9th and Custodes

[Balerion84]

Yes, Allarus having so many good strats and finally being able to actually afford them, is exciting. Hope the new point values don't screw then too much...

As for wardens, unfortunately, no idea, don't have any and didn't try them by proxying either.

 

And one more thing... new morale... first time I was actually thowing for morale with Custodes  and even lost a model to attrition (last model of the unit so...). It's a very unfamiliar feeling.

Edited July 6, 2020 by Balerion84

[Maouw]

Meh okay

Im glad to know allarus perform well, they are kinda the unit i like the most :p

And no one have tested aquilon termi either ?

[Prot]

Did any of you guys got feedback of wardens in game ?

 

Sorry I can't see using Wardens right now. Just my initial reaction is that they really needed or should have received a specific "Warden" Strat to keep up with the rest of the changes. Right now it's hard to deny the Allarus flexibility.

 

For the record I do have 5 of them, but I only used them for a period in 7th ed.

 

Yes, Allarus having so many good strats and finally being able to actually afford them, is exciting. Hope the new point values don't screw then too much...

 

As for wardens, unfortunately, no idea, don't have any and didn't try them by proxying either.

 

And one more thing... new morale... first time I was actually thowing for morale with Custodes  and even lost a model to attrition (last model of the unit so...). It's a very unfamiliar feeling.

 

Yes Allarus feel good. And your opponent's Scarab Occult can be made to be very survivable (psychic stuff) and offensive (shoot twice strat if they don't move) and at AP-2... not to mention if the TS player is playing the Cult of Time, he can resurrect 2-3 a turn (and add to that with a strat). 

 

So if you could keep them down to a minimal size, I think that's pretty huge. I bet if you got them into CC though, your Allarus would shred them apart. (Also bypassing their ignore 1 AP "All is Dust" rule.)

 

Good call on the unlimited range of the Custodes deny strat. I still like the SoS option which may allow for 2 denials a turn. Plus I combined the SoS (-1 to cast within 18) with the Culexus -2 to cast. Not bad really. Not amazing Psychic protection, but I would say the limitation on Chaos HQ's for 9th is going to really hurt psychic armies, not to mention they have to Command Re-roll both dice, making it less of an auto pass.

 

Personally I'm sticking with the Vanguard detachment for now with my Allarus blob, SoS, and... I'll be trying my Multimelta Contemptor!!! 

 

That contemptor has maybe seen 4-5 games total way back. But now with the Dread Strats, moving and shooting without penalty + the new "roll extra D6" strat which I believe works on melta... well I think it's time to pull this guy out and get him to work with the Telemon(s)!

[Maouw]

Maybe a dumb question but i don't have mycodex right now : can a telemon be used in deep strike with the stratagem who allow you to teleport at 3 of a vexilla ?

 

 

 

Personally I'm sticking with the Vanguard detachment for now with my Allarus blob, SoS, and... I'll be trying my Multimelta Contemptor!!!

 So i assume you use your SoS with bolter and to hold objective ? Or you still take troops ?
 

[Prot]

Maybe a dumb question but i don't have mycodex right now : can a telemon be used in deep strike with the stratagem who allow you to teleport at 3 of a vexilla ?

 

 

 

Personally I'm sticking with the Vanguard detachment for now with my Allarus blob, SoS, and... I'll be trying my Multimelta Contemptor!!!

 So i assume you use your SoS with bolter and to hold objective ? Or you still take troops ?

 

 

So in game 1, I took the one squad I actually own. The ones with the Great Swords. (still being painted, but otherwise quite playable). Their Swords actually are... great. 

 

In Game 2 I took no SoS and that's because I was forcing a legal Battalion, but I'm having second thoughts.

 

I feel right now that for all comers, one of my greatest issues will be against Psykers, and Mortal Wounds specifically. I don't think my Culexus is enough. (Maybe he will be, but not so far.)

 

So in the future I would like to try: A Rhino, a squad of great swords, and a squad of flamers. The Greatswords are good enough imho because anything near the middle of the board will be handled by Custodes, and I want the SoS that are tasked with holding something to only be doing so where I can hide them. (A bolter, imho, isn't a good enough reason to make them visible to any enemy at T3 and one wound a piece.)

 

The flamer squad will 1) use the Rhino to 'shield' my characters (which are so unprotected in this edition!) and 2) get out, and roast screening units like I'm seeing my Tau friends starting to use in 9th (as they have seen the necessity of it now.) Screens (I think) will make a comeback in 9th with some armies that rarely used them, if at all.

 

It might be too many points, but there is a few things going on here that might make it worthwhile? I'd love to hear from other people who have tried them.

[Balerion84]

Yes Allarus feel good. And your opponent's Scarab Occult can be made to be very survivable (psychic stuff) and offensive (shoot twice strat if they don't move) and at AP-2... not to mention if the TS player is playing the Cult of Time, he can resurrect 2-3 a turn (and add to that with a strat).

 

So if you could keep them down to a minimal size, I think that's pretty huge. I bet if you got them into CC though, your Allarus would shred them apart. (Also bypassing their ignore 1 AP "All is Dust" rule.)

 

Indeed, over the 2 rounds it took my 5 Allarus to delete his 9 scarabs, he resurrected 3 of them I think, 1 and then 2. With all their defensive buffs, they are tough, and at 1 point there was 56 shots going at my allarus. They resulted in those mentioned 3 dmg, rest was done in CC. Luckily, that's when my vindicare decided to become useful and one shot his sorcerer with dark matter crystal so they wouldn't run away :D

 

I think the fact I painted them in their shield host shadowkeepers colors before the game was the secret.

Edited July 6, 2020 by Balerion84

[Kenzaburo]

So glad to hear that Allarus are now unit that I not only play because it looks cool, but because they are worthwhile too. I'll have to see how I handle Guardians, Sagittarum and Venatari though. I really want to use them.

[klisof]

So it seems like Crusade style games are going to be popular at least for the start of 9th, how does everyone think Custodes will do on that format?

 

25 power level they start at is not much, the HQ+one troop min requirement is at least 15 power level (foot captain + sagittarum) and you only start with 3 CP.

[BaconCouch]

So it seems like Crusade style games are going to be popular at least for the start of 9th, how does everyone think Custodes will do on that format?

 

25 power level they start at is not much, the HQ+one troop min requirement is at least 15 power level (foot captain + sagittarum) and you only start with 3 CP.

For giggles, on a tiny board, the opponent won't be able to mass enough firepower to really deal with it. Take that, and then a dreadnought or a min terminator or bike squad. I think we'll shine at those points.

[Prot]

 

So it seems like Crusade style games are going to be popular at least for the start of 9th, how does everyone think Custodes will do on that format?

 

25 power level they start at is not much, the HQ+one troop min requirement is at least 15 power level (foot captain + sagittarum) and you only start with 3 CP.

For giggles, on a tiny board, the opponent won't be able to mass enough firepower to really deal with it. Take that, and then a dreadnought or a min terminator or bike squad. I think we'll shine at those points.

 

 

- I will say for my first games of 9th I felt Assault was getting a big boost. The table size definitely helps.

- That said I have been surprised at the 'mini-nerfs' to assault which swing the pendulum back to shooting.

- So far I think a mid range shooty army with tough troops is strong. Where an army like Tau will still have very strong advantages against Custodes. They will just have to flex their secondaries in different ways than us. Obviously our strengths are their weaknesses and vice versa.

 

Specifically the half inch within an model within an inch for assault can be tricky. Thankfully we get around the '6 model' new coherency rules, and I can tell you first hand (with other armies) it is quite cumbersome.

 

Also the ability to multicharge and throw the 'hail mary' approach is not really a thing anymore (failing to make one charge results in no charges).

 

The change in activation can be a big factor in some matchups. (Chargers still go first, but after that the opponent gets first non-charge activation.)

 

The people who play ITC will see a distinct difference between ITC and new terrain rules for competitive play. There's a moment where (hopefully) you have this Ruin you will sit behind, and then comes a moment where you are all in. That feels different. Once your in that Ruin your opponent will be doing everything they can to remove you.

 

Characters: This is extremely different. I think if you haven't played any games yet, you soon come to realize that you better keep a Dread/vehicle or big squad around your banners/HQ's etc.

 

Those are just some of the things I've found that add up to actually take Assault down a notch. Don't get me wrong I've been enjoying Custodes a lot right now. But my first inclination to believe it was going to be an assault edition had been definitely proven wrong. The good news is Custodes are one of the better armies at those board control aspects and Killing isn't as important as it used to be.

 

As far as Crusade:

- I love the idea.

- My main playing group is planning on playing this style for a while at least.

- We aren't using Power Levels... just points. (I don't know why GW insists on force feeding this on everyone. Power level is just too goofy and lopsided to take seriously beyond learning to play 40k.)

 

Crusade as a back drop seems fantastic and I hope it's properly supported.

[Hellex_The_Thanatar]

Escort teleporting dreadhost telemon on turn 2 with a vexilla' for teleport homing on the next turn is going to be my babysitter.

[Maouw]

Escort teleporting dreadhost telemon on turn 2 with a vexilla' for teleport homing on the next turn is going to be my babysitter.

That so damn nasty ? :p

[Brother Tholath]

So I have a question! I plan to try getting fully into Custodes with 9, and currently have a Shield Captain with Guardian Spear, 3 Custodes with Spears, 3 with Shields and Swords, a Vexilla in normal armour and 3 Allarus Terminators with Spears, which I can make up to 751points in old values

 

I've got £60 with FW Vouchers so was wondering what people would suggest to go for with FW stuff? Terminators? Dread?

[Prot]

 

Escort teleporting dreadhost telemon on turn 2 with a vexilla' for teleport homing on the next turn is going to be my babysitter.

That so damn nasty ?

 

 

I started doing that my first few games. Now I don't bother. The Telemon walks up the board with the Vexila to protect him starting T1 (Don't forget you literally don't know who's going first until you roll off (after alternating deployment). 

 

What I found is the Telemon is a good enough tank, and the opponent is hard pressed to single him out.

 

That's my experience in my test games thus far. Save the CP, protect the Vexila.... just my 2 cents... or should I say my 3 CP? :)

 

 

So I have a question! I plan to try getting fully into Custodes with 9, and currently have a Shield Captain with Guardian Spear, 3 Custodes with Spears, 3 with Shields and Swords, a Vexilla in normal armour and 3 Allarus Terminators with Spears, which I can make up to 751points in old values

 

I've got £60 with FW Vouchers so was wondering what people would suggest to go for with FW stuff? Terminators? Dread?

 

I really hate giving 'buy' advice, because we all see something different that appeals to our playstyles, but that being said, see my answer above. Telemon is probably a Unit you are going to see in just about any list that has a slow moving core.

 

Even in lists with a strong speed element, you can put him in God Strike pre-game, and Vexilla him in later.

 

Honestly I have a lot of FW stuff from Custodes going way back before all the layers of nerfs. It is my personal opinion almost all of it isn't worth it anymore aside from the little mini-tanks (I don't have one of those, wish I did for my collection) and the Telemon.

[Maouw]

 

 

Escort teleporting dreadhost telemon on turn 2 with a vexilla' for teleport homing on the next turn is going to be my babysitter.

That so damn nasty ?

 

 

I started doing that my first few games. Now I don't bother. The Telemon walks up the board with the Vexila to protect him starting T1 (Don't forget you literally don't know who's going first until you roll off (after alternating deployment). 

 

What I found is the Telemon is a good enough tank, and the opponent is hard pressed to single him out.

 

That's my experience in my test games thus far. Save the CP, protect the Vexila.... just my 2 cents... or should I say my 3 CP?

 How did you buy your telemon ? Storm canon x2, fist + storm canon ?

And i could use those 3CP to teleport a achilus :p

 

[duz_]

Great thing about telemons are they're designed for magnets so really easy to mix and match funds permitting

[GenerationTerrorist]

Has anyone else tried a blob of 6 Allarus Terminators, plus Trajan (with "From Golden Light") deep striking and then the Stratagem to split up into individual units?

At least there are the command points for it now!

 

Hoping to dust off my unpainted hall of Custodes shame for 9th, at some stage, and am thinking of just running a Vanguard Detachment of:

- Trajan

- Bike Captain

- 5 Spear Guardians (for holding a backfield objective)

- 2*Contemptor with MM

- 6 Allarus with Axe

- 2*4 Bikes

 

Now I am getting used my Airbrush, painting Gold has become less of an annoyance!

[Dallas Drake]

You can’t split the turn you DS.

[Dulahan]

So a thought on Wardens?   The Grenade launcher they have is considered a blast weapon.  That means auto hits against hordes.  And while MSU is certainly going to be common, I think we'll see some swings away from that at least on Orks and Daemons.   (Remember, the 6 hits only applies to 20+, not 30!).  And 30 daemons can easily tarpit an objective long past our ability to secure it. 

 

But even with MSU stuff, Unleash The Lions might become potent for fire splitting purposes (If only to easily get into range of things), or guarding a character or something.

 

All in all, glad that the situation for Custodes seems less dire than my other army.  Though Tau are gonna remain rough (And that's probably my most common matchup :(  ).  Maybe smaller table will help there. 

[Hellex_The_Thanatar]

So a thought on Wardens? The Grenade launcher they have is considered a blast weapon. That means auto hits against hordes. And while MSU is certainly going to be common, I think we'll see some swings away from that at least on Orks and Daemons. (Remember, the 6 hits only applies to 20+, not 30!). And 30 daemons can easily tarpit an objective long past our ability to secure it.

 

But even with MSU stuff, Unleash The Lions might become potent for fire splitting purposes (If only to easily get into range of things), or guarding a character or something.

 

All in all, glad that the situation for Custodes seems less dire than my other army. Though Tau are gonna remain rough (And that's probably my most common matchup :( ). Maybe smaller table will help there.

 

Do you mean allarus? Wardens don't have grenades.

[Dulahan]

Oops, yeah. This is what happens when I haven't played in months and am 200 miles from my stuff.

[Hellex_The_Thanatar]

I am sad because I have 12 aquilon as well but allarus are just so much more flexible currently.

 

I love termies but I don't think it's viable to bring squads of both types. I really wish we had some sort of jump Stratagems so we could have termies on the board and then have them warp somewhere else as needed. Then aquilons with their shots could unload. Teleport repeat. Who wants to engage them in cc? Not no one.

[nordsturmking]

So a thought on Wardens?   The Grenade launcher they have is considered a blast weapon.  That means auto hits against hordes.  And while MSU is certainly going to be common, I think we'll see some swings away from that at least on Orks and Daemons.   (Remember, the 6 hits only applies to 20+, not 30!).  And 30 daemons can easily tarpit an objective long past our ability to secure it. 

 

But even with MSU stuff, Unleash The Lions might become potent for fire splitting purposes (If only to easily get into range of things), or guarding a character or something.

 

All in all, glad that the situation for Custodes seems less dire than my other army.  Though Tau are gonna remain rough (And that's probably my most common matchup   ).  Maybe smaller table will help there. 

I Assume you mean Allarus? the grenade launcher is d3 shots so very unit with 6+ model gives it the max of 3 shots(not auto hit). Weapons with d6 shots get the max of 6 shots against unit with 11+ models.

 

I think the Allarus are slitly better than the Aquilon if you have enough other stuff to kill T8 units. But if you rely on melee to kill tanks and knights you probably want the Aquilon with fists. time will tell people have to keep their characters close now so it will be easier to get to some of them so you might not need to snipe them with the Allarus stratgem. It also depends on the type of character your opponent has if they are vital for their army being able to snipe them is more useful. But if they are not that imported for their army it might not be worth it.

 

I not think i will use Unleash the lions often because when so many good stratagem now to buff out units. The Tau matchup totally depends on the Terrain if there is enough LOSB than it not that hard. If you play on planet bowling ball it is very hard but thats just a gerneral problem with Tau.

[Maouw]

Do anyone have new about the futur update on FW rules and points ? When they gonna release the V9 point cost, im gonna start to make my list but i don't want to invest in a large of FW stuff to be nerfed/useless 1 month later.... :/

[nordsturmking]

Do anyone have new about the futur update on FW rules and points ? When they gonna release the V9 point cost, im gonna start to make my list but i don't want to invest in a large of FW stuff to be nerfed/useless 1 month later.... :/

Yes i deed i have.

 

Here are the new points for Custodes. I will post a list of changes later.

 

Seems to be the same as what guys at Mob rules say.

 

and here is a goonhammer analysis about it.

https://www.goonhammer.com/the-9th-edition-munitorum-field-manual-points-review/

 

 

 

Edited July 13, 2020 by nordsturmking