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Dealing with Aggressors?

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#1
BlueBiscuit Raider

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Aggressors have become a staple in my local meta, I can't fight a Marine army (except the Blood Angels) without fighting at least a unit of six, often 2 units, and they always do lots of incredible amounts of damage through volume of fire, and I've problems removing them since they became 3W a model.

What's the best way to deal with them as DG?



#2
Aothaine

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I would use over-whelming firepower. Did DG get access to the new Havocs? If so, you could use the chaincannons to mow them down. Something else that works really well are any of the daemon engines. Helbrutes and other vehicles designed for close combat will work really good against them. A squad of Myphitic Blight-Haulers could do some seriously good work into them. 

 

DG terminators could work really well too. 

 

Look for units that are almost immune to small-arms fire when you want to deal with them.


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#3
The Unseen

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I will admit that I'm mostly unfamiliar with the new DG codex, but what you need is stuff that does a flat 3 damage, 2 damage in a pinch. Quad Mortar Rapiers are a good example, but unclear whether DG get them or just generic CSM do. But small arms fire they are very durable against. Also, surprised that no Blood Angel player is using them tbh. We have a relic that gives an ancient a 5+++ FNP equivalent bubble, which you can stack with a company ancient for the 4+ chance to shoot again when you die. It makes a very scary brick. Anyway...

 

More generally, you want things that either ignore their overwatch, or functionally do by being T8, or T5+ with a good save. T4 stuff, even with a half decent save, just get shredded thanks to the # of shots, even on just overwatch.

Any dreadnought variant that makes it into combat with them is likely to turn them to paste, since you'll wound them on 2s thanks to your Str12, they'll only have a 6+ save, and each failed save is a dead guy.

If your trying to weather the fire, make sure your necrotic butt is in cover. They don't like dealing with 2+ saves. In fact, I'm suprised your Plague Marines are dying much to them. T5, 2+ save in cover, and a 5+++ means that they *should* be a nightmare to remove with Str4 no ap fire, even with as much as aggressors put out.


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#4
BlueBiscuit Raider

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I would use over-whelming firepower. Did DG get access to the new Havocs? If so, you could use the chaincannons to mow them down. Something else that works really well are any of the daemon engines. Helbrutes and other vehicles designed for close combat will work really good against them. A squad of Myphitic Blight-Haulers could do some seriously good work into them. 

 

DG terminators could work really well too. 

 

Look for units that are almost immune to small-arms fire when you want to deal with them.

No, we still don't have Havocs unfortunately

I've tried charging them with hellbrutes and even hellforged contemptors, but usually I only kill 2-3 and with their powerfirst and the extra attacks they punch dreads into oblivion, especially the hellbrutes since it doesn't have an invuln. A whole squad of Blight haulers is too unreliable I found, even with the +1 to hit (which I still think I'm paying too much for)

 

Terminators again are way to swingy, everything but the flail wounds them on 4+ at best, even with an archcontaminator warlord nearby they often survive to hit back.

 

I will admit that I'm mostly unfamiliar with the new DG codex, but what you need is stuff that does a flat 3 damage, 2 damage in a pinch. Quad Mortar Rapiers are a good example, but unclear whether DG get them or just generic CSM do. But small arms fire they are very durable against. Also, surprised that no Blood Angel player is using them tbh. We have a relic that gives an ancient a 5+++ FNP equivalent bubble, which you can stack with a company ancient for the 4+ chance to shoot again when you die. It makes a very scary brick. Anyway...

 

More generally, you want things that either ignore their overwatch, or functionally do by being T8, or T5+ with a good save. T4 stuff, even with a half decent save, just get shredded thanks to the # of shots, even on just overwatch.

Any dreadnought variant that makes it into combat with them is likely to turn them to paste, since you'll wound them on 2s thanks to your Str12, they'll only have a 6+ save, and each failed save is a dead guy.

If your trying to weather the fire, make sure your necrotic butt is in cover. They don't like dealing with 2+ saves. In fact, I'm suprised your Plague Marines are dying much to them. T5, 2+ save in cover, and a 5+++ means that they *should* be a nightmare to remove with Str4 no ap fire, even with as much as aggressors put out.

My local BA players likes playing mostly fluffy, he uses the banner most of the times on a unit of Sanguinary Guard, conga-lining back to him as needed.

 

Even when in cover my Plague Marines tend to get shot to uselessness, and as said before even when my hellbrute makes it in he's either punched to death by survivors or sometimes by some smash character that heroically intervened because the Aggressors were castling around him for re-rolls.

 

My problem is exactly that I don't feel like like I have any really efficient option to kill 3W models: most of my weapons are either 2 damage or d3 damage.

 

Edit: The Foul Blightspawn sometimes does work, but again I roll high Str on his flamer as often as not, and my opponents have long learned to keep way from him.


Edited by BlueBiscuit Raider, 04 October 2019 - 02:13 AM.


#5
Putrid Choir

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Wait for the codex cycle to get to the Death Guard because until then it's almost pointless haha.

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Edited by Putrid Choir, 04 October 2019 - 05:43 AM.


#6
Putrid Choir

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But until then, pure Death Guard doesn't have much of an answer. Not alot of 3 damage weapons at our disposal.

But to echo The unseen, 6 aggressors with boltstorms is 198pts and with no reroll hits and not moving the previous turn, that's 72 shots but when you do the math against plague marines in cover that's only 1.75 wounds, double it to 3.5 if your not in cover. Keep them plague marines in cover and to 4str 0ap 1D shots that halves the wounds you take.

#7
Squike

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I have found them tricky to remove, autocannon havocs have worked best for me but as said above DG don't have access. don't forget also from turn 2 they are likely to be AP-1 due to tactical doctrine. and as said there fists can be pretty scary, I had a Khorne DP charge them and even with the Demonic Axe I only managed to kill 1 of them, (granted wasn't the best rolling but it should have been adequate, and he did well on his saves), the remaining two then managed to kill the DP outright with no hassle.



#8
Closet Skeleton

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My local BA players likes playing mostly fluffy, he uses the banner most of the times on a unit of Sanguinary Guard, conga-lining back to him as needed.

 

 

Standard of Sacrifice is models within 6" so you can't gain the benefit if you stretch your units out.



#9
BlueBiscuit Raider

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I have found them tricky to remove, autocannon havocs have worked best for me but as said above DG don't have access. don't forget also from turn 2 they are likely to be AP-1 due to tactical doctrine. and as said there fists can be pretty scary, I had a Khorne DP charge them and even with the Demonic Axe I only managed to kill 1 of them, (granted wasn't the best rolling but it should have been adequate, and he did well on his saves), the remaining two then managed to kill the DP outright with no hassle.

This has been by most common experience when dealing with them. My shooting kills at most 2, then I charge kill 1 or 2 again but the survivors punch my unit to death.

 

But until then, pure Death Guard doesn't have much of an answer. Not alot of 3 damage weapons at our disposal.

But to echo The unseen, 6 aggressors with boltstorms is 198pts and with no reroll hits and not moving the previous turn, that's 72 shots but when you do the math against plague marines in cover that's only 1.75 wounds, double it to 3.5 if your not in cover. Keep them plague marines in cover and to 4str 0ap 1D shots that halves the wounds you take.

Even when in cover, which I always try to give them, the sheer number of shots have always killed at least 3 PMs in my games. There's also that 18'' is both my optimal firing range for me rapid firing plasma as well as that of their weapons, meaning that often enough the mission we're playing forces me to be the one to move to get to an objective or whatnot, meaning they get to stay put and fire twice.

 

 

 

My local BA players likes playing mostly fluffy, he uses the banner most of the times on a unit of Sanguinary Guard, conga-lining back to him as needed.

 

 

Standard of Sacrifice is models within 6" so you can't gain the benefit if you stretch your units out.

 

Didn't know that, I've never looked at their Codex, I guess me and my friend will talk next time we play each other.

 

Honestly, pretty much the only thing I haven't tried yet is FW units beyond the Contemptor and actually taking Predators with autocannons and nothing else just to kill them.



#10
BlueBiscuit Raider

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My local BA players likes playing mostly fluffy, he uses the banner most of the times on a unit of Sanguinary Guard, conga-lining back to him as needed.

 

 

Standard of Sacrifice is models within 6" so you can't gain the benefit if you stretch your units out.

 

Actually now that I think about can't you simply always allocate the wounds to the models that are within the range of the banner, even if the whole unit isn't?



#11
Squike

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My local BA players likes playing mostly fluffy, he uses the banner most of the times on a unit of Sanguinary Guard, conga-lining back to him as needed.

 

 

Standard of Sacrifice is models within 6" so you can't gain the benefit if you stretch your units out.

 

Actually now that I think about can't you simply always allocate the wounds to the models that are within the range of the banner, even if the whole unit isn't?

 

yes as the player who's models died gets to pick which models from the squad died, you can just pick the models that are within the 6" to die and fist instantly



#12
helterskelter

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Flesh mower for me, again when they work, but it's 9 attacks, -2 d2, I've been averaging getting 6 dice to wound, so when they bite you're ripping chunks out.
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#13
Bloody Legionnaire

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What about autocannon predators? All shots are damage 3
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#14
BlueBiscuit Raider

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I haven't tried them yet purely because I've always felt that you go all in and get 2 or 3 Preds or they are gonna get bracketed turn 1. I've seen it happen. They are so much more fragile compared to most other DG daemon engines.

Still it's maybe worth a try so I'll give it a go sometime in the future and see how it goes.


Edited by BlueBiscuit Raider, 07 October 2019 - 12:10 AM.


#15
Cleon

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Not a pure Death guard option, but have you considered a second detachment with War Dogs with the Autocannons from Chaos Knights?


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#16
Bloody Legionnaire

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You may have trouble getting them in range, but a foul blightspawn or two could jack some aggressors up...

#17
BlueBiscuit Raider

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I do usually run a blightspawn, but my most frequent opponents have long learned to keep their important stuff away from him.



#18
Wolf Lord Loki

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Could this be a area where something like a defiler or plague hulk could be useful?

Possibly a land raider delivering blightlords? (as part of a mechanised assault perhaps, regular marines bringing flails for an overwhelming charge?)
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