We're so going to get nerfed

[Debauchery101]

I went to my first tournament of the year yesterday. Think there were around 50-60 players

Man...more than half were Marine Players. Half of them were Salamanders successors using stealthy and marksmen

 

I played salamanders. Ive put in a lot of games with my club at each other's houses which is mostly marines...because its the only fun way. I really wanted to bring my death watch or raptors but I figured I should go for the win. Which I won every game easily. Although I took 2nd place because a Harlequin player seemed to max out every possible point in his matches...weirdly he only played vs 2 marines and I went vs 4 marines...oh well

 

I myself and most everyone seemed to not really like the way the scene has progressed. 2 guys who ive been seeing at competitions for years say they're quitting.

 

Whats crazy is that my salamanders army is basically the same as its always been but instead of using 2 venerable dreads w/ las cannons and taking a phobos librarian, I took a judicar and 2 eradicators...this list wasn't all that good a year back. Now I can play the counter game near flawlessly.

I am worried that marines about to get slapped down or were going to have xenos/traitor get major buffs to counter us.

 

Thinking about it more.. Gw probably going to knee-jerk nerf marines after they sell the codex, start releasing the other codices, which are likely already printed. Then have to nerf them because they'll be OP

[Minsc]

 

 

We're so going to get nerfed

 

Good, means all the WAAC:y bandwagoners can hopefully move along and leave my Chapter alone so I can play it without feeling like "that   guy".
(Not that I consider Salamander successors with "Stealthy and Marksmen" to be remotely connected with Salamanders, but that's a different topic.)

On a more serious note, while our Chapter Tactic gets nerfed (no more re-roll to hit), the overall buff to Flamer- and Melta-weapons will probably increase our overall strength (assuming the list contains said weapons), while also removing the "forced need" for MSU. 

It's a win in my book. 


 

[Debauchery101]

Lol...if you go to a tournament and youre not 'that guy' why did you go?

My issue with having one faction dominating everyone is that the next OP list/faction is sitting just around the corner waiting for the current one to die. Because that was what kept it in check

 

I really miss the game when it was more Rock, Paper, Scissors

 

Now its paper, paper, Tactical Nuke

Edited September 13, 2020 by Debauchery101

[Uberlord Gendo]

Hopefully they'll be a bit more restrained in things, since the big advantage most Salamanders have is is in terms of playing to the tough and durable side of the Salamanders, which I think heavy intercessors are going to exacerbate for the Iron Hands too. Take and hold seems to be the way to go in 9th, but I'm encouraged by things like a Green Tide winning a tournament. I just looked it up, article here: https://www.goonhammer.com/tournament-report-labor-day-gt/, but short version is it came in second with a single loss to Custodes. Predictably, the Custodes list used a bunch of tanks, but it also used Sisters of Silence for objective control. It's also worth noting that none of the top 4 lists were loyalists, though two were nurgle based chaos.

 

As a result, I'm actually sort of hopeful here, since if Da Boyz can win, it means there's options besides being tough. I'm thinking that as the edition goes on, we may see more options, particularly since building to counter marines as a high toughness high wound threat ends up opening gaps for horde armies.

 

I think GW can deal with most of it by modulating strat costs to PL, since while Heavy Intercessors are going to be filthy for... like everyone actually, they don't synergize well with some chapters like White Scars and while they'll have a place in Imperial Fists armies etc, the points adjustments that would make sense for IH or Salamanders strats would make them unusable for other foneed. At the same time, the boost of old-marines to 2 wounds and the changes to heavy bolters are going to really shake things up- I think some of these lists we're seeing now are just not going to work in a few months because of these changes and their ripples in the meta.

 

So I'm hoping GW sits and thinks first about why things are good before moving to nerf. In this regard, I'm actually hopeful since the mission structure was made with my tournament organizers, so if they're getting input from them, I'm hoping we'll see a more measured response, since, again, I'm thinking a solid fix may just be increasing the costs of some strats for units with given characteristics.

[Debauchery101]

I think a better guage on effectiveness will be later on but i feel the nerf bat will strike before players can figure out counters.

This was the first tournament in my area and it was at 1 of 3 places that just started letting people game since Sept 1st. There was a good mix of competitive and casual gamers. That most likely is going to be a regular thing until casual gamers have more options to casually game. That definitely retards proper analysis of strength.

I really wanted to fight those harlequins. A good player is challenging to face and armies like salamanders uaing my list is as close to a hard counter as I could get them. Death guard are similar, which oddly enough, had no showing.

I think 2 things to balance Eradicators that won't break them would be to take away their ability to outflank via the baseline 9th stratagems unless they're in a transport. Also coming in from reserves should prevent them from double tapping.

 

Theyre still t5 long range melta gunners and theyre about to get the 2 shot multi meltas...

 

With my raptors, wolves and death watch I have been able to mitigate most the outflanks. I intentionally and most likely will be able to screen and block players from sideswiping me with Eradicators for a couple turns which turns out to be a good tactic. Every turn you arent using them is really bad. I run mostly infantry as well so stay behind area terrain out of site from the ones on the table until I can maneuver to kill them.

 

I think the next sleeper marine faction will be raven guard/raptors. Not a lot of players have experience using or play against armies with 3+ pregame redeploy skills along with deep striking and advance moving nasty stuff like centurions

Edited September 14, 2020 by Debauchery101

[SirVulkan]

We are going to lose our reroll to hit and our core vanilla marine strats are probably going to change.  Our doctrines and how they work may change as well.  All of the new codex's coming out are getting amped up so the meta is going to change every month for this first year.  I enjoy a changing meta but that's just a little too much for me.  I don't care at this point what people think about playing my sallies.  We have sucked for almost a decade, I am going to enjoy this day in the sun.  

 

I really wouldn't take GT's seriously this year.  There are army's that simply do not function right now.  Knights, Tau, DE, all suck until they get new codices which is going to be a while.  

 

We had a GT in my area and 1st was custodes, 2nd was orks, 3rd was chaos and it had a lot of really good players in the NOVA area.  The Salamanders players landed middle to last place.  

Edited September 15, 2020 by SirVulkan