Codex: Space Wolves Errata and Preview

[Knightsword]

I hope we keep access to the main codex traits. The idea that I can take a Gravis Wolf Lord, give it the Chapter Master upgrade for the armour relic, and then give him Iron Resolve and Wolfkin to produce a model with T6, 9 wounds, 6 to 8 power fist attacks and 2+/4++/6+++ is just amusing. Imagine might of heroes on top of that. Only downside is the slow movement and needing a Repulsor to taxi him.

[Ragnar69]

The strat to get the second warlord trait specifically mentions that this must be a SW one. They wouldn't need t o write this if we didn't have access to others.

[Karhedron]

I hope we keep access to the main codex traits. The idea that I can take a Gravis Wolf Lord, give it the Chapter Master upgrade for the armour relic, and then give him Iron Resolve and Wolfkin to produce a model with T6, 9 wounds, 6 to 8 power fist attacks and 2+/4++/6+++ is just amusing. Imagine might of heroes on top of that. Only downside is the slow movement and needing a Repulsor to taxi him.

Better still, put it on a TWolf Lord with Storm Shield. Then you have a 1+/4++/6+++ save and he has a healthy 10" movement as well meaning maneuverability is not a problem.

[Triszin]

https://preview.redd.it/andy41e6iuv51.jpg?width=1540&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b5a08fdc372132e401b6e84e1c1880a122dc4188 Edited October 28, 2020 by Triszin

[WrathOfTheLion]

I didn't know that, thanks

 

I jest

Edited October 28, 2020 by WrathOfTheLion

[Bulwyf]

 

And to address someone's point above about using frost axes in your army as "blue power axes" that's only fine for those people who don't care about WYSIWYG. I personally do not care about WYSIWYG but that's my personal opinion. There's many people that DO care about that and more crucially you may run into a gamer that won't let you use those frost axe models because those aren't actually power axes those are frost axes.

WHSIWYG is no longer part of the rules and hasn't been for a couple of editions so that is not much of an argument.

 

Secondly, you are absolutely entitled to use them as blue power weapons because there is now literally no such thing as a frost weapon in the wargear list. They can't not be power axes. Icy blue is now just an aesthetic choice rather than a separate weapon.

 

 

You completely ignored my other points about WYSIWYG. For those who care about hobby side, running around with models using incorrect weapons is an issue.  

 

I also don't know if you have ever been to a tournament but every single one I've been to or heard of strictly applies WYSIWYG for models. Those frost weapons don't just magically become power axes because you want them to be. They are still frost weapons since the power weapon has it own model. 

 

If you ignore the tournaments there are still plenty of players in casual games that will only play by WYSIWYG. You can shrug these things off if they don't apply to you but let's don't ignore this for those people it does impact.

Edited October 28, 2020 by Bulwyf

[Fang_Guard23]

 

"The was only one Wolf King, there cannot be another."

"lol, then take another title, think of something new"

 

I think with all the abilities that the wolves and space marine codex have at their disposal  I wouldn't have too much of a problem with the Hounds.

[Karhedron]

Those frost weapons don't just magically become power axes because you want them to be. They are still frost weapons since the power weapon has it own model.

 

Actually, that's exactly what happens since there is now no such thing as a Frost Weapon in our wargear lists. Those are weapons ARE now variant patterns of power sword and power axe. If anyone quibbles with that, ask them to show you the entry for a Frost Sword or a Frost Axe in our wargear list.

[Bulwyf]

 

Those frost weapons don't just magically become power axes because you want them to be. They are still frost weapons since the power weapon has it own model.

 

Actually, that's exactly what happens since there is now no such thing as a Frost Weapon in our wargear lists. Those are weapons ARE now variant patterns of power sword and power axe. If anyone quibbles with that, ask them to show you the entry for a Frost Sword or a Frost Axe in our wargear list.

 

 

I know at least two tourney organizers that would post a picture of a frost weapon and a power weapon and tell you to switch to a power weapon on the model since it has its own model. The frost weapon option has been in SW gear for many years now. GW changed the rules for them just now. They would expect you to break arms off your models and replace them.

 

Again, I don't have a problem with this since I ignore WYSIWYG and show my opponent my list so they can see what gear each unit has so there is no sneaky sneaky stuff. There are players who don't have that option. I have some opponents that refused to play me because of WYSIWYG even with the gear pointed out correctly in a list. That's not even getting into tournaments where they demand WYSIWYG on every model. As I explained above I'm pretty sure where at least some of them are going to rule when it comes to SW and frost weapons. I hope I'm wrong.

[VIth]

“I know at least two tourney organizers that would post a picture of a frost weapon and a power weapon and tell you to switch to a power weapon on the model since it has its own model.”

 

Who? What tournaments?

[Gherrick]

I'm curious how the ruling would go for those that use third party bits. It seems like those models would not be allowed then. I guess I'm glad I don't play tourneys, because I would often play with folks that would use "counts as" models, if for no other reason they couldn't often afford to keep buying new models each edition when certain wargear and/or units changed drastically. I have plenty of bikes, for example, I fully intend to "count as" outriders for now, probably rebasing them at some point. They used to be WG on bikes, but ever since they got nixed, they've been gathering dust. I'm not going to fork over more money to GW to get new models, when I have fully functional ones already.

[Rune Priest Jbickb]

 

 

I know at least two tourney organizers that would post a picture of a frost weapon and a power weapon and tell you to switch to a power weapon on the model since it has its own model. The frost weapon option has been in SW gear for many years now. GW changed the rules for them just now. They would expect you to break arms off your models and replace them.

 

To be fair citing how things were ruled in a different ruleset does not say how it would be ruled in the current rules. A more accurate comparison would be if those TOs ruled you had to model master crafted weapons from the 8e space marine codex as that's much closer what we have now.

[TiguriusX]

So both casuals and super strict anal TOs are going to care what color/shade your close combat weapon is?

 

That sounds like a bad hobby scene...not a GW issue

[TheUnlikelyGamer84]

 

 

 

Those frost weapons don't just magically become power axes because you want them to be. They are still frost weapons since the power weapon has it own model.

Actually, that's exactly what happens since there is now no such thing as a Frost Weapon in our wargear lists. Those are weapons ARE now variant patterns of power sword and power axe. If anyone quibbles with that, ask them to show you the entry for a Frost Sword or a Frost Axe in our wargear list.

I know at least two tourney organizers that would post a picture of a frost weapon and a power weapon and tell you to switch to a power weapon on the model since it has its own model. The frost weapon option has been in SW gear for many years now. GW changed the rules for them just now. They would expect you to break arms off your models and replace them.

 

Again, I don't have a problem with this since I ignore WYSIWYG and show my opponent my list so they can see what gear each unit has so there is no sneaky sneaky stuff. There are players who don't have that option. I have some opponents that refused to play me because of WYSIWYG even with the gear pointed out correctly in a list. That's not even getting into tournaments where they demand WYSIWYG on every model. As I explained above I'm pretty sure where at least some of them are going to rule when it comes to SW and frost weapons. I hope I'm wrong.

I have played many tournaments here in Florida and I can tell you that 99% of players wouldn’t know or care about the difference between a frost weapon or power weapon. In fact most people I’ve talked to over the years couldn’t possibly hope to know what everyone else’s weapons are for “x” faction unless they own the same army. I know I can only speak for myself with certainty. However I was the only Space wolf player from the last 4 FLGS I’ve played consistently at since 7th Ed. TBH the only Frost weapons I can think of that don’t look like power swords or axes are the wulfen ones that actually look like ice on their edge. The rune covered sword from the grey hunter box looks like a power sword. The two handed frost axe looks Power axe as well with runes on it. Edited October 28, 2020 by TheUnlikelyGamer84

[Rune Priest Jbickb]

 

 

 

 

Those frost weapons don't just magically become power axes because you want them to be. They are still frost weapons since the power weapon has it own model.

Actually, that's exactly what happens since there is now no such thing as a Frost Weapon in our wargear lists. Those are weapons ARE now variant patterns of power sword and power axe. If anyone quibbles with that, ask them to show you the entry for a Frost Sword or a Frost Axe in our wargear list.

I know at least two tourney organizers that would post a picture of a frost weapon and a power weapon and tell you to switch to a power weapon on the model since it has its own model. The frost weapon option has been in SW gear for many years now. GW changed the rules for them just now. They would expect you to break arms off your models and replace them.

 

Again, I don't have a problem with this since I ignore WYSIWYG and show my opponent my list so they can see what gear each unit has so there is no sneaky sneaky stuff. There are players who don't have that option. I have some opponents that refused to play me because of WYSIWYG even with the gear pointed out correctly in a list. That's not even getting into tournaments where they demand WYSIWYG on every model. As I explained above I'm pretty sure where at least some of them are going to rule when it comes to SW and frost weapons. I hope I'm wrong.

I have played many tournaments here in Florida and I can tell you that 99% of players wouldn’t know or care about the difference between a frost weapon or power weapon. In fact most people I’ve talked to over the years couldn’t possibly hope to know what everyone else’s weapons are for “x” faction unless they own the same army. I know I can only speak for myself with certainty. However I was the only Space wolf player from the last 4 FLGS I’ve played consistently at since 7th Ed. TBH the only Frost weapons I can think of that don’t look like power swords or axes are the wulfen ones that actually look like ice on their edge. The rune covered sword from the grey hunter box looks like a power sword. The two handed frost axe looks Power axe as well with runes on it.

The only one I can think of was an axe off an older upgrade sprue that was definitely frost (icy edged).

[Castle Wolfenstein]

 

 

 

 

I have played many tournaments here in Florida and I can tell you that 99% of players wouldn’t know or care about the difference between a frost weapon or power weapon. In fact most people I’ve talked to over the years couldn’t possibly hope to know what everyone else’s weapons are for “x” faction unless they own the same army. I know I can only speak for myself with certainty. However I was the only Space wolf player from the last 4 FLGS I’ve played consistently at since 7th Ed. TBH the only Frost weapons I can think of that don’t look like power swords or axes are the wulfen ones that actually look like ice on their edge. The rune covered sword from the grey hunter box looks like a power sword. The two handed frost axe looks Power axe as well with runes on it.

The only one I can think of was an axe off an older upgrade sprue that was definitely frost (icy edged).

 

 

Space Wolf Ven Dread axe has an icy looking edge. Props to anyone who managed to use that as a conversion bit for their Thunderwolf cavalry.

 

I guess I dont see what all the fuss is aboot. I always thought that frost weapons used the same modes as power swords/axes, just painted all frosty. Of course I have only been playing since 2018, and not at all in tournaments, so maybe I'm dumb.

[Bulwyf]

“I know at least two tourney organizers that would post a picture of a frost weapon and a power weapon and tell you to switch to a power weapon on the model since it has its own model.”

 

Who? What tournaments?

 

Our local store had one where the guy went bonkers on me for having frost weapons on TWC that I was counting as TH with the opponents okaying it and it was correctly pointed on the list but he wouldn't let it go. Told me to break arms off or not use them and I was like well I guess I'm out of the tourney. The other one is from a large city that had the same mentality when I brought this exact situation up to him thinking he would agree with me but instead went the other way.

[Gherrick]

Not dumb certainly, because not all wargear have actual GW models/bits to represent them. We still don't have a generic wolf priest model...either use the ulrik one, or you must kitbash it yourself...I wonder if TOs would have issue with that?

[TheUnlikelyGamer84]

Bulwyf I don’t know what to tell you. I hope you took your money elsewhere as that Big city tournament and that game store are poison for the community And I’m guessing that’s not the only thing wrong there. To the rest of the world outside of our niche they are seen as friggin toys for god sake. I’m for one am glad my gaming community isn’t like that. and frankly I see that type of behavior Akin to bullying. If they keep that behavior up their will be no one to game with and last I checked 40k takes at least 2 players. Not everyone has the income to constantly change weapons and arms each time GW changes something. Which we know is often.

[Bulwyf]

Bulwyf I don’t know what to tell you. I hope you took your money elsewhere as that Big city tournament and that game store are poison for the community And I’m guessing that’s not the only thing wrong there. To the rest of the world outside of our niche they are seen as friggin toys for god sake. I’m for one am glad my gaming community isn’t like that. and frankly I see that type of behavior Akin to bullying. If they keep that behavior up their will be no one to game with and last I checked 40k takes at least 2 players. Not everyone has the income to constantly change weapons and arms each time GW changes something. Which we know is often.

 

That led to me not doing tournaments again. I already hated the mentality of min/max everything and no fluff and that kind of WYSIWYG strict adherence was the last straw.

 

But that's me. There's other gamers that like WYSIWYG and again the tournaments enforce it. I just hope no one else has the experience I had.

[Valerian]

 

“I know at least two tourney organizers that would post a picture of a frost weapon and a power weapon and tell you to switch to a power weapon on the model since it has its own model.”

Who? What tournaments?

 

 

Our local store had one where the guy went bonkers on me for having frost weapons on TWC that I was counting as TH with the opponents okaying it and it was correctly pointed on the list but he wouldn't let it go. Told me to break arms off or not use them and I was like well I guess I'm out of the tourney. The other one is from a large city that had the same mentality when I brought this exact situation up to him thinking he would agree with me but instead went the other way.

You were trying to pass off Frost/Power Weapons (axes and swords, I assume) as Thunder Hammers. I can see why they’d have a problem with that, if they were trying to enforce WYSIWYG.

 

However, that experience in no way validates your claim that either of these TOs would not count Frost Swords as Power Swords, or Frost Axes as Power Axes, especially as there is no meaningful differences in the bits. Just as there is no meaningful difference in the Master Crafted versions of those weapons.

[Wispy]

Known Frost Axes: Harald's, Krom's, the one in that upgrade sprue, the Dreadnought frost axe, the wulfen frost axes

 

Known Frost Swords: Ragnar's, the one that comes with that upgrade sprue.

 

Known Frost Claws: Murderfang's, Wulfen Frost Claws

Edited October 28, 2020 by Wispy

[Bulwyf]

 

 

“I know at least two tourney organizers that would post a picture of a frost weapon and a power weapon and tell you to switch to a power weapon on the model since it has its own model.”

Who? What tournaments?

 

Our local store had one where the guy went bonkers on me for having frost weapons on TWC that I was counting as TH with the opponents okaying it and it was correctly pointed on the list but he wouldn't let it go. Told me to break arms off or not use them and I was like well I guess I'm out of the tourney. The other one is from a large city that had the same mentality when I brought this exact situation up to him thinking he would agree with me but instead went the other way.

You were trying to pass off Frost/Power Weapons (axes and swords, I assume) as Thunder Hammers. I can see why they’d have a problem with that, if they were trying to enforce WYSIWYG.

 

However, that experience in no way validates your claim that either of these TOs would not count Frost Swords as Power Swords, or Frost Axes as Power Axes, especially as there is no meaningful differences in the bits. Just as there is no meaningful difference in the Master Crafted versions of those weapons.

 

 

I already talked to the guy at the local store. He would not allow frost axes on models with how they operate now unless they were relic weapons. I haven't asked the other guy because I didn't know there would be an inquisition over this.  I'll ask him and wait for a response. 

 

I guess that does in fact "validate" my claim. 

 

It also does not answer the problems I raised with other players, other WYSIWYG and the hobby side where your guys are running around with frost weapons and you simply don't have them at all now in 9th except as relic weapons. 

 

Not one person has really addressed this except to say don't play with people that would play that way. Ok...? What if that's the only people you can play with? What if you don't want your models to have now banned weapons? 

 

It is ok to admit there's no nice and tidy solution to those problems. 

[Dark Shepherd]

Is Frostfang a frost sword or just has frost in the title and that caused a misconception? Or was it model design?

 

8th ed codex of strange scenario of Frost Swords being depicted as larger chainswords but anyone running Frost Swords probably just painted a power sword blue. Frost Axes and Claws were blued up rather than chained up too

[Ragnar69]

I never met anyone who made a difference on frost vs. power weapon bits.

Besides, breaking arms off is a staple of edition/codex changes

I recently glued back on some power fists that had been removed in 4th edition iirc. And that intercessor pack leader who got a hammer a few months back will probably lose it again

 

Ps: but I have to admit that ripping plastic arms from metal models is way easier than all plastic models.

Edited October 28, 2020 by Ragnar69