Executioner main weapon?

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

Out of the main guns which is best in 9th?

[Captain Idaho]

Please clarify what you mean? What's the definition of main weapons and on what unit?

[MegaVolt87]

The plasma is the same as the redemptor and the other gun and the tank itself is crap compared to its rules it once had in 8th ed. I would be   if I had bought even one. The repulsor executioner in 8th ed was basically a FW unit in a codex. 9th ed its a decent paper weight as is most SM armoured units these days that aren't walkers. 

[Captain Idaho]

Ah I get you, you mean the Executioner tank, sorry I was in a different wavelength.

 

I think against targets the Macro Plasma Incerator is the better option.

 

However, it isn't a great tank unfortunately. A Land Raider is better and they're not great right now.

[Jorin Helm-splitter]

Personally I'd go with the heavy laser destroyer. The Marco plasma incinerator is probably a better weapon but you can take it on a better chassis (Redemptor). The heavy laser destroyer is unique and I really think when your playing a subpar unit that's important. I use mine in more casual games or against armies that need a new codex and its fun. That said if your going to pick one up be realistic with your expectations. 

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

Ah I get you, you mean the Executioner tank, sorry I was in a different wavelength.

 

I think against targets the Macro Plasma Incerator is the better option.

 

However, it isn't a great tank unfortunately. A Land Raider is better and they're not great right now.

cant put gravis in a landraider

[Captain Idaho]

That's fair but I'd advise against that Strategy as you can only transport 3 Gravis models in an Executioner and therefore their usefulness becomes very limited.

[Lord Blackwood]

Honestly they should just strip out the transport capacity of the executioner , treat it like a heavy battle tank and cost it a bit better so it would see some use. 

[Karhedron]

That's fair but I'd advise against that Strategy as you can only transport 3 Gravis models in an Executioner and therefore their usefulness becomes very limited.

Plus putting an expensive unit in an expensive (and not very durable) Transport paints a huge bullseye on the hull.

[Jorin Helm-splitter]

 

Ah I get you, you mean the Executioner tank, sorry I was in a different wavelength.

 

I think against targets the Macro Plasma Incerator is the better option.

 

However, it isn't a great tank unfortunately. A Land Raider is better and they're not great right now.

cant put gravis in a landraider

 

 

If you already have the executioner or if its the one you want I'd still recommend the heavy laser destroyer. That said if you don't have one the regular Repulsor may be a better choice* its cheaper both in points and dollars. You have some extra room to work with, and neither gun option on the executioner is worth the premium that they charge. 

 

* I tend to only recommend more competitive choices, because its tough to know what people are looking for with the hobby. So while I think you can have alot fun with this if your playgroup doesn't play optimal lists, I don't recommend either tank. If you think they're cool and your play group is more casual go for it, just have realistic expectations. In a gravis themed army I think its cool, but a repulsor with aggressors is basically a combination of one of our worst vehicles, and weaker elite choices.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

That's fair but I'd advise against that Strategy as you can only transport 3 Gravis models in an Executioner and therefore their usefulness becomes very limited.

good thing I only have 3 aggressors and they’ve proven to be the most useful primaris unit I have so far

 

 

 

Ah I get you, you mean the Executioner tank, sorry I was in a different wavelength.

 

I think against targets the Macro Plasma Incerator is the better option.

 

However, it isn't a great tank unfortunately. A Land Raider is better and they're not great right now.

cant put gravis in a landraider

If you already have the executioner or if its the one you want I'd still recommend the heavy laser destroyer. That said if you don't have one the regular Repulsor may be a better choice* its cheaper both in points and dollars. You have some extra room to work with, and neither gun option on the executioner is worth the premium that they charge.

 

* I tend to only recommend more competitive choices, because its tough to know what people are looking for with the hobby. So while I think you can have alot fun with this if your playgroup doesn't play optimal lists, I don't recommend either tank. If you think they're cool and your play group is more casual go for it, just have realistic expectations. In a gravis themed army I think its cool, but a repulsor with aggressors is basically a combination of one of our worst vehicles, and weaker elite choices.

i actually forgot there’s a normal repulsor lol.

Thanks for the reminder

 

But being able to wound T6 on a 2+ does seem like fun lol

Edited September 8, 2021 by Inquisitor_Lensoven

[Orange Knight]

The Laser Destroyer is the better choice as it fills a niche in the Primaris line that many units don't currently focus on. Very long range, high-strength, high-damage firepower.

 

The Plasma can be taken on other units like the Redemptor, and is better on those platforms.

 

I would also add that whilst the Repulsor tanks are currently somewhat under-powered, this is not going to be the state of things forever. It wasn't long ago that the Triple-Repulsor list was a staple at the highest levels of tournament play.

My advice is to always collect and build the models you like, because the strong and weak units are always in rotation. This time next year the Repulsor could be a top tier unit again.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

The Laser Destroyer is the better choice as it fills a niche in the Primaris line that many units don't currently focus on. Very long range, high-strength, high-damage firepower.

 

The Plasma can be taken on other units like the Redemptor, and is better on those platforms.

 

I would also add that whilst the Repulsor tanks are currently somewhat under-powered, this is not going to be the state of things forever. It wasn't long ago that the Triple-Repulsor list was a staple at the highest levels of tournament play.

My advice is to always collect and build the models you like, because the strong and weak units are always in rotation. This time next year the Repulsor could be a top tier unit again.

yep, I don’t meta chase. Just want to make things as good as possible, particularly if it’s not meta.

[Closet Skeleton]

Honestly they should just strip out the transport capacity of the executioner , treat it like a heavy battle tank and cost it a bit better so it would see some use. 

 

Gladiators already dump the transport capacity without becoming viably priced.

[CCE1981]

I don’t think that transport capacity comes with a point cost in GWs point tallies.

[tvih]

The plasma is the same as the redemptor and the other gun and the tank itself is crap compared to its rules it once had in 8th ed. I would be   if I had bought even one. The repulsor executioner in 8th ed was basically a FW unit in a codex. 9th ed its a decent paper weight as is most SM armoured units these days that aren't walkers. 

Eh. It was good in 8th as far as firepower, but like any vehicle without invuln or such it died in a hurry, even then. Well, in a competitive environment at least, of course it was still technically better than most units in most codices. but in said competitive environment would've been better off taking more things like Devastator Centurions and Thunderfires. I had one of each of the three and I don't think the Repulsor ever survived the second turn in a 5-round tournament... or maybe in one battle.

 

But yes, the current state of vehicles and certainly the Executioner is ridiculous. Nothing but free kills. Of course, said Devastator Centurions are in the dumpster tier now too, and TFC very "meh" at best.... especially when Eradicators exist. Yay for internal balance.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

I don’t think that transport capacity comes with a point cost in GWs point tallies.

i think it does.

If there’s enough of a trade off between transport and firepower one cancels the other out.

However when it comes to heavy firepower and transport capacity i feel there has to be a points cost associated with transport as well or things would be unbalanced

[Jorin Helm-splitter]

 

I don’t think that transport capacity comes with a point cost in GWs point tallies.

i think it does.

If there’s enough of a trade off between transport and firepower one cancels the other out.

However when it comes to heavy firepower and transport capacity i feel there has to be a points cost associated with transport as well or things would be unbalanced

I don't think they charge for transport capacity, just look at razorback with a twin Las compared to a predator annihilator. The predators costs a little more but has an extra wound.

 

 

Also if you take off the two lascannons from the razor, and a add a storm bolter you'd pay the exact amount you would for a rhino which can carry more models.

 

This doesn't really bother me, transports have advantages and disadvantages that scale well. For example a Raider with termies is 20% of someone's army and is only one drop. So your opponent should gain alot of information during deployment, you also can't just park it on an objective.

Edited September 12, 2021 by Jorin Helm-splitter

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

 

 

I don’t think that transport capacity comes with a point cost in GWs point tallies.

i think it does.

If there’s enough of a trade off between transport and firepower one cancels the other out.

However when it comes to heavy firepower and transport capacity i feel there has to be a points cost associated with transport as well or things would be unbalanced

I don't think they charge for transport capacity, just look at razorback with a twin Las compared to a predator annihilator. The predators costs a little more but has an extra wound.

 

 

Also if you take off the two lascannons from the razor, and a add a storm bolter you'd pay the exact amount you would for a rhino which can carry more models.

 

This doesn't really bother me, transports have advantages and disadvantages that scale well. For example a Raider with termies is 20% of someone's army and is only one drop. So your opponent should gain alot of information during deployment, you also can't just park it on an objective.

one extra wound and sponsons would be quite a bit of capability to have compared to transporting only 5 models

[Jorin Helm-splitter]

Yeah the extra wound is what convinces me that GW doesn't charge anything for transport capacity. The razor back in the example above pays 12 points a wound, and the predator annihilator without sponsons pays around 11.8. IMO the difference is explained by them trying to make most costs end in zero or five.

 

What's interesting is if we take off 40 points off of both (the lascannons) and compare the point cost per wound to rhino without the stormbolter you'd have 8 points for both the rhino and razorback, and 8.18 for pred. So my bet is the baseline cost for a t7 vehicle is 8 points a wound. if we look at the standard dreadnought it supports this, if they're paying 8 per wound, 10 points more than thunderhammer for their fist, the cost of the stormbolter, and the normal cost of a MM we're real close to the actual cost of the dread.

 

I'm willing to bet that for t8 they charge about 10 points per wound based on the land raider. That said the t8 vehicles have a lot of unique weapons and raiders have a better save so it wouldn't surprise me if that factors in a bit (maybe 9 points for a t8 3+ and 10 for a t8 2+ save). The different options make it really tough to compare. It does make me wonder if vindicators are big under rated this edition.

 

I do think your right that GW values the ability to have sponsons but I think that shows up more in the slot that the vehicle is assigned to rather than being reflected in points. 

[Mandragola]

Whatever the formula is, it's nonsense. Marine vehicles are hopelessly overpriced. I've got two repulsors and three executioners and I don't expect I'll field them at all in this edition.

 

The fact is you can get the same firepower and better survivability for a fraction of the price with stuff like eradicators, inceptors and attack bikes. I honestly just wish I'd never bought my executioners (the repulsors did decent service in 8th) because I didn't get them finished during the brief time window when they were worth having.

 

That said, it's easy to magnetise the main gun. Do that, as if and when these things become worth having again, it's hard to say what weapon you'll want.

[Jorin Helm-splitter]

That breakdown had more to do with an earlier discussion about removing the transport capacity for the executioner and adjusting the points. Based on the other hulls they don't charge for it so we shouldn't offer that as a fix (it doesn't need more nerfs). I also don't think those base line costs are the issue, I doubt many of us think land raiders and repulsors should be under 160 points.

 

That said they charge vehicles 5 points more per heavy weapon, which doesn't make any sense removing that surcharge would actually be a pretty easy short term fix for most vehicles. It would amount to a 20 point drop for most battleline tanks, and I think infantry have enough advantages that vehicles don't need to be charged more.

 

I also think one issue that all of the primaris tanks have at the moment is that their points went up while at the same time losing some good abilities in fly and repulsor fields. I think they took it away late in the design process of the new book and didn't adjust the points.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

It was really unfair to remove the keyword Fly.

[Karhedron]

It was really unfair to remove the keyword Fly.

True but FLY itself was nerfed in 9th anyway. Flying units can no longer withdraw from melee and still shoot. This was one of its biggest strengths in 8th.

[lansalt]

It was really unfair to remove the keyword Fly.

A skimmer tank shouldn't have ever had FLY, those ridiculous images of executioners on top of buildings were proof of that.