Gate of Bones/ Dawn of Fire

[aa.logan]

As a stand-alone book, it’s pretty decent- Andy Clark is improving with every book and this is well-written. Action-heavy, but with some thoughtful moments, but it doesn’t really expand one’s understanding of the feel of the Universe during the Crusade- it details An Event, and sets up a few potential threads for future stories; there’s plenty more to come from

the Chaos sorcerer baddie and potentially even a few of the Mordians from Mordian- that’s at least two characters in Andy Clarke novels who emerge from ‘death’ under a massive mountain of bones, incidentally- and it looks like interviews with Fabian the historian will be used bookend most/all stories. The Imperial Fist who gets the most page time, Lucerne, could also go in interesting directions

.

 

The cover definitely informs you of the content of the book- we’re not at Guilliman’s side as momentous things happen, instead we’re seeing some of the actual fighting from the front, mainly from an Imperial PoV. It’s all new events, so it’s not going to feel momentous *yet*, but has the potential to cement the new aspects of the setting as part of a greater whole.

Edited February 7, 2021 by aa.logan

[GarvielEisenhorn]

Does this book pick up the plot threads of the Inquisitor or the Terran data-entry woman from Avenging Son? I'm just wondering if I should reread before jumping into this one.

[Lucerne]

Any mention of Alpha Legion/traitor legion strategies in this timeframe?

[aa.logan]

In answer to both, no.

[Lord Nord in Gravis Armour]

Any mention of Alpha Legion/traitor legion strategies in this timeframe?

 

aa.logan already answered that in the negative, but you're going to enjoy reading about the Greyshield sergeant in this book.

[Marshal Rohr]

“Primaris marines bent double in a rhino”

 

Well I guess they aren’t going with ‘they’re all just space marines’ anymore.

[Lord Nord in Gravis Armour]

So, regarding Rostov from the last book and whether that's followed up on (not a spoiler ahead, as long as you've read Avenging Son)...

 

Remember that "agent" he was trying to find at the end of the last book? The one who was only known by a particular title?

 

Check the Dramatis Personae in Gate of Bones. One character just quietly has that title after his name. And he's never referred to by that title in the book.

 

I'm thinking this is a mistake as it doesn't line up with Rostov's description from the end of book one. Like maybe they did use that title for *Character X* during the writing of Gate of Bones and then decided it was a really cool title and stole it as a late change to whatever alias they were originally using in Avenging Son. And then after they scrubbed all mention of that title from the Gate of Bones story itself, they forgot to change it in the Dramatis Personae.

 

(EDIT: Feel free to fact-check me on that title never actually being used in the Gate of Bones story itself. If it was and I missed it and the two are indeed supposed to be the same character, it would be a lame letdown for what sounded like a setup for an ongoing spy hunt).

Edited February 8, 2021 by Lord Nord

[Darkwrath121]

So, regarding Rostov from the last book and whether that's followed up on (not a spoiler ahead, as long as you've read Avenging Son)...

 

Remember that "agent" he was trying to find at the end of the last book? The one who was only known by a particular title?

 

Check the Dramatis Personae in Gate of Bones. One character just quietly has that title after his name. And he's never referred to by that title in the book.

 

I'm thinking this is a mistake as it doesn't line up with Rostov's description from the end of book one. Like maybe they did use that title for *Character X* during the writing of Gate of Bones and then decided it was a really cool title and stole it as a late change to whatever alias they were originally using in Avenging Son. And then after they scrubbed all mention of that title from the Gate of Bones story itself, they forgot to change it in the Dramatis Personae.

 

(EDIT: Feel free to fact-check me on that title never actually being used in the Gate of Bones story itself. If it was and I missed it and the two are indeed supposed to be the same character, it would be a lame letdown for what sounded like a setup for an ongoing spy hunt).

Assuming you're referring to

the hand of Abaddon

, he's called that a few different times through the book, though how they're described doesn't seem to line up right between the books too much. Edited February 8, 2021 by Darkwrath121

[Lord Nord in Gravis Armour]

Yep, that's what I was referring to.

 

adding spoiler tags, although I'm still trying not to spoil anything from Gate of Bones...

 

 

Don't know how I missed the usage of that term within the text of the second book. But then I was up to about chapter thirty before I saw the post here asking about Rostov and that's probably what sparked my memory of that eariier usage in Avenging Son.

Edited February 8, 2021 by Lord Nord

[Osteoclast]

A bit ambivalent about the book tbh, though leaning positive. Two pet peeves:

1) Chaos forces referring to the “Dark Gods” and “traitor militia” just feels entirely out of place. You’d think they’d have gotten some decent PR folks over the past ten thousand years.

2) Please someone teach BL writers what a chain of command is and why it is absurd for a general to bother with reports about individual platoons. 
 

“Primaris marines bent double in a rhino”

Well I guess they aren’t going with ‘they’re all just space marines’ anymore.

It was a Sororitas Rhino.

[aa.logan]

A bit ambivalent about the book tbh, though leaning positive. Two pet peeves:

1) Chaos forces referring to the “Dark Gods” and “traitor militia” just feels entirely out of place. You’d think they’d have gotten some decent PR folks over the past ten thousand years.

2) Please someone teach BL writers what a chain of command is and why it is absurd for a general to bother with reports about individual platoons.

They gave up developing further branding after the designation ‘False Emperor’ tested so well with key demographics; ‘Corpse God’ had some traction early on but marketing felt it diluted their core values of ‘Dark Gods’ and ‘Let The Galaxy Burn” too much.

[Taliesin]

Anyone else finished yet and ready to give a review?

[RedFurioso]

Which character portraits the book contains?

[Petitioner's City]

You mean the cover or the limited edition? Does the latter have internal art?

 

Edit: I'm several chapters in, and enjoying. It is adding much to my appreciation for internal divisions within the Custodes - ideological divisions, not martial ones - as well as making me suddenly want to collect Mordians (which I never would have expected).

 

The Iron Warriors character is nicely described and presented too, including his 'love' for his Words Bearers comrade (perhaps not intended to be homoerotic, but it is quite distinctive!)

 

Hoping this will be more than just a "battle" novel - certainly very well described so far. 

Edited February 8, 2021 by Petitioner's City

[RedFurioso]

You mean the cover or the limited edition? Does the latter have internal art?

>Includes full-colour page with art from the standard edition along with two full colour character portraits

https://www.games-workshop.com/en-GB/The-Gate-of-Bones-Special-Edition-2021?_requestid=6603993

[Lord Nord in Gravis Armour]

So, in honor of a certain new character from the novel, who's going to volunteer to kitbash a Conflagration Cannon on their Questoris chassis?

[Ishagu]

Loving this book so far.

 

I'm not very far in but I have really enjoyed the various scenes and conversations between characters.

 

The opinions of the Custodes Tribune who doesn't trust Guilliman, the conversation between the Imperial Lords and the "Guest" that Guilliman invites, etc.

[b1soul]

Is the Tribune Colquan, same as Dark Imperium?

[Ishagu]

Yeah.

 

I've just finished the book and really enjoyed it.

[DarkChaplain]

There's one thing that confuses me timeline-wise, regarding

Eldrad Ulthran.

 

If Guilliman knew the seer from back during the Great Crusade, even joint operations, then it'd have been likely that Eldrad would have also approached him about the Heresy. Eldrad did this with Fulgrim, albeit only when Horus was already on the brink. However, Eldrad was an excellent seer even back then, and we know from Feat of Iron that other seers were approaching some of the Primarchs as well, years earlier - in this case Ferrus Manus, with clear foreshadowing of his beheading. The novella concludes with these seers wanting to approach others.

 

After Fulgrim, Eldrad retreated from working with humans - and was distrustful of them even before, though not excessively so before finding out that Fulgrim had already been corrupted. That doesn't really speak in favor of a great work relationship with Guilliman beforehand. It also throws into question why he didn't try to approach Roboute about the Heresy at all, despite pretty much setting John Grammaticus on his task to go to Ultramar. He could have gone a more direct route than this third party nonsense that was prone to interference from other Cabal-agents, as we've seen happen.

 

And yes, the Cabal issue is even bigger. Because in Legion, we had the Cabal approach Alpharius/Omegon about the looming Heresy parallel to Ullanor. Considering that we are told later in the series that Eldrad worked with the Cabal, it seems only logical that he'd do so because he either found out or was told about the Heresy as well. Of course, this could have happened after he approached Fulgrim, but that wouldn't really have allowed him much time to dig down to the roots of the Cabal and its members, to the point where we could see him "end" it in Old Earth. He does not act like a junior member might have. Considering he had enough time to also disavow the Cabal's path and undermine its secrets, I'd say it's safe to say he knew enough to approach one of his Imperial contacts with established relationships instead of solely going for Fulgrim and giving up.

 

 

I'm not laying this down as a flaw of The Gate of Bones or anything, really. It's just one of those weird quirks about the early Heresy in particular, and how the goalposts changed so drastically over the years. A lot of these instances exist where we are shown one thing and later told another, adding nuance, depth and history to events and characters that the first half of the series in particular pretty much shuts down through a lack of references / building characters and relationships from square one. It's one of the parts I appreciate more about the latter Heresy - there are more "throwaway" references that leave the door open for further connections down the road. It left a bit more ambiguity about the Great Crusade than the early Heresy did.

 

This is also evident with stuff like the Dark Angels under Luther getting exiled back to Caliban; in their first outing, we are told this happens right away after what's seemingly their first outing, but later in the series, we are told it wasn't the first, they'd fought with other Legions and saw Horus in action before, and they even had meet and greets at Zaramund. Chains of events that were initially presented as cut and dry, rigid A->B->C movements later got stretched to resemble B->D->F instead, not only leaving room in-between for whatever developments or diversions, but also room for however many As, so as not to start events and characters from 0, but allow authors to go further backwards as required to make references or tell stories.

 

Which I feel is also the approach Dawn of Fire and Dark Imperium are following. Dark Imperium in particular would have been a stage F story here - the "conclusion", so as it was, of the Indomitus Crusade. Most stories told since then sit somewhere in between the Gathering Storm and Dark Imperium, like The Devastation of Baal or other SMConquest books. Campaign books, like Vigilus, had to happen afterwards. Which is why I'm totally okay with the rejigging of the timeline to not have it be the end of Indomitus but maybe just Guilliman's direct involvement in the Crusade proper - the point from which it became a self-runner.

 

Haley left enough open in Dark Imperium - particularly Cawl and the Primaris history - that we can now have him and other authors tell Dawn of Fire while able to make direct links forwards and backwards, having both a framework to aspire to via the past few years' of books and story branches, but also enough flexibility to tell us really weird stories like The Gate of Bones, that still fit within the framework anyway. Characters like Colquan were left nuanced and open enough that having development shown before what we saw in Dark Imperium isn't only possible, but sensible.

 

Colquan's relationship with Guilliman in Dark Imperium isn't the starting point - but the intermediate step in his character narrative. Even The Gate of Bones isn't necessarily that starting point, either, because we've seen him mentioned briefly in Watchers of the Throne: The Emperor's Legion, as being a new tribune whose history wasn't even clear to Valerian. We are presented with ambiguity about characters that leaves them open for later interpretation, without feeling vapid and unclear in the moment of the given narrative. And that's one big thing I love about the ongoing meta-narrative we've been following since 8th edition. Here we can see it working from the ground up, pretty much, while with the Heresy, it only happened many years into the writing process, and it doesn't work well retroactively - especially as books hopped the timeline anyway.

 

To some, this indefinite approach may seem like a weakness of the narrative, but to me, it is the approach I want out of this giant toybox setting. It establishes ground rules and character dynamics more in the moment without closing off opportunities, something I feel like happened right at the launch of 8th when people were led to believe that Primaris couldn't fall to the Black Rage, or turn Wulfen, or were just Marines+1 without their own quirks..... and it hardly gets more quirky than an Imperial Fist Primaris praying to the Dad-Emperor and wishing to one day become a Black Templar.

[Lord Nord in Gravis Armour]

 

Which I feel is also the approach Dawn of Fire and Dark Imperium are following. Dark Imperium in particular would have been a stage F story here - the "conclusion", so as it was, of the Indomitus Crusade. Most stories told since then sit somewhere in between the Gathering Storm and Dark Imperium, like The Devastation of Baal or other SMConquest books. Campaign books, like Vigilus, had to happen afterwards. 

 

What leads you to that conclusion? The Vigilus books included a timeline relative to the opening of the Great Rift and according to that timeline, the runup to the War of Beasts started almost immediately, Calgar showed up about six years post-Rift, and then the whole thing concluded about 25 years post-Rift.

 

I know some people have based similar placement of Vigilus post-DI on the fact that he's not mentioned as having crossed the Rubicon in Dark Imperium (also running around in a Land Raider). But I think that's just a retcon that needs to be accepted. Because otherwise, since Calgar is still canonically the first, then NO other characters could have crossed the Rubicon prior to the end of the Indomitus Crusade. Including Mephiston, who had clearly done so much earlier.

 

It's all academic now, obviously - since the Dark Imperium trilogy is being reset to much earlier. But I'm curious if there was any reason besides the Calgar situation for people to be placing Vigilius after the Indomitus Crusade PRIOR to the timeline being adjusted.

[RedFurioso]

 

But I'm curious if there was any reason besides the Calgar situation for people to be placing Vigilius after the Indomitus Crusade PRIOR to the timeline being adjusted.

Yes, the Vigilus books mentioned Plague Wars (which happened before Vigilus and after the end of Indomitus Crusade)

>The Ultramarines, many of whom had faced Daemons before, laid down a storm of bolter fire that shredded the foremost invading creatures. These were not the slow and methodical plague-spawn that had defiled Ultramar, but a fast and dexterous breed that danced through the firestorm and endured grievous wounds with shrieks of ecstatic glee.

>Dontoria Hivesprawl had been tainted by the plagues of Nurgle that had so recently infected Ultramar, and became host to a fast-spreading sickness that none could cure.

>The Ultramarines had been critical in the war against Mortarion and his Death Guard, and he knew well that to allow the faithful of Nurgle a foothold was to see unnatural disease spread rapidly soon after. Ultimately, the barrier between reality and the warp would thin to the point that the spawn of Chaos could manifest in realspace. That nightmare could not be allowed to be made real.

>This force Calgar called the Extremis Guard, led by Lieutenant Eothrus – a rising hero who had proven himself in the long and baleful wars against Mortarion’s Death Guard.

 

>Calgar drafted a large and ornate parchment bearing the words of the Primarch Guilliman himself, and the vow that Vigilus would not fall. To this he added his own addenda, then signed with his full array of titles in his function as Regent of Ultramar, Heir Apparent of the Tetrarchy, and Chapter Master of the Ultramarines.

The Tetrarchy was established after the end of Indomitus Crusade (Dark Imperium book)

[Vanger]

Finished the book. I quite liked it. There were two things I liked a lot. First, how atypical some characters were and that even the antagonists got some character development.The other thing was having "faith" as a central theme.

The only letdown is the unsuccessful atempt at building suspense. It's not a fault of the writer, it's hard to build suspense, when the reader knows how the story ends.

Also fun fact, you can find an error in later parts of the book, wher it's obvious that Clark rewrote some of the scenes

Edited February 26, 2021 by Vanger

[Kelborn]

Still haven't received my copy.

Anyone else having the same issues?

 

I mean, Brexit for sure but it's getting ridiculous now...

Edited February 27, 2021 by Kelborn

[DukeLeto69]

So reading this thread the jury is out for me in whether to buy this. The collector in me wants to get the whole DoF series but the discerning reader really only wants to buy the strong entries in the series as my wallet has been burned in the past (looking at you HH and you TBA and you SMB). Edited February 27, 2021 by DukeLeto69