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+Blazing Sons+ Rise once more......probably?

Blazing Sons Revival DIY notthischapteragain.jpeg

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#1
Grey Hunter Ydalir

Grey Hunter Ydalir

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Greetings Liber.

 

 

I'm back once again, like another round of the dreaded pox.

 

In any case I've just decided to write out my notes for my latest work on the Blazing Sons. It's nothing decidedly new or ground breaking but it's yet another start, hopefully this time with a proper finish.

 

Let's see what you lot think.

 

 

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

 

 

Blazing Sons.

 

 

Basic Core Traits:-

Spoiler

 

 

Cultural Influences:-

Spoiler

 

 

Home-world.
 
The Blazing Sons call the world of Jardenfel, home. A cold, world on the Eastern Fringe. Jardenfel is a relatively sparse, rocky world. Jagged hills and sheer cliffs dominate the landscape while small cities dot the landscape of the largest continent. The world was originally colonized during Humanity's golden age, chosen for it's location away from the galactic trade routes and a lack of extensive natural resources made it a prime location for a set of gene-labs not unlike the Emperors own facilities on Terra. Extreme experimentation on local and imported fauna was undertaken for reasons now lost to time. When Humanity's fall came, Jardenfel's labs were overrun and it's experiments escaped into the wild, adding to the chaos. Only desperate holding actions by the worlds last defenders prevented total genocide.
 
With the Fall came silence. Cut off from the rest of humanity the world gradually contracted, both culturally and technologically. Farming land and herding grounds became war-worthy among the scattered bands of survivors. Only the few standing cities could build or produce anything of note. So power consolidated with the ruling clans of the cities and few independents who produced food in return for basics such as woven fabrics and stone bricks.
 
Technology has not disappeared completely on Jardenfel, but has been severely stunted as the millennia passed. Electricity mostly gave way to torches and wood-fires. Conduits and panels were covered with stone brick and timber as their uses faded. As it stands, while the world holds a feudal level culture and general technology level, some more modern pieces are not unknown. Household artisans can still make what would be common items in the wider Imperium, yet are considered almost priceless and heirloom items.
 
The ancient experiments also flourished and quickly came into conflict with the survivors. As time passed, the new predatory wildlife quickly threatened all they came into conflict with. Eventually it became tradition for once every decade for a great hunt to be undertaken to cull the worst of the beasts. The tribes and clans would lay down their arms against each other and pursue the beasts that threaten their homes, while the youths of the world are expected to defend their homes while the warriors are gone.
 
Jardenfel is a world caught paralyzed between three eras. The Golden Age and it's Fall, the evidence of which still towering and crumbling across the world's landscape, indelibly marked in the culture of the survivors of that apocalypse. The millennia that passed as the world teetered on a knife edge for human survival and the loss of knowledge or drycræft, as it's now referred to in the histories. Finally, the coming of the Blazing Sons that has shaped the world and their understanding of the galaxy around them, with the Cecatrix Maledictum now staining their once cold, clear skies.

 

 

Home-world Traits:- 

Spoiler

 

 

Recruitment.

 

New initiates for the Chapter are inducted annually from their home-world during what is now known as the Wild Hunt. Previously known as the Cull, the worlds beasts and brigands are hunted down by the world's warriors. Now it is a time when the Blazing Sons themselves cross the sky in search of noble souls to join them. The settlements are vulnerable and the youth are left to fend off the myriad terrors. As the first snows of the season fall, the beasts retreat to their lairs and the warriors embark upon their journey. The youth tend the guard posts and contend with roaming beast pariahs and bandits looking to capitalize on the warriors absence. Children of Jardenfel are taught to fight as soon as they can walk, survival being bought through strength of arms above all else on the cold world.

 

The Chapters Reclusiam monitors these times closely, their passing often being remarked upon by the people as Wuotanes Her, or Wilde Jagd, Odin's Army or Wild Hunt respectively. 10th company warriors and Húskarl keep their eyes on the worlds young warriors, hovering at the edge of battle and struggle, watching those who struggle and fight the most valiantly against death. Those who choose to fight on, choosing death before dishonour. At the moment of their "first death", these tragic few are taken, in somber procession, to the fortress monastery. In truth, these boys are attended at the moment they lose consciousness, and given enough care to keep them alive, if just barely, to return them to the fortress.

 

The oath of Jardenfel's first Son.
Deað he þær byrigde; hwæðere eft Dryhten aras

mid his miclan mihte mannum to helpe.
 
He tasted death there [in the grave]; nevertheless, afterwards the Lord arose
 
to help mankind with his great might.

 

From what they believed was their certain death, the recruits awaken to the fortress' great hall. Rolls of honour hung from the walls where the names of the fallen are remembered for all time. Horns, tusks and teeth of the greatest of the worlds beasts are hung from the walls. Where the statues of heroes would stand, the alcoves instead hold the chapter's ancients, those fallen in battle but with the will to carry on, arcane machines wires and cables plugged into their sarcophagi.

 

It is here, in this moment of elation at their life returned, yet grief of their lost family and loved ones that the Chaplains of the company begin their induction, to undertake the oath of the first Blazing Son of Jardenfel.

 

 

 

Organisation.

 

While the Blazing Sons are on paper a mostly Codex compliant chapter, with only minor differences in structure, rank and naming convention, the reality is very different. The Blazing Sons are very decentralized in nature, while the company lords are obeyed as one would expect, when bands of warriors are split off from their host, they become wholly independent. As such, while they are under the remit to return to the chapter when they are able, if they choose to undertake a crucial task, they are given the latitude to follow their intuition.

 

In this manner, the specialists of the chapter also operate differently. The Sons preference for small units operating independently means that Chaplains who would usually ply their oratory and spiritual guidance to a company on campaign are more often seen accompanying, if not outright leading groups of questing or 'errant' Blazing Sons. The Librarians of the chapter conversely are rarely seen. Few and far between, they are usually seen accompanying Shield Captains, scrying the skein of the warp for enemy intent and movement. Some may be seen traversing the stars on special tasks known only to themselves and their warriors.

 

The Apothacarian by contrast spreads it's skills far and wide. To earn the right to lead or undertake a quest, the warrior must first be able to return with the geneseed of any brothers who fall on the journey. The survivalists mindset of the chapter and the people of their homeworld has almost every warrior learning what many others deem the realm of the medicae, aid for others as well as self. Just as the Salamanders forge and maintain their equipment, the Blazing Sons all carry and maintain their medical equipment and skills as second nature. The Apothacarian functions more as stores and a rank for master surgeons for serious emergencies, often working together with the brothers of the Forge for cybernetics or incarceration within a Dreadnought. As such, it is not uncommon for a questing group of warriors to mistakenly be assumed to being lead by an apothacary by presence of a Narthecium, when in reality this is simply a practical need.

 

Without these divergent methods of training and equipping their brethren, the chapter would have died out centuries past and the Sons do not apologize for it.

 

Occasionally, a squad will spend years following a particular enemy, or undertaking a great mission, travelling across the Imperium before finally being able to return home. The reasons can range from following a respected Inquisitor, responding to an Arbites call for aid, striking a deal with a Rogue Trader or even a Mechanicus Magos to aid the chapter. At times they will simply complete whatever task they were assigned or undertook and return home, while at others they will be gone for such a period as to be declared lost.

 

While it is usually doesn't adversely affect operations on a macro scale, given the Sons preference for aiding the mortals around them. This has however affected their recruitment practices, and as such, their registered numbers tend to fluctuate wildly, which has brought some adverse attention to the chapter in it's time. Their will to fight wherever and whenever they are able has them in good standing with most in the Imperium's hierarchy for that alone. A number of investigations have been suffered by the Blazing Sons, yet each time the verdict remains the same. Due to the brothers flowing in and out of the chapter, whether through death or being 'lost' on a quest, the results are within acceptable margins. For now.

 

 

 

The long departed, returned. (WIP)

 

Twice in the history of the chapter have groups of warriors disappeared for such long stretches as to be genuinely considered MIA. Firstly when Captain Aethelus and his Huscarls pursued an Eldar Corsair Captain into the webway, disappearing for a century, then again when a combat squad who, under the leadership of their huscarl-sargent Halfdan, struck a deal with the Rogue Trader Garadon Velght to explore north of the Ghoul Stars, disppearing for forty years, before reappearing above Jardenfel, Rogue Trader in tow.

 

 

Captain Aethelus returned to the chapter, delivered by Arbite Strike Cruiser from a far away world. The Xenos' head on his belt and six of the original ten of his retinue left alive, the bodies of the slain being carried by their brothers. The maze of the webway and the aliens attempts to lose his hounds through exodite worlds and warzones wherever he could cost the Astartes in blood, yet they never lost sight of their quarry, his end was assured. Their armour was battered and torn, their weapons spent or lost, yet they prevailed.

 

 

Huscarl-Sargent Halfdan and his warriors were part of Captain Coenwahl's Fourth Host, who had been detached from his command to secure the nearby spaceport from insurgents. Eventuating in a desperate holding action against a horde of treasonous insurgent soldiers, Halfdan and his warriors, alongside various docked ships loyal naval armsmen managed to turn the tide. One of those who's lives were saved by the Sons was the Rogue Trader. A deal was struck, in return for protection of the Trader in his quest into the Ghoul Stars, he would direct the Sons to an ancient resource cache. They were considered lost for many years, before an unexpected warp translation above Jardenfel brought them home. The Trader's word was good, the cache was delivered and the Sons returned home. The Trader and Coenwahl exchanged oaths of friendship between the fourth host and the Trader.

 

 

 

Recent History.

 

The Indomitus Crusade has swept the Imperium, providing respite and stability for a broken empire. When Guillimans envoys reached Jardenfel, the Sons leadership held a day of respite for the people of the world, a rare thing denoting celebration and a day of rest from the constant work for survival. The Sons had heard tale of his return, but to see the Custodes and hear their words as Guillimans, to see and receive the Primaris Marines was quite another. Unlike many other chapters who were in dire straits, the Sons had no wish to deploy untested warriors, no matter how technically brilliant they may appear to be. As such the work of the training cadre had their work cut out for them, as the Terran Primaris given to the Sons had to be tested and trained as the Chapter willed it.

 

However the Sons would not appear ungrateful to a Son of the Emperor so in an unprecedented move, unilaterally assigned five whole battle companies to the Crusade. Any missing warriors who were yet to return home. While the chapter was spread to the four winds, the order was given and the companies gathered at their own pace, joining the crusade fleet when they were able.

 

The Primaris of the Blazing Sons have had to work to prove their worth to the Sons. Thrown into the last stages of the Proving, they are expected to perform as the native initiates do, to be moulded into individual warriors of honour and accountability for all they do, and to treat others as such. The transition has been hard for many, being trained for a duty they were now to be held back from. Some friction was expected and fighting soon became common between the Emperors Astartes and Guillimans Primaris, however it is the way of the Sons to brawl, and as the re-training continued, the friction began to lessen as the warriors began to see eye-to-eye as their problems were settled with their hands. Especially difficult for the Primaris marines was the adaptation to individual pragmatic survival, and an individual warriors honour, rather than their training as a group, as legion.

 

While the Sons can not claim to be the individualistic masters of the Custodes, they believe wholeheartedly in accountability and honour of the warrior who stands as one of many brothers in arms, rather than the group, the squad, company or chapter as the Primaris had been drilled. Their thinking had to be broken down and restructured and as many will attest, old habits, especially those from training, are hard to break.

 

To their credit, the Primaris brethren took to their training and immersed themselves in Jardenfel's people and history, wishing to be the best they could be and earn their right to be a warrior of the Blazing Sons. Once they were shown the way, it was only a matter of time before their nature shone through. As it stands today, the Primaris brethren of the chapter have come a long way, being even more suited to the deployment practices that the Sons choose to undertake due to their enhanced physiology, while the Vanguard forces allow the chapter to give smaller groups a much larger impact on the battlefield.

 

As it stands, the Blazing Sons are very grateful to the Lord Commander of the Imperium. The Primaris have proven themselves and the chapter has pledged itself to the greatest quest in the galaxy. The hard pragmatic edge of the chapter may have even been lifted slightly, though none would admit it beyond their own brothers.

 

 

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

 

 

 

So that's what I've got so far.

 

It's not much, definitely not. However, it's a (yet another) start.

 

I'd appreciate any feedback and/or suggestions 

 

Visually I've found that a couple of images of the old Thunder Warriors help me to see these guys in my minds eye. Obviously without some of the wild, unrestrained brutality. That's not these guys, but the armour and colours are close enough, of which I'll link below.

 

This, specifically.

 

Cheers!

 

 

 

.....I don't think I stuffed anything up...... hopefully......


Edited by Grey Hunter Ydalir, 10 January 2020 - 12:25 AM.

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The Octaguide.
The Thousand Marine Myth.

On the scale mismatch of bolts and bolters by Coldfyre

Commissar Molotov's Castigators - Essential reading for IA Creation.

"...I have seen the birth of this world and I have seen its death. I walked with the first men and I shared a beer with the last. For me everyone is both old and young at the same time as a million lifetimes pass before my eyes and humanity is like the grains of sand in the desert, each breath to me a sigh in the vast never-ending vacumn of space."
-Silver Phoenix


#2
Bjorn Firewalker

Bjorn Firewalker

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Basic Core Traits:-

- Self-reliance and self-sufficiency.

- To fight for victory for it's own sake, rather than for glory or status.

- Strong preference to fight alongside the Imperiums 'mortal' defenders.

- Extremely close relationship with homeworld population (linked to above point).

- Attach themselves to other hosts in various numbers (squads to companies) to other endeavors.

This is acceptable.

Cultural Influences:-

- Saxon inspired aesthetic and homeworld culture. Deeply ingrained in the chapter.

- Unwilling to judge others on reputation alone, individual actions of the moment are held above all else. Your reputation is a frame through which you yourself are seen, but you are judged truly on your character alone.

- Great love and affection for family and clan. Wary of outsiders, stoic and unwilling to share true names beyond those they consider kin.

- Lovers of brawling and all hand to hand combat. Most issues between brothers are settled with their fists. Most recreation is had with their fists.

This is mostly acceptable, but it may invite comparisons to the Space Wolves, who have a similar culture. Some additional details are recommended to emphasize the Blazing Sons are NOT "Space Wolves in different colors."

Homeworld Traits:-

- Mars sized.

Problem: A planet's size has a direct effect on its gravity, which in turn has a direct effect on its atmospheric density. Mars' gravity is approximately 1/3 that of Earth's, meaning its inhabitants will evolve with a relatively weak skeleton, unless archeotech is used to either artificially increase the planet's gravity to that of Earth's, or to genetically enhace the human colonists so they may survive on planets with Earth-like gravity. 1/3 gravity will also result in an atmosphere too thin for humans to breathe in; remember Douglas Quaid (Arnold Schwarzenegger) asphyxiating outside the habitat domes the Martian colonists lived in, in 1990's Total Recall?

- Cool, rocky world. Orbits a white star, while hotter than the Terran Sun, is far enough away to not only be colder as a whole, but in accordance with it's slower orbit, the seasons last twice as long.

A Fenrisian "great year" is approximately twice as long as that of Earth. This line is begging readers to think of the Blazing Sons as "Space Wolves in different colors"- NOT a good thing if you want your IA to be seen as anything other than a ripoff of Codex: Space Wolves.

[Had an idea for some gene-labs to be hidden in the worlds spinal mountain ranges, falling into almost complete, irreparable disrepair with the fall of the local AI mainframe during the fall. It was designed with a little hinted at intrigue in mind, however I don't feel like it adds anything to the overall picture so I think I'll drop it.]

This detail can be a GREAT help in making your IA more than a ripoff of Codex: Space Wolves. As noted, the human colonists require genetic enhancements to breathe in a Mars-like planet's thin atmosphere, and further enhancements to reinforce their skeletons so their bones won't snap like twigs in an Earth-like planet's gravity. The gene-labs may be responsible for creating monsters that turned the Chapter planet into a death world, forcing its human inhabitants to fight for their lives every day, with many youths becoming worthy candidates for the Chapter; see Death Force, from MD Geist, for comparison.

Edited by Bjorn Firewalker, 27 November 2019 - 05:41 AM.

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Wolf Scout- Catachan barking toad eggs+ Thousand Sons Marine= Fun! (Wolves of Catachan)

Warhammer 40,000+ Star Wars- Rian Johnson- Reylo= AWESOME! (Knights of Renaissance)

Reasons to use the Steel Crusaders ('Codex: Space Marines' supplement) or the Iron-hearted Angels ('Codex: Blood Angels' supplement): Because you think giving Sternguard Veterans a heavy bolter wtih special issue HEAVY BOLTER ammunition is ALMOST as much fun as shoehorning an Earthshaker cannon into a Land Raider.

#3
Ace Debonair

Ace Debonair

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I wondered when the Blazing Sons would surface again.happy.png
 
You know the drill, Ydalir - I'm about to come at you with the questions, but it's all in the name of forging this Chapter into something stronger.

 

I'm aware that I'm following this with a bunch of starkly-worded, banter-free questions. Please don't assume this is me being unusually harsh or unfair - I'm just writing on a time limit since I have about ten minutes before I need to go to work! sweat.gif

 

So, on with the C&C!

 

Basic Core Traits:-

- Self-reliance and self-sufficiency.

- To fight for victory for it's own sake, rather than for glory or status.

- Strong preference to fight alongside the Imperiums 'mortal' defenders.

- Extremely close relationship with homeworld population (linked to above point).

- Attach themselves to other hosts in various numbers (squads to companies) to other endeavors.


Alright, so... let's get some more sense of the Chapter's personality here.

 

Do the Sons prefer to fight alongside regular humans because they value the common folk, or because they want to impress them, or because it's always nice to have cannon fodder to use as a shield?

When you say the Sons are close to the people of their homeworld - what sort of relationship do they have? Do they rule their homeworld? How do the population view the Blazing Sons?


I mean, I think I remember the approximate character of the Blazing Sons, but I don't want to make any assumptions, and finding the motivations of the Chapter are always interesting. happy.png
 

Cultural Influences:-

- Saxon inspired aesthetic and homeworld culture. Deeply ingrained in the chapter.

- Unwilling to judge others on reputation alone, individual actions of the moment are held above all else. Your reputation is a frame through which you yourself are seen, but you are judged truly on your character alone.

- Great love and affection for family and clan. Wary of outsiders, stoic and unwilling to share true names beyond those they consider kin.

- Lovers of brawling and all hand to hand combat. Most issues between brothers are settled with their fists. Most recreation is had with their fists.


Sounds good so far. biggrin.png

 

Although it might be worthwhile to (at some point) try and describe the homeworld's culture without using the word 'Saxon', just to give a clearer picture of what aspects of Saxon culture and lifestyle you're looking to incorporate. happy.png

 

Homeworld Traits:-

- Mars sized.

- Cool, rocky world. Orbits a white star, while hotter than the Terran Sun, is far enough away to not only be colder as a whole, but in accordance with it's slower orbit, the seasons last twice as long.

- Colonised during the Dark Age of Technology, razed during the war with the Men of Iron, leaving only devastated, flattened cities and a comparatively precious few survivors in it's wake. Most marks of civilization crumbled and were buried over the milennia.

- Generations of survivors recovered and re-established some communities. Compared to their time during the fall, positively flourished. At least, so much as they were able. Natural regression in technology, rebuilt to semi-feudal society with some vestiges of technology.

[Had an idea for some gene-labs to be hidden in the worlds spinal mountain ranges, falling into almost complete, irreparable disrepair with the fall of the local AI mainframe during the fall. It was designed with a little hinted at intrigue in mind, however I don't feel like it adds anything to the overall picture so I think I'll drop it.]


Neat, but...

What makes this world suitable for the Blazing Sons to recruit from? Are there wars? A vast pool of recruits to draw from? Other hardships that lead to viable recruits?

 

The people of this world are important to the Blazing Sons. Why? What sparks that connection?

 

The note about the seasons is interesting, although I must admit I don't know how this will effect the Chapter much.sweat.gif

 

 

It's good to see the Blazing Sons again, albeit in outline form.

Really looking forward to seeing them get fleshed out a little more! biggrin.png


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#4
Brother Lunkhead

Brother Lunkhead

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Well met Brother Grey,

 

We meet again to spar over yet another fine IA..... this time, yourstongue.png It actually looks quite interesting and with great possibilitiesyes.gif I do have a few questions that I hope will help you along with this most worthy project.

 

Brothers Ace and Bjorn brought out some good points and I won't belabor them.

 

 

Basic Core Traits:-

 

- Self-reliance and self-sufficiency.

 

How do you define these traits? Do they rely solely on themselves for resources? ….. for motivation? This is a very generic statement that could mean almost anything.

 

 

Cultural Influences:-

 

- Unwilling to judge others on reputation alone, individual actions of the moment are held above all else. Your reputation is a frame through which you yourself are seen, but you are judged truly on your character alone.

 

One cannot be judged worthy by character alone. You can have sterling character and still be a total dunderheadwacko.png

 

 

Homeworld Traits:- 

 

- Mars sized.

 

- Cool, rocky world. Orbits a white star, while hotter than the Terran Sun, is far enough away to not only be colder as a whole, but in accordance with it's slower orbit, the seasons last twice as long.

 

- Colonised during the Dark Age of Technology, razed during the war with the Men of Iron, leaving only devastated, flattened cities and a comparatively precious few survivors in it's wake. Most marks of civilization crumbled and were buried over the milennia.

 

- Generations of survivors recovered and re-established some communities. Compared to their time during the fall, positively flourished. At least, so much as they were able. Natural regression in technology, rebuilt to semi-feudal society with some vestiges of technology.

 

Okay, so let's talk about the homeworld againteehee.gif Brother Bjorn brought up some good points so I won't repeat those. But, what about mass? Along with the atmosphere problem, you're also going to have a gravity problem with a world only slightly stronger than Terra's moon. Weak gravity will breed weak people..... not very suitable for Astartes recruitment. Perhaps the planet has a super-dense core of handwaviumwacko.png  or some other exotic material. 

 

I hope you've found My points of some small help. That's about all I have for you now, except that on the whole, I find your outline to be quite good and interesting. I'm looking forward to seeing more.


Edited by Brother Lunkhead, 23 November 2019 - 04:16 AM.

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gallery_26154_15777_13780.png


#5
Bjorn Firewalker

Bjorn Firewalker

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Cultural Influences:-

- Unwilling to judge others on reputation alone, individual actions of the moment are held above all else. Your reputation is a frame through which you yourself are seen, but you are judged truly on your character alone.

One cannot be judged worthy by character alone. You can have sterling character and still be a total dunderhead
Good point. HOW do you evaluate a person's character, in order to judge it? WHAT characteristics do you judge a person's character by, and how do you test them?

Anyone can claim he's willing to give his life for his friends, but you can't test whether or not a person is actually this loyal and selfless, without actually putting his friends in danger. Anyone can say he feels guilt for committing a sin, and wishes to make amends; but you can't test whether or not he's sincerely remorseful without tempting him with the same sins.
  • Grey Hunter Ydalir likes this
Wolf Scout- Catachan barking toad eggs+ Thousand Sons Marine= Fun! (Wolves of Catachan)

Warhammer 40,000+ Star Wars- Rian Johnson- Reylo= AWESOME! (Knights of Renaissance)

Reasons to use the Steel Crusaders ('Codex: Space Marines' supplement) or the Iron-hearted Angels ('Codex: Blood Angels' supplement): Because you think giving Sternguard Veterans a heavy bolter wtih special issue HEAVY BOLTER ammunition is ALMOST as much fun as shoehorning an Earthshaker cannon into a Land Raider.

#6
Ace Debonair

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Cultural Influences:-

- Unwilling to judge others on reputation alone, individual actions of the moment are held above all else. Your reputation is a frame through which you yourself are seen, but you are judged truly on your character alone.

One cannot be judged worthy by character alone. You can have sterling character and still be a total dunderhead

 

Good point. HOW do you evaluate a person's character, in order to judge it? WHAT characteristics do you judge a person's character by, and how do you test them?

Anyone can claim he's willing to give his life for his friends, but you can't test whether or not a person is actually this loyal and selfless, without actually putting his friends in danger. Anyone can say he feels guilt for committing a sin, and wishes to make amends; but you can't test whether or not he's sincerely remorseful without tempting him with the same sins.

 


I think what GHY is saying with that point is along the lines of: "It doesn't matter if you have a prior reputation for tactical genius, if you go into battle alongside the Blazing Sons and make a complete blunder of it, that's what they'll remember you for."

With the obvious addendum of "It doesn't matter if you're a penal legion comprised of sinners and cannon fodder; if you fight like tigers in the face of oblivion, the Blazing Sons will laud your courage."

 

Or in short "How you behave around the Blazing Sons is how the Chapter will remember you".

 

… I'm sure he'll correct me if I'm wrong. laugh.png


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#7
Bjorn Firewalker

Bjorn Firewalker

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I think what GHY is saying with that point is along the lines of: "It doesn't matter if you have a prior reputation for tactical genius, if you go into battle alongside the Blazing Sons and make a complete blunder of it, that's what they'll remember you for."

With the obvious addendum of "It doesn't matter if you're a penal legion comprised of sinners and cannon fodder; if you fight like tigers in the face of oblivion, the Blazing Sons will laud your courage."

Or in short "How you behave around the Blazing Sons is how the Chapter will remember you".

Like how Benedict Arnold bravely fought for the US in the Battles of Saratoga, but American history forgot his acts of loyalty in the face of his treason and subsequent actions against the US during the Revolutionary War?
  • Grey Hunter Ydalir likes this
Wolf Scout- Catachan barking toad eggs+ Thousand Sons Marine= Fun! (Wolves of Catachan)

Warhammer 40,000+ Star Wars- Rian Johnson- Reylo= AWESOME! (Knights of Renaissance)

Reasons to use the Steel Crusaders ('Codex: Space Marines' supplement) or the Iron-hearted Angels ('Codex: Blood Angels' supplement): Because you think giving Sternguard Veterans a heavy bolter wtih special issue HEAVY BOLTER ammunition is ALMOST as much fun as shoehorning an Earthshaker cannon into a Land Raider.

#8
Brother Lunkhead

Brother Lunkhead

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Cultural Influences:-

- Unwilling to judge others on reputation alone, individual actions of the moment are held above all else. Your reputation is a frame through which you yourself are seen, but you are judged truly on your character alone.

One cannot be judged worthy by character alone. You can have sterling character and still be a total dunderhead

 

Good point. HOW do you evaluate a person's character, in order to judge it? WHAT characteristics do you judge a person's character by, and how do you test them?

Anyone can claim he's willing to give his life for his friends, but you can't test whether or not a person is actually this loyal and selfless, without actually putting his friends in danger. Anyone can say he feels guilt for committing a sin, and wishes to make amends; but you can't test whether or not he's sincerely remorseful without tempting him with the same sins.

 


I think what GHY is saying with that point is along the lines of: "It doesn't matter if you have a prior reputation for tactical genius, if you go into battle alongside the Blazing Sons and make a complete blunder of it, that's what they'll remember you for."

With the obvious addendum of "It doesn't matter if you're a penal legion comprised of sinners and cannon fodder; if you fight like tigers in the face of oblivion, the Blazing Sons will laud your courage."

 

Or in short "How you behave around the Blazing Sons is how the Chapter will remember you".

 

… I'm sure he'll correct me if I'm wrong. laugh.png

 

 

Yes..... I'm thinking it's something like that.

 

 

 

Like how Benedict Arnold bravely fought for the US in the Battles of Saratoga, but American history forgot his acts of loyalty in the face of his treason and subsequent actions against the US during the Revolutionary War?

 

Those of us who stayed awake during history classteehee.gif  actually do remember Benedict Arnold's bravery and strategic acumen as well as his treason at West Point, but ultimately it is his worst and final act that he is justly remembered fordry.png Anyway.......

 

I think we are getting ahead of ourselves in this argument and should wait for the author to chime in before going any further.


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#9
Grey Hunter Ydalir

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Ok so I just spent half an hour writing out my response and then hit the back button when I got up from the table. Faaaaaantaaaaastic.

 

 

 

 

 

Right so I think you're right and I'll make the Viking Caricature wolf-yiffers definitly not the first thing you think of. It's not what I intended, but with the similar cultural epoch they draw from in pre-norman uk/europe, I can see how I drew that thought process.

 

I love the gene-lab play to not only give the world some extra dimension, yet also to fix my bad-astrophysics. I'm not so good at the science-gubbinz.

 

I wish I'd thought of that. I'll roll that idea around a bit, but thank you for the suggestion.

 

 

I wondered when the Blazing Sons would surface again.happy.png
 

 

 

Yeah, you and me both!

 

So, to the first point.

 

1. The sons fight alongside the common folk because they believe humanity to be their extended kin. The Astartes are trans-humans and while they are humanities superlative warriors, they are engineered to fight. They are the Great Hunt as it were, where the normal humans are the ones who's bravery should be lauded the most, as they have the most to lose. I'll expand on this of course, but later as most of the points being raised are interlinked.

 

So, yes. They rule their homeworld. They live alongside their people, at least as much as a chapter that spends it's days constantly deployed and rarely returning can live alongside them. They help to maintain the settlements defenses, hunt the great beasts and help to build and repair whatever needs it. Again it's something linked to another section. I feel like I'm going to be repeating that a lot.

 

 

2. Yes absolutely, I will find other descriptors for the chapter and homeworld aesthetic and culture but for the moment 'Saxon' is the most concise way to get the point across. It is definitely something to expand on, I just have to find the best way to mix that culture with a distant, DAoT world in the *somewhere* in the galaxy.

 

I suppose I should link a couple of other pictures to help visualize this.

 

gallery_26631_1168_28627.jpggallery_26631_1168_3482.jpg

 

 

Now,

 

3. I hadn't quite decided about their recruitment practices, to be honest. I'd say they only recruit from their homeworld given their close-knit and direct cultural draw from their home and it's people. Unless they help their people colonize other worlds in their system, which they could do, they like to help their people after all, but this may get them into strife with the Adeptus Terra, given how they aren't supposed to be establishing their own empire.

 

That said, depending on the state of the galaxy and where their homeworld is located, it could be an interesting development in the 'modern' galaxy and state of the Imperium. Again, something they could get away with now that the galaxy is basically a dumpster-fire right now. Something to think about.

 

I didn't really have any other objective with how I described the homeworld was having some loose justification for the world to be how it is, so that it's a suitable place for the chapter, it's people and subsequent culture.

 

I appreciate the points Ace.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Now on to you, brother. I must say, rewriting this lot has basically killed me, but let's see how this goes.

 

1. Self-sufficiency. They don't like relying on anyone else other than themselves. Their fortress monastery would also be their chapter forge, they maintain, repair and rebuild on their own and produce as much as they can on their own. They're not smiths and artisans like the Salamanders or Iron Hands, they're survivalists.

 

Survivalists do their damnedest to be as self-reliant and self-sufficient as possible. They won't turn away shipments of arms and armour because they're dogmatic, but they do strive to be able to operate and thrive without outside assistance. This is somewhat assumed for a lot of chapters, but I always wanted it to be more of an explicitly stated focus for this chapter. Related to their homeworld culture, yet again.

 

Their people don't have an over-abundance of other resources beyond metals, stone and some wood and a lack of any industrial capacity, even in a medieval context due to where they have to have their settlements. Thus, wasting resources and the necessity of this mindset for survival of the whole city, rather than individually, is bred into the chapter.

 

 

2. Ok, fair point, I think I mis-worded it. They don't judge you by what others say of you. They judge you by your own actions and your character. To be fair, most individuals they interact with that are either Imperial Guard, Navy or Astartes are usually fairly competent so being a dunderhead isn't as relevant. However if your character is lacking, despite whatever accolades you may have been lauded with, they will still judge you as lacking in their eyes.

 

It's more meant to be a commentary on how they interact with others outside the chapter. To address Bjorn again to the same point, 99.99% of all their interactions with anyone from outside the chapter and their own people would be in war-zones and combat operations. They don't have many other frames of reference for judgement other than how someone acts under pressure, and their own ideas of honour.

 

3. Yeah I know, the homeworld was not terribly descriptive, more of a bio-sheet. I'll work on it. That said I feel like Bjorn addressed some of this earlier and I'm pretty happy with developing that line.

 

 

It may sound like I'm defending some points, I'm not. What I'm trying to do is put down what I've had in my head, using your comments as a frame to set them out more clearly. I'm not so much defending them as redirecting what would be a miscommunication on my part and trying to right the ship as it were.

 

Anything mentioned by you fellas is something I need to look at and work on, or explain better or what have you.

 

I appreciate the C&C! I'll expand on what I've got slowly over the next day or two and see what I come up with.

 

Cheers!

 


Edited by Grey Hunter Ydalir, 23 November 2019 - 11:20 PM.

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The Octaguide.
The Thousand Marine Myth.

On the scale mismatch of bolts and bolters by Coldfyre

Commissar Molotov's Castigators - Essential reading for IA Creation.

"...I have seen the birth of this world and I have seen its death. I walked with the first men and I shared a beer with the last. For me everyone is both old and young at the same time as a million lifetimes pass before my eyes and humanity is like the grains of sand in the desert, each breath to me a sigh in the vast never-ending vacumn of space."
-Silver Phoenix


#10
Bjorn Firewalker

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Is this the level of technology available to the Chapter planet's inhabitants? Will it also influence those recruited from them, e.g., the Blazing Sons favor spears over axes and swords as melee weapons?

gallery_26631_1168_3482.jpg

This looks AWESOME.

I hadn't quite decided about their recruitment practices, to be honest. I'd say they only recruit from their homeworld given their close-knit and direct cultural draw from their home and it's people.

I wrote the following for my own IA:

The Sanguinala, a holiday to commemorate the Blood Angels Primarch, is most celebrated on Argentum [the Chapter planet]. The colonists hold athletic competitions on that day, demonstrating their readiness to fight for the Emperor... From 404.M37 to 688.M41, the Bleeding-hearted Angels [Blood Angels descendants] sent a Chaplain to attend each game, judge each competition, and recruit athletes for the Chapter...

The Blazing Sons may do something similar, e.g., host annual martial arts tournaments in Stonehenge-like "rings of honor" built at various places on the Chapter planet, to evaluate potential recruits. Alternatively, have the Chapter planet's inhabitants fight annual flower wars to prove their worth before the Emperor's eyes, with Blazing Sons Chaplains selecting those who demonstrate great valor the way the Space Wolves Wolf Priests would if Russ' sons were better organized.
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Wolf Scout- Catachan barking toad eggs+ Thousand Sons Marine= Fun! (Wolves of Catachan)

Warhammer 40,000+ Star Wars- Rian Johnson- Reylo= AWESOME! (Knights of Renaissance)

Reasons to use the Steel Crusaders ('Codex: Space Marines' supplement) or the Iron-hearted Angels ('Codex: Blood Angels' supplement): Because you think giving Sternguard Veterans a heavy bolter wtih special issue HEAVY BOLTER ammunition is ALMOST as much fun as shoehorning an Earthshaker cannon into a Land Raider.

#11
Grey Hunter Ydalir

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*snip* 

 

I provided the original template from the painter here but I couldn't quite get the bronze-ish look right on the painter. The image was made up for me and I wish I could credit who made it but it was a while ago and I can't remember who it was. A think the conversation has been lost too. Maybe it was Dazzo? I can't remember.

 

I do like the idea of having the 'annual games' as a competition for aspirants.

 

As to the technology level of the world, mostly. Most warriors would be armed with your normal early medieval style.

 

Firearms do exist and aren't uncommon, but since everything is relatively hard to manufacture in great quantities they're not the most common weapons in anything other than say, a chiefs Housecarls, etc. It's a ruined world with a low base-tech level but they're not complete barbarians. Let's say it's a 'fallen world' with a feudal era level of easily manufacturable tech, but some remnants of the old world still exist. They came from a DAoT world, they don't have any mind bending magic or any mary-sue tech but they're not purely barbarians. At least, that's not how I imagined them.

 

If you were a city guard, a sharpshooter may have your sections heirloom rifle, but the rest of you have a spear or crossbow, or somesuch combination, but if you were a hunter or tracker you'd likely find it easier, cheaper and more effective to simply use a good bow.

 

Perhaps a type of - pre-techno barbarian? In any case, sort of feudal but not completely.

 

I originally had them fighting beside their Astartes as 'serfs' and it being somewhat an odd point among other Imperial organisations, but not gaining much notoriety considering the generally dispersed nature of the chapter.

 

Anyway, I'll stop rambling here. 


The Octaguide.
The Thousand Marine Myth.

On the scale mismatch of bolts and bolters by Coldfyre

Commissar Molotov's Castigators - Essential reading for IA Creation.

"...I have seen the birth of this world and I have seen its death. I walked with the first men and I shared a beer with the last. For me everyone is both old and young at the same time as a million lifetimes pass before my eyes and humanity is like the grains of sand in the desert, each breath to me a sigh in the vast never-ending vacumn of space."
-Silver Phoenix


#12
Brother Lunkhead

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Posted 23 November 2019 - 07:22 PM

 

 

Quote

gallery_26631_1168_3482.jpg

This looks AWESOME.

 

OHHHYEAAH......AWESOME is definitely the wordthumbsup.gif

 

I really like the Blazing Sons heraldry too...…… but wait a minute theredry.png That's an eight pointed star there bubeek.gif Are the Blazing Sons some sort of secret heretic chapter...…. The Inquisition must be informedyes.gif teehee.gif

 

You might want to trim a couple of points off the Blazing Sons heraldry to fix that association with Chaos thing. I wouldn't do any more modification than that as the overall symbol is rad.

 

Bjorn Firewalker, on 06 Mar 2015 - 6:48 PM, said:snapback.png

The Sanguinala, a holiday to commemorate the Blood Angels Primarch, is most celebrated on Argentum [the Chapter planet]. The colonists hold athletic competitions on that day, demonstrating their readiness to fight for the Emperor... From 404.M37 to 688.M41, the Bleeding-hearted Angels [Blood Angels descendants] sent a Chaplain to attend each game, judge each competition, and recruit athletes for the Chapter...

The Blazing Sons may do something similar, e.g., host annual martial arts tournaments in Stonehenge-like "rings of honor" built at various places on the Chapter planet, to evaluate potential recruits. Alternatively, have the Chapter planet's inhabitants fight annual flower wars to prove their worth before the Emperor's eyes, with Blazing Sons Chaplains selecting those who demonstrate great valor the way the Space Wolves Wolf Priests would if Russ' sons were better organized.

 

That is a most excellent idea.

 

The limited tech idea looks good. Dan Abnett did the same thing with Baal Solock in Brothers of the Snake. The elites had access to  las-locks and a few had bolt pistols too.

 

That's all I have for now. This is going to be a kickin' chapter....... except for that little heresy problemmsn-wink.gif


Edited by Brother Lunkhead, 25 November 2019 - 06:57 PM.

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#13
Grey Hunter Ydalir

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That's all I have for now. This is going to be a kickin' chapter....... except for that little heresy problemmsn-wink.gif

 

I thought I'd quickly check the Liber before I went to bed, and saw your comment.

 

Now, I've never really noticed it or thought about it until now. You're absolutely right.

 

That's, well, yeah I don't have the tools to really do that anymore, and the guy who did the work I don't think is around to rework it.

 

gallery_26631_1168_50539.gif

 

.... I guess this heraldry is out too then eh? Well, bugger. If anyone has the know how to give it a shot I'd be happy to let anyone take a crack at mucking about with it. Until then, it stays as it is because my brain is too fuzzed from my current workload.

 

More notes for this IA will come after friday/saturday. I have a deadline on friday and then about three hours travel time on saturday after I get everything squared away to get on the road. I know I'm just spinning my wheels here but it's all I can do, I just don't want to let this die for, what, the third time now?

 

Thank's for the keen observation!

 

 

EDIT: Oh and sorry Bjorn, in regards to melee weapons, I'd say the Blazing Sons, being survivalists are pragmatic enough to know that a bolter is as good a tool as any to win the day, their world does have some ranged tech and makes use of bows and crossbows at the lowest level. That said, if the chance to brawl is as good as a ranged engagement, on balance they will always choose the brawl.

 

I'd probably put them more into the extreme CQB field. They would close till point blank where their armour, strength and speed will give them far more advantage than at long range. It's how I envision most Astartes to fight, in reality.

 

Maybe I'll write a mini thesis on that eventually but for now, this is what I've got for the Blazing Sons.


Edited by Grey Hunter Ydalir, 26 November 2019 - 12:10 PM.

The Octaguide.
The Thousand Marine Myth.

On the scale mismatch of bolts and bolters by Coldfyre

Commissar Molotov's Castigators - Essential reading for IA Creation.

"...I have seen the birth of this world and I have seen its death. I walked with the first men and I shared a beer with the last. For me everyone is both old and young at the same time as a million lifetimes pass before my eyes and humanity is like the grains of sand in the desert, each breath to me a sigh in the vast never-ending vacumn of space."
-Silver Phoenix


#14
Ace Debonair

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Hang on, hang on, the emblem's fine as it is.

 

The symbol is a metaphor for their duty - no matter which direction the enemy chooses to run, the Emperor's Vengeance in the form of the Blazing Sons will hunt them down. (Hence the self-sufficient companies; good for long hunts when required msn-wink.gif )

 

Conversely, the circle at the centre of the symbol could represent the Imperium (and regular humans in particular, if you like), and the multitude of points could represent the Space Marines, a metaphorical ring of spears pointing in all directions to repel those who would destroy or desecrate Humanity's rightful domain (i.e. the galaxy).

 

EDIT: forgot to finish a sentence there. Oops!


Edited by Ace Debonair, 26 November 2019 - 01:37 PM.

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#15
Bjorn Firewalker

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.... I guess this heraldry is out too then eh?

It's fine for vehicles, e.g., Land Raider doors. It's likely too detailed for small surfaces, e.g., Space Marine pauldrons. It's probably OK in 3D, but not so in 2D, e.g., an Ancient's standard; for the latter, the Chapter symbol and the background should be in different colors, the resulting contrast making the Chapter symbol easy to see.
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Wolf Scout- Catachan barking toad eggs+ Thousand Sons Marine= Fun! (Wolves of Catachan)

Warhammer 40,000+ Star Wars- Rian Johnson- Reylo= AWESOME! (Knights of Renaissance)

Reasons to use the Steel Crusaders ('Codex: Space Marines' supplement) or the Iron-hearted Angels ('Codex: Blood Angels' supplement): Because you think giving Sternguard Veterans a heavy bolter wtih special issue HEAVY BOLTER ammunition is ALMOST as much fun as shoehorning an Earthshaker cannon into a Land Raider.

#16
Brother Lunkhead

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Posted Today, 05:07 AM

 

.... I guess this heraldry is out too then eh? Well, bugger.

 

Now hold up there Brother..... Don't be so hasty to throw out the baby with the bath water.

 

 

Posted Today, 06:36 AM

 

Hang on, hang on, the emblem's fine as it is.

 

"Hang on"..... yesyes.gif ....."fine as is"?...…..no.gif Not quite.

 

Clearly a lot of love and work went into the heraldry and I would absolutely hate to see you discard it for the sake of a couple of pesky points. However, as is it does look like a stylized Sigil of Chaos, I don't think there is any way around that..... If a lunkhead like me can see it, I'm sure others will too. Fortunately, I think there's an easy fix. If you remove the points at the  90 degree and 270 degree marks you eliminate the problem and preserve the aesthetic of a truly excellent piece of heraldry. If you can't get hold of the original artist who rendered the original symbol, I'm sur you can find another orbiting our community who can do it justice.


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#17
Ace Debonair

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...With the utmost respect, brother, there's a thread still on the front page of the Liber where you're stating that nothing is too ridiculous for 40k (citing the sudden inclusion of Cawl and Primaris as an example) provided it's done well enough.

 

A really well-drawn symbol that happens to have eight points and is being used by loyalists shouldn't even be a blip on the radar by comparison.

 

There's a Chapter called the Harbingers that has a very similar badge to the Blazing Sons, but two of their points are represented by a sword driven through the circle. Still eight points, and I could make a Chaos star from it with little trouble. But that's an official Chapter, and not one that's been excommunicated.

 

Heck, look at the Black Templars, or any chapter with their eight-pointed cross. It'd be comparatively little effort required to turn it into a variant Chaos star. Still an official Chapter, still not excommunicated.

 

The Imperium doesn't - as far as I can tell - immediately ban anything with eight points on it.

 

The Blazing Sons might draw some suspicions from paranoid inquisitors, but so does every other Chapter.

 

Remember, most people in 40k don't know diddly squat about Chaos (at least up until the Cicatrix Maledictum, no idea what the status quo is in that regard in modern 40k. Frankly at that point everyone has much bigger problems than the Blazing Sons' choice of Chapter Badge, though!) so the badge having eight points won't have peasants in the streets or grunts in the trenches muttering prayers, averting their eyes and making the sign of the aquila to ward off the evil giants.

 

 

All that said, if the badge remains a sticking point, I'd posit that adding more, smaller spikes might be easier (and cooler) than removing existing ones.

If I had any art skills at all, I'd offer to help. Sadly this is far, far beyond my skill level. sweat.gif


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#18
Brother Lunkhead

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…… and Brother Ace makes some fine points (pun?....yes.gif) too.

 

I'll just say that I don't have anything against the number eight or symbols with eight pointy things per say, nor do I think Brother Grey would be out of place if he decides to use his very cool heraldry as is. I'm just pointing (ouchohmy.png ..... I did it again) out possibilities.


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#19
Brother Cambrius

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Well, hello there old acquaintance, the fire rises once more!

 

Now then straight into the current point( :P ) of the matter, the symbol is a okay. There's no distinctive arrowhead as per the norm to imply chaos stuff, (plus it would mean the similar star for my Swords of Orion are in trouble...). I think it was Dazzo's handiwork on the creation of the heraldry with the extra bits and pieces. He was a great chap. I miss him...

 

Now onto the meat of the chapter discussion.

 

So first off, one thing is missing to my eyes, why are the Blazing Sons stationed where they are? What must they protect/counteract in this deadly galaxy of the Imperium's myriad of foes? Does what they fight affect their growth as a chapter and their combat style (eg lots of Orks  = Boltguns/Heavy Bolters galore instead of more exotic weaponry).

 

The idea of them judging on the merit of action as opposed to reputation is a cool one I like, woe betide a failed campaign somewhere to earn the ire and disgust of the Blazing Sons. Has there been any fallout from such an event that has led to strained relationships with specific factions like the Ecclesiarchy/Mechancium/Inquisitorial elements that have stewed and grown over the millennia? Though they are self-sufficient, such acts could emphasise this trait further as they aren't cool with their local corner-shops of warfare.

 

The feudal world idea I like a lot, Bjorn's concept of the labs possibly creating monstrosities that roam and hunt the lands is a pretty interesting concept too, it could really add to some flavour of legend for the local populace of old Medieval monsters hunting out in the lands and to defeat one is a great trial fore a young warrior/squire to become a Blazing Son. It doesn't have to be a horde of these gribblies, just enough to appear seasonally as they seek new food from the citizens. In terms of tech, the ruins of the old world carrying some vestiges of the past is fun and certainly doable, I wonder if techmarines would be looked upon as wizards akin to their psyker brethren for making machines work? (Also as an aside, just imagine armour made from bits of the Steel Men that fell in war on clan leaders and such. How the mighty hath fallen to become trinkets. :P)

 

It's a good framework to start, now let's see it grow. :D

 

Cambrius


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#20
Bjorn Firewalker

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I wonder if techmarines would be looked upon as wizards akin to their psyker brethren for making machines work?

An interesting point, one that can add a lot of flavor to this IA, distinguishing it from others' works.

Also as an aside, just imagine armour made from bits of the Steel Men that fell in war on clan leaders and such. How the mighty hath fallen to become trinkets.

The armor is unlikely to be powered (artificial intelligence- known to the Imperium as "abominable intelligence"- will likely be required to control the actuators, in the absence of machine spirits approved for use in Imperial power armor); but if you turn the T-800 into a set of plate armor, you will certainly make its wearer look AWESOME.

Edited by Bjorn Firewalker, 01 December 2019 - 07:28 PM.

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Wolf Scout- Catachan barking toad eggs+ Thousand Sons Marine= Fun! (Wolves of Catachan)

Warhammer 40,000+ Star Wars- Rian Johnson- Reylo= AWESOME! (Knights of Renaissance)

Reasons to use the Steel Crusaders ('Codex: Space Marines' supplement) or the Iron-hearted Angels ('Codex: Blood Angels' supplement): Because you think giving Sternguard Veterans a heavy bolter wtih special issue HEAVY BOLTER ammunition is ALMOST as much fun as shoehorning an Earthshaker cannon into a Land Raider.

#21
Brother Lunkhead

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Greetings Hereticsteehee.gif msn-wink.gif

 

Posted Yesterday, 12:37 PM

 

So first off, one thing is missing to my eyes, why are the Blazing Sons stationed where they are? What must they protect/counteract in this deadly galaxy of the Imperium's myriad of foes? Does what they fight affect their growth as a chapter and their combat style (eg lots of Orks  = Boltguns/Heavy Bolters galore instead of more exotic weaponry).

 

Very good point. This is an area I'd be very interested to see in more detail.

 

The feudal world idea I like a lot, Bjorn's concept of the labs possibly creating monstrosities that roam and hunt the lands is a pretty interesting concept too, it could really add to some flavour of legend for the local populace of old Medieval monsters hunting out in the lands and to defeat one is a great trial fore a young warrior/squire to become a Blazing Son. It doesn't have to be a horde of these gribblies, just enough to appear seasonally as they seek new food from the citizens.

 

I like this too. It would tie in nicely with Brother Grey's idea of the ancient gene-labs here:

 

[Had an idea for some gene-labs to be hidden in the worlds spinal mountain ranges, falling into almost complete, irreparable disrepair with the fall of the local AI mainframe during the fall. It was designed with a little hinted at intrigue in mind, however I don't feel like it adds anything to the overall picture so I think I'll drop it.]

 

It just needs to be fleshed out more. Perhaps these creatures were created by the original colonists to help combat the Men of Iron.... or the reverse. The Men of Iron created them to eradicate the colonists

 

Posted Yesterday, 05:45 PM

 

Brother Cambrius, on 30 Nov 2019 - 12:37 PM, said:snapback.png

I wonder if techmarines would be looked upon as wizards akin to their psyker brethren for making machines work?

An interesting point, one that can add a lot of flavor to this IA, distinguishing it from others' works.

 

Indeed. Just some clarification for me..... We are talking about the local population seeing the Techmarines as wizards, right?

 

Quote

Also as an aside, just imagine armour made from bits of the Steel Men that fell in war on clan leaders and such. How the mighty hath fallen to become trinkets.

The armor is unlikely to be powered (artificial intelligence- known to the Imperium as "abominable intelligence"- will likely be required to control the absence of machine spirits approved for use in Imperial power armor), but if you turn the T-800 into a set of plate armor, you will certainly make its wearer look AWESOME.

 

Perhaps as artificer armor for Champions and some officers.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      


Edited by Brother Lunkhead, 01 December 2019 - 07:49 PM.

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#22
Grey Hunter Ydalir

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Alright, well after a few days hiatus, returning home from a required course for work, I'm at my day-job and it's as usual, slow.

 

Therefore, in-between large bouts of sweet-FA, I can get a couple of posts in here at the Liber. So, conceitedly, I'll start with my own project first!

 

I think the common consensus for the chapter symbol seems to be that the eight-pointed halo can be left as is, which I'll take since it's less work for me! I was also doing some thinking on this over the last day or two and considering the half-halo and other Imperial iconography had an eight pointed motif at times before and after the Heresy, I think I can justify their use. Either that or take one of the angles and turn it into a planetary ring, since it'd suit the symbol I think. That's more of a stop-gap later down the line.

 

Perhaps the symbol is taken from something pre-strife that is present on the world? If we go with the gene-labs, perhaps it was the symbol of their particular division? Or the civil order/defense unit for the world? Either or, I think that could work too. In that way, it would be a more sacredly held icon and would perhaps help avoid issues with other organisations? Maybe, or maybe this is going a little too much into the weeds here, it's just a thought.

 

 

Well, hello there old acquaintance, the fire rises once more!

 

Now then straight into the current point( tongue.png ) of the matter, the symbol is a okay. There's no distinctive arrowhead as per the norm to imply chaos stuff, (plus it would mean the similar star for my Swords of Orion are in trouble...). I think it was Dazzo's handiwork on the creation of the heraldry with the extra bits and pieces. He was a great chap. I miss him...

 

Now onto the meat of the chapter discussion.

 

So first off, one thing is missing to my eyes, why are the Blazing Sons stationed where they are? What must they protect/counteract in this deadly galaxy of the Imperium's myriad of foes? Does what they fight affect their growth as a chapter and their combat style (eg lots of Orks  = Boltguns/Heavy Bolters galore instead of more exotic weaponry).

 

The idea of them judging on the merit of action as opposed to reputation is a cool one I like, woe betide a failed campaign somewhere to earn the ire and disgust of the Blazing Sons. Has there been any fallout from such an event that has led to strained relationships with specific factions like the Ecclesiarchy/Mechancium/Inquisitorial elements that have stewed and grown over the millennia? Though they are self-sufficient, such acts could emphasise this trait further as they aren't cool with their local corner-shops of warfare.

 

The feudal world idea I like a lot, Bjorn's concept of the labs possibly creating monstrosities that roam and hunt the lands is a pretty interesting concept too, it could really add to some flavour of legend for the local populace of old Medieval monsters hunting out in the lands and to defeat one is a great trial fore a young warrior/squire to become a Blazing Son. It doesn't have to be a horde of these gribblies, just enough to appear seasonally as they seek new food from the citizens. In terms of tech, the ruins of the old world carrying some vestiges of the past is fun and certainly doable, I wonder if techmarines would be looked upon as wizards akin to their psyker brethren for making machines work? (Also as an aside, just imagine armour made from bits of the Steel Men that fell in war on clan leaders and such. How the mighty hath fallen to become trinkets. tongue.png)

 

It's a good framework to start, now let's see it grow. biggrin.png

 

Cambrius

 

Cambrius, good lord, this is a magnet isn't it? Glad to see you're still kicking about.

 

Right, so onto your first point. Where are they and why?

 

In the past I always have my chapters fighting off localized threats, renegades and Dark Eldar. I actually love the Dark Eldar for all my chapters as an enemy, since the whole galaxy is their playground for slave raids. It makes sense for almost any human world to have suffered their depredations before, as well as still being alive and present. You snatch up some of the population, sow fear in the rest and then abscond and await them to breed more slaves for you. It allows them to have a history of conflict without the local population being completely devastated by a more wantonly destructive enemy. It also gives the Astartes a run for their money against a technologically advanced foe who isn't necessarily interested in fighting them per-se, considering these guys subsequent link to their homeworld, having to protect the people of the world would be a good start.

 

I'd say it's one of many worlds that the Imperium is aware of, yet has neither had the opportunity, nor necessarily the local need to bring them back into compliance considering the expense of the operation, vs the known resources or lack thereof for the world (relatively secret gene-lab complex notwithstanding).

 

As for weaponry? Kinetic, bolters, assault canons, missile launchers etc. I think they'd appreciate a somewhat lower tech style of warfare where applicable, as well as the obvious melee component. This also works well against Dark Eldar considering most of their units are armoured with paper-mache. It also ties into the reliability aspect. If you maintain your weapons, you can clear almost any malfunction in the field. Anything plasma, melta or otherwise wouldn't have the same level of ease of maintenance, also losing the ability to cannibalize other weapons for parts if need be.

 

 

Now as to which organizations would suffer the most from how the Blazing Sons view them on merit? Probably the Ecclesiarchy and elements of the Inquisition, given their respective track records. That said, it'd be on an individual basis, along with any planetary governors they interact with. I wouldn't think they hold grudges, more that they have a long memory and if you're a known quantity to them and you don't redeem yourself in their eyes, they'll have nothing to do with you. On the other side of the coin, I doubt a lot of organizations would be particularly happy to be judged and then given the cold shoulder for one of their members by a group of travelling Astartes.

 

I could see Inquisitors being petty, but dismissive. I can see Ecclesiarchal figures being extremely egotistical in the reaction to their dismissal by the Sons and causing no end of trouble, especially if the overzealous Sisters are under their direction. I'd like to see a proper conflict here. The Guard as a whole wouldn't be too bothered, they'd just assign a different liaison or commander, especially if the Sons concerns are valid and taken seriously, though aristocratic regiments may have an issue.

 

I love the term 'corner-shops of warfare'. For the Adeptus Mechanicus, perhaps a functional relationship at best. They don't like how self-sufficient the chapter is, but are content to supply them only on request. I don't think they'd have much to do with them to be honest. Though it is conceivable for them to have a conflict with a magos or dominus as part of an Explorator fleet, or Rogue Trader expedition which could lead to some censure, but I'm not sure it'd affect them too much. I can see the Sons simply being pragmatic and requesting material from another forge world if someone is causing a problem, or just wait for them to die!

 

If anyone has any input for some of these I'd appreciate it, as I think my opinion is fairly limited in scope.

 

 

Now, the idea of the techno-wizards as they're seen by the populace is a good one and something I could definitely work in as a side-note.

 

So in terms of era, it's an early feudal, saxon/anglo saxon inspired world. I'd see it slightly closer to germanic sagas in terms of how they hunt creatures, but I'd rather not stray too far into Wolfy territory, so perhaps I'll work something out that's a bit more unique to the world and cross the cultures a little.

 

In my recent musings I was thinking of the creatures. I'd perhaps see it as a Caliban-lite. It's not a death world, but the creatures are large enough, numerous enough and aggressive enough that they warrant a regular culling by the planets warriors. An event to even bring together warring tribes or cities for common-survival. The gene-labs that existed on the world pre-fall were used to experiment with the local fauna, yet when the fall suddenly came the labs were compromised and the creatures that survived the fighting were unleashed into the wilderness, where they adapted and survived over the millennia.

 

Over time the cities technological defenses break down and fail as power runs out and maintenance breaks down and the populace has to fend for itself, thus resulting in the necessity to bring these creatures to heel on a regular basis.They'd bring the young males as a right of passage, expecting them to assist or even claim a kill themselves.

 

Now, just what these creatures are is what I can't seem to settle on. There are a lot of other chapters that I'd be stepping on the toes of culturally speaking no matter where I go. Considering these are genetically altered creatures it could be almost anything but I've yet to find something I'm happy with. My most recent thoughts have been more on the altering of normally docile creatures like Deer to become apex-predators. The Stag is a fairly enduring symbol in a lot of saxon imagery so it works, but I'm not sure how else to proceed really. 

 

 

 

As to the men of Iron mentioned by a few of you, it'd be interesting to see. If the world survived the fall I'd expect evidence of it somewhere. Perhaps the high-king(s?) of the world have various items related to their station that are pieces of Iron Men, as perhaps the first leaders of the survivors from so long ago were from the military or civil defense who managed to fight and survive the apocalypse, claiming the trophies as a measure of authority. I think it works.

 

Would anyone have any suggestions as to where they could be located? My knowledge of the Imperium since the big old warp tear split the damn thing is not so crash-hot. I usually have my chapters in relatively far flung locations, but it really doesn't matter given the depth of the galaxy and how worlds can be lost and found in even the densest of Imperial controlled territory.

 

Thank you everyone for your continued input. I'm mulling things through as I go, since I don't always have the necessary time to work on this (work, kids, study, etc). I'll try and get a slightly more fleshed out main post sometime soon.

 

 

Damn, I really do ramble a lot.


The Octaguide.
The Thousand Marine Myth.

On the scale mismatch of bolts and bolters by Coldfyre

Commissar Molotov's Castigators - Essential reading for IA Creation.

"...I have seen the birth of this world and I have seen its death. I walked with the first men and I shared a beer with the last. For me everyone is both old and young at the same time as a million lifetimes pass before my eyes and humanity is like the grains of sand in the desert, each breath to me a sigh in the vast never-ending vacumn of space."
-Silver Phoenix


#23
Bjorn Firewalker

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For the Adeptus Mechanicus, perhaps a functional relationship at best. They don't like how self-sufficient the chapter is, but are content to supply them only on request.

I doubt the AdMech will give a damn how self-sufficient a Chapter is. A greater concern is whether or not the Marines will offer the military aid they're obligated to provide, according to the treaty the Emperor negotiated between Terra and Mars. If a forge world's workers go on strike to bargain for safer working conditions or greater worker benefits, and its ruling magi ask the Marines to break up this strike, you can be certain the AdMech will be PISSED if the Marines choose to side with the workers instead.

I don't think they'd have much to do with them to be honest. Though it is conceivable for them to have a conflict with a magos or dominus as part of an Explorator fleet, or Rogue Trader expedition which could lead to some censure, but I'm not sure it'd affect them too much.

If a useful STC pattern is discovered, it WILL affect everyone on the expedition, as the AdMech will stop at nothing to get its hands on the pattern.

This can be a good opportunity to give your Chapter a history. Say Rogue Trader discovers an intact or near-intact STC pattern, which an AdMech Magos attempts to seize without compensating the Rogue Trader, leading to a tense standoff between the Magos and the Rogue Trader's bodyguards- the latter of which include Marines accompanying him. As the AdMech and the Rogue Trader's house are both vital allies, the Chapter Master appeals to an Archmagos to resolve the dispute; before the Marines receive the Archmagos' reply, the Magos attempts to seize the STC pattern by force, and the Marines kill him in self-defense. The Archmagos publicly condemns his impulsive subordinate, and agrees to the price the Rogue Trader demands for the STC pattern- but the fact the Marines killed an AdMech Magos (even a criminal one) creates tension between the Chapter and certain forge worlds where the condemned Magos has relatives in high positions.

My most recent thoughts have been more on the altering of normally docile creatures like Deer to become apex-predators. The Stag is a fairly enduring symbol in a lot of saxon imagery so it works, but I'm not sure how else to proceed really.

Giant carnivorous stag beetles that evolved to resemble actual stags, to lure their prey- deer as well as the wolves that prey upon them- within reach of the beetles' mandibles? Perytons (known as "preytons," with the "r" and "e" transposed, in Warhammer Fantasy)?
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Wolf Scout- Catachan barking toad eggs+ Thousand Sons Marine= Fun! (Wolves of Catachan)

Warhammer 40,000+ Star Wars- Rian Johnson- Reylo= AWESOME! (Knights of Renaissance)

Reasons to use the Steel Crusaders ('Codex: Space Marines' supplement) or the Iron-hearted Angels ('Codex: Blood Angels' supplement): Because you think giving Sternguard Veterans a heavy bolter wtih special issue HEAVY BOLTER ammunition is ALMOST as much fun as shoehorning an Earthshaker cannon into a Land Raider.

#24
Grey Hunter Ydalir

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For the Adeptus Mechanicus, perhaps a functional relationship at best. They don't like how self-sufficient the chapter is, but are content to supply them only on request.

I doubt the AdMech will give a damn how self-sufficient a Chapter is. A greater concern is whether or not the Marines will offer the military aid they're obligated to provide, according to the treaty the Emperor negotiated between Terra and Mars. If a forge world's workers go on strike to bargain for safer working conditions or greater worker benefits, and its ruling magi ask the Marines to break up this strike, you can be certain the AdMech will be PISSED if the Marines choose to side with the workers instead.

I don't think they'd have much to do with them to be honest. Though it is conceivable for them to have a conflict with a magos or dominus as part of an Explorator fleet, or Rogue Trader expedition which could lead to some censure, but I'm not sure it'd affect them too much.

If a useful STC pattern is discovered, it WILL affect everyone on the expedition, as the AdMech will stop at nothing to get its hands on the pattern.

This can be a good opportunity to give your Chapter a history. Say Rogue Trader discovers an intact or near-intact STC pattern, which an AdMech Magos attempts to seize without compensating the Rogue Trader, leading to a tense standoff between the Magos and the Rogue Trader's bodyguards- the latter of which include Marines accompanying him. As the AdMech and the Rogue Trader's house are both vital allies, the Chapter Master appeals to an Archmagos to resolve the dispute; before the Marines receive the Archmagos' reply, the Magos attempts to seize the STC pattern by force, and the Marines kill him in self-defense. The Archmagos publicly condemns his impulsive subordinate, and agrees to the price the Rogue Trader demands for the STC pattern- but the fact the Marines killed an AdMech Magos (even a criminal one) creates tension between the Chapter and certain forge worlds where the condemned Magos has relatives in high positions.

My most recent thoughts have been more on the altering of normally docile creatures like Deer to become apex-predators. The Stag is a fairly enduring symbol in a lot of saxon imagery so it works, but I'm not sure how else to proceed really.

Giant carnivorous stag beetles that evolved to resemble actual stags, to lure their prey- deer as well as the wolves that prey upon them- within reach of the beetles' mandibles? Perytons (known as "preytons," with the "r" and "e" transposed, in Warhammer Fantasy)?

 

 

 

These are some great ideas. Firstly, I tend to agree that the AdMech wouldn't necessarily care whether the chapter was self-sufficient or not, but it would dictate how often the chapter may request resupply. There's no point in wasting materials when they're not needed. As to the treaties, that's true to an extent though usually individual chapters will have their own list of allies and contracts between forge-worlds and manufactorum worlds.

 

The idea of an STC causing conflict is also a good one as it changes the dynamic between the parties involved. My mind springs to the worker-conflict on the Speranza for example, as well as the various different Techpriests and Rogue Trader and other elements that come into various levels of conflict throughout.

 

I'll think on this. I don't want to create needless conflict just to make them edgy like I have done before, to my detriment. However, adding tension would be great.

 

Now the beetles, that's an idea. On your suggestion I just had the thought to perhaps, rather than limit it to a specific genus, have the creatures that were experimented on be varied and as such, different areas of the world are host to different dangerous packs of creatures. Those in the crag-valleys would perhaps have the beetles and ferocious lizard kind, while those living close to the sparse forests would have the apex-deers, and so on and so forth. As such, each city would likely have different trophies. Perhaps, though the inspiration for different kinds of creatures than those I had locked my mind on due to previous influence is appreciated.


The Octaguide.
The Thousand Marine Myth.

On the scale mismatch of bolts and bolters by Coldfyre

Commissar Molotov's Castigators - Essential reading for IA Creation.

"...I have seen the birth of this world and I have seen its death. I walked with the first men and I shared a beer with the last. For me everyone is both old and young at the same time as a million lifetimes pass before my eyes and humanity is like the grains of sand in the desert, each breath to me a sigh in the vast never-ending vacumn of space."
-Silver Phoenix


#25
Grey Hunter Ydalir

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Just spent the last few minutes banging out a first go at the Homeworld. Let me know if it... sucks.sweat.gif
 
Thanks in advance, to anyone who wants to read it.
 
Cheers!
 
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Homeworld.
 
The Blazing Sons call the world of Jardenfel, home. A cold, world on the Eastern Fringe. Jardenfel is a relatively sparse, rocky world. Jagged hills and sheer cliffs dominate the landscape while small cities dot the landscape of the largest continent. The world was originally colonised during humanities golden age, chosen for it's location away from the galactic trade routes and a lack of extensive natural resources made it a prime location for a set of gene-labs not unlike the Emperors own facilities on Terra. Extreme experimentation on local and imported fauna was undertaken for reasons now lost to time. When humanities fall came, Vvardenfel's labs were overrun and it's experiments escaped into the wild, adding to the chaos. Only desperate holding actions by the worlds last defenders prevented total genocide.
 
With the fall came silence. Cut off from the rest of humanity the world gradually contracted, both culturally and technologically. Farming land and herding grounds became war-worthy among the scattered bands of humanity. Only the few surviving cities could build or produce anything of note. So power consolidated with the ruling clans of the cities and few independants who produced food in return for basics such as woven fabrics and stone bricks.
 
Technology has not disappeared completely on Jardenfel, but has been severely stunted as the millennia passed. Electricity gave way to torches and woodfires. Conduits and panels were covered with stone brick and timber as their uses faded. As it stands, while the world holds a feudal level culture and general technology level, some more modern pieces are not unknown. Household artisans can still make what would be common items in the wider imperium, yet are considered almost priceless and heirloom items.
 
The ancient experiments also flourished and quickly came into conflict with the survivors. As time passed, the new predatory wildlife quickly threatened all they came into conflict with. Eventually it became tradition for once every decade for a great hunt to be undertaken to cull the worst of the beasts. The tribes and clans would lay down their arms against each other and pursue the beasts that threaten their homes. The youths of the world are expected to defend their homes while the warriors are gone.
 
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The Octaguide.
The Thousand Marine Myth.

On the scale mismatch of bolts and bolters by Coldfyre

Commissar Molotov's Castigators - Essential reading for IA Creation.

"...I have seen the birth of this world and I have seen its death. I walked with the first men and I shared a beer with the last. For me everyone is both old and young at the same time as a million lifetimes pass before my eyes and humanity is like the grains of sand in the desert, each breath to me a sigh in the vast never-ending vacumn of space."
-Silver Phoenix






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