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Iron Hands diffirent close combat style? (fluff)

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#26
Iron Father Ferrum

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In the axe vs sword department, I'd just like to point out that Iron Father Gdolkin in his novel used an axe. The mini that came out around the same time used an axe. Feirros' model has an axe. Stronos' artwork has an axe - which coincidentally is the same axe that is a relic in our supplement.

My point is that regardless of the comparative skills required, we are clearly an axe-faction.
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#27
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It’s kind of a shame Ferrus has a hammer, in a way.

#28
bluntblade

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It’s kind of a shame Ferrus has a hammer, in a way.

I'd be interested in seeing a depicting of him wielding a sword, given that he made Fulgrim's with the intent of using it himself.

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#29
Iron Father Ferrum

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It’s kind of a shame Ferrus has a hammer, in a way.


On that note, our Tactical upgrade kit came with a hammer. So I also consider that pretty lore friendly.
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#30
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Ferrus used many melee weapons.
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#31
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As we already established.

#32
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There is short story he fought the Primogenitor with just gladius !
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#33
bluntblade

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I would say that in the fluff depictions I've seen, the Iron Hands aren't artists of bladework in the way that Dark Angels, Emperor's Children or Blood Angels tend to be. They're more of a piece with the Sons of Horus and Imperial Fists in that.


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#34
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Agreed and remember they are quite merciless as well .


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#35
bluntblade

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Kinda hard not to notice that when you've read Wrath of Iron.


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#36
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That was a really good one .
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#37
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As far as swordsmanship goes, some of the later Horus Heresy books frequently mention Medusan Zweihanders and such.



#38
bluntblade

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As far as swordsmanship goes, some of the later Horus Heresy books frequently mention Medusan Zweihanders and such.

But the wielding that's depicted doesn't suggest any fancy schools of swordsmanship. Henricos goes through several senior Sons of Horus captains, but the emphasis is on his bionic speed and power.
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#39
MetalMammoth

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Yes. Absolutely. Simple and efficient, no moves wasted, no-nonsense fighting style.

 

edit:

 

Which book was it, when the Salamander would keep coming up with fancy new names for his Iron Hand friend's new sword, and the medusan legionaire would just say: It already has a name: "Sword".

 

That's a great insight into their mindset.


Edited by MetalMammoth, 20 August 2020 - 11:07 AM.

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#40
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As far as swordsmanship goes, some of the later Horus Heresy books frequently mention Medusan Zweihanders and such.

But the wielding that's depicted doesn't suggest any fancy schools of swordsmanship. Henricos goes through several senior Sons of Horus captains, but the emphasis is on his bionic speed and power.

Wow Medusan zweihander needs to be modeled immediately in 40k.

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#41
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As far as swordsmanship goes, some of the later Horus Heresy books frequently mention Medusan Zweihanders and such.

But the wielding that's depicted doesn't suggest any fancy schools of swordsmanship. Henricos goes through several senior Sons of Horus captains, but the emphasis is on his bionic speed and power.
Wow Medusan zweihander needs to be modeled immediately in 40k.
Have you read the shorts in which they appear? Cos the description is pretty neat too, with the weapon decked out with multiple disruptor feeds and such. A very techy sword.

Edited by bluntblade, 20 August 2020 - 02:06 PM.

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#42
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I’ll definitely have to check them out!

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#43
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I’ll definitely have to check them out!

Grey Talon and then Little Horus are the ones you want.
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#44
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I've always imagined the Iron Hands' fighting style to be focused on efficiency of movement - finding the most immediate, brutal means to a kill and executing it so that they can immediately move on to the next opponent - this is kinda informed by the fact that in Wrath of Iron they deem certain enemies too feeble to justify the waste in bolt rounds it'd take to kill them, so they switch to chainswords instead.

 

 

 

 

As far as swordsmanship goes, some of the later Horus Heresy books frequently mention Medusan Zweihanders and such.

But the wielding that's depicted doesn't suggest any fancy schools of swordsmanship. Henricos goes through several senior Sons of Horus captains, but the emphasis is on his bionic speed and power.
Wow Medusan zweihander needs to be modeled immediately in 40k.
Have you read the shorts in which they appear? Cos the description is pretty neat too, with the weapon decked out with multiple disruptor feeds and such. A very techy sword.

 

 

Okay, this needs to go in their expanded wargear options when I get round to working on a 30k Iron Hands supplement (would forcing re-rolls of successful invulnerable saves be too much?)



#45
bluntblade

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I've always imagined the Iron Hands' fighting style to be focused on efficiency of movement - finding the most immediate, brutal means to a kill and executing it so that they can immediately move on to the next opponent - this is kinda informed by the fact that in Wrath of Iron they deem certain enemies too feeble to justify the waste in bolt rounds it'd take to kill them, so they switch to chainswords instead.

 

 

 

 

As far as swordsmanship goes, some of the later Horus Heresy books frequently mention Medusan Zweihanders and such.

But the wielding that's depicted doesn't suggest any fancy schools of swordsmanship. Henricos goes through several senior Sons of Horus captains, but the emphasis is on his bionic speed and power.
Wow Medusan zweihander needs to be modeled immediately in 40k.
Have you read the shorts in which they appear? Cos the description is pretty neat too, with the weapon decked out with multiple disruptor feeds and such. A very techy sword.

 

 

Okay, this needs to go in their expanded wargear options when I get round to working on a 30k Iron Hands supplement (would forcing re-rolls of successful invulnerable saves be too much?)

Given the detail Wraight specified, and the fact that it cuts armoured Space Marines the feth in half (I don't know why there are no GIFs of Emily Blunt saying that in Looper), I think that's the right approach.


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#46
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Keep them Ap3 and it’ll be balanced I reckon.

#47
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Keep them Ap3 and it’ll be balanced I reckon.

 

I was thinking of the following profile (for centurions, consuls & praetors)

 

Str: +1  AP:Type: Melee, Two-Handed, Unwieldy, Disruption Matrix

 

Disruption Matrix: Any successful invulnerable saves made against wounds from this weapon must be re-rolled.

 

 

This was based off the profile for the Blood Angels' Blade of Perdition, as that weapon is AP2 and causes two wounds that each need to be rolled against separately, which is *kinda* similar mathematically to the Disruption Matrix given you cause 2 Invul saves, and while the Medusan Zweihander only has the potential to cause a single wound, the re-roll does make the singe save less likely to be successful. I also feel like AP2 is important as there aren't many things with an Invul save that don't have a 2+ armour save (at least in the Legion list), and if it was AP3 the invul shenanigans would be kinda redundant as any enemy would just take the armour save instead. Assuming the loss of Master-Crafted and Deathfire roughly equates to the Disruption Matrix rule, I've also given it Unwieldy and +1 Strength, as I liked the idea of it being heavy and less about challenges.

 

Overall this profile shakes out as a two-handed Power Axe that forces re-rolls of successful invulnerable saves, which makes it pretty brutal against 1-Wound Terminators but less amazing in challenges, as most enemies will be striking first and anything else with Unwieldy is probably powerful enough to cause Instant Death.


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#48
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Rerolling invuls is a badfeelsie but if damage is only 1D that isn’t really crazy .
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#49
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Rerolling invuls is a badfeelsie but if damage is only 1D that isn’t really crazy .

 

Valdor's spear forces invul re-rolls so there is a precedent, but I can understand if folks might not want it outside of Special Characters - my thinking was that it was a cool way to convey an archaeotech feeling, with the Iron Hands using a rare type of disruptor emitter that can interfere with energy fields. Plus it lets them have a melee weapon that's pretty good in a certain niche (mulching terminators) but if they come up against another character from a more close combat oriented Legion they're still gonna come a cropper. 


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#50
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It’s fluffy as heck so I like it .
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