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Weapon Rebalancing


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#1
Valerian

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Some of the Playtesters keep mentioning that more was coming, and even with the recent release of 9e, we don't yet have the "full picture."  I just assumed they were alluding to big changes in upcoming codexes (and perhaps they are), but now it also seems that some of the big changes are related to weapon profiles and abilities, and wargear.  We've already seen the probable change to Storm Shields, with the Bladeguard's rules for those, but now with these leaks, we're beginning to see a whole lot of major changes to some of the Marine weapons.  Check out the OP in New and Rumors here.

 

 

But, here is a bit of a summary:

 

Onslaught Gatling Cannon is now Heavy 8

 

Twin Accelerator Auto Cannon is Heavy 6

 

Multi-Meltas are now Heavy 2, and their ability has changed to D6+2 damage when shooting at a target within half range.

 

Heavy Bolter on the Invictor Warsuit changed to 1 shot at S5/AP-1/2D (less shots, but 2 Damage)

 

Ironhail Heavy Stubber now Heavy 4 (probably), which is a gain of 1 shot

 

Incendium Cannon gains a point of Strength to S6.  

 

 

Just based on these changes alone, it looks like one of the major efforts for 9e play testing has been doing a thorough pass through all of the weapon profiles to ensure lesser used equipment is made relevant.

 

If true, that's definitely big news, and will have a major impact on our lists.

 

Val


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#2
Debauchery101

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If that's the case for meltas I'm probably going to go back to to Raptors lol. Just master of ambush in 3 units of Eradicators. Also when combined with a couple units of Infiltrators and lord of deceit you can easily lock out an area, redeploy to the best spot and then deepstrike the hotness

Edited by Debauchery101, 04 August 2020 - 09:07 PM.

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#3
PeteySödes

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I'm really sad about the accelerator cannon since the Sicaran is my favorite armor. Still hope for the FW book though I suppose (assuming its in there) and the other changes are interesting. Stormwolf seems gross depending on the points.



#4
Gherrick

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The melta change will be huge on our flyers, as well. Two twin-linked MMs for 8 melta shots, and you can easily get withing 12" of the target...insane.


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#5
Valerian

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The melta change will be huge on our flyers, as well. Two twin-linked MMs for 8 melta shots, and you can easily get withing 12" of the target...insane.


Yes, sir.

#6
TiguriusX

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If the 9th edition storm fang ends up with 8 melta shots I expect the new biker chaplain to be cruising alongside chanting the recitation of focus

We will have the deadliest vehicle hunter in the game with 11 S8 AP4 BS2 shots not even counting the lascannons or missiles
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#7
Triszin

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O.o 8 melta shots....

It will be priority 1, but 8 melta shots!
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#8
The Saint Ragnar

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It can't be priority one if it is in reserves.
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#9
Triszin

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It can't be priority one if it is in reserves.


If everything is priority one, nothing is!

:D
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#10
Rune Priest Jbickb

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Thank goodness melta is getting a bump. Its always been my favorite and it's been sad to not see it on the table
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#11
Wolf Guard Dan

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I wonder if the invictor’s sidearm is still a heavy bolter or will be named something else. With heavy bolters going up in price it would make sense to me if they were S5 AP-1 D2 Three shots.
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#12
Valerian

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I wonder if the invictor’s sidearm is still a heavy bolter or will be named something else. With heavy bolters going up in price it would make sense to me if they were S5 AP-1 D2 Three shots.


Concur. That would make the new cost make sense, as well as make them a worthwhile option.

#13
Arentius

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If the 9th edition storm fang ends up with 8 melta shots I expect the new biker chaplain to be cruising alongside chanting the recitation of focus

We will have the deadliest vehicle hunter in the game with 11 S8 AP4 BS2 shots not even counting the lascannons or missiles

Or you could do Catechism of fire for the +1 to wound rolls (2 chaplains lets have both!)

 

 

 

Edit: Also the ATV's have the biker keyword, so they should be able to use the Skilled Riders strat for that 4+ invuln / 3+ invuln when advancing


Edited by Arentius, 05 August 2020 - 07:54 AM.


#14
Karhedron

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The melta change will be huge on our flyers, as well. Two twin-linked MMs for 8 melta shots, and you can easily get withing 12" of the target...insane.


I JUST glued on the Heavy Bolters! wallbash.gif


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#15
Arentius

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So..provided this is universal in a 2k list you can absolutely decimate people with melta onslaught.

 

Storm wolf = 8 melta shots

Longfangs = 9 (11 if you add a 5th packmember)

Eradicatores = 6 shots

 

23 shots a turn, with primo turn 1 potential if deepstriking the Longfangs via droppod / keen senses.

 

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#16
Wolf_Lord_Kraigen

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Some of the Playtesters keep mentioning that more was coming, and even with the recent release of 9e, we don't yet have the "full picture." I just assumed they were alluding to big changes in upcoming codexes (and perhaps they are), but now it also seems that some of the big changes are related to weapon profiles and abilities, and wargear. We've already seen the probable change to Storm Shields, with the Bladeguard's rules for those, but now with these leaks, we're beginning to see a whole lot of major changes to some of the Marine weapons. Check out the OP in New and Rumors here.


But, here is a bit of a summary:

Onslaught Gatling Cannon is now Heavy 8

Twin Accelerator Auto Cannon is Heavy 6

Multi-Meltas are now Heavy 2, and their ability has changed to D6+2 damage when shooting at a target within half range.

Heavy Bolter on the Invictor Warsuit changed to 1 shot at S5/AP-1/2D (less shots, but 2 Damage)

Ironhail Heavy Stubber now Heavy 4 (probably), which is a gain of 1 shot

Incendium Cannon gains a point of Strength to S6.


Just based on these changes alone, it looks like one of the major efforts for 9e play testing has been doing a thorough pass through all of the weapon profiles to ensure lesser used equipment is made relevant.

If true, that's definitely big news, and will have a major impact on our lists.

Val


I hope Macro Plasma Incinerators get a change too because currently I really regret taking one on my redemptor
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#17
Karhedron

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I hope Macro Plasma Incinerators get a change too because currently I really regret taking one on my redemptor


It already got Blast which makes it a bit stronger against large units.
Sanguinius stood up, stretching his wings to their full extent. He flexed his hands. "I need no blade".
It was as though Sanguinius gleamed with pale light, his face white, eyes becoming blood-red, surrounded by the golden crown of flowing hair. Guilliman had witnessed glimpses of of his brother's wrath before, but had never seen the true Blood Angel unleashed. Sanguinius surged forward on alabaster wings, half a meter from the floor, whiteness streaming from him like flames.

#18
Vassakov

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So, I'm going to be "that guy" but this is a definite example of where being a supplement might be an advantage as we won't have to wait to be brought in line with other adjustments.

 

The devil will be in the detail (Strategems, Relics, retention of unique units etc) but if they are revamping a lot of the core weapon profiles we'll get those with everyone else rather than having a 6-9 month delay again.


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#19
Triszin

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The melta change will be huge on our flyers, as well. Two twin-linked MMs for 8 melta shots, and you can easily get withing 12" of the target...insane.


I JUST glued on the Heavy Bolters! wallbash.gif

 

and here I was about to cut my meltas off.

 

I think you could bore out the bolter and put a magnet in it, and then put a magnet in the melta tip? and just put the melta tip on top of the heavy bolter bit?


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#20
Dark Shepherd

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These bumps mighnt be for free though

Could very easily be points increases for some of these weapons/units

#21
Jorin Helm-splitter

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I think as far as the storm wolf is concerned the melta buff would be a bit of double edged sword, because it's a great target for their melta as well. Its always seemed with melta units that they are great if your opponent has a model or two that are more expensive than the unit.

#22
TiguriusX

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I think as far as the storm wolf is concerned the melta buff would be a bit of double edged sword, because it's a great target for their melta as well. Its always seemed with melta units that they are great if your opponent has a model or two that are more expensive than the unit.

 

The stormwolf/stormfang have the alpha strike advantage

 

 

They can either hide far away in a corner and zoom 20-50" using superior mobility to hit a target OR they can strategic reserve and drop right on target turn 2

 

The biggest change to the meta IMO will be multi-melta marines in drop pods

 

You can't intercept and kill those units...only defense is to screen them out

 

Vehicles are going to disappear like they did when the Castellan was curb stomping things


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#23
Dark Shepherd

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I think as far as the storm wolf is concerned the melta buff would be a bit of double edged sword, because it's a great target for their melta as well. Its always seemed with melta units that they are great if your opponent has a model or two that are more expensive than the unit.


The stormwolf/stormfang have the alpha strike advantage


They can either hide far away in a corner and zoom 20-50" using superior mobility to hit a target OR they can strategic reserve and drop right on target turn 2

The biggest change to the meta IMO will be multi-melta marines in drop pods

You can't intercept and kill those units...only defense is to screen them out

Vehicles are going to disappear like they did when the Castellan was curb stomping things

Auspex Scan/Chooser of the Slain; if youre playing against marines youd almost want a Wolf Priest beside a Repulsor of Invictor just for it

Deepstrike is the way to go for Stormfangs, they look like serious glasscannons now. Though technically they have free Stormstrike missiles I think due to a points glitch

I do agree though that we could see a vehicle light meta
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#24
TiguriusX

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I think as far as the storm wolf is concerned the melta buff would be a bit of double edged sword, because it's a great target for their melta as well. Its always seemed with melta units that they are great if your opponent has a model or two that are more expensive than the unit.


The stormwolf/stormfang have the alpha strike advantage


They can either hide far away in a corner and zoom 20-50" using superior mobility to hit a target OR they can strategic reserve and drop right on target turn 2

The biggest change to the meta IMO will be multi-melta marines in drop pods

You can't intercept and kill those units...only defense is to screen them out

Vehicles are going to disappear like they did when the Castellan was curb stomping things

Auspex Scan/Chooser of the Slain; if youre playing against marines youd almost want a Wolf Priest beside a Repulsor of Invictor just for it

Deepstrike is the way to go for Stormfangs, they look like serious glasscannons now. Though technically they have free Stormstrike missiles I think due to a points glitch

I do agree though that we could see a vehicle light meta

 

 

You can't kill the marines inside a drop pod using intercept stratagems

 

All you do is kill the drop pod and then marines get to pop out

 

I guess you could get lucky with rolls of 1 but that isn't worth the CP IMO

 

***

Q2. If the unit arriving as reinforcements has another unit embarked inside it which must disembark after it has been set up (such as units embarked within a Drop Pod, or a Tyrannocyte), can the firing unit shoot at the unit as it disembarks? A: No – though the unit can shoot at the Drop Pod/ Tyrannocyte before the units inside disembark

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#25
Wolf_Lord_Kraigen

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I hope Macro Plasma Incinerators get a change too because currently I really regret taking one on my redemptor

It already got Blast which makes it a bit stronger against large units.

That's true but unfortunately it's not really an anti-horde weapon IMO, I'd pick the Onslaught cannon otherwise. The real purpose of the plasma is anti vehicle but it does the job very poorly IMO while it's d6 shots.
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