Can you take a Sorcerer Thrall with Ahriman?

[Rune Priest Jbickb]

Good afternoon all, quick question, is it possible to take a Sorcerer thrall with Ahriman? He doesn't have a cult so I feel like no, but I am unsure if I am missing something.

[byrd9999]

I would also side with "no", just because they specifically mention <Great Cult> Exalted Sorcerer, and the Thrall has to belong to the same <Great Cult>.

 

If it were Ahriman, he wouldn't specify a <Great Cult>, even though he can belong to any of them.

 

But you could make a case for "yes".

[byrd9999]

I'm still confused by the way GW write their rules now.

 

With Doombolt: it says "...the closest enemy unit within 18" of and visible to this psyker suffers 3 mortal wounds."

 

If they mean "closest visible enemy unit within 18" then why not just say it? There is no confusion.

 

 

BUT, that "and" they slipped in there means that both conditions need to be satisfied in order to target that unit:

1 - the unit must be the closest enemy unit

2 - the unit must be visible

 

So the Rule As Written would mean that you can only target the nearest enemy unit if they are also visible? I.e. if there is a hidden unit 7" away, then you cannot target the visible unit 12" away.

 

 

Does anyone have any insight? I can see a particularly intransigent opponent insisting on the second interpretation (that BOTH conditions need to be met) and, RAW, they would be right.

 

 

GW seem to have tried to adopt some kind of legalese language to write their rules (see some of Jervis Johnson's White Dwarf articles over the past 2-3 years), but they end up sounding unnatural and give me a headache trying to decode.

Edited September 3, 2021 by byrd9999

[Xenith]

RAW you cannot, as Ahriman lacks the GREAT CULT keyword. 

[Mushkilla]

I'm still confused by the way GW write their rules now.

 

With Doombolt: it says "...the closest enemy unit within 18" of and visible to this psyker suffers 3 mortal wounds."

 

If they mean "closest visible enemy unit within 18" then why not just say it? There is no confusion.

 

...

 

 

It's the exact same wording as smite so at least its consistent. Both conditions need to be met. It's the same as "closest visible" from a boolean logic perspective.

[Rune Priest Jbickb]

RAW you cannot, as Ahriman lacks the GREAT CULT keyword.

That was the sense I got. Trying to figure a reason to take him over an exalted on a disk but I need to unlock the second Sorcerer so now I'm leaning away from Ahriman...

[byrd9999]

 

I'm still confused by the way GW write their rules now.

 

With Doombolt: it says "...the closest enemy unit within 18" of and visible to this psyker suffers 3 mortal wounds."

 

If they mean "closest visible enemy unit within 18" then why not just say it? There is no confusion.

 

...

 

 

It's the exact same wording as smite so at least its consistent. Both conditions need to be met. It's the same as "closest visible" from a boolean logic perspective.

 

 

So, if both conditions need to be met: that the target needs to be BOTH the closest enemy unit AND visible, then does this mean opponents can prevent the use of spells like Doombolt and Smite by hiding a unit close to the psyker but hidden out of sight?

 

The closest enemy unit would not be visible, therefore any other visible unit would not be the closest, and therefore Smite cannot be used?

 

This seems like a stupid rule.

[Mushkilla]

 

So, if both conditions need to be met: that the target needs to be BOTH the closest enemy unit AND visible, then does this mean opponents can prevent the use of spells like Doombolt and Smite by hiding a unit close to the psyker but hidden out of sight?

 

The closest enemy unit would not be visible, therefore any other visible unit would not be the closest, and therefore Smite cannot be used?

 

This seems like a stupid rule.

 

 

No. Might be easier if you think about it like this:

 

The closest enemy unit that meets the following conditions: within 18" AND visible.

 

or:

 

1. You are looking for units that are both: within 18" AND visible

2. Then you pick the closest units that meets those conditions.

 

Hope that helps. 

[byrd9999]

Thanks!

[Closet Skeleton]

Ahriman has been an auto include even in non TS chaos armies for a long time so its good that he has some drawbacks now.