Implausible Nature YouTube Channel!

[SydonianDragoon404]

 

Great video, 1 thing that were my opinion tends to diverge from most here that I would like to add to the conversation is about the indomitus captain. In my opinion, he only offers a marginal benefit over the standard primaris captain. We already ignore mortal wounds on a 5+, so improving that to a 4+ on one guy isn't much. +1 strength and damage on the sword and +1 to armor saves is also kind of irrelevant now. Here's my reasoning: We all know we're going to be limited to 1 captain per detachment soon, so I don't know about you guys but I'm not really keen on building mine as a close combat missile anymore. I would rather keep that re-roll aura alive. 

 

I rate the gravis captain much more than the indomitus captain. Multiple close combat weapons to pick from, better toughness, additional wound, both of those have literally saved my captains life from certain death. 

 

If the indomitus captain had a 3+ invulnerable from his shield then maybe there would be more of a conversation here, but as it stands I don't see the value. 

I like the analysis here.  And I would agree that the other primaris captains are a good alternative to the Indomitus version.  However, just remember that you cannot put Gravis armor into the Impulsor, which forms the basis of that particular combo.  Captain, Judiciar, and Bladeguard in the Impulsor to utilize the Devout Push stratagem.  I often take The Honour Vehement now to ensure those Bladeguard get the additional attack after using Push.  Otherwise, the Gravis armor character has to walk.  I prefer not to do that if possible.

 

Thanks Laeroth. Yes I agree that if the specific combo of Judiciar + Captain re-rolls + Bladeguard is the combination you're going for, then the Indomitus Captain would be ideal. However, I would say that this combination is not an efficient use of a captain once our new codex comes out. We already spend lots of CP pre-game on auto-take relics and upgrades. Said auto takes are as follows:

-Captain with the Crusader Helm + WL Trait of choice (free)

-Master of Sanctity + Ancient Breviary (2 CP total)

-Any other HQ (usually a LT) with the Aurilian Shroud (1 more CP) 

 

Plus if we are going into list building knowing its quite likely we'll be fighting psykers, we want witchseeker bolts bringing us up to 4 CP before the game starts. 

 

I don't think The Honor Vehement is worth the opportunity cost on your combo considering we can be spending those CP on things like Honor The Chapter and I think its called Post-Human strength? The one that's basically our super doctrine but it costs a CP. 

 

Additionally, I think that given our current rules with bladeguard stuck at 3 models, yes it sucks and its not quite what we want. If it happens that bladeguard do move to 3-6 models per squad AS THEY SHOULD, then the ideal combo in my opinion that is similar in concept to yours is 5 Bladeguard + Judiciar in the quintessential impulsor. The biggest thing here to keep in mind as well when recommend this combo to people is that we should not be making any charges during the turn when we use this. The reason is simple, charges always go first. Once your first charging unit has fought, your opponent can immediately counterassault for 2CP with whatever the bladeguard are in combat with. If they're in combat with something nasty, you've just crippled your own strategy by allowing your opponent an opening. A serious mistake, even with how hardy bladeguard vets are. Keep in mind that RAW, your opponent CAN counterassault regardless of the Judiciar debuff. 

 

If you do end up having guests on your podcast I would be happy to discuss this further! 

[Hymnblade]

Personally, I don't really see the EC as competing with the Judiciar, especially since they're not in the same slot. I'd happily take both. The big issue for a Champion is that we typically want a captain aura, a lieutenant aura, and a chaplain, and whoops that's all the HQ slots in a Battalion; meanwhile, the Champion is just a guy with a sword, and we can get melee capability elsewhere. So either he needs to be a really good beatstick, or he needs to have some kind of support ability (eg, Vows or the ability to issue challenges) that competes with those options.

Edited August 8, 2020 by Hymnblade

[SydonianDragoon404]

Personally, I don't really see the EC as competing with the Judiciar, especially since they're not in the same slot. I'd happily take both. The big issue for a Champion is that we typically want a captain aura, a lieutenant aura, and a chaplain, and whoops that's all the HQ slots in a Battalion; meanwhile, the Champion is just a guy with a sword, and we can get melee capability elsewhere. So either he needs to be a really good beatstick, or he needs to have some kind of support ability (eg, Vows or the ability to issue challenges) that competes with those options.

100% agreed. The age where we can afford to use up an HQ slot for a melee missile is kind of over. 

[SWORD BROTHER RYAN]

Okay, just subscribed. I can't thank you two enough for getting this content out there for all. I hope this helps a lot of us that have been having trouble staying competitive. We'll see what 9th brings when it drops in full.

 

Your unit break-down is awesome, as I have the Indomitus Box coming. I also appreciate the break-down on Faith and Fury. Since all this pandemic stuff has hit, I haven't been playing and am glad that there is an explanation of what is good an what is "meh". I was disappointed in the Tactics change, but thanks for putting that into perspective.

[Sword Brother Adelard]

Is it beyond your purview to look at Crusade?

 

As I get more into it, I am beginning to see the pitfalls of early list building. In particular the fact that the system encourages you to max out on a WL trait, Relic and Crusade Relic (That is, relics from the Crusade, Crusade Relics, not the Black Templars Crusade Relics. It's not confusing at all...) on pretty much every character, but once you have chosen, you're stuck with your choices. 

Then you also have the unit traits to think about. There's a lot of variety there!

[Marshal Laeroth]

Is it beyond your purview to look at Crusade?

 

As I get more into it, I am beginning to see the pitfalls of early list building. In particular the fact that the system encourages you to max out on a WL trait, Relic and Crusade Relic (That is, relics from the Crusade, Crusade Relics, not the Black Templars Crusade Relics. It's not confusing at all...) on pretty much every character, but once you have chosen, you're stuck with your choices.

Then you also have the unit traits to think about. There's a lot of variety there!

I haven't gotten too deep into Crusade myself, but I think Acebaur has. I believe he wanted to do a video or two on it. :)

[Sword Brother Adelard]

I think it could get difficult later, for instance, I currently don't think I can later ass Helbrecht because my current Marshal has Front Line commander as his WL trait.

Similarly, I've left some key relics until later in the system, so I can put them on more expensive characters i plan to add later.

 

The other side of the coin is that you can really tank up characters. I have a company ancient with the Sword of Judgment, +1 Strength and a 5+++! And he's still to receive a WL trait!

[Templar1107]

I'm really enjoying the videos so far, you're definitely correct in that there is a definite lack of content out there for more competetively-minded black templars players.

 

Just a humble suggestion, but I'd love to see a video at some point showing tactics on the table. Even with a few mock situational setups and how you would position models to take advantage of auras, chaplain litanies, things like devout push etc. I think that visual element would be awesome.

[Acebaur]

I think it could get difficult later, for instance, I currently don't think I can later ass Helbrecht because my current Marshal has Front Line commander as his WL trait.

Similarly, I've left some key relics until later in the system, so I can put them on more expensive characters i plan to add later.

 

The other side of the coin is that you can really tank up characters. I have a company ancient with the Sword of Judgment, +1 Strength and a 5+++! And he's still to receive a WL trait!

 

The named characters are always considered to have their WLT in Crusade and don't have to spend RP on it or prevent other units from getting that WLT

[Sword Brother Adelard]

Oh yeah. I had only really looked at the Req point for them.

 

I also don't think there's anything to stop named characters levelling up? You could really do some damage with the right upgrades later on...

[Sword Brother Adelard]

No, wait, I'm thick. Looking in the wrong place again. No experience for characters! That would have been broken!

[RandyB]

No, wait, I'm thick. Looking in the wrong place again. No experience for characters! That would have been broken!

Here's the $40K question: can a character that advances via the Crusade rules ever equal a comparable named character?

[Sword Brother Adelard]

I think so, by the end they can be pretty beefy. 

[Sword Brother Adelard]

Here's an interesting idea, I can't see there being anything which stops the Cenobyte Servitors from gaining XP and levelling up...

Who can craft the most broken Cenos?

[RandyB]

I think so, by the end they can be pretty beefy.

That's a pleasant surprise. I'd expect GW to be more protective of their babies.

[Hymnblade]

 

No, wait, I'm thick. Looking in the wrong place again. No experience for characters! That would have been broken!

Here's the $40K question: can a character that advances via the Crusade rules ever equal a comparable named character?

Depends who you're comparing to, I think. None of the Crusade traits can replicate unique auras like Helbrecht or Grimaldus have, so it's hard to compete with buffing characters. But there are lots of ways to make a character into a better beatstick, so characters like the Emperor's Champion who are just really fighty can probably be surpassed.

[RandyB]

 

 

 

No, wait, I'm thick. Looking in the wrong place again. No experience for characters! That would have been broken!

Here's the $40K question: can a character that advances via the Crusade rules ever equal a comparable named character?

Depends who you're comparing to, I think. None of the Crusade traits can replicate unique auras like Helbrecht or Grimaldus have, so it's hard to compete with buffing characters. But there are lots of ways to make a character into a better beatstick, so characters like the Emperor's Champion who are just really fighty can probably be surpassed.

That's more what I expected. Not just from GW, but from any game company. GW hasn't been the worst though. Not in my experience.

[Sword Brother Adelard]

So, If I'm not mistaken, because Cenobyte Servitors have no unit leader, you can upgrade each model's close combat weapon individually.
In which case, I think I would go Shredder and Heirloom on each. So you get exploding 6s, wounding on a 4+ regardless. 

I'd then give them Veteran Warriors to re-roll 1s to hit, Grizzled for a 6+++ and Battle Tested for Obsec

[Acebaur]

You'd be spending your marked for glory on them every game since they aren't going do much else. I don't think that's worth it tbh.

[Sword Brother Adelard]

I'm not suggesting they do it quickly!

 

What's more likely is that they die every game and never get anywhere close with all of the battlescars and lost XP.

[atropos_priest]

Subscribed, cool channel!

[Gnosis]

Great work!

Subscribed and following fanatically

[Medjugorje]

It would be very nice to hear about the list which finished 6th place on a major tournament and how the mechanics work in this list. 

[redmapa]

It would be very nice to hear about the list which finished 6th place on a major tournament and how the mechanics work in this list. 

 

Where was this and what was the list? Sounds interesting, tried google but nothing came up.

[Marshal Laeroth]

It would be very nice to hear about the list which finished 6th place on a major tournament and how the mechanics work in this list.

I also have not seen a BT list on the GT top 10 list.