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Chapter Approved Discussion


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35 replies to this topic

#1
Chris521

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Not many things changed but there are things to talk about

 
Astropaths -11
Russ-15
Mortars +4
lascannon -5
Missile launcher -5
scions -2 This one seems massive
 
Wyvern...+10 wut?
 
Vulture +25? (don't remember base), but it isn't affected by the punisher cannon increase.

 

Unfortunately the punisher cannon went up 10. Though personally, I use my Russes for anti tank anyway.

 

The BaneBlade, BaneHammer, and BaneSword went down 40.


Edited by Chris521, 30 November 2019 - 05:18 PM.

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#2
mertbl

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The wyvern is the most confusing thing I've seen out of CA.

Mortars went up to 9 or added 9 points?

#3
Chris521

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Mortars went up to 9 or added 9 points?

sorry up to 9 I fixed it



#4
duz_

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Seems like a dyslexic decision in changes
Vigilus made wyvren barely playable adding points to them sets them back again

I like russes going down rumours were tank commanders went up 20 which maybe with the -15 on the basic ones means just +5?

Glad the lascannon and mls got cheaper

Any word on FW fliers :D

#5
Chris521

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Well the D6 evolution channel on youtube has a video with all of the stills.  I wasn't sure if I'm allowed to post it.

 

Unfortunately the punisher cannon went up 10. Though personally, I use my Russes for anti tank anyway.

 

The BaneBlade, BaneHammer, and BaneSword went down 40.


Edited by Chris521, 30 November 2019 - 03:49 PM.


#6
duz_

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I'm glad BBs went down just those 3 variants though? The lascannon changes would impact them too?

I actually pulled the punisher from my list so I'm ok with that


Why did ogryns go up?

#7
Chris521

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I have no idea what's going on with Ogryns when the good version of the unit remain the same.  Maybe GW saw Mordian Glory's video where he tried to make a case for them a few months back?


Edited by Chris521, 30 November 2019 - 04:02 PM.

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#8
GuardDaddy

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I run Lascannons in infantry/vets as my army anti tank (saved 40pts)

 

3 astropaths saves me another 30.

 

Wyvern and 9 morters takes back some - I'm about 30pts better off.


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I am creating a custom regiment, the Fallax Hammers based on Necromunda models. Please take a moment to view Work in Progress here

 

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#9
Santaclauswitz

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37 points gained in my current list! I could get a squad of scions... how much have the changes affected your lists?
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#10
GuardDaddy

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I'm now very very very tempted to do some scions using the Necromunda police figures.. 7pts with hotshot lasgun is very interesting


I am creating a custom regiment, the Fallax Hammers based on Necromunda models. Please take a moment to view Work in Progress here

 

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#11
Santaclauswitz

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I'm now very very very tempted to do some scions using the Necromunda police figures.. 7pts with hotshot lasgun is very interesting


They look pretty monopose on the sprue. I picked up a pack last week but haven't built them. I'm also not a great modeller so I might be totally wrong.

#12
GuardDaddy

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They look pretty monopose on the sprue. I picked up a pack last week but haven't built them. I'm also not a great modeller so I might be totally wrong.

 

 

I'm fine with the Necromunda sculpts - its my army theme

http://www.bolterand...mers-wip/page-3


I am creating a custom regiment, the Fallax Hammers based on Necromunda models. Please take a moment to view Work in Progress here

 

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#13
Santaclauswitz

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Very nice!

#14
WarriorFish

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The drop for Stormies is great, will really help them out smile.png Good to see some heavy weapon adjustments that are appropriate too, but that said for Mortars their attraction was the cost! Not like they were that good, but I don't mind it. Not sure on the Punisher, it's not a good gun outside of a Tank Commander but not a big deal with an overall Russ change so it's fine.

 

Wyvern increase is a strange one, not sure on why that was thought necessary? Not too bad overall if this is all the changes for Guard, other armies need more help and should get it and I like what I see here :tu:


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#15
sairence

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The Wyvern with the Vigilus detachment has been a staple of tournament lists for a while now. Even without it's a really solid unit. I'm not surprised it went up.

For me, the most surprising and welcome is that LR with Battlecannon is now 137p. Armoured Assault, here I come.
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#16
duz_

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From goonhammer
https://www.goonhamm...nhammer-review/

Astra Militarum


Robert “TheChirurgeon” Jones

Biggest Winners:

Baneblade / Banehammer / Banesword / Doomhammer
Leman Russ Tanks
Non-mortar heavy weapons
Tempestus Scions
Biggest Losers:

Ogryns
Wyverns
Mortars
Vulture Gunships
Punisher Gatling Cannons

Astra Militarum were in a pretty solid place and so the tweaks they’ve received are more about adjusting playstyles rather than completely nerfing the army or trying to catch it up competitively. The army’s super-heavy tanks – the Baneblade and its variants – all dropped between 20 and 40 points. Tempestus Scions also won big, getting a 2 ppm drop, and Leman Russes came down 15 points.

On the losing end, Ogryns (+6), Wyverns (+10), and Mortars (+4) all saw significant increases, with the latter seeing some mitigation in that lascannons (-5) and missile launchers (-5) both got cheaper. In the case of lascannons, they got cheaper for the entire army, so the cost of some tanks will also have gone down.

Overall, these changes amount to more of an annoyance for Guard than a true challenge. They’ll squeeze the points out of other detachments in a soup army, but monofaction guard should easily regain anything lost to mortars with other units.


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#17
GuardDaddy

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Reflecting I think they are pricing in indirect fire. This is fair enough. If anything basilisk dodged a bullet!!!

I am creating a custom regiment, the Fallax Hammers based on Necromunda models. Please take a moment to view Work in Progress here

 

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#18
HallofStovokor

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It wasn't too bad. My standard TAC list went up 3 points I can adjust by dropping the stubber from my punisher and giving the Ministorum priest a Laspistol instead of a bolt pistol. He's not really there for a direct contribution to the fight anyways. I could also drop the 10th infantry squad and use the points on better wargear.

#19
GuardDaddy

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Psyker Bomb: 

3 Primaris Psyker = 138pts (3 smites)

3 Astropaths = 48pts (one Maelstrom, 2 defence buffs)

 

186pts

 

 

I'd bought into the 5pts guardsman worries and so had been just planning for 50pt squads....... on that basis I now get a missile launcher for the 50pts I'd planned!


Edited by GuardDaddy, 01 December 2019 - 08:08 AM.

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I am creating a custom regiment, the Fallax Hammers based on Necromunda models. Please take a moment to view Work in Progress here

 

gallery_30308_9518_2534.pnggallery_48988_15465_10130.png

 
 

#20
H311fi5h

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I'm quite worried the Ogryn nerf was ment for Bullgryns and will get errata'd. At that point pure Guard Armies would become very hard to play in a competitive setting, making soup almost mandatory. At the same time they buffed regular Custodes, so maybe we'll just have to play gold plated Bullgryns If that happens?

Other thoughts:
- Do you think the Baneblade buff has pushed them over the edge into playability (in non-meme armies)? I'd love to bringe them out, but I have the feeling the lack of an invuln and machine spirit resurgent equivalent hurts too much.
- Leman Russ spam? Harker surrounded by 6 regular russes with battle cannon, tripple heavy bolter and stubber clocks in at 980 points. Sucks against stacked hit modifiers though.
- How do we gun down hordes in the future? Vultures are out of the picture, mortar teams probably too. Punisher TC's and Wyverns took a hit as well.
- Are scion bombs back?

Edited by H311fi5h, 01 December 2019 - 02:13 PM.


#21
sairence

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I'm sure we'll still see Mortars and Wyverns in mono or mostly Guard lists...the reductions in other stuff that comes with those lists balances it out. Bringing 3 Astropaths with their reduction alone pays for the Mortars.

They will be pricier to bring in soup lists that only ally in some Guard. I think that was the main aim. Except for the Ogryns...no idea what they were thinking. I don't think the increase was meant for Bullgryns. It'd be a pretty massive mistake.
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#22
Galron

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Sweet. Hopefully the Russ price decrease extends to FW models. My Annihilator might actually be worth bringing now. My Infantry list just went down quite a bit with its 9 lascannons, 3 missile launchers and 15 Tempestus. Now I get to add at least 2 "assault" squads. Ill save a few points on my mech team army.but nothing huge without FW drops. Guess I will go see if I can find them. Tempestus army has the point savings pretty much eaten by the Vulture increase. :/


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#23
crimsondave

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The Death Korps of Krieg "update" for FW was a real head scratcher.



#24
duz_

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I think goonhammer sums up the changes to ogryns quite well:

I also don’t quite know who has been bullying the GW design team with regular Ogryns, but I confidently predict their big cost increase will take them from “seeing no play” to “seeing no play”.



:ermm:
I had actually considered them for one list but probably not now

Rough numbers on my new list I'm yet to try could see a 30pt reduction :D

Also means I might start using some of my many Mordian lascannons :tu:

#25
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So what units are “officially” legended, I assume Ponies are Dodo’d anything else?
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