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[2000 pts] Trying to make a SW list


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#1
Maouw

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Greetings fellow wolf brothers,

 

He i am, in the middle of the night, with another (i know they are plenty, sorry) what do you think about my list. But this time, its not only one list, not even two but three (!) list i need opinion on.

 

Why 3 list you want to ask me ?

 

I want to play the army as a mix between ragnar and  iron wolf, so that mean i would like some armored units. However, i just can't fit all i want into a single list, so i need to make choices and i would like to have different point of view about it. And instead of saying over 10 post the changes i make, i already show what i have in mind to be, i hope, more easy to read.

 

Im not looking at a tournament list but i want something strong enough to be played with real chances of victory and can face anything, without the need to be 100% opti against those list but able to do the job without beng a disaster. A swiss knife if you prefer, not the best but still usefull.

 

I try also to fit unit i like if i can.

 

- Here the first list, where i managed to fit most things, three dread and one unit of aggressor + bjorn. I have ranged firepower with the 2 dread and eliminator, melee with murderfang and the impulsor rush/intercessor, anti armored with long fang and bjorn. I kinda like it. However i couldn't fit a tank in it and that make me sad. And i don't know if those primaris dread are worth the point cost

 

Spoiler

 

- The second one, i say goodbye to redemptor dread and aggressor to take two units of wulfen, this is more "i gonna rush it to close and its gonna hurt" list. I dislike the fact i almost totally forgot the "armored" part of a iron wolf army but i that give me a lot of anti armored unit, but maybe im having more trouble to deal with infantry and hordes.

 

Spoiler

 

 

- And the last one, i wanted to fit a executioner in all of that but that sh*t cost a arm and two legs >< Dunno if the tank is worth the sacrifice of the long fang and the remplacement of one redemptor dread by a aggressor squad.

 

Spoiler

 

Well, that all for me, so now im waiting if kind people can tell me if my ideas can be played or if they are a total disaster ^^'

 



#2
Debauchery101

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I think you should scrap the long fangs. Use las fusil eliminators. Get a battle leader to camp with them.

Try experimenting with Cunning of the Wolf for your aggressors and/or wulfen..maybe even nab a rune priest or wolf priest in terminator armor to drop in next to them for buffs/heals.

My experience so far in 8th with SW is that they are probably the best Hero Hammer army and starting to think they have the best loyalist Terminators.

Wulfen are great but if you aren't going to get a ride for them then I really think you should have some phobos deployed ahead as screens and a jump pack wolf priest near them.

Also if you're new to SW you need to really MASTER your heroic intervention strategies. Which is why more characters is good. They get a 6 in move and everyone else gets 3in..a character with armor of russ nearby of something your opponent normally wants to charge ASAP...will probably make them do something else. If they want that smoke then they're definitely going to bleed for it
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#3
Maouw

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I think you should scrap the long fangs. Use las fusil eliminators. Get a battle leader to camp with them.

 

Are a squad of 3 las fusil better than a big unit of long fangs ? So far, everyone told me to keep long fang because they perform really well. And i was thinking to have a battle leader along my intercessor, should i take another cheap one for the snipers ? Since long fang get a native hit reroll so...

 

Try experimenting with Cunning of the Wolf for your aggressors and/or wulfen..maybe even nab a rune priest or wolf priest in terminator armor to drop in next to them for buffs/heals.

 

 

Dunno. The thing i like with wulfens is, they can advance and charge in the same turn, but if i "deepstrike" them they is almost half a chance they miss the charge and get nuked next turn :/ But or aggressor, yea maybe since they are slow as heck >< Also, is investing in a trasport for a single unit of wulfen really worth ?

 

Also if you're new to SW you need to really MASTER your heroic intervention strategies. Which is why more characters is good. They get a 6 in move and everyone else gets 3in..a character with armor of russ nearby of something your opponent normally wants to charge ASAP...will probably make them do something else. If they want that smoke then they're definitely going to bleed for it

 

 

Yea totally new on SW and i don't use heroic intervetion really often with my DG, since i get nuked before reaching the close...

So, wich character should i invest then ? And should i take the primaris version or the old vanilla ones ?

 

So far, i managed to get that following your advices. In my idea, ragnar and the primaris gonna be the first wave, the second wave gonna be 2 units of wulfens and the eliminator and bjorn are for long range firepower, sniping character and anti-tank shoot (even if i find i have some lack of anti heavy armored options...). I have see a tournament list with 3 wolf priest, here i take only 2 because i want bjorn.

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Imperium - Space Wolves) [68 PL, -3CP, 1,258pts] ++

+ HQ +

Ragnar Blackmane [6 PL, 120pts]: Warlord

Rune Priest [7 PL, 130pts]: 5. Storm Caller, 6. Jaws of the World Wolf, Bolt pistol, Jump Pack, Psychic hood, Runic armour, Runic axe

+ Troops +

Intercessor Squad [5 PL, -1CP, 107pts]: Auto Bolt Rifle, Auxiliary Grenade Launcher, Veteran Intercessors
. 4x Intercessor: 4x Bolt pistol, 4x Frag & Krak grenades
. Intercessor Pack Leader: Thunder hammer

Intercessor Squad [5 PL, -1CP, 107pts]: Auto Bolt Rifle, Auxiliary Grenade Launcher, Veteran Intercessors
. 4x Intercessor: 4x Bolt pistol, 4x Frag & Krak grenades
. Intercessor Pack Leader: Thunder hammer

Intercessor Squad [5 PL, -1CP, 107pts]: Auto Bolt Rifle, Auxiliary Grenade Launcher, Veteran Intercessors
. 4x Intercessor: 4x Bolt pistol, 4x Frag & Krak grenades
. Intercessor Pack Leader: Thunder hammer

+ Elites +

Wulfen [11 PL, 198pts]
. 4x Thunder hammer & Stormshield: 4x Storm Shield, 4x Thunder Hammer
. 4x Wulfen
. Wulfen Pack Leader: Frost claws

Wulfen [11 PL, 198pts]
. 4x Thunder hammer & Stormshield: 4x Storm Shield, 4x Thunder Hammer
. 4x Wulfen
. Wulfen Pack Leader: Frost claws

+ Dedicated Transport +

Impulsor [6 PL, 97pts]: 2x Storm Bolters, Shield Dome

Impulsor [6 PL, 97pts]: 2x Storm Bolters, Shield Dome

Impulsor [6 PL, 97pts]: 2x Storm Bolters, Shield Dome

++ Spearhead Detachment +1CP (Imperium - Space Wolves) [18 PL, 334pts] ++

+ HQ +

Primaris Wolf Lord [6 PL, 82pts]
. Master-crafted auto bolt rifle and bolt pistol: Master-crafted auto bolt rifle

+ Heavy Support +

Eliminator Squad [4 PL, 72pts]
. Eliminator Sergeant: Bolt sniper rifle, Camo cloak
. Eliminator w/ Bolt sniper rifle: Bolt sniper rifle, Camo cloak
. Eliminator w/ Bolt sniper rifle: Bolt sniper rifle, Camo cloak

Eliminator Squad [4 PL, 72pts]
. Eliminator Sergeant: Bolt sniper rifle, Camo cloak
. Eliminator w/ Bolt sniper rifle: Bolt sniper rifle, Camo cloak
. Eliminator w/ Bolt sniper rifle: Bolt sniper rifle, Camo cloak

Eliminator Squad [4 PL, 108pts]
. Eliminator Sergeant: Camo cloak, Las fusil
. Eliminator w/ Las fusil: Camo cloak, Las fusil
. Eliminator w/ Las fusil: Camo cloak, Las fusil

++ Supreme Command Detachment +1CP (Imperium - Space Wolves) [24 PL, 1CP, 402pts] ++

+ HQ +

Bjorn the Fell-handed [12 PL, 1CP, 204pts]: Heavy flamer, Twin lascannon

Wolf Priest [6 PL, 99pts]: 6. Canticle of Hate, Bolt pistol, Jump Pack, Power fist, Tale of the Wolf King and the Lord of the Deeps

Wolf Priest [6 PL, 99pts]: 4. Mantra of Strength, Bolt pistol, Jump Pack, Power fist, Tale of the Wolf King and the Lord of the Deeps

++ Total: [110 PL, -2CP, 1,994pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe



#4
TSkouboe

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I like your list a lot!

It'll be able to take a lot of board control, and most units are a threat of some kind.

I think it's also difficult to choose Secondaries against in ITC - which is very good.

I have a few thoughts, but they're rather minor.

 

I would personally try to fit a Wolf Lord with Jump Pack and Thunder Hammer in. Ragnar may be just as deadly, but he is slower and can't jump over screens, so he doesn't perform the exact same role. Such a Wolf Lord can kill almost anything with the right stratagems, and (sometimes/mostly) it's worth it to charge him forward and take out two Riptides or Gorkanauts in a single turn.

 

I'm not a fan of Mantra of Strength. It can only target the priest itself, and I feel a Wolf Lord performs the role of melee monster better.

 

I may be in the minority in this, but I like one of my Wulfen without any special wargear. There's always someone firing mortars, bolters, shootas or some other basic weapons at them, and I'd rather take those wounds on a guy I've paid a lot less for.

 


I think you should scrap the long fangs. Use las fusil eliminators. Get a battle leader to camp with them.

Are a squad of 3 las fusil better than a big unit of long fangs ? So far, everyone told me to keep long fang because they perform really well. And i was thinking to have a battle leader along my intercessor, should i take another cheap one for the snipers ? Since long fang get a native hit reroll so... 

I like my Long Fangs.

I usually have six heavy weapons in the squad and a Terminator Pack Leader with Storm Shield. That makes somewhat up for their vulnerability, and even with the added cost, they're the most deadly shooting unit we have per point. They're just not the most sturdy, and that's why some don't like them.

 

Dunno. The thing i like with wulfens is, they can advance and charge in the same turn, but if i "deepstrike" them they is almost half a chance they miss the charge and get nuked next turn :/ But or aggressor, yea maybe since they are slow as heck >< Also, is investing in a trasport for a single unit of wulfen really worth ?

I completely agree with your thoughts here. Outflanking Wulfen is dangerous and only a good idea if your opponent both can't screen and you can get your Wolf Priest near them for Canticle of Hate. Those are too many dependencies for me.

Outflanking Agressors may be a good idea - their shooting is good, so they don't need to reach melee to have performed their role.

I don't invest in transports for Wulfen. I run them up the table, patiently jumping between between ruins, and that usually gets them to where the action is. In ITC, ruins are quite safe for infantry.


Edited by TSkouboe, 19 May 2020 - 02:33 PM.


#5
Maouw

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I would personally try to fit a Wolf Lord with Jump Pack and Thunder Hammer in. Ragnar may be just as deadly, but he is slower and can't jump over screens, so he doesn't perform the exact same role. Such a Wolf Lord can kill almost anything with the right stratagems, and (sometimes/mostly) it's worth it to charge him forward and take out two Riptides or Gorkanauts in a single turn.

 

Well i try to make one in it, with a storm shield either i think ?

 

 


I'm not a fan of Mantra of Strength. It can only target the priest itself, and I feel a Wolf Lord performs the role of melee monster better.

To be honest i don't have my codex yet so i have no idea about the way to use/optimize wolf priest so i took that mantra because he looked cool ^^'

 

 

I like my Long Fangs.

I usually have six heavy weapons in the squad and a Terminator Pack Leader with Storm Shield. That makes somewhat up for their vulnerability, and even with the added cost, they're the most deadly shooting unit we have per point. They're just not the most sturdy, and that's why some don't like them.

Well, look like, for almost the same cost of point, i can have :

One unit of lascan gun + a lord to reroll 1

One unit of 5 LF plasma canon x5 + Leader + Terminator wolf lord

The good thing about the LF is, it allow me to field another unit of regular eliminator, but a article i just read say long fang are vulnerable and you should use them as a deep strike and then sacrifice them next turn :/

 


 

I completely agree with your thoughts here. Outflanking Wulfen is dangerous and only a good idea if your opponent both can't screen and you can get your Wolf Priest near them for Canticle of Hate. Those are too many dependencies for me.

 

I don't invest in transports for Wulfen. I run them up the table, patiently jumping between between ruins, and that usually gets them to where the action is. In ITC, ruins are quite safe for infantry.

 

Yup. Im already heavily frustrated by charge, as a death guard player i really like deathshroud but i alway miss the charge roll and then, they become kinda useless. At least Wulfens can move a lot more but for the same price i could take more aggressor who will not depend on a wolf priest...i really don't know what to do in that case, wulfens are lorewise really a "true" SW unit and people told me aggressor can be shut down really quick too. And the other problem is, with that stupid rule who allow you to deploy your unit with a lot of space as a cordon to block deepstrike, i feel like i should not rely on that stratagem...

 

So that the "new" list i made after your opinion, to be honest that one look cool to me, but on the paper from now

 

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Imperium - Space Wolves) [57 PL, -3CP, 1,060pts] ++

+ HQ +

Ragnar Blackmane [6 PL, 120pts]: Warlord

Rune Priest [7 PL, 130pts]: 5. Storm Caller, 6. Jaws of the World Wolf, Bolt pistol, Jump Pack, Psychic hood, Runic armour, Runic axe

+ Troops +

Intercessor Squad [5 PL, -1CP, 107pts]: Auto Bolt Rifle, Auxiliary Grenade Launcher, Veteran Intercessors
. 4x Intercessor: 4x Bolt pistol, 4x Frag & Krak grenades
. Intercessor Pack Leader: Thunder hammer

Intercessor Squad [5 PL, -1CP, 107pts]: Auto Bolt Rifle, Auxiliary Grenade Launcher, Veteran Intercessors
. 4x Intercessor: 4x Bolt pistol, 4x Frag & Krak grenades
. Intercessor Pack Leader: Thunder hammer

Intercessor Squad [5 PL, -1CP, 107pts]: Auto Bolt Rifle, Auxiliary Grenade Launcher, Veteran Intercessors
. 4x Intercessor: 4x Bolt pistol, 4x Frag & Krak grenades
. Intercessor Pack Leader: Thunder hammer

+ Elites +

Wulfen [11 PL, 198pts]
. 4x Thunder hammer & Stormshield: 4x Storm Shield, 4x Thunder Hammer
. 4x Wulfen
. Wulfen Pack Leader: Frost claws

+ Dedicated Transport +

Impulsor [6 PL, 97pts]: 2x Storm Bolters, Shield Dome

Impulsor [6 PL, 97pts]: 2x Storm Bolters, Shield Dome

Impulsor [6 PL, 97pts]: 2x Storm Bolters, Shield Dome

++ Spearhead Detachment +1CP (Imperium - Space Wolves) [29 PL, 535pts] ++

+ HQ +

Wolf Lord [6 PL, 143pts]: Jump Pack, Storm shield, Thunder hammer

+ Heavy Support +

Eliminator Squad [4 PL, 72pts]
. Eliminator Sergeant: Bolt sniper rifle, Camo cloak
. Eliminator w/ Bolt sniper rifle: Bolt sniper rifle, Camo cloak
. Eliminator w/ Bolt sniper rifle: Bolt sniper rifle, Camo cloak

Eliminator Squad [4 PL, 72pts]
. Eliminator Sergeant: Bolt sniper rifle, Camo cloak
. Eliminator w/ Bolt sniper rifle: Bolt sniper rifle, Camo cloak
. Eliminator w/ Bolt sniper rifle: Bolt sniper rifle, Camo cloak

Eliminator Squad [4 PL, 72pts]
. Eliminator Sergeant: Bolt sniper rifle, Camo cloak
. Eliminator w/ Bolt sniper rifle: Bolt sniper rifle, Camo cloak
. Eliminator w/ Bolt sniper rifle: Bolt sniper rifle, Camo cloak

Long Fangs [11 PL, 176pts]
. Long Fang: Plasma cannon
. Long Fang: Plasma cannon
. Long Fang: Plasma cannon
. Long Fang: Plasma cannon
. Long Fang: Plasma cannon
. Long Fang Pack Leader: Chainsword
. . Boltgun and Bolt Pistol
. Wolf Guard Pack Leader: Storm bolter, Storm shield

++ Supreme Command Detachment +1CP (Imperium - Space Wolves) [24 PL, 1CP, 402pts] ++

+ HQ +

Bjorn the Fell-handed [12 PL, 1CP, 204pts]: Heavy flamer, Twin lascannon

Wolf Priest [6 PL, 99pts]: 6. Canticle of Hate, Bolt pistol, Jump Pack, Power fist, Tale of the Wolf King and the Lord of the Deeps

Wolf Priest [6 PL, 99pts]: 4. Mantra of Strength, Bolt pistol, Jump Pack, Power fist, Tale of the Wolf King and the Lord of the Deeps

++ Total: [110 PL, -2CP, 1,997pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe


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#6
Debauchery101

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I still stand by Las Fusils vs Long Fangs. In itc play you'll know if you're going first or not. Which means your opponent can deploy accordingly.
I always have 1 phobos character with Lord Of Deceit. So I can redeploy after them and put my las fusils right where I want them. Especially if the opponent has artillery i will move them to whatever cover I can even if not the most favorable spot on the board. But at least they'll have a decent chance to survive most things with a 1+ save

1 unit of LFs with terminator w/shield and 5 lcs=230 pts-8 wounds

2 units of Las Fusil Eliminators = 216 pts-12 wounds

5 Wolf Guard terminators- 2-hammer/shields, 3 combi plasma/fist-211-10 wounds
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#7
TiguriusX

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If you want to charge out of reserves you need to add tools to help clear chaff out of the way.

-Artillery (whirlwinds)
-Something with mobility and dakka (land speeder etc)

Alternatively you need tools to kill the chaff and continue to the next target

-Canticle of hate is the best
-Ragnar aura good too

Here is why wolf priests are amazing
6 inch pile in + 6 inch consolidate is 12" of free movement

You can sling shot around and through chaff

If you cant kill chaff you can almost always surround or tri point with that kind of movement bonus

An army list is a well tuned machine where all parts work together.

Synergy makes good units into great units

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#8
Maouw

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I still stand by Las Fusils vs Long Fangs. In itc play you'll know if you're going first or not. Which means your opponent can deploy accordingly.
 

Im not playing ITC rules by far  sweat.gif

 

 

I always have 1 phobos character with Lord Of Deceit. So I can redeploy after them and put my las fusils right where I want them. Especially if the opponent has artillery i will move them to whatever cover I can even if not the most favorable spot on the board. But at least they'll have a decent chance to survive most things with a 1+ save
 

If i don't make a mistake, that only work for phobos keyword unit and eliminators don't have the keyword phobos

 

 

1 unit of LFs with terminator w/shield and 5 lcs=230 pts-8 wounds

2 units of Las Fusil Eliminators = 216 pts-12 wounds

5 Wolf Guard terminators- 2-hammer/shields, 3 combi plasma/fist-211-10 wounds

Im not sure about terminator, because they're ugly (yea that count too) and im worried without a arjac, they could be only..meh

My concern with your idea is double. I don't know if you are wrong or right, but the return i got about this confuse me. Ppl told me, LF with plasma are awesome, so i build them. Then a article say, long fang are the most usefull when deepstrike but this is not that great since you have to use PC and they gonna be destroyed next round. Then is you, who would ditch LF for lasgun eliminator. Im kinda lost overall sweat.gif

And if i take AT eliminator, i lost two of them as anti infantry and/or character, wich i one of my concern since, in my idea, they are here to kill character the time my melee units reach the close to soften the ennemy.

 

If you want to charge out of reserves you need to add tools to help clear chaff out of the way.

-Artillery (whirlwinds)
-Something with mobility and dakka (land speeder etc)
 

I want to get in melee range and drop 30 dices in the face of my opponent. But i want a decent range support too, because, and im talking about my DG experience, since i NEVER got the turn 1 im alway behind in term of firepower, and death guard is oriented for melee/close range guns so i want something with range, who can ditch out those :cussing vehicule and soften the enemiesline till ragnar come and shred everything with his fellow primaris friends.

This is why i :cussing likee those eliminator since i read they datasheet : sniper (i love sniper), able to take down character (so destroy ennemy synergie around them) and even pressure my opponent even if he is undercover. And they only cost 72pts, so im :cussing sold to those units ^^' However, im still not sue that list is strong enough in term of range. I don't aim to win the battle guns versus guns but i want to do more that just scratch the paint of my emmey.

 

 

Alternatively you need tools to kill the chaff and continue to the next target

-Canticle of hate is the best
-Ragnar aura good too

Here is why wolf priests are amazing
6 inch pile in + 6 inch consolidate is 12" of free movement

You can sling shot around and through chaff

If you cant kill chaff you can almost always surround or tri point with that kind of movement bonus

An army list is a well tuned machine where all parts work together.

Synergy makes good units into great units

So, in that current list, do that look working kinda well or i just put units in it and they have crapy synergy overall ?

And i agree about synergy, its just hard to find them without the experience in the game sadly :/



#9
Debauchery101

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I'm sorry for confusion. Deep striking an Expensive unit of marines with heavy plasma cannons...doesn't seem efficient. They most likely will die soon after. Plus if you overcharge when they drop they die on 1s and 2s

Which is why I showed those alternate options around the same cost..even though I didn't add in the drop pod cost.

Whirlwinds are an excellent choice

As for the wolfguard terminators...6 over charged shot...no penalties for moving so just die on 1s

Arjac is a Bargain Value Character.. I'd put him in the top 5 best value Named Characters in the game. But not having him around Wolf Guard Terminators doesn't make them bad. They still hit on 3s with their fists/hammers. He will mitigate most of the 1s on the plasma guns. Even if the 3 gunners melt themselves you still need to direct a decent amount of dmg resources to take out 2 terminators with shields.

I don't know what other Marine lists you've played but as it sits with Marines you're either punchy or shooty. Then in those two types some chapters allow different ways to enhance those types. So when looking at choices to cover weaknesses you should ask if that choice if made will be as efficient as the units that play into chapter strengths. I think its prudent to take units that have a really high chance of sustained dmg output and/or tarpit use. Elminators in cover definitely last longer.

A common scenario is you roll out with Ragnar and friends in impulsors...hop out after it moves to line up charge next Turn. You also dropped those terminators in. Now your opponent has to choose between plasma spam/terminators charging and Ragnar.

I'm not saying you're wrong and I'm right. I'm just trying to give more of a competitive way of looking at it. Rule of Cool definetly is a good way of choosing an army
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#10
Maouw

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I'm sorry for confusion. Deep striking an Expensive unit of marines with heavy plasma cannons...doesn't seem efficient. They most likely will die soon after. Plus if you overcharge when they drop they die on 1s and 2s

No problem ^^. My issue is, i suck at deepstriking. Well, maybe not, but my opponent alway use one cheap unit to cover upp all the aera and i end up in the middle of nowhere...and my charge rolls are so far alway crapy as heck.

 

Arjac is a Bargain Value Character.. I'd put him in the top 5 best value Named Characters in the game. But not having him around Wolf Guard Terminators doesn't make them bad. They still hit on 3s with their fists/hammers. He will mitigate most of the 1s on the plasma guns. Even if the 3 gunners melt themselves you still need to direct a decent amount of dmg resources to take out 2 terminators with shields.

So, if i take arjac + 4 termi plasma/fist and 2 hammer/shield, i get some nice drop on the ennemy team and still get a treat in long range.A wolf priest with cantical of hate become a must have in that case i assume

 


I don't know what other Marine lists you've played but as it sits with Marines you're either punchy or shooty. Then in those two types some chapters allow different ways to enhance those types. So when looking at choices to cover weaknesses you should ask if that choice if made will be as efficient as the units that play into chapter strengths. I think its prudent to take units that have a really high chance of sustained dmg output and/or tarpit use. Elminators in cover definitely last longer.

So far ? No one. In my local meta, in the club, i only know one guy who play SW (lol) but almost everyone including me play chaos or xenos, we have almost no loyalist list and even less SM list, i never faced one so i have no idea of what i should expect facing them or playing them. But SW is kinda like my DG, they are the best when you reach close, wich make me sick (lolx2) with y DG with the lack of mobility so im looking at SW who can move faster and be :cussing brutes in melee too.

 

But the "trauma" if i can say that, from the fe games i played as a DG is how easily i got removed by long range weapons, so im "afraid" to go all in melee with SW and try to include a solid firepower base. Like, leviathan, repex, eliminator, even long fang. The termi bomb really tempt me (even if i find SW termi kinda old and ugly) but that let me with a lot less of range option, so would that be still okay or not, i dunno



#11
TiguriusX

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I don't know what other Marine lists you've played but as it sits with Marines you're either punchy or shooty. Then in those two types some chapters allow different ways to enhance those types. So when looking at choices to cover weaknesses you should ask if that choice if made will be as efficient as the units that play into chapter strengths. I think its prudent to take units that have a really high chance of sustained dmg output and/or tarpit use. Elminators in cover definitely last longer.

So far ? No one. In my local meta, in the club, i only know one guy who play SW (lol) but almost everyone including me play chaos or xenos, we have almost no loyalist list and even less SM list, i never faced one so i have no idea of what i should expect facing them or playing them. But SW is kinda like my DG, they are the best when you reach close, wich make me sick (lolx2) with y DG with the lack of mobility so im looking at SW who can move faster and be :cussing brutes in melee too.

 

But the "trauma" if i can say that, from the fe games i played as a DG is how easily i got removed by long range weapons, so im "afraid" to go all in melee with SW and try to include a solid firepower base. Like, leviathan, repex, eliminator, even long fang. The termi bomb really tempt me (even if i find SW termi kinda old and ugly) but that let me with a lot less of range option, so would that be still okay or not, i dunno

 

 

Every Wolf Lord has their own style

 

I probably play SW with more shooting than my peers

 

I feel our melee is good enough that I don't need 100% melee units

 

I shoot the melee armies and melee the shooty armies

 

I basically use the water style approach to combat

 

 

 

SW actually have some really good shooting tricks

 

SW leviathans are deadly because keen senses lets them walk and shoot anything at BS2...flyers and defensive trick units have no hope of surviving the dual storm cannons

 

Terminator bomb is really awesome and I keep spreading the news everywhere I can

 

Long fangs can be good but will chew up your CP to get the most impact (at least 3 CP to outflank...keen senses...eye of the wolf)


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#12
Maouw

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SW actually have some really good shooting tricks

 

SW leviathans are deadly because keen senses lets them walk and shoot anything at BS2...flyers and defensive trick units have no hope of surviving the dual storm cannons

 

Terminator bomb is really awesome and I keep spreading the news everywhere I can

 

Long fangs can be good but will chew up your CP to get the most impact (at least 3 CP to outflank...keen senses...eye of the wolf)

 

 

Talking about leviathan, are they really that good ? I was looking at the repex first but i deadly love that leviathan and i would be happy to put one on the tabletop.

And yea, terminator bomb look cool, im gonna look at it since i like arjac model biggrin.png
So my choice would be between arjac/termi and a leviathan i guess, no way to make them fit together...


Edited by Maouw, 21 May 2020 - 05:59 PM.


#13
TiguriusX

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Talking about leviathan, are they really that good ? I was looking at the repex first but i deadly love that leviathan and i would be happy to put one on the tabletop.
And yea, terminator bomb look cool, im gonna look at it since i like arjac model biggrin.png
So my choice would be between arjac/termi and a leviathan i guess, no way to make them fit together...


Funny you mention that.

I replaced my leviathan with the terminator bomb.

I found my leviathan died turn 1 most games and was enemy priority #1 all the time

I was tempted to run 2 leviathans to overcome this but then I discovered white scars and started outflanking a WS leviathan to guarantee it was alive to attack

My terminators teleport so they are guaranteed to alpha strike before they get shot at

And they are pure SW so fit my mono faction needs for now.

If I go crazy I can combine both concepts but it would be a completely different list from what I am currently running

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#14
Maouw

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So in your opinion terminator bomb would be more usefull ? Sadly i can't find any decent combi plasma to replace the combi bolters they have ><

Could aggressor bomb be a thing instead of the termi ? A lot o firepower, a treat in melee but they can't get a buff from rjac for example



#15
TiguriusX

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So in your opinion terminator bomb would be more usefull ? Sadly i can't find any decent combi plasma to replace the combi bolters they have ><

Could aggressor bomb be a thing instead of the termi ? A lot o firepower, a treat in melee but they can't get a buff from rjac for example

 

It depends on your list.  Remember everything works together.

 

A single leviathan can be killed (people geared up to kill knights in the meta a few cycles back)

 

However, an army built around a leviathan as bait can take advantage and be stronger

 

Multiple vehicle type units (warsuits and dreads and impulsors etc.)

 

 

When they nerf chaplain dreads I may go back to 1 or even 2 leviathans in my list.  It doesn't work for me currently but that doesn't make it a bad unit.

 

Terminators work for me because I get the offense and defense benefits

 

I drop my rune priests behind the terminators...I mortal wound things that scare me.  I fire 20 plasma shots at things that scare me.

When I am done most of the scary things are usually dead.  Whatever is left can try to kill 10 terminators with 7 storm shields but I usually pop transhuman physiology

 

As long as 1 survives to block for the RPs I follow up the next turn with more mortal wounds.  My RP force can be effective without using a CP so they are great for the end game

 

That is how my list is designed to operate

 

A leviathan can't teleport in like that.  It doesn't fit my current list needs.


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#16
TiguriusX

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Sadly i can't find any decent combi plasma to replace the combi bolters they have ><


Waiting for these to arrive in mail...will let you know if they work

http://image.boltera...16298_30668.png
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#17
Maouw

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Sadly i can't find any decent combi plasma to replace the combi bolters they have ><
 


Waiting for these to arrive in mail...will let you know if they work

http://image.boltera...16298_30668.png

 

Look like what i need, im waiting the feedback with a lot of hopes smile.png

 

 

 

So in your opinion terminator bomb would be more usefull ? Sadly i can't find any decent combi plasma to replace the combi bolters they have ><

Could aggressor bomb be a thing instead of the termi ? A lot o firepower, a treat in melee but they can't get a buff from rjac for example

 

It depends on your list.  Remember everything works together.

 

A single leviathan can be killed (people geared up to kill knights in the meta a few cycles back)

 

However, an army built around a leviathan as bait can take advantage and be stronger

 

Multiple vehicle type units (warsuits and dreads and impulsors etc.)

 

 

When they nerf chaplain dreads I may go back to 1 or even 2 leviathans in my list.  It doesn't work for me currently but that doesn't make it a bad unit.

 

Terminators work for me because I get the offense and defense benefits

 

I drop my rune priests behind the terminators...I mortal wound things that scare me.  I fire 20 plasma shots at things that scare me.

When I am done most of the scary things are usually dead.  Whatever is left can try to kill 10 terminators with 7 storm shields but I usually pop transhuman physiology

 

As long as 1 survives to block for the RPs I follow up the next turn with more mortal wounds.  My RP force can be effective without using a CP so they are great for the end game

 

That is how my list is designed to operate

 

A leviathan can't teleport in like that.  It doesn't fit my current list needs.

 

I would lke to play a dual list with ragnar company and iron wolves company, so mecanised stuff all around, even if its not the best competitive thing. Do you don't have any issues with a 10 terminator drop ? Usually my opponent alway let spread unit everywhere to stop me from deepstriking like i want. Do i really need to choose between rune priest and wolf priest or i could take both ?

 

 

Edit :

What do you guys think about that list ? 2 intercessor with stalker bolt for hold and shoot objective, one to hold objective, 3 units to rush close with impulsor and ragnar, two eliminator squad for the character hunting, a termi drop bomb with arjac, one unit of aggressor to flank even more and creat another source of threat. I have replaced two incursor unit by intercessor because they are cheaper if i want to field the aggressor, gonna cost me much money but...

 

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Imperium - Space Wolves) [85 PL, -3CP, 1,512pts] ++

+ Stratagems +

Trophies of Fenris [-1CP]: Trophies of Fenris - 1 Extra Relic

+ HQ +

Arjac Rockfist [7 PL, 110pts]

Bjorn the Fell-handed [12 PL, 1CP, 204pts]: Heavy flamer, Twin lascannon

Ragnar Blackmane [6 PL, 120pts]

+ Troops +

Intercessor Squad [5 PL, -1CP, 107pts]: Auto Bolt Rifle, Auxiliary Grenade Launcher, Veteran Intercessors
. 4x Intercessor: 4x Bolt pistol, 4x Frag & Krak grenades
. Intercessor Pack Leader: Thunder hammer

Intercessor Squad [5 PL, -1CP, 107pts]: Auto Bolt Rifle, Auxiliary Grenade Launcher, Veteran Intercessors
. 4x Intercessor: 4x Bolt pistol, 4x Frag & Krak grenades
. Intercessor Pack Leader: Thunder hammer

Intercessor Squad [5 PL, -1CP, 107pts]: Auto Bolt Rifle, Auxiliary Grenade Launcher, Veteran Intercessors
. 4x Intercessor: 4x Bolt pistol, 4x Frag & Krak grenades
. Intercessor Pack Leader: Thunder hammer

+ Elites +

Aggressors [6 PL, 111pts]: 2x Aggressor, Aggressor Pack Leader
. Auto Boltstorm Gauntlets/Fragstorm Grenade Launcher

Wolf Guard in Terminator Armour [13 PL, 211pts]
. Wolf Guard in Terminator Armour: Combi-plasma, Power fist
. Wolf Guard in Terminator Armour: Storm shield, Thunder hammer
. Wolf Guard in Terminator Armour: Combi-plasma, Power fist
. Wolf Guard in Terminator Armour: Combi-plasma, Power fist
. Wolf Guard Pack Leader in Terminator Armour: Storm shield, Thunder hammer

+ Heavy Support +

Eliminator Squad [4 PL, 72pts]
. Eliminator Sergeant: Bolt sniper rifle, Camo cloak
. Eliminator w/ Bolt sniper rifle: Bolt sniper rifle, Camo cloak
. Eliminator w/ Bolt sniper rifle: Bolt sniper rifle, Camo cloak

Eliminator Squad [4 PL, 72pts]
. Eliminator Sergeant: Bolt sniper rifle, Camo cloak
. Eliminator w/ Bolt sniper rifle: Bolt sniper rifle, Camo cloak
. Eliminator w/ Bolt sniper rifle: Bolt sniper rifle, Camo cloak

+ Dedicated Transport +

Impulsor [6 PL, 97pts]: 2x Storm Bolters, Shield Dome

Impulsor [6 PL, 97pts]: 2x Storm Bolters, Shield Dome

Impulsor [6 PL, 97pts]: 2x Storm Bolters, Shield Dome

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Imperium - Space Wolves) [26 PL, -1CP, 485pts] ++

+ HQ +

Wolf Guard Battle Leader [5 PL, 128pts]: Jump Pack, Master-Crafted Weapon, Saga of the Beastslayer, Storm shield, Thunder hammer, Warlord

Wolf Priest [6 PL, -1CP, 99pts]: 6. Canticle of Hate, Bolt pistol, Jump Pack, Power fist, Saga of the Wolfkin, Stratagem: Hero of The Chapter, Tale of the Wolf King and the Lord of the Deeps, The Wulfen Stone

+ Troops +

Intercessor Squad [5 PL, 86pts]: Auxiliary Grenade Launcher, Bolt rifle
. 4x Intercessor: 4x Bolt pistol, 4x Frag & Krak grenades
. Intercessor Pack Leader

Intercessor Squad [5 PL, 86pts]: Auxiliary Grenade Launcher, Stalker Bolt Rifle
. 4x Intercessor: 4x Bolt pistol, 4x Frag & Krak grenades
. Intercessor Pack Leader

Intercessor Squad [5 PL, 86pts]: Auxiliary Grenade Launcher, Stalker Bolt Rifle
. 4x Intercessor: 4x Bolt pistol, 4x Frag & Krak grenades
. Intercessor Pack Leader

++ Total: [111 PL, -4CP, 1,997pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe


Edited by Maouw, 21 May 2020 - 08:51 PM.


#18
Debauchery101

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With terminator bombs you definitely want a couple of characters and maybe a unit of marines in drop pod to deploy together. That way you can spread out and take advantage of heroic intervention. Since all units can do so. At the very least you can maneuver closer for extra movement.
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#19
TiguriusX

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Do you don't have any issues with a 10 terminator drop ? Usually my opponent alway let spread unit everywhere to stop me from deepstriking like i want. Do i really need to choose between rune priest and wolf priest or i could take both ?

 

I don't need my terminators to get in close because they are a shooting/defensive unit in my list. 

 

12" is all I need.  24" is fine as well but I lose rapid fire.

 

I have the option to charge and Inquisitor Hector Rex has a psyker spell preventing overwatch so I can do it with 0 risk.

 

Go check out my Saga of the Terminator Trials thread.

 

I did batreps with pictures showing my experience recently.  

 

 Click on the SPOILER tags to reveal everything


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#20
Maouw

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With terminator bombs you definitely want a couple of characters and maybe a unit of marines in drop pod to deploy together. That way you can spread out and take advantage of heroic intervention. Since all units can do so. At the very least you can maneuver closer for extra movement.

 

 

 

I don't need my terminators to get in close because they are a shooting/defensive unit in my list. 

 

12" is all I need.  24" is fine as well but I lose rapid fire.

 

So if i understand well what your saying, from my modest noob point of view.

You take primaris into impulsor to rush close

You use a termi bomb somewhere on the map with combi and storm shield, either they take focus and tank a lot of shot or they are let alone and can shoot freely.

To make that work even more, i need character like smash captain and/or wolf priest w jumpack to buff as more as i can

I should find other threat in my list to force my opponent to make more choices.

 

If i take terminators to drop and shot, is that stilla good idea to bring arjac, since you loose the 1 additional attack in fight phase ? Better take another wolf lord in termi armor no ?

For example, trying to fit what you guys said.

I have a termi bomb who can reroll hit and wound of 1

Aggressor to "fep" maybe in another place

Muderfang as another melee threat

But for that i lost 1 CP and all the long range threat from eliminator

 

To be honest, try after try, i start to lost hope about finding something balanced enough x)

 

Spoiler


Edited by Maouw, 22 May 2020 - 05:27 PM.


#21
TiguriusX

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No list is perfect. There is always a counter. That is where your skill has to overcome the problem.

I absolutely fear artillery lists.

My main trick is 3 chaplain venerable dreads you cant shoot. They serve as my anchor and I play around them. If I play artillery I lose my hidden infantry protecting the dreads. I have to work around that as a player.



This whole terminator bomb is not supposed to cause you stress lol.

I use 10 because it means I get more value.
1 CP I get up to 20 rapid fire plasma hitting on 2

You only get half of that benefit with your 5 man unit

I dont use any impulsors in my list. I have a very different style of army

Think what you need them for. What is your goal when you play.

I see your list lacking anti tank shooting.
Plasma terminators can handle that. But I would recommend more guys.

You dont need aggressors to be honest.

Your impulsors have a ton of dakka to clear chaff and your intercessors do the same job.

If you want punchy power give some weapons to your terminators instead of a SS. Pack leader and 1 guy holding a weapon give you 7 attacks hitting on 2s (just like a hero character).

I wouldn't use terminator lord or WGBL if you can replace with jump pack versions it is much better.

I definitely wouldn't give them plasma. Never want to risk overcharge killing them so gun never gets full benefit. Melta is what I usually give a wolf lord

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