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Need help for 1500p Ravenwing list


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#1
Knaster

Knaster

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Hi everyone

So I've been following for the better part of a year now. Thank you for a great forum!

 

Im in a kind of urgent need for help here. A couple of friends dragged me into this tournament: 1500 points, max 3 detachments and Eternal/Maelstrom missions. As a beginner player I'm trying to run a pure DA list(!). Liking mobility, I've got mostly Ravenwing. I'm having serious doubts now only a few days before the list deadline and would like you opinions.

 

The Inceptors and the Lieutenant are put in reserve. The scouts sit on objectives with the Missile launcher and Heavy bolter as an option for dealing mortal wounds via their strats. What usually happens is the Dark talon and Darkshroud get shot down turn 1 or 2, all the while I charge forward with the bikers. I should probably play more conservatively, holding objectives and waiting in the back.

I seem to lack heavy firepower as well..

 

Thinking about swapping the Lt for a Whirlwind, the auto hit strat could be beneficial with the two land speeders. Also would like to bring a dreadnaught in (Contemtor mortis dread would mean a lot of heavy shooting)

Also I think the Inceptors arn't worth their cost as they don't seem to live after deepstriking.

I've also got 6 Rw Black knights I want to use, but don't seem to get in the list in a viable way.

 

All input is greatly appreciated!

Now here's the damn list finally smile.png

 

 
++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Imperium - Dark Angels) [25 PL, 419pts, 8CP] ++
+ HQ +
Librarian [8 PL, 122pts]: Force sword, Jump Pack, Storm bolter
Lieutenant [5 PL, 90pts]: Jump Pack, Master-crafted boltgun, Power fist
 
+ Troops [12 PL, 207pts] +
 
Scout Squad [4 PL, 83 pts] 4x Sniper rifle. 1 x Missile launcher
Scout Squad [4 PL, 57pts] 4 x Boltgun. 1 x Storm bolter
Scout Squad [4 PL, 67pts] 3 x Boltgun, 1 x Storm bolter, 1 x Heavy bolter
 
++ Outrider Detachment +1CP (Imperium - Dark Angels) [54 PL, 1,081pts, ] ++
Detachment CP [1CP]
Specialist Detachment: Ravenwing Attack Squadron [-1CP]
 
+ HQ [20 PL, 404pts] +
Ravenwing Talonmaster: 3. Brilliant Strategist, Warlord, Heavenfall Blade
Sammael in Sableclaw
 
+ Fast Attack [26 PL, 477pts] +
Inceptor Squad [10 PL, 177pts]: 3 x Plasma exterminators
Ravenwing Bike Squad [9 PL, 162pts] Chainsword x 5, Plasma gun x 2, 1 x Storm bolter
Ravenwing Darkshroud [7 PL, 138pts]: Heavy bolter [10pts]
 
+ Flyer [8 PL, 200pts] +
 
Ravenwing Dark Talon [8 PL, 200pts]
 
++ Total: [79 PL, 1,500pts, 8CP] ++


#2
Knaster

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So I think the list is too hard for me and decided to go with either an Azrael/Hellblaster castle or a more more vehicle oriented version of the list above.

A Repulsor, Whirlwind and a Smash captain instead of Sammy/Talonmaster.

 

Being the rookie I am, I believe a gun line is easier played. I find it hard to just remember the rules and available stratagems... But a few bikers to hide and keep for later turns seems a fun move.

 

So for what it's worth - and a better list for me I hope:

 
++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Imperium - Dark Angels) [52 PL, 871pts, 8CP] ++
 
+ No Force Org Slot [8CP] +
 
Battle-forged CP [3CP]
 
Detachment CP [5CP]
 
+ HQ [13 PL, 197pts] +
 
Librarian [8 PL, 122pts]: Force sword [8pts], Jump Pack [1 PL, 24pts], Storm bolter [2pts]
 
Primaris Lieutenants [5 PL, 75pts]
. Primaris Lieutenant [5 PL, 75pts]: 3. Brilliant Strategist, Bolt pistol, Master-crafted stalker bolt rifle [5pts], Warlord
. . Shroud of Heroes
 
+ Troops [18 PL, 290pts] +
 
Intercessor Squad [5 PL, 85pts]: Auxiliary Grenade Launcher, 4x Intercessor [68pts], Intercessor Sergeant [17pts]
. Stalker Bolt Rifles
 
Intercessor Squad [5 PL, 85pts]: Auxiliary Grenade Launcher, 4x Intercessor [68pts], Intercessor Sergeant [17pts]
. Bolt rifles
 
Scout Squad [4 PL, 65pts]
. 4x Scout (Sniper rifle) [52pts]: 4x Sniper rifle [8pts]
. Scout Sergeant [13pts]: Bolt pistol, Sniper rifle [2pts]
 
Scout Squad [4 PL, 55pts]
. 4x Scout (Boltgun) [44pts]
. Scout Sergeant [11pts]: Bolt pistol, Boltgun
 
+ Heavy Support [5 PL, 85pts] +
 
Whirlwind [5 PL, 85pts]: Whirlwind castellan launcher [15pts]
 
+ Dedicated Transport [16 PL, 299pts] +
 
Repulsor [16 PL, 299pts]: Fragstorm Grenade Launcher [4pts], Heavy Onslaught Gatling Cannon [30pts], 2x Krakstorm Grenade Launcher [8pts], Onslaught Gatling Cannon [16pts], Twin lascannon [40pts]
. Fragstorm Grenade Launchers [8pts]: 2x Fragstorm Grenade Launcher [8pts]
. Fragstorm Grenade Launchers [8pts]: 2x Fragstorm Grenade Launcher [8pts]
 
++ Outrider Detachment +1CP (Imperium - Dark Angels) [31 PL, 626pts, ] ++
 
+ No Force Org Slot [] +
 
Detachment CP [1CP]
 
Stratagem: Relics of the Rock [-1CP]: Relics of the Rock [-1CP]
 
+ HQ [6 PL, 124pts] +
 
Master [6 PL, 124pts]: Jump Pack [1 PL, 19pts], Storm shield [10pts], Thunder hammer [21pts]
. The Eye of the Unseen
 
+ Fast Attack [17 PL, 302pts] +
 
Ravenwing Bike Squad [5 PL, 82pts]
. Ravenwing Biker [34pts]: Chainsword, Plasma gun [11pts]
. . Space Marine bike [2pts]: Twin boltgun [2pts]
. Ravenwing Biker [23pts]: Chainsword
. . Space Marine bike [2pts]: Twin boltgun [2pts]
. Ravenwing Sergeant [25pts]: Storm bolter [2pts]
. . Space Marine bike [2pts]: Twin boltgun [2pts]
 
Ravenwing Bike Squad [5 PL, 82pts]
. Ravenwing Biker [34pts]: Chainsword, Plasma gun [11pts]
. . Space Marine bike [2pts]: Twin boltgun [2pts]
. Ravenwing Biker [23pts]: Chainsword
. . Space Marine bike [2pts]: Twin boltgun [2pts]
. Ravenwing Sergeant [25pts]: Storm bolter [2pts]
. . Space Marine bike [2pts]: Twin boltgun [2pts]
 
Ravenwing Darkshroud [7 PL, 138pts]: Heavy bolter [10pts]
 
+ Flyer [8 PL, 200pts] +
 
Ravenwing Dark Talon [8 PL, 200pts]: 2x Hurricane bolter [20pts]
 
++ Total: [83 PL, 1,497pts, 8CP] ++


#3
Grand Master Raziel

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List #1 is fairly solid. The problems you're having with the Dark Talon and Dark Shroud are fairly understandable. The Dark Talon can do a lot of damage, but it's pricey, it has to be up your opponent's nose to work effectively, and it's a valuable target for ITC secondary missions. That's also true to some extent of the Dark Shroud, plus your opponent has to chew through it to deny your other units its protection. You can try and and keep it hidden as much as possible and still have it do its job. Also always remember to advance with it. You're not losing much firepower, and you're giving it a 4++ against shooting attacks.

I dropped the Dark Talon out of my list in favor of another squad of Ravenwing Bikes. A 5-man squad of RW Bikes with 2 plasma guns and a combi-plasma is the workhorse unit in my lists. My current 2K list has 3 of them in it. Their bike bolters chew through infantry like a treat, and they have just enough plasma guns to be worth using WotDA on, should my RW Knights have already been taken off the table.

For heavy weapons, my go to unit is a squadron of 3 Land Speeders with Typhoon Missile Launchers. They have enough reach to keep then out of range of a lot of return firepower, and if kept close to Sammael can hit targets well enough, particularly if you can have something else put a wound on your target and pop a Signal The Attack.

I'd argue the Lieutenant is not a good use of points. The Talonmaster has the same aura and is much more useful. You could drop the Lieutenant and shift Sammael to be the other compulsory HQ in your battalion. That takes him out of the Ravenwing Attack Squadron, but he doesn't need to be in it that badly, and it doesn't affect his aura. Also, if you're going to spend that many points on a Librarian, you might as well field Ezekial. He can keep up with the rest of the force by advancing every turn, and that won't affect his utility much at all because he can still cast spells after advancing, whereas for guns all he has is a pistol, so you're not losing out much on firepower.

I also advise replacing at least 1 unit of Scouts with a unit of Intercessors. Sometimes you have to have a unit sit on an objective in the open, and when that happens you're a lot better off with the extra wounds and better armor save.


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#4
Knaster

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Thanks for the reply Raziel!

I ended up using the second list with a minor change (the Primaris Lt to a normal one and 3 more bolter scouts in 1 unit). The smash captain got to be the warlord and I only used 1 relic so a total of 9 CP. Dropped the Ravenwing attack squadron which I think was a mistake.

 

However, I won 3 out of 5 games (I've played a total of less than 15 games of 40k in my lifetime) so I'm very happy. Perhaps a bit lucky at times, but still a lot better than expected.

Lost 1-19 against a Renegade Knights list and 1-19 against Space wolves (a huge unit of bikers w storm shields and thunder hammers(wish we could do that!) backed by 3 nasty smaller knights (the imperium version of War dogs).

The 3 wins were: 11-9 against Salamanders and 12-8 against Khorne Chaos Space marines. And finally 19-1 where I tabled a fluffy Slaanesh female demon list. 

 

The scouts seemed to do nothing but get wiped round 1, so an Intercessor unit would ge a lot more durable. All in all very happy and been thinking about nothing else but 40k since last weekend.

 

I'm really looking forward into using 3 land speeders and a more Ravenwing focued list. I still think Sammy+Talonmaster needs a lot more tactical skills that I have at the moment.

But I just love the game right now! :)



#5
Grand Master Raziel

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Congrats on the wins! Playing Dark Angels is 40K on hard mode at the moment, so any time you can go to an event and walk away with a +50% win rate is a good day.

Yeah exposed Scouts are a juicy target, especially if you have them sitting on an objective and you're playing ITC missions, because they're a good target for opponents to score the Kill One base objective. They have some value as a cheap expendable screen or as a unit to sit on an objective that is not exposed. I like using a cheap squad of Scouts for the Engineers secondary as well. Give them sniper rifles, and they have a bit more standoff range and you can plink off an occasional mortal wound, and that's not bad either.

We don't have the best Smash Captains, but it's hard to go too far wrong with one too. But Sammy and Talonmasters are a treat because they pack a lot of firepower and are shielded from return fire because they're characters. Having the Fly keyword is handy as well, and they don't suck in assault. Talonmasters unfortunately don't have an invulnerable save, but choose your charge targets well and they can do some damage, expecially if you upgrade their power sword to the Heavenfall Blade or Monster Slayer of Caliban. I prefer the Heavenfall Blade because it's bonus is good against everything, but when I run two Talonmasters, you can bet the second is getting that Monster Slayer.


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