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2000pts Argent Shroud and Valourous Heart


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#1
bkde

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Below is a list that I'm refining, ran a 1750pt version of it at a local RTT and went 2-1.

 

2000pts of Sisters Goodness

 

Battalion (Argent Shroud)

Missionary w/autogun, laspistol, chainsword

Celestine

3x 5 BSS w/2x stormbolter and chainsword on superior

5 Retributors w/4x Heavy flamer

1x 3 Mortifiers - All have heavy bolters, two have double buzz blades, one double whips

3x Immolators w/immo flamers and the heavy bolter

 

Outrider (Argent Shroud)

Cannoness w/ blessed blade and inferno pistol (Optional upgrade to Blade of Admonition or book St. Lucius and Indom Belief)

Inquisitor Coteaz (option upgrade to psychic mastery warlord trait)

5 Seraphim w/2x twin inferno pistols, plasma pistol on superior

5 Seraphim w/2x twin inferno pistols

10 Seraphim all with bolt pistols

 

Spearhead (Valourous Heart)

Cannoness  (Warlord) w/ bolt pistol and power sword and rod of office, Beacon of Faith and Litanies of Faith

Imagifier 

3x Exorcists w/Exorcist launchers and heavy bolters

 

 

When I played the list before, I stuck the Tale of the Stoic on the Imagifier, the ability to ignore AP-2 to AP 0 on the exorcists was ace.  Sacred Rite Hand of the Emperor for +1 advance/charge worked great with Argent Shroud. Only things I added in the bump up to 2000 from 1750 were dropping Stormbolter doms (lack of vanguard affecting the vehicles hurts) and opted to put in something silly like the 4 Heavy Flamer Rets and mortifiers. 

 

I could swap to the standard load out of melta doms in Repressors, but I wanted to give the Mortifiers and Heavy Flamer rets a shot.  Coteaz is there to dish out mortal wounds (smite, terrify and castigation) and Deny the Witch attempts.

 

I'm anticipating I'll be a little CP light, as after the extra relic/warlord trait and giving Coteaz his warlord trait I'm going in with 7 CP.  2 CP needed for Deadly Descent to drop the two seraphim squads, 1-2 CP for Devastating Refrain, 1 CP for Celestine get back up reroll, possibly 1 for Martyr's Immolation, 1 CP for Purity of Faith, 1 CP for Suffer Not the Witch, 1 CP for Holy Rage...they start dropping off quick.


Edited by bkde, 13 December 2019 - 05:43 AM.

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#2
bkde

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Played the list above in a game against the new BA.  Maelstrom of War, one of the missions from Chapter Approved 2018.

 

There was a lot of ruin terrain on the board.  Can't remember what the final score was, but it was a loss for the ladies.

 

Things that worked well:

 

Coteaz.  He's a beast with the warlord trait stratagem (enabling him to cast 3, deny 2) and being able to smite/cast another power to dish out mortal wounds makes short work of 3++ storm shields

 

Seraphim, cannonesses, Celestine and the Exos also pulled their weight

 

Things that did not work well:

 

Mortifiers, they were difficult to manouver around all the ruins to get into good position to counterattack his squads when they came dropping in.  And as such they either got picked off by missiles or outmanouvered by Wings of Sanguinius/On Wings of Fire strat.  I'm not quite willing to drop them just yet, but they are tricky to manouver.  And having to walk around a lot of terrain with only a 9" move means they don't get as far as you want them to.

 

Rets with heavy flamers.  They're a bit of a one trick pony that is predictable.

 

Lack of CP's...really found I was CP strapped this game, started with only 7.

 

Possible changes:

 

Dropping the mortifiers and HF rets to make a Valourous Heart Battalion with 3 naked BSS squads, both Geminae since the points drop in CA to give Celestine more ablative wounds and adding in reinforcement points to be able to requisition an assassin.


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#3
bkde

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Revised the list again and shuffled around some wargear options.  Decided to drop the mortifiers entirely, stick with what I know how to use.

 

1905pts of Ladies, 95 reinforcement points

 

Battalion (Argent Shroud)

Missionary w/autogun, laspistol, chainsword

Cannoness inferno pistol, blessed blade (optional indon belief, book st. lucius, blade admonition)

2x 5 BSS w/2x stormbolter and combiflamer/chainsword on superior

5 BSS w/2x meltaguns and combimelta/chainsword on superior

10 seraphim with bolt pistols

2x 5 seraphim w/2x twin inferno pistols

3x Immolators w/immo flamers and the heavy bolter

 

Battalion - Valourous Heart

Cannoness  (Warlord) w/ bolt pistol and power sword and rod of office, Beacon of Faith and Litanies of Faith

Celestine

Inquisitor Coteaz (upgrade with warlord trait)

Imagifier 

3x 5 BSS w/chainsword on superior

3x Exorcists w/Exorcist launchers and heavy bolters

 

95pts spare to drop in an assassin

 

13CP, -1 for coteaz warlord, -1 for assassin, optional -1 heroine in making, optional -1 open reliqueries



#4
bkde

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Played the above against Thousand Sons, ITC Champions Missions #1.  I took a vindicare (only because I do not have a culexus painted), still kept him honest and his sorcerers hiding behind cover most of the game.

 

He didn't really have an answer to my exorcists and I kept him screened out of my deployment.  Other components of the list worked well and was a solid 35 to 9 victory for the ladies.

 

Looking forward to getting more games in with the list.



#5
Slasher956

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Is an assaissn worth the loss of sacred rites?

 

 

EDIT - in typical GW fashion the FAQ entry that says you lose the mono-faction bonus for taking an assassin ISNT found in the assassins FAQ but rather the SM Codex one......


Edited by Slasher956, 18 January 2020 - 12:02 PM.

Dyspraxic & Dyslexic  - So I might not write/explain what I think I have as clearly as intended to.... 

 

I'm confussed... what side of the fence am I on???

 

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#6
bkde

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Is an assaissn worth the loss of sacred rites?

 

 

EDIT - in typical GW fashion the FAQ entry that says you lose the mono-faction bonus for taking an assassin ISNT found in the assassins FAQ but rather the SM Codex one......

 

Yes, no, maybe?  I think it really depends.  I ran a vindicare (it and an eversor are all I have painted) and just the threat of being able to snipe out characters made him keep Ahriman and his sorcerers much further back or out of optimal spots.

 

I think both sacred rites and assassins bring a lot of utility and enable a bit of tailoring based on the opponent.  With the current meta though, as so many lists are dependent on having a few key characters to make them work, that character killing threat really keeps people on their toes.



#7
bkde

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Played the list above for first game of local competitive league.  Mission was Adepticon mission "Burn it Down"

 

https://www.adeptico...K9m7e-9bJ38AUPg

 

Opponents army was Imperial Guard:

Yarrick

3 Company Commanders

3x 10 guardmen

3x Tank Commanders with punisher gatling cannons and HB

Pask with punisher gatling and HB

3x 3 Basilisks

 

I looked at his army and nearly puked.  My warlord had litanies and beacon of faith.  Second canoness took blade of admonition and righteous rage warlord trait.  Coteaz took terrify and smite, for the assassin I chose a Eversor.  Starting deployment I put all 3 seraphim in deep strike.

 

Opponent won the roll to go first and blew away all three of my exorcists using his basilisks that were clumped together in a huge ridiculous mob to take advantage of Yarrick re-rolls on the right side of the board.  His tanks were all advancing on the left to seize the middle objective.

 

My turn one I used righteous rage to advance and charge in an immolator to his basilisk mob, charging one, then swinging in to tie up a second.  Coteaz (hero of the game) used terrify to shut down a leman russ, then charged with BSS support to trap the tank against the side of the board.  I failed to kill anything giving my opponent Solo Blood.

 

0-2 for my opponent.

 

Turn two he moved all of his basilisk blob to fall back and free everything up, his leman russes shot up an immo, killed a squad of BSS on the right midfield objective.  But now that his basilisks were all hitting on 5's or couldn't shoot his shooting was less effective.

 

My turn two I got the canoness and the squad of meltagun BSS into his objective on the upper right of the board.  Celestine moved up in front of a basilisk.      Dropped in my bolt pistol seraphim in to hold my left side deployment zone objective.  Coteaz smited and swung to kill the leman russ him and his BSS were locking up.  I then used Terrify to lock down Pask and Righteous Rage to charge Pask and lock him up with another squad of BSS.  Squad one of inferno pistol seraphim also dropped in on the right side middle objective to melta pistol a basilisk, but missed or failed to wound.  Shooting the meltagun squad and Canoness did damage to a basilisk, then charged in with all of them to lock down another basilisk.  Celestine charged in and tied up some basilisks, the immo that he fell back from charged in again, this time locking up two more basilisks.

 

3-5 for my opponent

 

Turn 3 my opponent only held one objective, the one in his deployment on the left side of the board.  I held the others.  Two basilisks had been destroyed and I had locked up 4 others in combat, leaving him with 3 to shoot with.  One guardsmen squad advanced to the center right objective.  His two non-locked down leman russes and basilisks that could fire shot up my seraphim and lone remaining sister superior and immolator around the center right objective.  He also gunned down my 10 seraphim holding the objective in my left deployment zone.  Yarrick charged into my immolator that was tying up his basilisks and they proceeded to slap each other.

 

My turn 3 I razed the objective in his right deployment zone, held the left centre, and right in my deployment zone, scoring me 7 points.  Celestine and Canoness continued their spree of murdering Basilisks (inferno pistol + Blade of Admonition did a lot of work), I pulled Coteaz back to my deploment zone left objective, and put two remaining BSS into combat with his Company Commander holding his left side deployment objective.  Seraphim dropped in and shot melta into his Leman Russ, Eversor dropped in out of LOS of his other Leman Russ.  Imagifier and Priest advanced up to clear the centre right objective of guard and company commander.  Charges saw both the Seraphim and Eversor go into his remaining Leman Russes, so that now Pask and one of the Tank Commanders could not move, Eversor tagged the remaining Tank Commander.  Two BSS went into his company commander on the objective in his back left deployment zone.  

 

10-6 for the ladies

 

His turn 4, he held the objective on the left side in his deployment, and the objective in the middle on the right.  Most of his basilisks were either dead or locked down, all of his Leman Russes were locked down.  He killed my missionary with lasguns then rushed to get his other squad of guardsmen over to the middle left objective.

 

My turn 4 I razed the center left objective.  Inferno pistol seraphim locking his tank shot it up point blank, Eversor did melta bomb things, he finally killed my immolator in his deployment zone,  Celestine and Canoness continued to kill his basilisks, Imagifier slapped his Company Commander.

 

15-9 for the ladies.

 

His turn 5 there really wasn't much to do, he scored 1 for holding the objective in his deployment zone on the left.  We called it after his turn as I would have scored an additional 5 points at the start of my turn (hold one objective, holding two objectives and linebreaker).

 

20-10 for the ladies!

 

This was a really ridiculous game.  That many basilisks were just gross, but grouping them all together to take advantage of Yarrick's re-roll ones was a mistake.  It enabled me to lock them all up by smashing immolators into them.  Coteaz and Terrify was the hero, shutting down his tank's overwatch then walking in to do flat three damage plus smites was great.  Canoness with inferno pistol, Blade of Admonition and Righteous Rage was a champ as well.



#8
bkde

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Played the above against GSC and tyranids.

Mission was from the Nova missions package: Invasion.

I chose end of game scoring and Headhunter, Shoot the Big Ones and Old School.

Opponent chose progressive scoring, Headhunter, Shoot the Big Ones and Recon.

I had first turn and I castled up and shot apart his artillery pieces using the exos awhile keeping him screened out. Trick was staying out of his 36” range. He blew apart my immos. Again Seraphim worked well to tie up his larger monsters and prevent his shooting. Culexes was a champ as well tying up his hive guard for two rounds and cutting his shooting. Game took a real swing on Round four, when I wiffed some key rolls, Celestine failed to get back up and I failed a few key saves.

Managed to battle back and the ladies took it 28 to 16 scoring 14 on primary, 11/12 secondaries and 3 on tertiary. Probably one of my favourite games so far this year.

#9
Astral Arcane

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Nice battle reports! I had forgotten how good Cotaez is, going to have to try taking him again. 



#10
bkde

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Third game of Competitive Champions League. Mission was ITC Mission #1 from 2020 Champions Package, opponent was another undefeated player.

 

I won the roll off for attacker/defender and chose defender, rolled up the 9" bubble in the middle and table quarter deployment (Seek and Destroy?).

 

Opponent was Eldar/Harlequins copy of the exact same list from the top Eldar player at LVO.  I think it was Battalion and Supreme Command but who was where I can only roughly recall.  Important thing with the Shining Spears is they get +1 Attack when within 3" of an objective and...something else.

 

Yncarne

Shadowseer (warlord)

Solitaire

2x 5 starweaver bikes w/haywire

2x deathjesters

 

Seer Council (2x warlocks on bikes)

Spiritseer

2x 8 shining spears

3x 5 rangers

 

For secondaries I took, Old School, Marked for Death on all his jetbikes and Ground Control (huge mistake as I misread the Behind Enemy Lines and thought it eliminated units with the FLY keyword, not FLYER battlefield role...whoops).  He took Headhunter, Behind Enemy Lines and Big Game Hunter.

 

I won the roll-off to go first and because I'm always suspicious of Eldar elected to go second...rookie move?

 

He deployed right on the line with all of his bikes.  I put the Exorcists in the far back, immolators up front to bait him so I could get some overwatch and blow them up, and put one squad of melta seraphim, culexus assassin and the bolt pistol seraphim in deep strike.  Remaining girls I hid behind a ruin on my side with all the characters, and screened out everything with battle sisters to prevent him from placing any bike bases anywhere to get to my exoricsts.

 

Game went something like this:

Turn one he moved all the bikes up, plinked away at the immos, shot up some battle sisters, psychic powers he had two double move spells, I was able to 4+ deny (with a re-roll) one of them.  He buffed up one squad of shining spears.  Shooting he stripped one exorcist down to 2 wounds using his harlequin haywire and plinked away at some immos (purposely choosing not to laser lance into the immos).  Charges he put harlequin bikes and shining spears into one immo, did the same with another immo.  He chose to just slap one immo, keeping his stuff safe in combat.  The other immo he destoryed with his buffed shinning spears, which I then blew up and stripped a few wounds.  

 

My counter attack I got everything within range, shot like crazy and killed...not much.  He rolled 4++ or 3++/5+ FNP's like a boss. Unengaged Harlequin bikes with -2 to hit meant my wounded exorcist had no targets.  I killed some harlequin bikes, and some shining spears, but not enough.  Charging I put Celestine, Coteaz and my Blade of Admonition Canoness into his harlequin bikes and buffed shining spears.  Again he rolled 4++ like a champ.  And I killed not enough.  

 

The game was basically over at this point.  He got into my exorcists, killed some battle sisters (warping the Yncarne in) then it was just mop up.  Psychic powers/shining spears/harlequin bikes took care of my characters.

 

I think I managed to kill one squad of shining spears to 2 models before he crushed my lines, and one squad of skyweavers to 1.  I had burned through CP at this point, the Culexus had stripped some wounds from his Shadowseer and resurrected Celestine managed to kill it.  Dropping in the Seraphim I was hopping to get lucky and nuke his Yncarne, but he passed all his saves and the melta did nothing.  

 

He did clock out around turn 5, but at that point I was basically tabled and had only the squad of 10 bolt pistol/hand flamer seraphim left.

 

Final score was a lot to a little.  I think I managed to get 11 points? But he definitely wrecked me pretty hard.

 

Things I would have done differently:

Whether or not being the defender vs. the attacker was a mistake.  I honestly don't know.  If I was attacker I would have had first turn, but Eldar have so many range shenanigans, he probably would have chosen my side for deployment, tucked all his bikes in the ruin out of LOS, and webwayed the max amount of units to have his bikes come in Turn 2 with all of his charge buffs.  I may have been able to screen him far enough back to deny the charges into my exorcists, but it's tough to call.

 

I definitely should have started both the Culexus (for the psychic bubble) and maybe the 2nd inferno pistol squad on the board.  Maybe even the Bolt Pistol/Hand Flamer seraphim.  Just giving me all hands on deck to try and blunt his turn one/turn two charge.  The 4++ and -1 to hit or the  3++/5+FNP is annoying, but the models are still only T4 and do go down to weight of fire.  And with that additional volume of fire I may have been able to down his unengaged squad of shining spears and harlequins.  Leaving me free to charge in with Celestine/Canoness/Coteaz vs his non-buffed engaged squads.  Because really, once those units are gone, the teeth of the list are gone.

 

Anyways, was good to play a really hard match against a really top notch list, and a top notch opponent.  This is a game where I really had to think, am I better swapping the Argent Shroud for Bloody Rose?  In this game, probably, but this is only one game out of a lot, and I absolutely love the freedom of movement granted by Argent Shroud.

 

At no point did I feel it was the girls letting me down, if anything it was me letting the girls down.  Which is frustrating when you have the tools for the job but still mess it up, that is part of the reason I feel so strongly about the importance in playing the same list over and over and over and over again to know the ins/outs of all your models.  Looking forward to a rematch, Eldar are always a hard matchup.


Edited by bkde, 11 March 2020 - 04:13 PM.


#11
Duke Danse Macabre

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Damn, looks like a hard game but you did well as it is just a copy paste Lvo list from a tournament player.
With eldar I find you want to go first, you need the time for your shooting, if you go first you can hurt him more but then they can jump onto objectives in their turn, it's hard to pin eldar down.
What I find works is if you can make 2 separate backbones at least 24 inches apart along your table edge with clear line of sight to each other.
This has the benefit of if he attacks one the other has lots of viable vulnerable targets, if he splits into 2 forces to multi task, focus on one then the remainder, means he can't use you to lock down combat and just sit there.

"In all my years of Study and Contemplation on the Imperial Truth, as close as I can figure out, it has something to do with Being on Fire."

 

Direct Quote from Chief Scribe Sweideger Steiger, Shortly before being burned to death by Sister Superior Larisa for Crimes of Heresy
 

 


#12
bkde

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Damn, looks like a hard game but you did well as it is just a copy paste Lvo list from a tournament player.
With eldar I find you want to go first, you need the time for your shooting, if you go first you can hurt him more but then they can jump onto objectives in their turn, it's hard to pin eldar down.
What I find works is if you can make 2 separate backbones at least 24 inches apart along your table edge with clear line of sight to each other.
This has the benefit of if he attacks one the other has lots of viable vulnerable targets, if he splits into 2 forces to multi task, focus on one then the remainder, means he can't use you to lock down combat and just sit there.

 

I thought about this, however going first means he castles in his back corner out of LOS, puts both shining spears in reserve, and one squad of harlequin bikes leaving no viable targets.

 

The two separate targets works against most armies, however the mobility of the bikes combined with two separate double move powers means either:

1) send all the bikes against one exorcist blob. Haywire cannon into it and tap it with one model from each squad, just enough to tap it, prevent it from falling back.  Then on my turn pile in, swing in melee hoping to kill it, then psychic double moving (32" into the other exo blob)

 

or

 

2) same as above, except if he doesn't kill exo squad one in melee on my turn, psychicing it down with smites, falling back the harlequins to haywire exorcist exorcist group #1 and if needed charge back in, because harlequins (advance and charge/fall back and charge...bleh).  And double moving the shining spears/other harlequin bikes if needed into exorcist squad #2 with the strategem to advance and charge and lock down exorcist squad #2.

 

At least that's how I would play it.  The other craftworld attribute the craftworlds had was the +1 to charge rolls from psychic awakening which combined with another psychic power meant the spears could charge 2d6 +4".

 

Against a clever player that knows how to use the fight phase and trap units in melee, it's a challenge to make the backbone thing work.

 

Again with Eldar I think the real trick is knowing which powers to deny: Quicken (double move Eldar), Protect (+1 to saving throws), Fortune (5+ FNP) and Twilight Pathways (double move Harlequins).

 

But this is why we play games.  After smoothly cruising through the last few matchups it's been good to come against something hard, piloted by a competent player.


Edited by bkde, 11 March 2020 - 11:29 PM.


#13
Duke Danse Macabre

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There is allot of ifs and buts is the issue, it's all to do with terrain, placement and use if Strats like fallback and shoot.
I know it can be done because I have done it but it's not easy and if your playing a skilled player one mistake leaving a squad just too close so they can consolidate will ruin you but sometimes it's the small things.
I do still highly recommend splitting it so 2 distant blobs, if they have the range in between it will make it harder to get both, screen out with units where you can to prevent and hamper deep strike and hopefully the double firing arch will allow you to draw line on something.

That said I'm not a Xenos player and where as I knew them well in 7th due to frequent match ups not so much now so I don't know all their tricks.
It is good to really test out your list against a skilled player, all my favourite games are the ones I've had to really work for the win in (if I got the win) so it really helps refine the list.

Are you considering any list edits or just play style approach/ tactics at this point?

"In all my years of Study and Contemplation on the Imperial Truth, as close as I can figure out, it has something to do with Being on Fire."

 

Direct Quote from Chief Scribe Sweideger Steiger, Shortly before being burned to death by Sister Superior Larisa for Crimes of Heresy
 

 


#14
bkde

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There is allot of ifs and buts is the issue, it's all to do with terrain, placement and use if Strats like fallback and shoot.
I know it can be done because I have done it but it's not easy and if your playing a skilled player one mistake leaving a squad just too close so they can consolidate will ruin you but sometimes it's the small things.
I do still highly recommend splitting it so 2 distant blobs, if they have the range in between it will make it harder to get both, screen out with units where you can to prevent and hamper deep strike and hopefully the double firing arch will allow you to draw line on something.

That said I'm not a Xenos player and where as I knew them well in 7th due to frequent match ups not so much now so I don't know all their tricks.
It is good to really test out your list against a skilled player, all my favourite games are the ones I've had to really work for the win in (if I got the win) so it really helps refine the list.

Are you considering any list edits or just play style approach/ tactics at this point?

Agreed on the terrain/placement.  The Seek and Destroy is a challenge as it means the 18" between armies gets eaten up real quick.

 

Regarding the double firing/split deploying, if we were playing a Dawn of War style deployment, I completely agree.  For this deployment however it wasn't really an option, nor would it have made a difference.  The first turn all he did was get closer, tag my girls/immos and wrap them.  The turn after he springboarded into my back lines.  Also you're assuming the double firing arc has a target.  He's not consolidating into things, he's using the tag and wrap trick (i.e. not killing things in melee the turn they charge, but using the pile in/consolidate to wrap the opponent so they can't fall back, keeping everything in melee where they can't be shot on my turn, ready to fall back and still charge on the opponent's next turn) to gain extra movement, NOT kill things in melee, but only keep him protected from shooting, then kill things in melee on my turn, or fallback, shoot if needed to clear BSS screens (8*4 shruiken bullets will gun down a 5 woman BSS squad) then tie charge into something else until he gets to the exos.  

 

So if you screen with girls, he'll wrap them, screen with immos, he'll wrap them.  It's a real rock/hard place situation.

 

Eldar in 8th, especially after Psychic Awakening are a very different beast compared to Eldar in 7th.

 

For list changes, I'll keep as is.  I feel the tools are all there, it's just practice, practice, practice, practice.  Maybe in this game Bloody Rose would have been better, maybe in my next game Argent Shroud will be better.  There's simply too many variables to know for sure.  But I do know I love the ability to advance and shoot, so I'm likely to stick with Argent Shroud.  If there was one thing to change, maybe, maybe a null rod on the frontline canoness, but the equipment options are so stupid for the canoness at this moment and running her with the blade of admonition/inferno pistol and Righteous Rage trait is just too much fun.  Besides the list has all of my favourite units in it that I've been running in some form or another since...6th edition.  Immos, Celestine, Seraphim, Exorcists and MSU BSS loaded up with special weapons.  Add in Coteaz, an assassin, and a fun lil' choppy Canoness, and it's a really enjoyable list to play.

 

This competitive league has been great though, can't wait for my next game.



#15
Duke Danse Macabre

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18 inches isn't allot of space to cover for fast armies that can look at a 30 inch charge threat range from turn 1 movement.
I'm know the tap and wrap trick, personally I hate it as it seems dirty in my eyes but I know how to deal with it, it's just the kind of play I normally only see in a tournament environment.
Luckily we do have reasonable combat options for the most part so we can manage counter attacks but losing a turn of shooting is very painful and hard to speed bump jump units as well.

Haven't faced the new eldar yet, they were op enough in 7th, granted I could still manage them with sisters back then but I don't know all their new witchy tricks.

Our HQ war gear selections are the most stupidly restricted and convoluted choices I have seen in any codex for years and the errata just makes it harder, just give them access based on how much they can carry like everyone else, problem solved.
Also I want jump packs for my canonesses, I know it's been about a decade but I want them back.

"In all my years of Study and Contemplation on the Imperial Truth, as close as I can figure out, it has something to do with Being on Fire."

 

Direct Quote from Chief Scribe Sweideger Steiger, Shortly before being burned to death by Sister Superior Larisa for Crimes of Heresy
 

 


#16
bkde

bkde

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18 inches isn't allot of space to cover for fast armies that can look at a 30 inch charge threat range from turn 1 movement.
I'm know the tap and wrap trick, personally I hate it as it seems dirty in my eyes but I know how to deal with it, it's just the kind of play I normally only see in a tournament environment.
Luckily we do have reasonable combat options for the most part so we can manage counter attacks but losing a turn of shooting is very painful and hard to speed bump jump units as well.

Haven't faced the new eldar yet, they were op enough in 7th, granted I could still manage them with sisters back then but I don't know all their new witchy tricks.

Our HQ war gear selections are the most stupidly restricted and convoluted choices I have seen in any codex for years and the errata just makes it harder, just give them access based on how much they can carry like everyone else, problem solved.
Also I want jump packs for my canonesses, I know it's been about a decade but I want them back.

 30" is nothing

 

Ghostwalk (Runes of Fortune) +2" to charge roll

Craftworld Attribute "Headstrong" add +1" to charge rolls

Shining Spear Exarch Power "swooping dive" add +1 to charge rolls

Shining Spears move 16", quicken to move another 16"

 

So can move 32", and reliably charge out to 44" (needing to roll an 8 with the +4" to charging buffs).

 

Skyweavers

Move 16", auto advance 6"

Twilight Pathways psychic power to move again

 

Moving 44" and charging on average dice out to 51"

 

The move and wrap trick may be dirty, but it's part of the game.  These games are part of a competitive league.



#17
Duke Danse Macabre

Duke Danse Macabre

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Well there's a reason everyone hates eldar. :P
It is a concern but with our choices now and new Strats I feel allot more capable, even if I can't 100% screen out.

It is but I understand in comp play, I play more comp than relaxed sadly.

"In all my years of Study and Contemplation on the Imperial Truth, as close as I can figure out, it has something to do with Being on Fire."

 

Direct Quote from Chief Scribe Sweideger Steiger, Shortly before being burned to death by Sister Superior Larisa for Crimes of Heresy
 

 





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