dwalghiri and Annapurna. They aren't under the Imperial Palace though.


This map should help

https://imgur.com/gallery/lUi7Sh5


That’s the city yes!
Jeez where’d you find that one? Its basically like walking under ground for ages. I had in my mind a long path under the palace, thanks for the info!!
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#10
Theredknight

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TBF, there is a passage in Master of Mankind - in the chapter Labyrinth - where Diocletian tells Zephon that the ruined city they are passing, on the way to the Imperial Dungeon, was once the capital of Nepal...

Considering the setting is 30,000 years in the future, and have tens of thousands of years of apocalyptic warfare with all sorts of arcane, world altering weaponry, it isn't that unreasonable that the Himalayas have sunk and crumbled a bit. And thats before a continent sized palace was built on top of them.


Yeah I think he blew them up a bit too, who knows then, I’d love some more info.
Plus you have the whole wars with men of iron and all sorts of cataclysms they wouldn’t know about or mention.
There’s also lots of warp psychic stuff too so I suppose it’s open to anything 😉

#11
Marshal Rohr

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TBF, there is a passage in Master of Mankind - in the chapter Labyrinth - where Diocletian tells Zephon that the ruined city they are passing, on the way to the Imperial Dungeon, was once the capital of Nepal...

 

Considering the setting is 30,000 years in the future, and have tens of thousands of years of apocalyptic warfare with all sorts of arcane, world altering weaponry, it isn't that unreasonable that the Himalayas have sunk and crumbled a bit. And thats before a continent sized palace was built on top of them. 

 

Or it's Lhasa or another Tibetan city and they believe it is Kathmandu. OR, this one isnt as fun, but they decided where the Palace was afterADB finished his book. 


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#12
Theredknight

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TBF, there is a passage in Master of Mankind - in the chapter Labyrinth - where Diocletian tells Zephon that the ruined city they are passing, on the way to the Imperial Dungeon, was once the capital of Nepal...

Considering the setting is 30,000 years in the future, and have tens of thousands of years of apocalyptic warfare with all sorts of arcane, world altering weaponry, it isn't that unreasonable that the Himalayas have sunk and crumbled a bit. And thats before a continent sized palace was built on top of them.


Or it's Lhasa or another Tibetan city and they believe it is Kathmandu. OR, this one isnt as fun, but they decided where the Palace was afterADB finished his book.

Haha poor ADB. It’s a great book though, the water bit is cool as well.

#13
Astartes Consul

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TBF, there is a passage in Master of Mankind - in the chapter Labyrinth - where Diocletian tells Zephon that the ruined city they are passing, on the way to the Imperial Dungeon, was once the capital of Nepal...

 

Considering the setting is 30,000 years in the future, and have tens of thousands of years of apocalyptic warfare with all sorts of arcane, world altering weaponry, it isn't that unreasonable that the Himalayas have sunk and crumbled a bit. And thats before a continent sized palace was built on top of them. 

 

Or it's Lhasa or another Tibetan city and they believe it is Kathmandu. OR, this one isnt as fun, but they decided where the Palace was afterADB finished his book. 

 

 

Look, all I've ever wanted is a detailed schematic of how the Imperial Palace works and where exactly everything is, and this conjecture does not will me with confidence that such a think will ever appear*

 

 

(*you're probably right though) 


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#14
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And thats where that train of discussion ends. Keep it about 30/40k, not the CIA or whatever.

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#15
Theredknight

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And thats where that train of discussion ends. Keep it about 30/40k, not the CIA or whatever.


Yeah exactly, il be honest I didn’t read pretty much any of that. I think I made it pretty clear when I was asking about lore in 30/40k!

Maybe the CIA are working for the dark gods?
Kathmandu is about 1400m above sea level? So to get that far below over 40k years must’ve had some disruptions. I guess there isn’t any lore explaining it..yet!

#16
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I feel like it's meant to be unknowable. A textbook exercise in Lovecraftian mystery, which raises mostly unsettling questions. I seem to recall instances of this in Skyrim too.

And also to communicate how far in the future this is. Wraight gets into similar territory in Carrion Throne.

Edited by bluntblade, 31 August 2019 - 07:59 AM.


#17
Theredknight

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I feel like it's meant to be unknowable. A textbook exercise in Lovecraftian mystery, which raises mostly unsettling questions. I seem to recall instances of this in Skyrim too.

And also to communicate how far in the future this is. Wraight gets into similar territory in Carrion Throne.


Yes a bit like why the 2 primarchs are ‘redacted from records’ just open to guess why. Who can know, 40’000 years I’d be surprised if we are still about anyway 😂 that or we turn into super mutants?

#18
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Well, the Missing Primarchs are a somewhat different issue, but the buried city clearly follows in the footsteps of things like The Nameless City. It's very much a cosmic horror trope, designed to cause unease (though I suppose one could make that argument for the Lost and Forgotten) because so much of the setting is unknowable.


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#19
Sandlemad

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Someone a while back did go to the trouble of georeferencing the map of the imperial palace that appeared in the Custodes codex, did a decent job: https://i.redd.it/ibl7vr1tz2531.jpg

 

You can compare to a map showing where Kathmandu is and it definitely puts more of Tibet under the palace's footprint than Nepal. Kathmandu is somewhere to the south, actually outside the bounds (and obviously underground, somehow, as with the webway entrance) of the palace. I'm sure there's ways to rationalise it post-hoc - it was a long trek underground - but it's absolutely a case of the production team not checking with/corresponding with ADB or checking against Master of Mankind; that's how GW works most of the time anyway. I can get why they went with this layout though, as a cartographic visual the sharp increase in elevation going north from Nepal is pretty compelling.

 

Who knows, might be the type of little contradiction FW addresses in a later black book. They make good work out of this sort of thing.



#20
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Does that book get into why they built the palace there? I mean, I'm betting back when they were brain storming all the background and were mixing Warhammer fantasy with dune and everything else they had watched or read, they probably were just like "well it would be too on the nose to put the Imperial Capital in Britain, and to hell with those rebel colonists, it won't be there, let's go with the hardest place to have a massive building project"
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#21
Marshal Rohr

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I don’t think theyve mentioned North America once in any of the Heresy novels or Black Books.

Your opinion is important, and someone posting here probably does care what you think. You should go tell them. Remember that it really hurts to come up with an idea you care about and have no one else care. Go care about something and tell them what you think. Now. Think of what it would have meant to you when you were young.

 

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#22
Darkwrath121

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I don’t think theyve mentioned North America once in any of the Heresy novels or Black Books.

"Neork" (New York) is mentioned as a major city in Lost and the Damned, funnily enough.
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#23
Trevak Dal

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I don’t think theyve mentioned North America once in any of the Heresy novels or Black Books.


Yeah I imagine that it goes something like "those damnable colonial rebel scum were all killed by nuclear fire" and "it's just a giant litter box, nobody lives there, nothing happens."

All the legions pull from other countries or Sol system planets. I mean, it's a British property, I get it. Though it would have been on the nose if a couple of traitor legions came from what was the US and India.

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#24
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30K is set 28,000 years from now. 28,000 years ago, humanity was only just producing the first ceramics (like the Venus of Dolní Věstonice), as far as we can tell from the archaeological record. The oldest archaeological find at Kathmandu is only 2,000 years old or so.

 

It's perfectly plausible that between now and 30K, the current city of Kathmandu could be destroyed and a second city named Kathmandu could be built elsewhere, or that Lhasa could be conquered and renamed Kathmandu due to centuries of geopolitical change, or that a Himalayan hive city named Kathmandu-Lhasa could sprawl out across the 605km of distance and 2km of elevation between the two places then shrink into a smaller city that is closer to where Lhasa was but only retained the first part of the name.

 

Or, as others have said, it's Lhasa or some other city, and they just don't have accurate records of the name anymore.


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#25
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I don’t think theyve mentioned North America once in any of the Heresy novels or Black Books.


Horus' memorialist - Petronella Vivar if memory serves - came from Merica.
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