218 replies to this topic

[Iron Father Imeran Byon]

My buddy was in vacation in the UK and had a chat with some of the design team a little after Matt ward's newcrons came out. Was the general consensus, which makes sense since all new models that used to use green rods (warscythes, immortals, tomb spyders). No longer have them. Plus all other new models and newer still still dont have any. Now that was a few years ago, and there could be a small chance that could change....but the new cryptek and szeres doesnt give me hope that the rods will appear again. GW has left a heavy crumb trail.

Destroyers, finecost lords, and monoliths were remnants of the second big necron release back in 3rd when GW was crazy about green clear bits. They just havn't had an updated model yet. I would be willing to bet any new model for these will not have the green rods.

That does make some sense. The "chat with the team a few years back" not so much (a lot of things have changed since then) butjust looking at the revamped models, you're right. They don't have them any more.

As you said, that's still not a definitive thing; just circumstantial evidence. But it seems likely.

 

I would have guessed that they'd eliminate the green colour, because that pushes you to either include green in the colour scheme or paint them over, losing the effect that transparent plastic has in the first place. So clear rods might still be a thing, I reckon. But we'll see what they do with it.

[Ahzek451]

It's a design direction they obviously decided to change. And frankly, we are too deep into the new range(by new I still mean ward) to switch back to using green rods. It would be really odd and make little sense.

Edited by Ahzek451, 22 April 2020 - 12:03 AM.

[Sete]

I did not hear anything about warriors being redone.

I would not expect it. Some failcast units maybe.

But its just rumours, so apply salt accordingly.

What "everyone" is saying is, Necrons are the new meta threat, end of summer, "new" edition, and what that entails.

Edited by Sete, 22 April 2020 - 11:46 AM.

[Evil Eye]

Re: Oldcrons vs Newcrons, I honestly don't hate the Newcron fluff. The Oldcrons, whilst cool, kinda trod on the Tyranids' toes (hooves?) in the "Faceless legions directed by an eldritch horror" territory. At least giving them the opportunity to have some actual personality is more than welcome IMO. Also IIRC the more recent fluff has suggested the bound C'tan shards might not be as bound as the 'crons had thought, for what that's worth. There's some old fluff I definitely prefer (specifically the Flayed Ones; I don't hate the new fluff for them but something about the old fluff with them trying to make themselves flesh and blood again by coating themselves in, well, just that is chilling) but on the whole I really don't mind the Newcrons.

 

Regarding new models, aside from introducing new units, there's a few things they could do. Most of their characters are still resin, including their "big cheese" Imotekh, and the Flayed Ones are long overdue plastic releases. I also reckon they could do away with the green rods once and for all but that's a personal thing, and I'm not sure how they would handle the Monolith due to the green prism on the particle whip- they could either do it in regular plastic and just have the modeller paint it crystal-y, they could cast it in clear plastic so you could use clear paint to give it whatever colour you wanted, or they could do away with the crystal altogether and redesign it to fit with the modern look a bit more. I kinda hope they do as I always really liked the Monolith and would hate to see it swept under the rug.

[Quantum]

Re: Oldcrons vs Newcrons, I honestly don't hate the Newcron fluff. The Oldcrons, whilst cool, kinda trod on the Tyranids' toes (hooves?) in the "Faceless legions directed by an eldritch horror" territory. At least giving them the opportunity to have some actual personality is more than welcome IMO. Also IIRC the more recent fluff has suggested the bound C'tan shards might not be as bound as the 'crons had thought, for what that's worth. There's some old fluff I definitely prefer (specifically the Flayed Ones; I don't hate the new fluff for them but something about the old fluff with them trying to make themselves flesh and blood again by coating themselves in, well, just that is chilling) but on the whole I really don't mind the Newcrons.

 

I completely agree with you with not hating the 'Newcron' lore. I like the fact that Necrons are now a collection of cultures and individuals (well, at nobility-level, anyway   ) instead of a single homogenous horde slaved to one being, with unique characters throughout the galaxy doing their thing.

 

But I certainly do lament the loss of the C'Tan as Lovecraftian Elder Ones that were as a threat (almost) on par with the Chaos Gods. And the fact that since they were not born from emotions that we can relate to as the Chaos Gods were, their methods and motivations were far more inhuman. 

 

There were issues with this interpretation: the 3rd edition Necron Codex suggested that everything bad in the galaxy could be traced back to the (war with the) C'Tan (including the birth of the Chaos Gods) so GW pushed them as (imagine hearing following text in a deep voice) gods more evil than the extradimensional gods that have actual daemons in service. That was both unnecessary (compare Cthulhu an Azatoth in the lovecraft mythos, the latter is infinitely more powerful that the former yet both can be the end of humanity) and unwanted as both can be credible threats without comparing the two in terms of evilness and power while suggesting fan-favorite Chaos is the lesser threat. 

 

But the 3rd edition codex also had some awesome pieces of lore that were some of the best I've ever read: the tale of Adept Corteswain, the Eldar Vision of the enslaved human race when the C'Tan won, and the (not from the codex, but published on the GW website at one time) Harlequin performance on how the Laughing God duped the Outsider to devour other C'Tan. No matter what lore GW creates, these pieces are for me the defining characterization of the C'Tan.

 

But like I said, I believe the two interpretations can be merged seamlessly; Necrons as an zombie-like horde, automatons, under the command of all-powerful C'Tan masters. Then, in the War of Heaven, Old Ones and C'Tan fight each other to near mutual-assured destruction (like Surtr and the Norse Gods in Ragnarok), or the C'Tan turn on each other, and their power and hold on the Necron wanes. Their slaves rise up against them, shattering (but not destroying) the already sorely weakened Star gods.  

 

How interesting is it to imagine a Necron Overlord obsessed with rebuilding his dynasty and empire, but secretly fearing the day the stars will be right again and the C'Tan shards will break their bonds, reassemble, and reclaim the Necrons as the slave race they really are? And being deathless, he will 'live' long enough to experience it. Or what about a Necron faction that has already fallen under the dominion of a powerful C'Tan shard?

Edited by Quantum, 23 April 2020 - 06:13 AM.

[Ishagu]

The old lore was better suited to a faction which isn't playable.

They were basically robotic Tyranids. It should be noted that the new lore still allows for a mindless, robotic Legion that simply responds to threats according to pre-programmed behaviour to exist, if that's what you really want.

[Nemesor Tyriks]

 

How interesting is it to imagine a Necron Overlord obsessed with rebuilding his dynasty and empire, but secretly fearing the day the stars will be right again and the C'Tan shards will break their bonds, reassemble, and reclaim the Necrons as the slave race they really are? And being deathless, he will 'live' long enough to experience it. 

 

This is essentially my homebrew Dynasty's fluff.

[Frater Antodeniel]

 

Re: Oldcrons vs Newcrons, I honestly don't hate the Newcron fluff. The Oldcrons, whilst cool, kinda trod on the Tyranids' toes (hooves?) in the "Faceless legions directed by an eldritch horror" territory. At least giving them the opportunity to have some actual personality is more than welcome IMO. Also IIRC the more recent fluff has suggested the bound C'tan shards might not be as bound as the 'crons had thought, for what that's worth. There's some old fluff I definitely prefer (specifically the Flayed Ones; I don't hate the new fluff for them but something about the old fluff with them trying to make themselves flesh and blood again by coating themselves in, well, just that is chilling) but on the whole I really don't mind the Newcrons.

 

How interesting is it to imagine a Necron Overlord obsessed with rebuilding his dynasty and empire, but secretly fearing the day the stars will be right again and the C'Tan shards will break their bonds, reassemble, and reclaim the Necrons as the slave race they really are? And being deathless, he will 'live' long enough to experience it. Or what about a Necron faction that has already fallen under the dominion of a powerful C'Tan shard?

 

 

If i remember correctly, it is the reason why in the new Lore, the Necron Overlord are very cautious with using the C'tan shards and only do so when all other options failed or would fail.

 

Many a Necron Overlord will suffer from some kind of insanity that will make him forgot that the C'tan shards in is possession are no mere weapons but fragments of godlike creatures. Those Overlord that still have their sanity intact, for their part, understand well enough that a C'tan shard is nothing else but a powerful prisonner who, if its chains are broken, will flee far away only to return one day to avenge itself upon his previous "masters". So, yes, i believe that more than one Necron Overlord rightfully fear the day when a C'tan will recover its full power and put the Necrons in chains, ones that they will never be able to break free.

 

As for a C'tan being in control of a Necron Dynasty, i think it is something that could be possible. I think that Deceiver could already be in control of many dynasty and cryptek conclave, and it would be quite an amusing thing to consider given the fact that it is him that allowed the Necrons to "enslave" the C'tan at the end of the War in Heavens...leading the Necrons to believe that they did enslaves all the Necrons, even the Deceiver, while in fact, it would have been the Deceiver's plans all along.

 

Given the fact that some Necrons named characters, notably, Szeras and Orikan, have plans to "evolve" and become true Gods, so to become C'tan, i do believe that in the same way, all the Necrons Lore is in fact the story of the C'tan Deceiver to become the Supreme Ruler of his kind.

 

After all, when you consider the Deceiver depiction :

- It is "he" who assumed very early the role of "messenger" between the uncaring Star Gods (the C'tans) and the Necrontyr

- It is "he" who suggested the Necrontyr to become mechanical construct in order to fight and win the War in Heaven (and perhaps even "orchestrated" the War in Heaven...)

- It is "he" who turned the C'tans against one another, reducing their number greatly

- And perhaps it may be him who created the "God-Killer" weapon the Necrons used against the surviving C'tans at the end of the War.

 

One can only imagine that the Deceiver willingly orchestrated his "enslavement", tricking the Necrons with the believe that they were the masters of their own fate, while in fact they were playing the Deceiver's game all along. Now, if the Deceiver is truly free, with most if not all his fellow C'tan enslaved or broken, the Deceiver may be the most powerful C'tan in the Galaxy, and i think his plans only start to unfold.

 

Also, one important question remain....What if Tzeentch, Cegorach and the Deceiver were, in the end, only one being....different words for the same things....(That's an "Inception" level of IQ.^^)

[jaxom]

I think it would be pretty straightforward to have an Unleashed C'tan sub-faction in addition to the Dynasties.

[NTaW]

=][= This is a reminder that this thread is for discussion on Psychic Awakening: Pariah, and that deep-dives into Necron lore are welcome in the Necron subform. =][=

 

Today saw a new Regimental Standard released talking about a "peace and quiet zone" where worlds have pylons like at Cadia. I believe this area was mentioned in previous PA book's "Echoes of Awakening" as the Gabeon Reach, the blurb also mentioned Black Templars and SoB being deployed to the area. Could it be we're seeing a bit of the setting revealed for where Pariah takes place?

 

The EoA blurb I'm Referencing, from Ritual of the Damned:

 

Spoiler

[Vox Intercept: Endolla Sub-sector, Gabeon Reach]

 

'The blackstone here... there's so much of it. There are more pylons here than the records say even Cadia had. There are hundreds, thousands. What's strange though is that they could only have been here for a few decades. Where did they come from? Who put them here?'

 

Addendum: Zero astropathic communiques detected coming out of the Gabeon Reach for some years. No warp activity identified. Circumstances suspicious. Data dispatched to [REDACTED] and nearest Imperial rapid response forces: Black Templars Adeptus Astartes and local Adepta Sororitas.

[Toxichobbit]

 

Also, one important question remain....What if Tzeentch, Cegorach and the Deceiver were, in the end, only one being....different words for the same things....(That's an "Inception" level of IQ.^^)

 

 

Then the setting would be all the more dull for it. There's already enough Chaos fapping in 40k. We don't need to have big reveals of Chaos controlling the Harlequins and Necrons too. Chaos is boring*, lets see some galaxy wide threats that don't come from it.

 

* not full on boring, more just boring at this point due to over-exposure.
 

[RandyB]

Also, one important question remain....What if Tzeentch, Cegorach and the Deceiver were, in the end, only one being....different words for the same things....(That's an "Inception" level of IQ.^^)

Then the setting would be all the more dull for it. There's already enough Chaos fapping in 40k. We don't need to have big reveals of Chaos controlling the Harlequins and Necrons too. Chaos is boring*, lets see some galaxy wide threats that don't come from it.

* not full on boring, more just boring at this point due to over-exposure.

Over exposure and poor handling of the lore. The Chaos Gods are now little more than bowdlerized caricatures. Their forces are cartoonishly overpowered*. And there is no evidence of any Story Bible controlling the depiction of events.**

*In lore. I know nothing of their tabletop performance.

**Yeah, I'm the "unreliable narrator" guy. Even that has its legitimate limits.

[Frater Antodeniel]

One interresting thing about the Pariah and other Blanks, and a thing that i believe could be an interresting addition to the Lore, is how they could be tied with the Warp and..... the Tyranids. I explain :

 

- While the actual Lore depict the Tyranids as being "Psychics", the powers the Tyranids uses are notably comparable to that of the Blanks and Pariah. The most iconic of those is the "Shadow in the Warp" which in its description is similar to the Blank effect displayed with by the Blanks and Pariah.

 

- Another thing, different, but nonetheless linked to the Blank and Pariah effect is the Noctilith, a material that can be attuned to either reppel or increase the Warp.

 

- Another different addition, coming from the Drukhari Lore and other materials, is the fact that Blank and Pariah still suffer from the Warp, meaning that their are not immune to it.

 

Following those elements and others, i wonder if Blanks and Pariah are not just simply Inverse Psykers. In this way, they would still be linked to the Warp, but on a different side of it  (Think about your reflection in the mirror). In this regard, Blanks and Pariah would indeed appear "Soulless" when viewed by a "Soulful" being, but the same goes the other way.

 

I think it may be something interresting to think about and see the different possible connections of it.

[Noserenda]

The Shadow in the warp isnt like being a blank, its like being inside the brain of a huuuuge psychic which calms the warp around it just because of inertia rather than being an anti psyker, i imagine if the hive mind were prone to emotions it would have a very different effect.

Blanks can indeed be affected by VERY powerful psykers but its a pretty (anti-)heroic feat.

[bluntpencil]

Yeah, the Shadow in the Warp is more like psychic noise, or static, caused by a huge psychic presence, drowning out other psykers.

[Panzer]

The Shadow in the warp isnt like being a blank, its like being inside the brain of a huuuuge psychic which calms the warp around it just because of inertia rather than being an anti psyker, i imagine if the hive mind were prone to emotions it would have a very different effect.

Blanks can indeed be affected by VERY powerful psykers but its a pretty (anti-)heroic feat.

 

Indeed. If I recall correctly they also gave strong hints that the hivemind is somewhat similar of a really strange and alien warp entity just recently (kinda like the chaos gods are reflections of the mortals emotions and ambitions, just that it's a reflection of the psychic network of the Tyranid race I guess. The true nature never got fully revealed obviously).

[Felix Antipodes]

Next PA story up on warcom site. This one relates to Pariah. After the drama with the last story they have not only omitted the name of the author (crap reaction on GW's part) but it isn't downloadable like the rest (ATT).

Sorry can't link to page ATT.

[Quantum]

Next PA story up on warcom site. This one relates to Pariah. After the drama with the last story they have not only omitted the name of the author (crap reaction on GW's part) but it isn't downloadable like the rest (ATT).

Sorry can't link to page ATT.

Drama? What are you talking about? 

 

Do you mean Retaliation? link: https://www.warhamme...ng-retaliation/

Not a great story, but hardly a powder keg, I would think. What happened?

 

As for the new story: link https://www.warhamme...ning-lassitude/

I like it; No chapter Masters, Warlords or other demigods of war, just common Imperial citizens that encounter something they do not know or understand. A prologue that does not raise (or worse; lower) expectations. Nice casual reading.

[Felix Antipodes]

Next PA story up on warcom site. This one relates to Pariah. After the drama with the last story they have not only omitted the name of the author (crap reaction on GW's part) but it isn't downloadable like the rest (ATT).
Sorry can't link to page ATT.

Drama? What are you talking about? 
 
Do you mean Retaliation? link: https://www.warhamme...ng-retaliation/
Not a great story, but hardly a powder keg, I would think. What happened?
 
As for the new story: link https://www.warhamme...ning-lassitude/
I like it; No chapter Masters, Warlords or other demigods of war, just common Imperial citizens that encounter something they do not know or understand. A prologue that does not raise (or worse; lower) expectations. Nice casual reading.

What a difference a couple of hours makes. Woke up this morning and the writing credit has returned as has the download button.
As for drama, I was referring to the reaction to the 'Consequences' short. See the thread in the Black Library section of this forum.