Jump to content

Welcome to The Bolter and Chainsword
Register now to gain access to all of our features. Once registered and logged in, you will be able to create topics, post replies to existing threads, give reputation to your fellow members, get your own private messenger, post status updates, manage your profile and so much more. If you already have an account, login here - otherwise create an account for free today!
Photo

Rules preview for Iron Father Feirros

- - - - -

  • Please log in to reply
86 replies to this topic

#51
RandomMarine

RandomMarine

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 1,321 posts
  • Faction: Iron Ravens



Because in Master of Mankind, it's revealed that bionics can't properly interface with power armor and just armor-plating your bionics restricts movement and function.

MoM doesn't take place in the "modern" Cawl age, however, and it is very easy to hand wave technological upgrades to make Primaris-level armor easily integrate with bionics/cybernetics.
Which is a bit of lazy writing to be entirely honest. "Everything has gone down the drain, no one knows how or why it works, everything is antiquated and falls apart, we're doomed...well, until that guy over there came along. Now we can do absolutely everything again.". Kind of like Movie Scientists - yeah sure, that guy surely got his PhD at the age of 13, and can learn any field in a matter of hours to save the world. Asteroid impact? Give me 5 minutes, I'll fix that. Black hole? Okay, make it 10 minutes.

For bionics, MoM also introduced the psychological aspect they display for their foes - that guy was maimed and mutilated, and still got back up to fight on. Half his face blown off? Whatever. Limbs missing? Just tacked on new ones, they'll work. Are you sure you want to face such a foe?

As for a MotF not replacing everything with bionics, I guess it's rather down to two reasons:
1. It's part of the internal conflict - compulsively replacing everything and shutting down any illogical thinking vs. remaining human to a degree. Having a faceless emotionless "character" defeats the purpose of a unique, named character - we can use the generic ones for that.
2. GW needs a justification for each character to turn primaris, no matter how paper-thin. There's no way to improve the weak fleshy bits when those were dumped some centuries ago.

Considering that guy still only has few visible non-bionic parts left, it doesn't matter all too much in the end.

[...] since adult cannons, lascannons, heavy bolters, HKMs [...]

Autocorrect for the win - now we have adult cannons, not just the small ones. biggrin.png

Sound positively slanneshi to me

#52
Triszin

Triszin

    ++ INTERFECTOR ROBUSTUS ++

  • ++ MODERATI ++
  • 7,540 posts
  • Location:Cleveland, Ohio
He uhh.

Is 6power level.

He might be 110pts. Waiting for them to say it again as I can't believe it....
banana

#53
Lemondish

Lemondish

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 3,577 posts

He uhh.

Is 6power level.

He might be 110pts. Waiting for them to say it again as I can't believe it....

That's pretty good for him. I wonder if he'll carry the techmarine keyword. Probably not...

Edited by Lemondish, 13 September 2019 - 04:34 PM.


#54
Reinhard

Reinhard

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 5,171 posts

It's not a realistic number, I wouldn't get too attched to it.


  • Black Blow Fly likes this

#55
emperorpants

emperorpants

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 484 posts

Wow, if he is only around 110, that's amazing!  Dude is an auto take for sure if that is his price point.



#56
Xerxus

Xerxus

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 150 posts
He should definitely be considerably more expensive than a Captain in Gravis armour at 108 pts.

#57
Lemondish

Lemondish

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 3,577 posts

It's not a realistic number, I wouldn't get too attched to it.

Seems much more realistic now...

69958795_480797676093785_354239526230976

6 PL matches Captain in Gravis Armour.

It also has the Techmarine keyword, so that's awesome.

Edited by Lemondish, 13 September 2019 - 06:44 PM.


#58
emperorpants

emperorpants

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 484 posts

A warhammer stream seemingly confirmed that he is 110 points...that's...well...incredible to say the least.  So likely 65 points cheaper than Shrike.  


Edited by emperorpants, 13 September 2019 - 06:55 PM.


#59
9x19 Parabellum

9x19 Parabellum

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 1,477 posts

110 pts. is freaking retarded for this guy.  I realize his low movement and lack of ability to embark in anything except Repulsors means he'll be far behind rest of army, but still...


gallery_95196_13406_23821.jpg gallery_95196_14997_633.jpgsml_gallery_48988_16086_9324.pnggallery_95196_16188_21038.png


#60
ThatOneMarshal

ThatOneMarshal

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 2,238 posts
  • Location:The Golden State
  • Faction: BT, NL, BA, & IG
110 points is way too low for the buffs he gives.

I mean woah
  • Kallas likes this

Terran_zps971683eb.pngETL_2014_Banner_V2_03A_Custos_Fidei.jpg  

 

 

 

 

 

 
 


#61
emperorpants

emperorpants

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 484 posts

Honestly...this is really starting to seem a bit unfair here guys.  It really is.  I'm happy Iron Hands got really good rules, but at this point, along with the rumor that Iron Hands can turn dreads into characters that can use relics...it is just kinda depressing for other chapters.  A bit more parity would have been nice.  The sad thing is, if the nerf hammer comes down, which I don't see how it won't eventually at this point, all chapters are gonna suffer pretty hard.  Again, it's awesome that Iron hands are gonna be awesome, it's just that the power differences seem quite perplexing.  Also, it seems Iron Hands are also going to get their own version of savior protocols.  Wow.  Can someone please explain to me how I'm supposed to fight all this?


Edited by emperorpants, 13 September 2019 - 07:35 PM.


#62
ERJAK

ERJAK

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 1,227 posts

Honestly...this is really starting to seem a bit unfair here guys. It really is. I'm happy Iron Hands got really good rules, but at this point, along with the rumor that Iron Hands can turn dreads into characters that can use relics...it is just kinda depressing for other chapters. A bit more parity would have been nice. The sad thing is, if the nerf hammer comes down, which I don't see how it won't eventually at this point, all chapters are gonna suffer pretty hard. Again, it's awesome that Iron hands are gonna be awesome, it's just that the power differences seem quite perplexing. Also, it seems Iron Hands are also going to get their own version of savior protocols. Wow. Can someone please explain to me how I'm supposed to fight all this?


The relics thing depends on how the IH relic section is worded. Because vehicles can't use any C:SM relics.

#63
quasistellar

quasistellar

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 463 posts

Well realistically, with Feirros having a 5" move and the best buffs being confined do 3", it's only going to be a couple vehicles in a small area of the board that will be harder than adamantium plated ceramite.

 

Ob-sec board control and baiting out defensive stratagems will be the tools for dealing with iron hands from what I'm seeing.


  • Juggernut likes this

#64
emperorpants

emperorpants

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 484 posts

Well realistically, with Feirros having a 5" move and the best buffs being confined do 3", it's only going to be a couple vehicles in a small area of the board that will be harder than adamantium plated ceramite.

 

Ob-sec board control and baiting out defensive stratagems will be the tools for dealing with iron hands from what I'm seeing.

 

Yeah, I think you're right.  God help anyone playing kill point games against Iron Hands though.  lol.



#65
Lemondish

Lemondish

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 3,577 posts

Honestly...this is really starting to seem a bit unfair here guys. It really is. I'm happy Iron Hands got really good rules, but at this point, along with the rumor that Iron Hands can turn dreads into characters that can use relics...it is just kinda depressing for other chapters. A bit more parity would have been nice. The sad thing is, if the nerf hammer comes down, which I don't see how it won't eventually at this point, all chapters are gonna suffer pretty hard. Again, it's awesome that Iron hands are gonna be awesome, it's just that the power differences seem quite perplexing. Also, it seems Iron Hands are also going to get their own version of savior protocols. Wow. Can someone please explain to me how I'm supposed to fight all this?


I think this is far too early to say definitively.

This guy isn't exactly anything but a big buff bot after all. He's not that impressive in shooting or melee compared to units with similar points costs and his only real offensive buff is very limited. Everything else is really just defensive, but truly only against weapons above AP -3, or AP -4. The mobility these units gain from the Chapter super doctrine is also pretty limiting since this guy only has a 5" move. He'll definitely keep things alive so folks will need to strike hard and direct. You finally need a plan for how to deal with these armies, but that doesn't mean there isn't a way to win.

Iron Hands will be strong because it's the easiest plug and play marine army. That doesn't make them the best.
  • Black Blow Fly likes this

#66
Reinhard

Reinhard

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 5,171 posts

 

It's not a realistic number, I wouldn't get too attched to it.

Seems much more realistic now...69958795_480797676093785_354239526230976
6 PL matches Captain in Gravis Armour.
It also has the Techmarine keyword, so that's awesome.

Likely an oversight or something that'll be faq'd soon. Feirros doesn't 'match' a Gravis Captain, he outclasses them, so he's more akin to pl 8-9? I'd expect him to get changed, the dissonance between the pl and what he brings to the table is just too great.(It gets especially poignant if the rumored 110 point cost that's been thrown around is true. A Gravis captain is 108 points, I can't really see all the advantages Feirros has over the xenos races and either bringing human-occupied planets into compliance or destroying them if they resisted.' class='bbc ipSeoAcronym'>GC being worth just 2 points?)

So yeah, unless I'm completely overvaluing Feirros' abilities here, I would still not get used to that number....


Edited by Reinhard, 14 September 2019 - 08:32 AM.


#67
Black Blow Fly

Black Blow Fly

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 16,682 posts
  • Location:Unto realms immortal...
  • Faction: TODESKOMPANIE
Iron Hands are better and deservingly so but no way are they the best now. No disrespectful intended.
  • Juggernut likes this

=][= fortis Fortuna adiuvat . =][=

my 40k FB Page Terminus Esthttps://m.facebook.com/Terminus6Est

Blood and Honor!
ALL TEH CHAOS FANBOIZ BE LIEK SO PANDA SADFACE :D


#68
MeltaRange

MeltaRange

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 390 posts

I'll just straight up say it: as of now Iron hands seem straight up broken. lol. They are so much better then everyone else it's kinda comical. Please don't take offense guys, I'm not trying to be salty. What I don't understand is why did G-Mans aura get nerfed if they were going to hand out this kind of stuff? Honestly, Iron Hands would still be heads and shoulders above Ultras even if G-Man had his old aura. Congrats guys, I'm happy for you! It's a good time to be an Iron Hand, and honestly Iron Hands deserve to be on top for once. Just be prepared for incredible amounts of salt from people, as an Ultra player who used G-Man I know what it's like to have people salty over your rules. lol.

I definitely wouldn't say broken. Crazy strong, yes for sure. Characters fill the gaps that space marines (especially vehicles) have, ie: invulns and reducing damage. There's plenty of synergy but once you kill the characters, the whole plan falls apart. Snipers will be the bane of IH I think, as we have no way of passing off wounds etc

Just as with DE and GSC, they're very strong but have hard counters

Wait until you see the stratagem "Cogitated Martyrdom"

Edited by MeltaRange, 14 September 2019 - 02:42 AM.


#69
radionausea

radionausea

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 284 posts
  • Location:London
  • Faction: Nurgle, Ministorum

Cogitated Martyrdom is the company veterans bodyguard rule but for a command point.  It's not Saviour Protocols for a command point as it says "...that unit suffers 1 mortal wound for each of those wounds".  No converting a 6D lascannon shot into one mortal wound. 



#70
TrawlingCleaner

TrawlingCleaner

    ++ CLOACARIUS RETICULUM ++

  • ++ MODERATI ++
  • 1,443 posts
  • Location:UK

I'll just straight up say it: as of now Iron hands seem straight up broken. lol. They are so much better then everyone else it's kinda comical. Please don't take offense guys, I'm not trying to be salty. What I don't understand is why did G-Mans aura get nerfed if they were going to hand out this kind of stuff? Honestly, Iron Hands would still be heads and shoulders above Ultras even if G-Man had his old aura. Congrats guys, I'm happy for you! It's a good time to be an Iron Hand, and honestly Iron Hands deserve to be on top for once. Just be prepared for incredible amounts of salt from people, as an Ultra player who used G-Man I know what it's like to have people salty over your rules. lol.

I definitely wouldn't say broken. Crazy strong, yes for sure. Characters fill the gaps that space marines (especially vehicles) have, ie: invulns and reducing damage. There's plenty of synergy but once you kill the characters, the whole plan falls apart. Snipers will be the bane of IH I think, as we have no way of passing off wounds etc

Just as with DE and GSC, they're very strong but have hard counters
Wait until you see the stratagem "Cogitated Martyrdom"

I've seen it, and again, there's plenty of counters same with drones and any cult unit

#71
TrawlingCleaner

TrawlingCleaner

    ++ CLOACARIUS RETICULUM ++

  • ++ MODERATI ++
  • 1,443 posts
  • Location:UK
He's confirmed at 110 points from codex reviews

#72
MeltaRange

MeltaRange

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 390 posts

I'll just straight up say it: as of now Iron hands seem straight up broken. lol. They are so much better then everyone else it's kinda comical. Please don't take offense guys, I'm not trying to be salty. What I don't understand is why did G-Mans aura get nerfed if they were going to hand out this kind of stuff? Honestly, Iron Hands would still be heads and shoulders above Ultras even if G-Man had his old aura. Congrats guys, I'm happy for you! It's a good time to be an Iron Hand, and honestly Iron Hands deserve to be on top for once. Just be prepared for incredible amounts of salt from people, as an Ultra player who used G-Man I know what it's like to have people salty over your rules. lol.

I definitely wouldn't say broken. Crazy strong, yes for sure. Characters fill the gaps that space marines (especially vehicles) have, ie: invulns and reducing damage. There's plenty of synergy but once you kill the characters, the whole plan falls apart. Snipers will be the bane of IH I think, as we have no way of passing off wounds etc

Just as with DE and GSC, they're very strong but have hard counters
Wait until you see the stratagem "Cogitated Martyrdom"
I've seen it, and again, there's plenty of counters same with drones and any cult unit
Well, you specifically cited snipers as being a "bane of IH" which is a joke with the inclusion of this strat

Edited by MeltaRange, 14 September 2019 - 12:29 PM.


#73
MajorNese

MajorNese

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 2,179 posts

That strat is limited to one unit to be the meatshield. Declared at the start of the shooting phase, so you are free to snipe any other characters in the meantime.

And since multidamage is turned into individual MWs, there is no overkill - a single Eliminator shot can kill up to 4 single-wound models. Shouldn't be too hard to remove that one unit.

 

Yes, IH are clearly strong, but it boils down to a very straight-forward approach. There are ways to get around it, but trying to counter it with the same approach probably won't work.


  • TrawlingCleaner likes this

gallery_6494_6331_8260.pnghhoth_majornesehts27qojyj.jpggallery_48988_11572_4164.pnggallery_48988_11572_12518.pnggallery_48988_15465_8459.pnggallery_48988_15465_5251.pnggallery_48988_6285_13120.pnglockdownpaintingchallwgjra.png


#74
MeltaRange

MeltaRange

    +FRATER DOMUS+

  • + FRATER DOMUS +
  • 390 posts

That strat is limited to one unit to be the meatshield. Declared at the start of the shooting phase, so you are free to snipe any other characters in the meantime.
And since multidamage is turned into individual MWs, there is no overkill - a single Eliminator shot can kill up to 4 single-wound models. Shouldn't be too hard to remove that one unit.

Yes, IH are clearly strong, but it boils down to a very straight-forward approach. There are ways to get around it, but trying to counter it with the same approach probably won't work.


I guess if you're playing your first game ever and just blindly put all your characters in range/los of snipers, and don't hide or put any in transports...

Single wound models? I guess but I mean 10 intercessors around your Iron Father with this strat is the BEST anti sniper ability in the game so yeah saying their "bane" is snipers is silly. They are arguably the best equipped to deal with snipers of any army in the entire game.

#75
TrawlingCleaner

TrawlingCleaner

    ++ CLOACARIUS RETICULUM ++

  • ++ MODERATI ++
  • 1,443 posts
  • Location:UK

 

That strat is limited to one unit to be the meatshield. Declared at the start of the shooting phase, so you are free to snipe any other characters in the meantime.
And since multidamage is turned into individual MWs, there is no overkill - a single Eliminator shot can kill up to 4 single-wound models. Shouldn't be too hard to remove that one unit.

Yes, IH are clearly strong, but it boils down to a very straight-forward approach. There are ways to get around it, but trying to counter it with the same approach probably won't work.


I guess if you're playing your first game ever and just blindly put all your characters in range/los of snipers, and don't hide or put any in transports...

Single wound models? I guess but I mean 10 intercessors around your Iron Father with this strat is the BEST anti sniper ability in the game so yeah saying their "bane" is snipers is silly. They are arguably the best equipped to deal with snipers of any army in the entire game.

 

Poor a decent amount of fire power into a 10 man intercessor squad, IH or not, they will go down. As Nese said this has to be used at the start of shooting, you can either bait out this strat or kill the intercessor squad 






0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users