Eliminators

[Archon_77]

Or in this case a Las Fusil for some extra AT... he doesn't use it if he's guiding aim, but its an OPTION if he needs it

[MajorNese]

That's up to you. Paying 12p for the possible option of one shot las seems excessive, but that's your decision.

 

And IBC could be an option, but in that case the sarge would have to die first - with a single casualty, Guided Aim, becomes worse than unguided and twice the shots. If the sarge were not to die first, you'd have a unit that can't do either job properly.

[ValourousHeart]

So it sounds like you either want to either match the the sarg with the unit or have the sarg take the IBC.

[MajorNese]

My squads are entirely bolt sniper. From turn 2 on, Guided Aim becomes entirely redundant when targeting characters. And when that happens, I want that additional shot for the rest of the game - hitting and wounding the usual T4 stuff on 2+ is good enough.

 

If I ever do las-fusil dudes, the sarge maybe gets the IBC, I'll see that when it happens. But for regular snipers, nope, not worth giving up that much more powerful shot.

[duz_]

My current list is 2 squads 1 of each all the same weapon...

I haven't tested it yet but this edition has taught me volume of fire is king

 

If that doesn't work I'll use my Mor Deythan as sgts with the special carbine B)

Edited September 25, 2019 by duz_

[Claws and Effect]

For the sniper bolt rifles, it might be beneficial to spend a CP to give the Sgt Korvidari bolts and take the carbine.

 

Still gives him solid shooting, especially during the Tactical Doctrine, and gives you charge protection by letting the squad move.

[Bluflash]

While I hope the FAQ will clear things up with the WL Trait, even at D3 taking Korvidari Bolts on a Phobos Cap is a stellar option as well.

 

I'm on team 3x Bolt Sniper Rifle if you're playing RG or RG successor though. Other armies may find value in using the carbine for counter-charge, but with our deployment toolkit our snipers should stay pretty well isolated, and taking the las-fusils feels like wasting Surgical Strikes on one of the best units for it. Taking one unit of fusils can create a "sniper-free" pocket for the enemy to maneuver in.

Edited September 25, 2019 by Bluflash

[SkimaskMohawk]

My current list is 2 squads 1 of each all the same weapon...

I haven't tested it yet but this edition has taught me volume of fire is king

 

If that doesn't work I'll use my Mor Deythan as sgts with the special carbine B)

Honestly I was wondering if mor deythan could be counts as'd effectively. Probably not, as they're a lot smaller in terms of los

[duz_]

Slightly smaller but the impact is both ways

I doubt most people would complain its fairly fluffy for the RG

Just need to put them on 40mm bases

[seriade]

 

My current list is 2 squads 1 of each all the same weapon...

I haven't tested it yet but this edition has taught me volume of fire is king

 

If that doesn't work I'll use my Mor Deythan as sgts with the special carbine

Honestly I was wondering if mor deythan could be counts as'd effectively. Probably not, as they're a lot smaller in terms of los

 

Use them as sternguard honstly.

[9x19 Parabellum]

So I didn't spend much time theory-hammering until I got the codex for myself (I like to have the fine print right in front of me and go through it methodically).

 

And, that didn't happen until today because I ordered the Collector's Edition and it got delayed because of whether or some such nonsense.

 

Soo....I'm looking through Surgical Strikes as I didn't really understand someone's post from above.  Am I to understand this right?

 

Surgical Strikes doesn't ONLY affect Rapid fire and assault weapons (despite being triggered by Tactical Doctrine).  It applies to every weapon that is on a model "with this ability" (ie, all members of the chapter with appropriate keyword, not servitors or soupers).

 

Is that correct?

[Nusquam]

So I didn't spend much time theory-hammering until I got the codex for myself (I like to have the fine print right in front of me and go through it methodically).

 

And, that didn't happen until today because I ordered the Collector's Edition and it got delayed because of whether or some such nonsense.

 

Soo....I'm looking through Surgical Strikes as I didn't really understand someone's post from above.  Am I to understand this right?

 

Surgical Strikes doesn't ONLY affect Rapid fire and assault weapons (despite being triggered by Tactical Doctrine).  It applies to every weapon that is on a model "with this ability" (ie, all members of the chapter with appropriate keyword, not servitors or soupers).

 

Is that correct?

 

Correct

 

Im also team triple bolt, but I play Raptors with Fusillade and Artisans so three shots usually hit and wound. Ill save points if I use Guided Aim to fish for Mortals on characters with good invuls.

[duz_]

Correct it merely activates in the facial Doctrine irrespective of weapon type

[Bluflash]

Yup, all models, all weapons, in all phases as long as they can legally target the character.

[Dracos]

Still not sure why this isn’t triggered in the Devestator Doctrine? Other than it encourages using other units than Eliminators. After looking at the Iron Hands (bless you GW keep those crying eyes off the Raven Guard) Codex it cant because it’s OP. Personally I like living in the Tactical Doctrine. It makes my Aggressors even deadlier. :)

 

With my decision today to make a major hobby decision I’ll be building at least two units with Sniper Rifles.

[SkimaskMohawk]

Probably because they associate "tactical" with commandos and assassination and all that cool stuff instead of "devestator"; the latter draws the imagery of unrelenting fire power. Which isn't very assassiny.

 

Sniper weapons unfortunately fall between the gaps, but I can see them trying to avoid a scenario where your 13 point model hits on 2s, wounds those knight characters on 5s and generates mortal wounds off those at -1AP on turn 1. A 10 squad of sniper scouts can already reliably kill most characters turn 2, turn 1 might have been deemed too anti-fun during playtests. Characters tend to have more emotional attachment than other units after all.

[ShinyRhino]

Still not sure why this isn’t triggered in the Devestator Doctrine? Other than it encourages using other units than Eliminators. After looking at the Iron Hands (bless you GW keep those crying eyes off the Raven Guard) Codex it cant because it’s OP. Personally I like living in the Tactical Doctrine. It makes my Aggressors even deadlier. :)

 

With my decision today to make a major hobby decision I’ll be building at least two units with Sniper Rifles.

My guess is because the majority of armaments for Phobos units benefit from the Tactical Doctrine, and GW seems to have designed RG to be the penultimate Phobos wearing Chapter. So we advance to the Tactical Doctrine and stay there, so our Super Tactic had to match it.

[duz_]

Let's try and keep on the topic of Elimators

 

Plenty other tactics topics going at the moment

[Dracos]

I hate myself and set myself back who knows how long today. Traded in my 15 painted Hellblasters for store value ....

 

Decided to push my DIY as far into Phobos as possible. I think ShinyRhino and SkimaskMohawk are both right about the “No Fun” and Phobos-centric focus GW is pushing Raven Guard with. Still keeping my 2 Xiphons, 10 Aggressors and 20 Intercessors though :)

 

 

So I’m using the trade value of that (and a couple Knights) to go all in on Eliminators. I’ll be running them all Sniper Rifles all the time. I’m trying to decide if I want to keep as a pure counts as Raven Guard or go Successor. Deciding if Master Artisan is worth giving up the benefits of not. Makes all the difference in what HQs I need and how I use them I think.

[MajorNese]

 

I’m trying to decide if I want to keep as a pure counts as Raven Guard or go Successor. Deciding if Master Artisan is worth giving up the benefits of not. Makes all the difference in what HQs I need and how I use them I think.

Same here.

Though the main difference is paying an additional CP to get RG's Ex Tenebris, and not being able to use Shrike but Issodon. But I'd prefer settling for one and not switching all the time.

[Dracos]

Do you mean the real Issodon or the counts as we can build using the Warlord Traits and Relics?

 

I hope Forge World starts Primaris-ing some characters .... like Lias :)

[MajorNese]

Real Issodon.

 

There's been a lengthy discussion about why one would ever choose Inheritors successor tactics instead of just going "This is RG with a different paint scheme", since there is no official rule about such paint schemes. Inheritors has no upside, but you can't use Shrike and have to pay CP for Ravenspire relics as a downside.

 

Well, using FW chars is the only reason one might ever use Inheritors - Issodon has the Raptors keyword, so there is no way it can be Raven Guard at the same time, only a successor (with or without Inheritors). And when it has to be successor anyway, I could trade the Inheritors trait (cover, -1 to hit in terrain) for Stealthy (cover) and something else, like Master Artisans (which should be stellar with MSU like Eliminators).

 

But yes, I hope they update some of the FW chars - Issodon is damn expensive now compared to the revamped chars, and his abilities (like oldmarine "pre-maris" Shrike) don't work with primaris. But since they stopped handing out rules for something without models, and FW doesn't do primaris, I don't expect that to happen any time soon.

[Malakithe]

So...take the Instigator or not? lol

[Nusquam]

I would say only if your meta has a lot of pregame moves or shunts like BAs. Issue there is that deployed too far up things can jump over them and charge behind them. Though you can also move towards the unit if you're so inclined to reduce the distance they would gain by charging as well. Then they only kill an eliminators unit and are stuck farther out.

 

Otherwise it might be best saving points and playing infiltrators for zoning.

[Claws and Effect]

So...take the Instigator or not? lol

I'm taking it on one squad and giving the Sgt Korvidari bolts. It makes it so his shooting can keep up with the other guys, and you get the move after overwatch ability.

 

I'm going to deploy that squad far forward and use them as bait.