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Tau vs DG

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#1
Dont-Be-Haten

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New spoiler puts the Death guard against Tau in PA 5. Is it 5? I've lost count!

Let's get the hype train started off right! And even if the hype train is left wanting, the DG will be better than what they were! Perhaps we will get a new chapter tactic/add on or at the least change how the DG work with regards to their better bolters.

I know there's been some speculation and a lot of wish listing. I think DG will get a bit more than 1k sons did because I think it's just 2 armies and not 3+ here's hoping!

Speculation commence!

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#2
Charlo

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As one army I play (however I use Farsight Enclaves so... We'll see) and another I *could* play with a bit of Heresy count-as... Colour me excited!


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#3
Wolf Lord Loki

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Where was the spoiler?

I'd been hoping this would be the case. Hope and advancement vs morbidity and decay

Edit: just found and read the short story. Exciting stuff. Really hoping there is some good stuff for us mono army death guard out there

Edited by Wolf Lord Loki, 13 January 2020 - 04:43 PM.

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Battle Tracker for my White Scars (Swindon 2008): Games this year 5 - Wins 2, Losses 2, Draws 1

Opponents:
Grey Knights 0/ 1/ 0 Imperial Guard 1/ 0/ 0
Eldar - 0/ 1/ 0 Crimson Fists 0/ 0/ 1
Tau 1/ 0/ 0

#4
TrawlingCleaner

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It may be Tau vs DG vs GSC as the promo pictures for Shadowsun had GSC genestealers in the background. Could just be used for promo stuff though, so I could be entirely wrong there.



#5
Dont-Be-Haten

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It may be Tau vs DG vs GSC as the promo pictures for Shadowsun had GSC genestealers in the background. Could just be used for promo stuff though, so I could be entirely wrong there.


I've had a feeling of DG vs Tau since the codex brought us that awesome artwork between the two armies. It would be interesting if GSC were brought in, but they don't seem to fit against the DG narrative. And shadow seemed much more worried about the DG than anything else and that seemed like boiler coming to a head. Color me excited non the less!

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#6
TrawlingCleaner

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It may be Tau vs DG vs GSC as the promo pictures for Shadowsun had GSC genestealers in the background. Could just be used for promo stuff though, so I could be entirely wrong there.

I've had a feeling of DG vs Tau since the codex brought us that awesome artwork between the two armies. It would be interesting if GSC were brought in, but they don't seem to fit against the DG narrative. And shadow seemed much more worried about the DG than anything else and that seemed like boiler coming to a head. Color me excited non the less!

Oh for sure, I'm very excited for the release. I'm quite new to Death guard but I think there's a few gaps they they need filling to do better and hopefully this brings it

#7
Spacecow

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It may be Tau vs DG vs GSC as the promo pictures for Shadowsun had GSC genestealers in the background. Could just be used for promo stuff though, so I could be entirely wrong there.


Yeah, I think that is still an option. Especially reading the story. ( first part of the message before they move to the other enemy named DG)

#8
Paturabo

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Yeah, I think that is still an option. Especially reading the story. ( first part of the message before they move to the other enemy named DG)


The story specifically calls out "Be’gel" (Orkz), "Gue’la" (Humans), and "Y’he" (Tyranids); and where humans and nids mix there might be a genestealer cult lying in wait.
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#9
DuskRaider

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I expect Chaos Knights to be included. Obviously I could be wrong, but it would make sense.

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#10
Jarl Caldersson

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I expect Chaos Knights to be included. Obviously I could be wrong, but it would make sense.


Imperial knights in the DG? I'm sorry but you have crossed a line, knights are much to fast for a DG army! I say good day sir and may a nurgling bite your buttocks! ;)
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#11
Putrid Choir

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I want wet sounding bolters...
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#12
Wolf Lord Loki

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The Daemon face at the front of the gun sneazes bolt rounds....
Battle Tracker for my White Scars (Swindon 2008): Games this year 5 - Wins 2, Losses 2, Draws 1

Opponents:
Grey Knights 0/ 1/ 0 Imperial Guard 1/ 0/ 0
Eldar - 0/ 1/ 0 Crimson Fists 0/ 0/ 1
Tau 1/ 0/ 0

#13
Dont-Be-Haten

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I expect Chaos Knights to be included. Obviously I could be wrong, but it would make sense.

Imperial knights in the DG? I'm sorry but you have crossed a line, knights are much to fast for a DG army! I say good day sir and may a nurgling bite your buttocks! ;)

But are they though? Myphitic blight haulers + bloat drones + PBC + mortarion = 1 fast army.

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#14
Archaeinox

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Yes, probably GSC too. Next week's story is GSC-centered.


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#15
Wolf Lord Loki

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Interesting thought- it's never really been covered what would happen if chaos marines and/ or their mortal servents were corrupted by Genestealers

I recall there was a comic (Warhammer monthly?) that had Deathwatch fighting Genestealers. One got implanted and could feel it taking over his mind so he self destructed his armour power cell.

Chaos marines don't have that same self sacrificing spirit as regular astartes. So they might not suicide until it was too late.

Also what protection might dedication to a god of chaos have???
Battle Tracker for my White Scars (Swindon 2008): Games this year 5 - Wins 2, Losses 2, Draws 1

Opponents:
Grey Knights 0/ 1/ 0 Imperial Guard 1/ 0/ 0
Eldar - 0/ 1/ 0 Crimson Fists 0/ 0/ 1
Tau 1/ 0/ 0

#16
TrawlingCleaner

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Interesting thought- it's never really been covered what would happen if chaos marines and/ or their mortal servents were corrupted by Genestealers

I recall there was a comic (Warhammer monthly?) that had Deathwatch fighting Genestealers. One got implanted and could feel it taking over his mind so he self destructed his armour power cell.

Chaos marines don't have that same self sacrificing spirit as regular astartes. So they might not suicide until it was too late.

Also what protection might dedication to a god of chaos have???

It's slightly off topic but I think most Chaos marines would be immune due to their patronage or potentially succumb to it like the DW marine. I imagine as its a type of infection DG would be entirely immune to it? It's not really something that's been explored in the lore and IMO isn't really something I'd want exploring either.



#17
MegaVolt87

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I want wet sounding bolters...

 

You could make the argument for that with EC bolters as well.... 

 

GSC could provide a good enemy for tau initially, numbers bloat, then DG show up because there is enough flesh to carry plague and they are the worse foe for the tau then. 


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#18
Dont-Be-Haten

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Once we get a full bird's eye view of what the 1k sons recieved in PA 4 we can have better speculation for what is to come for the nurg'hel mans. I'm quite excited to get some new stratagems (Possibly one for our non daemon engines or at the bare minimum Helbrutes!) as well as some cult specific stuff within the 7 companies!


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#19
Putrid Choir

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I'm not getting my hopes up. TS got spells, warlord traits, relic and strats but tied to cult specific detachments. GK got all those not tied to a cult, and got a 4 choice mono army bonus and new litanies. Unless your faction has <Imperium> keyword, the love is less.

#20
DuskRaider

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Interesting thought- it's never really been covered what would happen if chaos marines and/ or their mortal servents were corrupted by Genestealers

I recall there was a comic (Warhammer monthly?) that had Deathwatch fighting Genestealers. One got implanted and could feel it taking over his mind so he self destructed his armour power cell.

Chaos marines don't have that same self sacrificing spirit as regular astartes. So they might not suicide until it was too late.

Also what protection might dedication to a god of chaos have???


Well it depends... a Chaos Cult could fall to Genestealer "infection" as they're still functionally human (for the most part). Back in the day there used to also be Chaos-corrupted Genestealer Cults.

As far as Plague Marines and Poxwalkers... well, are they even considered living? Obviously Poxwalkers are walking corpses so they would be an unsuitable host for Genestealer gestation. I'd have to think a Plague Marine would be similar. So I would think that a Genestealer Cult would attempt to avoid Death Guard and followers of Nurgle in most cases. Even with mortal Cultists the chances of the Genestealer becoming infected would probably be relatively high.

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#21
MegaVolt87

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I'm not getting my hopes up. TS got spells, warlord traits, relic and strats but tied to cult specific detachments. GK got all those not tied to a cult, and got a 4 choice mono army bonus and new litanies. Unless your faction has <Imperium> keyword, the love is less.


Yeah, at least you can still soup though with Chaos Knights, 12 Lascannon dev battery with the Purge renegades etc for combat power. It's no mono faction bonus, just raw power.
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#22
Putrid Choir

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I'm not getting my hopes up. TS got spells, warlord traits, relic and strats but tied to cult specific detachments. GK got all those not tied to a cult, and got a 4 choice mono army bonus and new litanies. Unless your faction has <Imperium> keyword, the love is less.

Yeah, at least you can still soup though with Chaos Knights, 12 Lascannon dev battery with the Purge renegades etc for combat power. It's no mono faction bonus, just raw power.

And they still have that option and just sacrifice their bonuses. We have daemons, other Legions and chaos knights, that's it. They have all their Legions and other power armor like GK, knights, admech, IG, sisters, inquisition and others they can ally with. We don't get the option of a mono bonus (probably, I doubt we will with PA). I play Death guard. Not death guard with three TS sorcs/princes, chaos knight, abbadon surrounded by cultist with daemons splashed in and or a random chaos space marine detatchment. And our "raw power" can't hold a candle light next to some of the SM supplements *cough iron hands cough*.
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#23
Panzer

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Interesting thought- it's never really been covered what would happen if chaos marines and/ or their mortal servents were corrupted by Genestealers

I recall there was a comic (Warhammer monthly?) that had Deathwatch fighting Genestealers. One got implanted and could feel it taking over his mind so he self destructed his armour power cell.

Chaos marines don't have that same self sacrificing spirit as regular astartes. So they might not suicide until it was too late.

Also what protection might dedication to a god of chaos have???


Well it depends... a Chaos Cult could fall to Genestealer "infection" as they're still functionally human (for the most part). Back in the day there used to also be Chaos-corrupted Genestealer Cults.

As far as Plague Marines and Poxwalkers... well, are they even considered living? Obviously Poxwalkers are walking corpses so they would be an unsuitable host for Genestealer gestation. I'd have to think a Plague Marine would be similar. So I would think that a Genestealer Cult would attempt to avoid Death Guard and followers of Nurgle in most cases. Even with mortal Cultists the chances of the Genestealer becoming infected would probably be relatively high.

 

 

Well if anything, Plague Marines are MORE living than others. Though infecting Marines in general doesn't do much for Genestealer since they can't produce offspring. ^^


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#24
Dont-Be-Haten

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I'm not getting my hopes up. TS got spells, warlord traits, relic and strats but tied to cult specific detachments. GK got all those not tied to a cult, and got a 4 choice mono army bonus and new litanies. Unless your faction has <Imperium> keyword, the love is less.


I don't find it disheartening that the worst functional army got the most buffs.

Death guard are in a weird place right now, but so are a lot of armies. I think the buffs they get will be better than getting nothing at all, and I treat the 1k sons cults like detachments. As I think is the intention.

I'm not expecting an overhaul but shoring up a weakness or two will be solid.
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#25
Putrid Choir

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I'm not getting my hopes up. TS got spells, warlord traits, relic and strats but tied to cult specific detachments. GK got all those not tied to a cult, and got a 4 choice mono army bonus and new litanies. Unless your faction has <Imperium> keyword, the love is less.

I don't find it disheartening that the worst functional army got the most buffs.

Death guard are in a weird place right now, but so are a lot of armies. I think the buffs they get will be better than getting nothing at all, and I treat the 1k sons cults like detachments. As I think is the intention.

I'm not expecting an overhaul but shoring up a weakness or two will be solid.

Yeah but everything we get will most likely be an opportunity cost. Using a new relic/warlord trait means not taking an old one. Spending command points on new strats mean not spending them on old ones. Casting new spells means casting less old spells. That lessens the gain. Our issues were similar to alot of the loyalist space marine issues prior to their new codex/supplements with a general lack of firepower for points used while not having a staying presence on the board because everything is getting stronger (like marines free AP). A blanket buff like a doctrine, super doctrine and a rework of a legion trait and making it apply to ALL units is HUGE! That benefits every unit at no cost. Our DR and higher toughness is baked into the cost of every unit that has it. We pay a cost of 5 more points and 1" less movement on our basic marines for the extra toughness and DR. Iron Hands 6+ FNP and the rest of the trait/doctrine/super doctrine is free and is on everything. I would be ten times happier if they just made the legion trait army wide and a mono bonus of -1ap on plague weapons or DR applying to every unit over any amount of relics, strats, warlord traits or psychic spells. But that will take a codex not a half assed campaign release, and probably will never happen.

I don't feel like anyone needs to be grateful for some extra strats and stuff. Every army is getting some extra stuff to stay relevant because of the power creep GW creates. The only thing I'm looking forward to is my second army I play is Tau and at least I can buy one book for both armies.

If the consensus is still "well chaos can just soup daemons and other Legions to stay competitive", then what's the fear of giving them a mono bonus? Can't have both, no power gaming there. It at least would give us a choice and let those that want to play an actual legion play the darn legion.

Edited by Putrid Choir, 15 January 2020 - 01:59 PM.

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