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State of the Union (Heresy)

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jaxom Venerable Brother

jaxom

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I would love thematically specific Destroyers for each legion. I guess not all Legion Destroyers used the same tactics and/or weaponry. F'rex I can't really guess how IF Destroyers would work given the character of their Primarch (Though after John French's The Will of the Legion I guess he wouldn't mind a bit of cruelty). For me any flavoured rules would be good, even if they're not 100% balanced. But I'm more a narrative player than a competitive one, so I understand the objections.

 

Even so, I think Destroyers need some love. Lorewise they are described as bringers of utter destruction with a varied arsenal of Old Night weaponry, but rulewise they only have rad grenades, phosphex bombs and rad missiles. Kinda meh TBH.

 

I think we already have this. The legions that embraced Destroyers have that reflected in more specialized units (effectively giving them two types of Destroyer units) and/or access to Rites of War which emphasize the role of Destroyers in army composition and give similar 'scorched earth' effects to other units. The Imperial Fists work exactly like default-Destroyers because that's what they used them for; there was no expansion of their role or requirement for special equipment. Need rad or phosphex? Deploy Destroyers, let them poison everything and then move on. 

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Cris R Battle-Brother

Cris R

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Have to say I hope they don’t start adding more legion specific rules to individual units. The thing I like about AoD is that it only has a few ways to make unique armies (LA rules, RoW, special characters) which means that it can stay quite balanced. The more things you add the more potential for powerful combinations, and the more open to abuse it is. The LA rules already add quite a bit of customisation and I’m happy to stick with that. More RoW though would be good. 

I was going to propose doing something similar with Indomitus terminators as this conversation picked up but I came to same conclusion. Someone else in the forums suggested giving them Deep Strike or free Power Fist upgrades as their unique differentiator from the other two marks of Terminator armor and I think that makes the most sense so they're more of a blank slate for for each legion.

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Noserenda Venerable Brother

Noserenda

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I think we already have this. The legions that embraced Destroyers have that reflected in more specialized units (effectively giving them two types of Destroyer units) and/or access to Rites of War which emphasize the role of Destroyers in army composition and give similar 'scorched earth' effects to other units. The Imperial Fists work exactly like default-Destroyers because that's what they used them for; there was no expansion of their role or requirement for special equipment. Need rad or phosphex? Deploy Destroyers, let them poison everything and then move on. 

 

That would rather rely on the Legions having equal treatment and focus, which clearly is not true as they have increase the number of Legion units and stuff over time. Not only that but the fluff is always malleable, there is (afaik) nothing specific about Alpha Legion destroyers but if one of the writers came up with some awesome fluff/rules about them setting elaborate traps or something you know that'd be out as fast as they could type it ;) Absence of proof is not proof of absence after all.

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Iron Hands Fanatic Venerable Brother

Iron Hands Fanatic

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Have to say I hope they don’t start adding more legion specific rules to individual units. The thing I like about AoD is that it only has a few ways to make unique armies (LA rules, RoW, special characters) which means that it can stay quite balanced. The more things you add the more potential for powerful combinations, and the more open to abuse it is. The LA rules already add quite a bit of customisation and I’m happy to stick with that. More RoW though would be good. 

I was going to propose doing something similar with Indomitus terminators as this conversation picked up but I came to same conclusion. Someone else in the forums suggested giving them Deep Strike or free Power Fist upgrades as their unique differentiator from the other two marks of Terminator armor and I think that makes the most sense so they're more of a blank slate for for each legion.

 

 

Given access to Deep Strike is more of a big deal in 30k and heavily involves Rites of War/ specific units, the direction I was planning on going with for Indomitus was letting them re-roll their reserve roll when deep striking, only scatter D6" when they arrive and letting them re-roll on the mishap table too, so while you need access to deep strike to use these effects it means they do have a significant bonus when they do so.

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Cris R Battle-Brother

Cris R

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Have to say I hope they don’t start adding more legion specific rules to individual units. The thing I like about AoD is that it only has a few ways to make unique armies (LA rules, RoW, special characters) which means that it can stay quite balanced. The more things you add the more potential for powerful combinations, and the more open to abuse it is. The LA rules already add quite a bit of customisation and I’m happy to stick with that. More RoW though would be good.

I was going to propose doing something similar with Indomitus terminators as this conversation picked up but I came to same conclusion. Someone else in the forums suggested giving them Deep Strike or free Power Fist upgrades as their unique differentiator from the other two marks of Terminator armor and I think that makes the most sense so they're more of a blank slate for for each legion.
Given access to Deep Strike is more of a big deal in 30k and heavily involves Rites of War/ specific units, the direction I was planning on going with for Indomitus was letting them re-roll their reserve roll when deep striking, only scatter D6" when they arrive and letting them re-roll on the mishap table too, so while you need access to deep strike to use these effects it means they do have a significant bonus when they do so.
It's an interesting idea but you're building it around specific rites of war or units that not every player will use in their lists. 30k is very much a game where everyone has access to a core set of units, each with their own set of strengths and drawbacks, that they can use to build their armies. If I run Legion Cataphractii Terminators, they will start off with a 4++ save and can't overwatch, run, or sweeping advance, which is the same starting point for all players in the game. Our legion abilities, rites of war, or unit upgrades may alter how we use the Terminator or change its profile, but the underlying rules largely remain consistent no matter which Legion, rite, or upgrade we pick for our lists. That template makes the most sense for new potential rules for the Indomitus Terminators, whether that includes Deep Striking or something else entirely. Edited by Cris R
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Hungry Nostraman Lizard Veteran

Hungry Nostraman Lizard

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If there's an argument that armies aren't flavourful enough then I couldn't disagree more. 

 

Even if neither player used a rite or war, and even if neither player used Legion rules, and even if neither player used legion specific units, there is still enough in the red book to have two massively different armies.

 

3 bullet points of special rules, two unique rites of war, a primarch (which is a force multiplier on top of being a power house) and 3-5 unique units/characters, allied with the generic rites of war and varying FOC charts is more than enough to differentiate between the legions. 

I hear you, the point with the tacticals getting their FotL buffed wasn't the intent for more flavor, but rather - incentive to take them more. I don't see large  blobs of infantry outside of a few key circumstances, Iron Warriors, Word Bearers, World Eaters, etc... giving tacticals a slight buff via a mechanic like FotL would shake up meta everywhere, I think. 

 

I also, admittedly, don't write for games professionally and am not a playtester. I'm thinking of trying the rules in some house-rule capacity and can report on that.

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Calibanite Knight Angel Battle-Brother

Calibanite Knight Angel

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Pretty sure Saul Tarvitz increased in price too :sad.: I believe he was AUD $69 when he dropped, now is AUD $74

(correct me if I'm mistaken though)

EDIT: My bad, didn't see the "across the board" part. Everything costs more (good thing I ordered the Lion a number of weeks back before his price went up!)

Edited by Calibanite Knight Angel
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MegaVolt87 Veteran

MegaVolt87

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Surprisingly transfer sheets didn't all get bumped up to the more expensive DA/WS/EC price, at least on the US store.

 

Although, I guess I shouldn't be giving them ideas any ideas :smile.:

 

I think those were all re-designed though from scratch? I wouldn't know if the older ones were better or not than the re-designs. Also- who misses the etched brass? I got enough for my IW's, but as time passes its only gotten more scarce to find for another project as I keep procrastinating on a loyalist legion choice.  

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Calibanite Knight Angel Battle-Brother

Calibanite Knight Angel

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Surprisingly transfer sheets didn't all get bumped up to the more expensive DA/WS/EC price, at least on the US store.

 

Although, I guess I shouldn't be giving them ideas any ideas :smile.:

 

I think those were all re-designed though from scratch? I wouldn't know if the older ones were better or not than the re-designs. Also- who misses the etched brass? I got enough for my IW's, but as time passes its only gotten more scarce to find for another project as I keep procrastinating on a loyalist legion choice.  

 

 

Etched brass was one of the best things ever. I just assume that it was so niche that not enough people bought it to justify them keeping it? But it really could do everything. I have the Minotaurs one, and used it to put symbols on combat shields, put iconography on vehicles, and will use it to provide the imagery on the company standard, but the sky really is the limit so I agree with your sentiment and hope it returns too.

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Excessus Venerable Brother

Excessus

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Anyone else going to Scandus? :smile.:

 

60 people are attending this weekend, it's gonna be fun!

If only! It sounds amazing. What are you bringing Excessus?

 

The day I signed up, in the morning there were five crusade slots left, but in the afternoon after work when I finally had time to sign up, there were only leviathan slots left.

 

I'm bringing a Fellblade warlord, an Alpha Legion recon company and two warhound scout titans. 3500p total! :D

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derLumpi Veteran

derLumpi

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Anyone else going to Scandus? :smile.:

 

60 people are attending this weekend, it's gonna be fun!

If only! It sounds amazing. What are you bringing Excessus?

The day I signed up, in the morning there were five crusade slots left, but in the afternoon after work when I finally had time to sign up, there were only leviathan slots left.

 

I'm bringing a Fellblade warlord, an Alpha Legion recon company and two warhound scout titans. 3500p total! :D

Please take some pictures! :)

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Chaeron Venerable Brother

Chaeron

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Anyone else going to Scandus? :smile.:

 

60 people are attending this weekend, it's gonna be fun!

If only! It sounds amazing. What are you bringing Excessus?
The day I signed up, in the morning there were five crusade slots left, but in the afternoon after work when I finally had time to sign up, there were only leviathan slots left.

 

I'm bringing a Fellblade warlord, an Alpha Legion recon company and two warhound scout titans. 3500p total! :biggrin.:

Please take some pictures! :smile.:

 

Absolutely, can’t wait to see this!

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