Who else is disappointed by the new Outrider kit?

[phoenix01]

 

It would be a little easier to stomach if they hadn't gotten rid of the firstborn Bike Squad.

 

?

 

They are still in the Marine codex and available to buy.

 

They might be in the Codex, but they aren't on the US website. Searching for "Bike" on the GW US website: https://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/searchResults?_dyncharset=UTF-8&_dynSessConf=8383907404928859183&qty=&sorting=&view=&Ntt=bike

There's 3-man Scout Bikes, Attack Bike, White Scars Khan on Bike, White Scars Bike Squad Upgrade Kit, the new Primaris Chaplain on Bike, and the Ravenwing Bike Squad. See for yourself: no Vanilla Bike Squad. I'm not sure if the Ravenwing Bike Squad is the classic bikes (looks like there's wing things on the handlebar and headlight fairing plus that robed model), but it also mentions something about Land Speeder upgrades.

[WrathOfTheLion]

Ravenwing bike squad is the same kit as the normal bikes with the Ravenwing upgrade included.

 

https://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Dark-Angels-Ravenwing-Accessory-Pack

 

Think there's just some reboxing or logistics things going on with a few of the kits. Since the RW bike kit is online-only, it doesn't need to be reboxed.

Edited November 4, 2020 by WrathOfTheLion

[BluejayJunior]

Lots of kits have been taken off the site temporarily lately. I wouldn't read too much into that at the moment. If they planned on retiring that kit, they likely would have moved the data sheet to Legends instead of putting it in the codex. 

[INKS]

Ravenwing bike squad is the same kit as the normal bikes with the Ravenwing upgrade included.

 

https://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Dark-Angels-Ravenwing-Accessory-Pack

 

Think there's just some reboxing or logistics things going on with a few of the kits. Since the RW bike kit is online-only, it doesn't need to be reboxed.

 I did not realize that sprue had twin linked assault cannons? what is that for? land speeders? It's been forever since I've looked at my codex. lol I should review since I am building a landspeeder and wanted it to have all the options.

[Sonoftherubric21]

As a scars player its annoying, barely customizable. Can do some minimal work, as I am running 6 but both look almost identical. Irritating for sure. 

[Zustiur]

 

 

Ravenwing bike squad is the same kit as the normal bikes with the Ravenwing upgrade included.

 

https://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Dark-Angels-Ravenwing-Accessory-Pack

 

Think there's just some reboxing or logistics things going on with a few of the kits. Since the RW bike kit is online-only, it doesn't need to be reboxed.

I did not realize that sprue had twin linked assault cannons? what is that for? land speeders? It's been forever since I've looked at my codex. lol I should review since I am building a landspeeder and wanted it to have all the options.

The twin assault cannons and twin heavy bolters are used to make Talonmaster speeders. I.e. Ravenwing lieutenants.

[Vardus]

 

 

It would be a little easier to stomach if they hadn't gotten rid of the firstborn Bike Squad.

 

?

 

They are still in the Marine codex and available to buy.

 

They might be in the Codex, but they aren't on the US website. Searching for "Bike" on the GW US website: https://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/searchResults?_dyncharset=UTF-8&_dynSessConf=8383907404928859183&qty=&sorting=&view=&Ntt=bike

There's 3-man Scout Bikes, Attack Bike, White Scars Khan on Bike, White Scars Bike Squad Upgrade Kit, the new Primaris Chaplain on Bike, and the Ravenwing Bike Squad. See for yourself: no Vanilla Bike Squad. I'm not sure if the Ravenwing Bike Squad is the classic bikes (looks like there's wing things on the handlebar and headlight fairing plus that robed model), but it also mentions something about Land Speeder upgrades.

 

 

No offense meant neighbour, yes, on the US site they do not appear but on the UK one they are there so I don't see this as an issue, as we know that no models means retirement the "legends old models home" and is probably just a repackaging issue. I find that the GW site is sometimes whack and doesn't show models that they clearly do, when looking for the Repulsor Executioner a few months ago the search would only bring up the Spearhead detachment for said model, so hopefully this will be resolved for you soon.

 

Back to the Outriders, I agree that not having a multipart kit with options really makes it hard to make them suit the aesthetics of some marine chapters, was kind of hoping to be able to field a primaris Ravenwing squad of 5 outriders, an ATV and a Storm Speeder, but hey ho!

[Mandragola]

Weird that bikers are on sale in the UK but not US. Extra weird that they're simply gone from the US site, without even a thing saying they're out of stock or something.

 

I actually think the outrider is a great kit and a really nice design, so I'm kind of torn on them. To me, they illustrate the folly of an approach that puts models far above the game. I don't want to get into an argument about which is most important, but it sometimes feels like the model designers feel that the game is irrelevant. It isn't, for many of us.

 

So you end up with the problem of the rules following models, but the models aren't designed to have good rules - just to look cool. It's no great surprise that we end up in this stupid situation. An individual outrider is one of the best models in the marine codex but a unit is awkward. It needs more models and access to alternative weapons. Without those it's kind of useless against the wrong opponent.

 

This is then compounded by the Deathwach codex, which suddenly decides that you can have units of 5 obsec outriders that don't use a FA slot. This makes no sense whatsoever when people like White Scars can't do it. It's honestly crossed my mind to get another 12 outriders to build 3 deathwatch kill teams, for my outrider Chaplain to lead, but I don't think that's the army I want to play.

[Brother_Darius]

I am holding off on all any and all Bike and TDA purchases until after the new DA dex drops.  

I have put together what came in the Indomitus box, but other than that I'm waiting.

On the off chance that a new box set will be coming with the new DA Dex.

I do still think I'll probably get the new Primis Landspeeder when it drops, and magnitize it for maximum flexability

Edited November 6, 2020 by Brother_Darius

[Lord Nord in Gravis Armour]

 

 

Plastic kits cost 10s of thousands of dollars to design and cut the moulds.  There's ZERO chance GW decided not to use one before it was even produced at all.

 

You'd be surprised how wrong you are; my previous employer has had to can two individual moulds as a result of the pandemic and take the costs on the nose. Warlord have had to delay or outright cancel releases they've already paid for plastic-wise, and the same applies to many other companies across the industry - be it plastic, resin or metal. It's a rough situation right now.

 

 

Along these lines, the rumours of the plastic sisters line literal years before they were released were because someone had seen a mould.

 

Entirely possible the mould exists but its sitting benched as they hadn't done the rules/felt they had enough new boxes for this release. 

 

The thing is, the new codex and the Outriders entry therein would still have been finalized months ago, very likely entriely pre-Covid and almost certainly before they had made any counter-strategy to the lockdown effects. So the only way the idea of them intentionally pushing back a planned MPK box works is if you believe that the MPK box won't confer any additional weapons options for the bikes, the bikers themselves, or the sergeant, AND if you believe that GW won't allow for either larger squad sizes of 3-6 or 3-9 Outriders OR for the ability to take an Invader as part of the squad a la the Firstborn bikes.

 

I'll grant SOME of those things may be true. But I doubt all of them are. I think the push-fit Outriders were always meant as a teaser for things to come, most likely next year. I WILL say that I have doubts that an actual separate box for the push-fit Outriders was always planned and THAT may have indeed been a reaction to Nurgle's effects. I'd expect that they planned to only offer those push-fit Outriders in the initial Indomitus box and then the followup starter sets. It may end up that one or more of their planned MPK squads (Assault Intercessors, Heavy Intercesssors, Bladeguard Vets or Eradicators) does indeed get pushed back to next year, but in all of those cases* the codex has given the units more options than their push-fit squads originally had.

 

*barring Heavy Intercessors of course as their MPK box will be their first appearance.

[Charlo]

I see them as being like Hellblasters or Eradicators etc

 

They have a specific loadout for a specific job.

 

With the advent of AP-1 chainswords what they have is just fine and no need for options.

[Debauchery101]

Buy more elite 40k boxes...split it trade or sell the rest...you'll pay for your bikes and gain a few bucks or extra models/bits

[Red_Shift]

My memory is hazy but I think the original space marine bike kit was monopose and even had the head moulded onto the body. The box set came with three metal guys that added a little variety but basically the squads were all the same guy. This set at least is not too hard to convert to add some variety and really, posing is limited by them being on bikes so I think the kit is fine.

[Blindhamster]

I think the kit will be a little better once the mpk assault intercessor kit is available, should be able to get some more poses that way.

[WrathOfTheLion]

Definitely agree, should be able to do grab some extra arm poses with both pistol and sword.

 

Will be annoying to cut and file the helmet off the belt though, I really wish that was a separate part. But can do some work with it, see if replacing with a chainsword or at least changing the pistol arm pose on the sergeant.

Edited November 8, 2020 by WrathOfTheLion

[Blindhamster]

That bothers me less, I'll just have bare heads on a few.

[WrathOfTheLion]

We have stuff like specific ravenwing MK VI helmets from the black knight kit that would do a lot to add some personality. Definitely an oversight from that perspective I think.

[Blindhamster]

Arent those mk VI though? Beakie heads end up looking dumb with high colara anyway. Maybe add the little wing things to the mk X ones instead?

[WrathOfTheLion]

Still requires cutting the helmet off either way 

 

My opinion on the matter is simple, for the price of the kit, it's not of acceptable quality. It can be worked around, but for that amount of money, shouldn't have to.

[Blindhamster]

Yeah agree they should have been cheaper

[Brother_Darius]

Still requires cutting the helmet off either way 

 

My opinion on the matter is simple, for the price of the kit, it's not of acceptable quality. It can be worked around, but for that amount of money, shouldn't have to.

That criticism is fair.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

My only wish is you can field them up to five including the sergeant per squad.

[Volt]

As both a Ravenwing player and fan of normal bikes, I despise the state of the models if it's intended to be the final kit, and mechanically I just don't see any real use to them. Sure they're durable, but it's pumping out shots and attacks that are little different to an assault squad, but with less oomph due to lacking significant AP, strength, or firepower. Bikes main use is busing special weapons to where they're needed, not getting stuck in melee as a glorified jump assault unit. While looking godawful, the Invader ATV is far more functional with the changes to multi melta, same with attack bikes. And as a First player from a model perspective, why would I ever change from a kit with a plethora of options and tons of bits in favor of something that's for all intents and purposes rigidly monopose with no options? That's a deal breaker right there.

[mel_danes]

Using the same sprues as the limited release box also comes with the added frustration of them being Indomitus vets.

Each model has the crusade badge sculpted on their arms.

The other squads in that box got multi part models without the crusade badge.

Not so for bikers.

[Mandragola]

It does create problems for the game when GW produces models like this with no alternative poses or weapon options. The unit is kind of hamstrung by the limit on its size and the fact it can only do S4 attacks. The end result is a limited unit that does oNe job pretty well, but nothing else.

 

It’s unfortunate because this is far from the first time they’ve done this. Reivers and their lieutenant gave the same pproblem - no other gear in the kit so no options for the squad. Characters with only the weapons they are built with, whether they make any sense or not. It’s just not a good policy at all.