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2000Pts BA+FT 2x Battallion and Vanguard Good Stuff

Blood Angels Flesh Tearers

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#1
Djangomatic82

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As the title says, this is my attempt at a "Good Stuff" list. Everything other than the inquisitor should punch above its weight.

-2x Smash captains: these explain themselves, the only issue is that unlike the classic version, these wont be able to get Master Crafted or a 5+FNP (except through the BoB Strat) due to needing to use the extra relics and hero of the chapter on other units.

- FT Sanguinary Priest: This guy was the inspiration for the list. After reading the Sorrows Genesis relic entree, the 2+ narthecium roll combined with the Over Flowing chalice strat got the creative juices flowing. I leave him basic, but there are enough points left over to kit him out as you see fit.

-10x FT sanguinary guard with Power Fists: These are the guys you want to do all  the things. You should be able to take out a knight equivalent in one round of fighting if you have HoA active and atleast 6-7 models left in the unit.

-1 FT Sanguinary Ancient with power fist.: This is the warlord and has the SoS from the Honored by Baal strat. you know what to do with this unit, it's classic.

-Lemartes: He's in the BA battalion, but since the wording of his abilities call out friendly DC, it shouldn't matter that the DC are in the FT battalion, if I'm wrong, I'm sure someone will comment, but I've seen no FAQ for it. Litany is up to you, i prefer mantra of strength, just remember that his litanies wont affect the FT units.

- 15x FT DC: they're classic, FF them or hold back in reserves as the situation dictates. Be canny with unbridled Ardour and you can kill more in your opponents turn than your own.

**As a personal note, I'm really tempted to run these all with hand flamers and rejigging slots to get Catechism of fire on them for 15D6 auto hitting S3 shots that wound everything on a 5+ minimum. but that's just me.**

-Libby Dread: Another classic that wrecks anything on the table. i dont see the point in giving it buffing powers as half the army cant benefit from it, just run Quicken and Wings.

-6x 5man Intercessor squads with thunderhammers, Assault Bolters and aux grenade launchers: I've been impressed by the damage a Sgt with a TH can dish out, definitely a threat to anything in play. I like assault bolters because i like to run and shoot, movement is key to winning and i dont like getting complacent and castling up, i always regret it.

- 1 Inquisitor, Ordo Xenos: Its cheap, returns CP on enemies use on a 5+ and has an overwatch deny power. run it up the board with a unit of intercessors towards the thing you want the SG to kill when they drop in. If your up against RG or other snipers, theres enough points to run Hector Rex instead with a 2+Sv, 3+Inv, 3 powers, 3 casts and 4 DENIES, he's crazy, but this list only has 6CP, so the xenos inquisitor wins out IMO, but do as you will.

 

+++  [117 PL, 6CP, 1,953pts] +++

++ Battalion Detachment  [30 PL, 618pts] ++

**CHAPTER**: Flesh Tearers
+ HQ +

Captain [6 PL, -2CP, 143pts]: 3. Cretacian Born, Death Visions of Sanguinius, Hero of The Chapter, Jump Pack, Storm shield, Thunder hammer

Librarian Dreadnought [9 PL, 154pts]: 1. Quickening, 6. Wings of Sanguinus, Furioso fist, Meltagun

+ Troops +

Intercessor Squad [5 PL, 107pts]: Auto bolt rifle, Auxiliary grenade launcher, 4x Intercessor
Intercessor Sergeant: Thunder hammer

Intercessor Squad [5 PL, 107pts]: Auto bolt rifle, Auxiliary grenade launcher, 4x Intercessor
Intercessor Sergeant: Thunder hammer

Intercessor Squad [5 PL, 107pts]: Auto bolt rifle, Auxiliary grenade launcher, 4x Intercessor
Intercessor Sergeant: Thunder hammer

++ Battalion Detachment + [30 PL, 619pts] ++

**CHAPTER**: Blood Angels

Armoury of Baal [-3CP]: 2 Additional Relics

Inquisitor [4 PL, -1CP, 55pts]: Blackshroud, Bolt pistol, Chainsword, Ordo Xenos, Stratagem: Inquisitorial Mandate, Xenos - Esoteric Lore
Psyker: 1) Terrify

+ HQ +

Captain [6 PL, -1CP, 143pts]: Death Visions of Sanguinius, Jump Pack, Storm shield, The Angel's Wing (replaces jump pack), Thunder hammer

Lemartes [5 PL, 100pts]: 4. Mantra of Strength, Invocation of Destruction, Litanies of Hate

+ Troops +

Intercessor Squad [5 PL, 107pts]: Auto bolt rifle, Auxiliary grenade launcher, 4x Intercessor
Intercessor Sergeant: Thunder hammer

Intercessor Squad [5 PL, 107pts]: Auto bolt rifle, Auxiliary grenade launcher, 4x Intercessor
Intercessor Sergeant: Thunder hammer

Intercessor Squad [5 PL, 107pts]: Auto bolt rifle, Auxiliary grenade launcher, 4x Intercessor
Intercessor Sergeant: Thunder hammer

++ Vanguard Detachment [57 PL, 1CP, 716pts] ++

**CHAPTER**: Flesh Tearers

+ HQ +

Sanguinary Priest [4 PL, 70pts]: Bolt pistol, Chainsword, Jump Pack, Sorrow's Genesis

+ Elites +

Death Company [27 PL, 270pts]: Jump Pack
15x Death Company Marine: Boltgun, Chainsword

Sanguinary Ancient [6 PL, -1 CP, 66pts]: 1. Legendary Fighter, Angelus boltgun, Death mask, Standard of Sacrifice, Power fist, Warlord

Sanguinary Guard [20 PL, 310pts]: Death mask
10x Sanguinary Guard: Angelus boltgun, Power fist



Created with BattleScribe (https://battlescribe.net)


Edited by Djangomatic82, 29 January 2020 - 11:47 AM.

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#2
Debauchery101

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The precedent set for successor chapters is pretty clear. Putting lemartes in there most likely wouldn't be allowed in matches play in the extreme restriction.

But say they're cool with it, because he does share "imperium" & "adeptus astartes" factions tags technically it's ok in matched play.

But then because he is blood angels he can only benefit from generic stratagems, his litanies wont affect flesh tearers. The abilities for 'friendly DeathCo' will work on flesh tearers. He cant gain benefit from any buffs that are not coming from 'Blood Angels'

Because hes not FT...then everyone loses 'savage echos'

He cannot be targeted with warlord traits, psychics or auras.

In Blood of Baal and the other marine supplements
it specifically says in the abilities section it says ....

Page 52 of Blood of Baal, top left of page

'If your army is battle forged, all units in your army with doctrines gain savage echos ability, so long as every unit in your army is a 'blood angels' unit or every unit from your army is a 'BA successor' chapter

Honestly I'd be ok with it..because competitively you're choosing to nullify some strengths.
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#3
Djangomatic82

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The precedent set for successor chapters is pretty clear. Putting lemartes in there most likely wouldn't be allowed in matches play in the extreme restriction.

But say they're cool with it, because he does share "imperium" & "adeptus astartes" factions tags technically it's ok in matched play.

But then because he is blood angels he can only benefit from generic stratagems, his litanies wont affect flesh tearers. The abilities for 'friendly DeathCo' will work on flesh tearers. He cant gain benefit from any buffs that are not coming from 'Blood Angels'

Because hes not FT...then everyone loses 'savage echos'

He cannot be targeted with warlord traits, psychics or auras.

In Blood of Baal and the other marine supplements
it specifically says in the abilities section it says ....

Page 52 of Blood of Baal, top left of page

'If your army is battle forged, all units in your army with doctrines gain savage echos ability, so long as every unit in your army is a 'blood angels' unit or every unit from your army is a 'BA successor' chapter

Honestly I'd be ok with it..because competitively you're choosing to nullify some strengths.

Yeah, i know the loss of Savage echoes was a thing, I'm OK with it as well. As a small consolation, since all units have the combat doctrines keyword, everything still gets those.
If it wasn't clear, the battalion with Lemartes was a BA detachment, so he is a legal HQ choice.  missing out on the FT aura's is really minor, as it is only a reroll of 1's to his single pistol shot or grenade. Maybe getting some wounds back from the SP will be missed, but I'm not worried.

 

EDIT: One thing that occurred to me is that since this list misses out on savage echoes but keeps doctrines, it might be better overall to sit in the Tactical phase to benefit all the assault bolters.


Edited by Djangomatic82, 31 January 2020 - 06:44 AM.

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#4
Debauchery101

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What is it that makes want to run 2 different chapters
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#5
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2 ways of turning off Overwatch.

Call me Indy. It's less syllables.

 

 

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#6
Djangomatic82

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What is it that makes want to run 2 different chapters

 

 

2 ways of turning off Overwatch.

yeah, it was the 2 overwatch denials and the sanguanry priest relic, but i read somewhere that the relic ability doesnt stack with overflowing chalice, so i've been reconsidering the use of running the two chapters together. I've reworked the list to instead stay pure BA and sub in astorath and primaris mephiston inplace of one smash captain and the priest, then switched out the preiest relic for veritus vite. end up with savage echoes, 2 additional casts and denies, 2 more litanies and mass of doom and to top it off, with the VV and xenos inquisitor, regening CP on both my uses ,and enemies uses.
One extra upside in my case is i have everything in the list built and mostly painted up, so i can give it a go next time i have a game.


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#7
Debauchery101

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How about trying this minor tweak and see what you like better 2000 pts even

Mephiston
Smash captain
Smash captain
Librarian dread with melta gun
Lemartes
Priest- jump pack

2x 5 man Intercessors- auto bolters, hammer, noob tube

2x 5 man Intercessors- stalkers or bolt rifles, nude tube

2x 5 man Scouts-sgt/storm bolter/power sword

15 DeathCo- jump packs, 2 hammers

10 sanguinary guard- 10 fists

Sanguinary Ancient

Inquisitor Eisenhorn


It should play similar. I only took away 4 hammers and downgraded 2 imtercessors to scours

My experience with hammers on Intercessors mostly seem like a waste of points. Most people ignore them unless it the only target or if they need kill you off objectives

Scouts can help with screens. Provide a lane for your dread/mephiston move in

Eisenhorn can do everything the basic Inquisitor can but wait there's more. He can toss out a daemon host, has better weapons and ser

Edited by Debauchery101, 01 February 2020 - 08:33 AM.

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#8
Djangomatic82

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How about trying this minor tweak and see what you like better 2000 pts even

Mephiston
Smash captain
Smash captain
Librarian dread with melta gun
Lemartes
Priest- jump pack

2x 5 man Intercessors- auto bolters, hammer, noob tube

2x 5 man Intercessors- stalkers or bolt rifles, nude tube

2x 5 man Scouts-sgt/storm bolter/power sword

15 DeathCo- jump packs, 2 hammers

10 sanguinary guard- 10 fists

Sanguinary Ancient

Inquisitor Eisenhorn


It should play similar. I only took away 4 hammers and downgraded 2 imtercessors to scours

My experience with hammers on Intercessors mostly seem like a waste of points. Most people ignore them unless it the only target or if they need kill you off objectives

Scouts can help with screens. Provide a lane for your dread/mephiston move in

Eisenhorn can do everything the basic Inquisitor can but wait there's more. He can toss out a daemon host, has better weapons and ser

interesting, i have a few notes.

1. 2nd smash captain: in a pure ba list, i dont see the point. neither of the gilded pinions, icon of the angel, quacke bolts or biomantic sarcophagus really make the cut into our classic triumvirate relics of the angels wings, standard of saccrifice and verits vite.

2. Eisenhorn: he's cool but Ordo Hereticus. the psychic power and warlord trait for that ordo arent really appealing to me, but too each their own. One bigside of having the Ordo Xenos is being able to stack up the CP regeneration of that warlord trait and the veritus vite, which for BA's massive CP hunger is much more of a draw, IMO.

3. Priest: I've been trying to make a BA priest work for the entire edition and every game I'm always at least a little dissapointed. The initial list use of the FT relic was the main draw in running one for that sweet 2+ ressurect, but without that, I've lost my interest in it again. +1S would be nice on the DC, but if I'm planning to babysit them with a buff character, i'd rather spend any CP to do such on Lemartes than a priest.

4. DC+TH: more of a matter of taste, but in my experience the TH are overkill for the stuff i throw them at. I prefer to send them against opponent troops and softer targets to disrup their ability to hold objectives. I've also found that through sheer weight of attacks, they can kill up to T7 fairly reliably if its their first target. for anything tougher, i have other units to deal with that.

5. Troops: these are more matter of taste. I'm disillusioned with running 5x of 1 wound models. I can see case made for running 10x of scouts or tacs though, as the survivability of a 10 wound unit is actually pretty good, as shown by intercessors. Next, SBR's are not in my wheelhouse.


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#9
Debauchery101

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Eisenhorn is Definitely ORDO XENOS...

Anyways I still think you should try it out. Decent players know how to speed bump and screen so you cant wrap, allowing for a counter charge. It's not hard slap down 15 DeathCo marines. So having a couple hammers helps keep their lethality well into losing half their unit

You could still keep those primaris tax units just give up a couple hammers and take Eisenhorn.

The 2nd smash captain is just some redundancy. He really doesn't need any of buffs and can easily 1 round a lot of heavy targets on the charge. Most competitive blood Angel's lists have 2 or 3

Edited by Debauchery101, 01 February 2020 - 06:06 PM.

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#10
Djangomatic82

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Eisenhorn is Definitely ORDO XENOS...

Anyways I still think you should try it out. Decent players know how to speed bump and screen so you cant wrap, allowing for a counter charge. It's not hard slap down 15 DeathCo marines. So having a couple hammers helps keep their lethality well into losing half their unit

You could still keep those primaris tax units just give up a couple hammers and take Eisenhorn.

The 2nd smash captain is just some redundancy. He really doesn't need any of buffs and can easily 1 round a lot of heavy targets on the charge. Most competitive blood Angel's lists have 2 or 3

Ahhh, you are right about eisenhorn. the issue i had was he has a mandatory warlord trait, Radical. I really do prefer Esoteric Lore though.


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#11
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Eisenhorn is Definitely ORDO XENOS...

Anyways I still think you should try it out. Decent players know how to speed bump and screen so you cant wrap, allowing for a counter charge. It's not hard slap down 15 DeathCo marines. So having a couple hammers helps keep their lethality well into losing half their unit

You could still keep those primaris tax units just give up a couple hammers and take Eisenhorn.

The 2nd smash captain is just some redundancy. He really doesn't need any of buffs and can easily 1 round a lot of heavy targets on the charge. Most competitive blood Angel's lists have 2 or 3

Ahhh, you are right about eisenhorn. the issue i had was he has a mandatory warlord trait, Radical. I really do prefer Esoteric Lore though.

I can understand that. But again just try it out. Blood Angels legit is the best chapter that really doesn't need much CP besides pregame upgrades. You've also engineered a stratagem out as an option that a lot of people use...for boosted Sanguinary guard due to taking all fists

Also Eisenhorn being able to cast/deny 2 psychics a turn is a huge plus. I started running 3 Librarian dreads and coteaz. Before I'd run just 1 Librarian dread and 1 phobos Librarian. A couple extra smiles and denies have saved my rest.
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#12
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  I can understand that. But again just try it out. Blood Angels legit is the best chapter that really doesn't need much CP besides pregame upgrades.

huh.png


Call me Indy. It's less syllables.

 

 

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#13
Djangomatic82

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Eisenhorn is Definitely ORDO XENOS...

Anyways I still think you should try it out. Decent players know how to speed bump and screen so you cant wrap, allowing for a counter charge. It's not hard slap down 15 DeathCo marines. So having a couple hammers helps keep their lethality well into losing half their unit

You could still keep those primaris tax units just give up a couple hammers and take Eisenhorn.

The 2nd smash captain is just some redundancy. He really doesn't need any of buffs and can easily 1 round a lot of heavy targets on the charge. Most competitive blood Angel's lists have 2 or 3

Ahhh, you are right about eisenhorn. the issue i had was he has a mandatory warlord trait, Radical. I really do prefer Esoteric Lore though.

 You've also engineered a stratagem out as an option that a lot of people use...for boosted Sanguinary guard due to taking all fists
 

Which strat is that?


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#14
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Eisenhorn is Definitely ORDO XENOS...

Anyways I still think you should try it out. Decent players know how to speed bump and screen so you cant wrap, allowing for a counter charge. It's not hard slap down 15 DeathCo marines. So having a couple hammers helps keep their lethality well into losing half their unit

You could still keep those primaris tax units just give up a couple hammers and take Eisenhorn.

The 2nd smash captain is just some redundancy. He really doesn't need any of buffs and can easily 1 round a lot of heavy targets on the charge. Most competitive blood Angel's lists have 2 or 3

Ahhh, you are right about eisenhorn. the issue i had was he has a mandatory warlord trait, Radical. I really do prefer Esoteric Lore though.
You've also engineered a stratagem out as an option that a lot of people use...for boosted Sanguinary guard due to taking all fists
Which strat is that?

Death on the wind.
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#15
Djangomatic82

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Eisenhorn is Definitely ORDO XENOS...

Anyways I still think you should try it out. Decent players know how to speed bump and screen so you cant wrap, allowing for a counter charge. It's not hard slap down 15 DeathCo marines. So having a couple hammers helps keep their lethality well into losing half their unit

You could still keep those primaris tax units just give up a couple hammers and take Eisenhorn.

The 2nd smash captain is just some redundancy. He really doesn't need any of buffs and can easily 1 round a lot of heavy targets on the charge. Most competitive blood Angel's lists have 2 or 3

Ahhh, you are right about eisenhorn. the issue i had was he has a mandatory warlord trait, Radical. I really do prefer Esoteric Lore though.
You've also engineered a stratagem out as an option that a lot of people use...for boosted Sanguinary guard due to taking all fists
Which strat is that?

Death on the wind.

 

Power fists dont prevent you from using Death on the Wind, or i'm misunderstanding what your saying.

from what you said and looking at the book in my hand, the only thing in the entry that mentions a specific weapon, is the fluff text in italics, but that has nothing to do with the actual rules of how we are to use the strat.


Edited by Djangomatic82, 03 February 2020 - 09:06 PM.

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#16
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Eisenhorn is Definitely ORDO XENOS...

Anyways I still think you should try it out. Decent players know how to speed bump and screen so you cant wrap, allowing for a counter charge. It's not hard slap down 15 DeathCo marines. So having a couple hammers helps keep their lethality well into losing half their unit

You could still keep those primaris tax units just give up a couple hammers and take Eisenhorn.

The 2nd smash captain is just some redundancy. He really doesn't need any of buffs and can easily 1 round a lot of heavy targets on the charge. Most competitive blood Angel's lists have 2 or 3

Ahhh, you are right about eisenhorn. the issue i had was he has a mandatory warlord trait, Radical. I really do prefer Esoteric Lore though.
You've also engineered a stratagem out as an option that a lot of people use...for boosted Sanguinary guard due to taking all fists
Which strat is that?
Death on the wind.
Power fists dont prevent you from using Death on the Wind, or i'm misunderstanding what your saying.
from what you said and looking at the book in my hand, the only thing in the entry that mentions a specific weapon, is the fluff text in italics, but that has nothing to do with the actual rules of how we are to use the strat.

Yes you misunderstood. Taking fists pretty much eliminates need for that particular strategy if you keep them in reroll to hit range. But if not then maybe it's a good idea since you will have the -1 to hit
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#17
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...that does not prevent the use of that Stratagem at all...

 

...Death on the Wind lets you count the D:D3 damage rolls of "1" of as "2"...you can have full re-rolls To Hit from Heirs to Azkaellon and still whiff the damage you need, so the abilities are complementary, not either/or. 

 

I do not understand your comments. 


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Call me Indy. It's less syllables.

 

 

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#18
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...that does not prevent the use of that Stratagem at all...

...Death on the Wind lets you count the D:D3 damage rolls of "1" of as "2"...you can have full re-rolls To Hit from Heirs to Azkaellon and still whiff the damage you need, so the abilities are complementary, not either/or.

I do not understand your comments.


Maybe you're ESL and the context of what I'm saying is lost on you. Just go on and play with your 4+ to hit powerfist squad. Then burn cp to make 2+ damage
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#19
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...that does not prevent the use of that Stratagem at all...

...Death on the Wind lets you count the D:D3 damage rolls of "1" of as "2"...you can have full re-rolls To Hit from Heirs to Azkaellon and still whiff the damage you need, so the abilities are complementary, not either/or.

I do not understand your comments.


Maybe you're ESL and the context of what I'm saying is lost on you. Just go on and play with your 4+ to hit powerfist squad. Then burn cp to make 2+ damage

 

Dont be rude, Deb. Even i'm not clear on what the issue you see with powerfists and the strat is. If its the - penalty to hit, Wounding everything in the game on a + more than kaes up for that, especially in conjunction with Heirs of Azkellion allowing rerolls of the 1's and 2's on those hits. upping any damage rolls of 1 to 2 damage is a solution to the weakest link in the whole attack cycle.


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#20
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...that does not prevent the use of that Stratagem at all...

...Death on the Wind lets you count the D:D3 damage rolls of "1" of as "2"...you can have full re-rolls To Hit from Heirs to Azkaellon and still whiff the damage you need, so the abilities are complementary, not either/or.

I do not understand your comments.

Maybe you're ESL and the context of what I'm saying is lost on you. Just go on and play with your 4+ to hit powerfist squad. Then burn cp to make 2+ damage
Dont be rude, Deb. Even i'm not clear on what the issue you see with powerfists and the strat is. If its the - penalty to hit, Wounding everything in the game on a + more than kaes up for that, especially in conjunction with Heirs of Azkellion allowing rerolls of the 1's and 2's on those hits. upping any damage rolls of 1 to 2 damage is a solution to the weakest link in the whole attack cycle.

I'm not trying be rude. There seems to be a barrier between us in communication.

Edited by Debauchery101, 04 February 2020 - 03:12 PM.

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#21
RyanT2112

RyanT2112

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If you want to avoid overwatch on two smash captains while using flesh tearers - you do NOT need to use a Blood Angels detachment to gain that relic. Just use the stratagem for 1 CP to take a blood angel relic. This means your warlord trait on one and your relic on the other will give you two no-overwatch captains and you can keep your FT special rules.







Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: Blood Angels, Flesh Tearers

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