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Warp Time on Deepstrikes Legal Again?
#1
Posted 21 September 2020 - 02:40 AM

- Jings and Putrid Choir like this
#2
Posted 21 September 2020 - 03:01 AM

#3
Posted 21 September 2020 - 08:14 AM

I don't know. Perhaps GW feels that with changes to Reserves in 9th this is less of problem. Units can only enter play in your DZ on turn 1 and in no-man's land on T2. While this makes a T2 charge very easy to pull off, it is no longer the T1 alpha-strike it was in 8th.
Its nasty for sure but I don't know if it much worse than the tricks some other armies can pull off. Chaplains with Canticle of Hate are nearly as good, cannot be blocked by Deny the Witch and can potentially buff multiple units. Both Blood Angels and Space Wolves have ways to stack charge rerolls with the +2" charge move meaning that the chances of a successful charge from Reserves goes up to around 83%.
It is worth posting the query directly to the GW rules team but my hunch is it may be a deliberate change.
It was as though Sanguinius gleamed with pale light, his face white, eyes becoming blood-red, surrounded by the golden crown of flowing hair. Guilliman had witnessed glimpses of of his brother's wrath before, but had never seen the true Blood Angel unleashed. Sanguinius surged forward on alabaster wings, half a meter from the floor, whiteness streaming from him like flames.
#4
Posted 21 September 2020 - 08:19 AM

#5
Posted 21 September 2020 - 09:17 AM

Are you saying my deepstriking warp talons and sorcerer could be viable again?
Nothing so concrete.
I am merely speculating that such a change might not be entirely unreasonable.
- Doctor Perils likes this
It was as though Sanguinius gleamed with pale light, his face white, eyes becoming blood-red, surrounded by the golden crown of flowing hair. Guilliman had witnessed glimpses of of his brother's wrath before, but had never seen the true Blood Angel unleashed. Sanguinius surged forward on alabaster wings, half a meter from the floor, whiteness streaming from him like flames.
#6
Posted 21 September 2020 - 02:34 PM


My Iron Warriors Project Guns for the guns god!, Bullets for the Brass throne!
#7
Posted 21 September 2020 - 02:41 PM

Reinforcement units cannot make a Normal Move, Advance, Fall,
Back or Remain Stationary in the turn they arrive for any reason, but
they can otherwise act normally (shoot, charge, fight etc.).
https://www.warhamme...USx1R8sU7cQ.pdf
Edited by Karhedron, 21 September 2020 - 02:42 PM.
- RolandTHTG and Doom Herald like this
It was as though Sanguinius gleamed with pale light, his face white, eyes becoming blood-red, surrounded by the golden crown of flowing hair. Guilliman had witnessed glimpses of of his brother's wrath before, but had never seen the true Blood Angel unleashed. Sanguinius surged forward on alabaster wings, half a meter from the floor, whiteness streaming from him like flames.
#8
Posted 21 September 2020 - 04:26 PM

#9
Posted 21 September 2020 - 06:40 PM

#10
Posted 21 September 2020 - 07:17 PM

Remain stationary means no -1 to hit with heavy weapons?
Does that come from the Remain Stationary action or from not moving?
#11
Posted 21 September 2020 - 08:26 PM

Remain stationary means no -1 to hit with heavy weapons?
Does that come from the Remain Stationary action or from not moving?
What I think Annatar Giftbringer is referring to is the when an infantry unit moves with a heavy weapon it suffers a -1 to hit with that weapon. However units coming from reserves are counted as if they performed a normal move.
#12
Posted 22 September 2020 - 04:04 AM

Does that come from the Remain Stationary action or from not moving?Remain stationary means no -1 to hit with heavy weapons?
Technically from the remain stationary action, which is why it doesn’t apply to deepstrike units.
If you look at the movement chapter of the role book, each unit can (Must?) choose from three types of movement in the movement phase:
Normal move
Advance
Remain stationary
A unit in engagement range may choose to remain stationary of fall back.
Not moving a unit means that it chose the option “remain stationary”, which is the required condition for firing heavy weapons without penalty (and for using summoning ritual, if you play chaos).
A unit arriving from deepstrike may not activate the “remain stationary” option, so while they cannot move, they also do not count as not having moved.
Prior versions of the deep strike rule simply used the wording “counts as having moved” But with the new (and imho improved) way of writing rules GW clarifies it by flagging the “no move” as a movement option itself.
Edited by Annatar Giftbringer, 22 September 2020 - 04:05 AM.
#13
Posted 22 September 2020 - 05:05 AM

#14
Posted 22 September 2020 - 05:50 AM

And if so, in which game modes does this apply, tournaments only or all match play, or..?
I hadn’t even thought about poor Cypher until you mentioned him, but purely by looking at the codex he does look playable...
Edited by Annatar Giftbringer, 22 September 2020 - 05:52 AM.
#15
Posted 22 September 2020 - 06:25 AM

Edit: maybe if you're playing Red Corsairs, the sting will be lessened. That said, a detachment of Daemons or Knights or another legion/warband will probably be a better use.
Edited by Doom Herald, 22 September 2020 - 06:28 AM.
#16
Posted 22 September 2020 - 06:45 AM

It also means that there’s a better chance when playing among friends to actually use Cypher* since nothing in the codex or matched play rules forbid it anymore, sweet!
I have no idea how to use him or what to do with him, but I like the character and it could be fun to just toss him in there

*without getting an extra detachment
#17
Posted 22 September 2020 - 02:22 PM

It would seem you can use Renascent Infiltration and Warptime though.
Edited by ChazSexington, 22 September 2020 - 02:25 PM.
Ceterum autem censeo Macragginem delendam esse.
#18
Posted 22 September 2020 - 09:37 PM

It would seem you can use Renascent Infiltration and Warptime though.
I admit that does look like a valid combo. There are various stratagems that allow units to redeploy as if they were coming in from Reserve but don't actually count as doing so (Upon Wings of Fire is a similar one that springs to mind). I wonder how these interact with Stratagems like Auspex Scan that trigger off units arriving from Reserve? I suppose they don't.
It was as though Sanguinius gleamed with pale light, his face white, eyes becoming blood-red, surrounded by the golden crown of flowing hair. Guilliman had witnessed glimpses of of his brother's wrath before, but had never seen the true Blood Angel unleashed. Sanguinius surged forward on alabaster wings, half a meter from the floor, whiteness streaming from him like flames.
#19
Posted 23 September 2020 - 07:54 AM

It would seem you can use Renascent Infiltration and Warptime though.
I admit that does look like a valid combo. There are various stratagems that allow units to redeploy as if they were coming in from Reserve but don't actually count as doing so (Upon Wings of Fire is a similar one that springs to mind). I wonder how these interact with Stratagems like Auspex Scan that trigger off units arriving from Reserve? I suppose they don't.
Upon closer inspection, you can't, as per page 363 in the Core rulebook. A weird thing to have rules in the appendix that aren't detailed in the rules section tbh.
- Karhedron likes this
Ceterum autem censeo Macragginem delendam esse.
#20
Posted 23 September 2020 - 08:10 AM

Good catch! Well that answers all my questions although why it is there rather than in the main rules of Reserves is a mystery to me.
- ChazSexington likes this
It was as though Sanguinius gleamed with pale light, his face white, eyes becoming blood-red, surrounded by the golden crown of flowing hair. Guilliman had witnessed glimpses of of his brother's wrath before, but had never seen the true Blood Angel unleashed. Sanguinius surged forward on alabaster wings, half a meter from the floor, whiteness streaming from him like flames.
#21
Posted 23 September 2020 - 08:18 AM

Good catch! Well that answers all my questions although why it is there rather than in the main rules of Reserves is a mystery to me.
Ditto - I asked on Reddit as it instinctively felt wrong. They clarified and redirected me.
Ceterum autem censeo Macragginem delendam esse.
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